Opinion on Local Tracks

Saw this on RacerX Ask Ping and found it interesting. My opinion on the subject? I agree with what was said. I hate going to the local tracks now because the faces of the jumps are really steep, the jumps keep getting big and if you aren't doing all of the jumps its pretty much a waste of time riding there. I've got work on Monday and a family to support. Trails and desert look better and better each time I go to the track.

Here's the question and Ping's answer

"Dear Ping,

It seems that a lot of local motocross tracks these days aren't any "good" unless they have jumps that will permanently disable, or kill you if you make a mistake. My question is: Why are local tracks moving towards becoming so gnarly that if you're not an intermediate or pro you have to roll more than half of the jumps, and realize how bad you suck? To me that is a great recipe for serious injuries, shrinking the racer turnout, and lawsuits from greedy scumbags that will shut tracks down. I know tracks need to be challenging for everyone, but I am seriously considering buying a skid plate and hand guards for my bike. I never thought I'd say that. What say ye grand master Ping? "

Cody aka "Not doin the big double"

"Cody,

This has become a major problem for our sport. Local tracks in 2017 look more like a supercross practice track from the early 1990s. I understand that the sport should progress, but at what cost? European tracks still have big, fun jumps but they are tabletops and step-ups instead of doubles with huge gaps that will kill or maim you when you mis-time them. Thanks to the unreal power and torque of modern four-stroke bikes, riders who don’t have the talent or technique to jump large obstacles are fumbling their way through the turns, lining up to the jump, and pinning it. They may pull it off for a while but at some point those riders end up going down in a big way and the injuries are ugly. The vast majority of injuries occur when you leave the ground. The bigger and more technical the jumps, the more frequent and severe the injuries will be. There are ways to make big, fun jumps that are safe [relatively speaking], but track builders are too lazy.

This week was our annual Race X Ride Day and we held it at the famed Castillo Ranch. I spent several hours the day before marking out a grass track in the unimaginably massive hills surrounding the main track. The recent rains provided perfect prep and the result was something that was challenging for pro riders and safe enough for mini bikes to ride. And the only jump was a rolling tabletop that was maybe 20 feet across the top. Despite the lack of jumps, most of the folks that came up said it was the best time they have had on a bike in a long time. I’m not saying we should build tracks with no jumps. But if you have good dirt, utilize the elevation change, and make the jumps safe, everybody has fun and goes home safe."

PING

What do you guys think?
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rk601
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Roseville, CA, USA
3/3/2017 1:23pm Edited Date/Time 3/3/2017 1:23pm
That's not a problem in NorCal, at least I don't feel like it is. I haven't been to many tracks in SoCal over the past few years outside of Glen Helen, so I don't know about that situation.

3/3/2017 2:00pm
Couldn't agree more, the mxgp tracks are a perfect example of great tracks without unnecessarily massive jumps.
dedi684
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Ravena, NY, USA
3/3/2017 2:04pm
That's how I feel about the tracks I race. I'm not a bad rider but really have to take chances I'd prefer not to.
3/3/2017 2:39pm
I disagree. In the late 90s there were jumps as big as everywhere but pala today. Just as steep, with smaller less manicured landings. Sounds like it's you that has changed. Not moto.

The Shop

JBecker 72
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3/3/2017 2:53pm
Heard this for years, it's nothing new. If you're not comfortable doing a jump, don't do it. Ride within your limits.
rmoto003
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3/3/2017 3:00pm
I like tracks being the way they are. There just arent a lot of "riding" areas where people can work on simply riding the motorcycle. People who havnt ridden before go out and buy a 60hp bike and immediately try to hit everything at their local track and carnage happens. My local track actually doesnt allow people in the C/D practices/races to jump one of the bigger jumps on the track because of that reason.
vetmxr
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3/3/2017 3:02pm
Its not easy making a track that all skill levels will have fun on......it may be impossible......the tracks around here may have Cody Gilmore or Denny Stephenson showing up along with kids on 50's, and everyone in between.....hard to challenge everyone without injuries in an already injury prone sport.
JBecker 72
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3/3/2017 3:07pm
vetmxr wrote:
Its not easy making a track that all skill levels will have fun on......it may be impossible......the tracks around here may have Cody Gilmore or Denny...
Its not easy making a track that all skill levels will have fun on......it may be impossible......the tracks around here may have Cody Gilmore or Denny Stephenson showing up along with kids on 50's, and everyone in between.....hard to challenge everyone without injuries in an already injury prone sport.
That is the truth right there. A few places I frequent have intermediate/vet tracks as well as an advanced track. But they are obviously fairly large operations compared to some of the smaller places.

