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So the world we are living in today is the 450's are the new open class.
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Like someone said above, the 125 class is gone!
So, in answer to your question, the 450 is it's own bike (class) that took 250 and 500 2-strokes with it in its wake. I don't care what the rule book says or if the mfg. no longer produces one. 250 2-strokes became better and better in the 90's and less riders chose the 500's. 4-strokes came around and all but eliminated the 500's and little by little you'd see less and less 250 2-strokes in the mid-2000's.
Your Suzuki's an amazing bike. Enjoy it, but respect it!
On a 2 stroke I'm all over the gearbox, as you have to be if you want to get the most out of your bike. With the 4 stroke you can finish an entire race and only use 3 gears.
As a result I have to remind myself to stay aggressive on the 4 stroke because before you realize it you'll be relying on the bike way too much and your lines, corners and passes become lazy. The bike puts so much power on the ground that it's tempting to ride the engine brake into a rut and stomp on the throttle through the turn down a straight away.
With the 2 stroke I'm forced to carry as much momentum into the corners as possible, I have to pay attention to my lines and I have to rev the absolute shit out of the thing to keep it in the power band.
At my best, I'm faster on a 4 stroke, as most guys are. But with that said, a 2 stroke forces me to be a better, more cerebral rider. You'll do a lot more work on the 2 stroke to go fast, but you