And honestly, most of the crashes I see happen are from the track being in bad shape, and not the size of the jumps.
3/3/2017 3:24pm
I think you have to look at what skill level is coming to the track most often. Most riders fit into that beginner to intermediate range. There are some faster, expert vet riders, but those guys don't usually sky it out because they know that their body won't heal very well. A small portion of riders are fast A riders or pros that aren't afraid of anything. The way I see it, build a track for an intermediate rider, but build a track that flows well. That way the beginners will have a fun, challenging track to learn on. Intermediates have fun because they don't feel intimidated, or like OP said, feel like they suck because they aren't hitting to 110 ft triple. The fast guys can still have a blast riding a float track with out massive jumps. After all, motocross is about riding a dirt bike, and when did we need tons of big jumps to enjoy that? Just my 2 cents.
neysbo
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Edelstein, IL, USA
3/3/2017 3:57pm
Around here in Illinois and surrounding states the tracks for the most part are all pretty damn good with many options and not much stupid shit. Most tracks have actually made jumps and sections better / safer in the last 5 years or so. Yet still challenging for the best riders.
tylermx967
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3/3/2017 4:25pm
I LIKE THE JUMPS THATS ON CYCUL RANCH THEY A LOT OF FUN AS LONG AS YOU DONT GET WHISKY THROTTEL
montesagold
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3/3/2017 4:33pm
Man, Ping said what I've been preaching for a while now. As a Offroad guy who practices on MX and races vintage mx a few times a year(1975 Bultaco 360 & 1985 500KX), I've come to realize that the real jumpy tracks are really doing an injustice to our sport and to the kids trying to learn at proper race speed. All the local mx kids can jump any thing but have no corner speed, cant manage a rough track and most importantly never get out of the main line. If all you're worried about is hitting the next jump, you will never learn to push the limits of you're cornering and line selection. Nothing wrong with jumps but every exit of every turn does not require a man made obstacle...
motokawi818
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3/3/2017 5:55pm Edited Date/Time 3/3/2017 5:56pm
Most socal tracks have two. A expert/main track with large jumps and a vet with only tables or very little jumps. Perfect, best of both worlds.
MX678
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3/3/2017 5:56pm
A track with mainly table tops will still be fun for all skill levels. Dig it deep and the ruts and roughness will still separate those that are faster.
motokawi818
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3/3/2017 5:59pm
Here's a link to the grass track at Castillo Ping is talking about!
https://youtu.be/2bz0Z28zOjM
That's cool but can be done in any open riding area and just using trees or other natural markers for corners.
3/3/2017 6:20pm Edited Date/Time 3/3/2017 6:20pm
Haha, the guy who wrote in might have been talking about the latest round of updates to Pala's main track.

I've been out there once and the new lay out is crazy. I know I will get more used to it as time goes on, but most of the take offs are verticle.
Mx286
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Owensboro, KY, USA
3/3/2017 6:29pm
Here in KY it seems to be the exact opposite. I'm not saying tracks need huge booters but you can make jumps that are somewhat technical and still be safe. But of course the majority of riders are novice/beginners.
Paw Paw 271
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3/3/2017 7:43pm
Some of our local tracks cater their tracks to the very few riders that are getting ready for LL's each year. That could be a few as 2 or 3 that actually go to LL's. THat is frustrating to other 200-300 or so local riders that have no intention on going. These riders ride for fun only. So in our view the track operator is punishing his large group of riders to help a few. The results are always the same. The track eventually fails due to lack of rider support as they feel the track operator is not hearing them and they just find another track to ride.
I have seen this repeat time after time, year after year and the track owners never understand the problem and wonder why they failed.

Paw Paw
3/3/2017 8:43pm
Most socal tracks have two. A expert/main track with large jumps and a vet with only tables or very little jumps. Perfect, best of both worlds.
Although there's an issue at some tracks. I was riding with CarlinoJoe on Sunday at LACR in socal, and the vet track there's was full of people while the main track had nowhere near the amount of riders on it. It's been like that the last few times I've been there.
Myke
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San Diego, CA, USA
3/3/2017 10:14pm
tylermx967 wrote:
I LIKE THE JUMPS THATS ON CYCUL RANCH THEY A LOT OF FUN AS LONG AS YOU DONT GET WHISKY THROTTEL
Is there any way please that you could just kill you caps lock? If you are truly a real dude you should be able to do this. I don't care about the misspelled words but the caps lock is incredibly annoying.

Thanks for any consideration on this. I do think it is incredibly self centered if you can't kill your caps lock. There has been enough people that have polity explained that it is bothersome.

Thanks!
3/4/2017 8:32am
It's gone both ways the last 10-15 years. I seem to remember big doubles and gap jumps in the late 90s before a lot of tracks went to more tabletops. Now, seems some tracks are going back the direction of true doubles and more and more have big roller/rhythm sections. It all depends on what/where you're riding.

Like many, I agree the proliferation of 4 strokes has yielded many unqualified and riders that lack technical skills in cornering, brake usage and how to actually manage/handle the bike. A track local to me gets roughed up pretty quick and more and more riders complain about the ruts and beg for water. I think that's more a of problem as well.
Pirate421
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3/4/2017 9:54am
Some of our local tracks cater their tracks to the very few riders that are getting ready for LL's each year. That could be a few...
Some of our local tracks cater their tracks to the very few riders that are getting ready for LL's each year. That could be a few as 2 or 3 that actually go to LL's. THat is frustrating to other 200-300 or so local riders that have no intention on going. These riders ride for fun only. So in our view the track operator is punishing his large group of riders to help a few. The results are always the same. The track eventually fails due to lack of rider support as they feel the track operator is not hearing them and they just find another track to ride.
I have seen this repeat time after time, year after year and the track owners never understand the problem and wonder why they failed.

Paw Paw
I agree about tracks who build up for lorettas. The funny thing is and I'll admit I've never been there but I've watched for a few years on racertv, but the actual obstacles at lorettas looks pretty tame. I believe I've even read that they make it tame and more natural or vet oriented because they have the minis and the vets. So for these tracks to build sx style obstacles to get people ready for a race that is held on a tamed down motocross track is pretty silly.
Paw Paw 271
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Benton, LA, USA
3/4/2017 12:06pm
vetmxr wrote:
Its not easy making a track that all skill levels will have fun on......it may be impossible......the tracks around here may have Cody Gilmore or Denny...
Its not easy making a track that all skill levels will have fun on......it may be impossible......the tracks around here may have Cody Gilmore or Denny Stephenson showing up along with kids on 50's, and everyone in between.....hard to challenge everyone without injuries in an already injury prone sport.
Take a look at a track that does it right!
swanmx.com
It is safe, fast and challenging to all rider levels. They have very large race turnouts and a huge practice membership and all for one reason. The track is fun!

Paw Paw
250John
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Xenia, OH, USA
3/4/2017 1:26pm
Agree on the LL comments. They have no huge gap jumps. Kind of like the Daytona SX. They build both the tracks safe, but yet still fun. The last thing MX Sports wants with these big races are a lot of people laying on the track hurt slowing down the program.
TSCHAM101
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Norco, CA, USA
3/7/2017 8:29am
From my perspective, i dont understand why the jumps have to be vertical. Milestone for instance, i swear that track is meant for people who know how to scrub really hard, because you can haul ass around that track if you can scrub and if you dont they are like jumps to space that you practically fall out of the sky on the landings and its always a rough landing.

btw im a vet B rider or a slow C rider compared to the kids in my area that race C(sandbagging in my opinion but thats a whole different conversation).

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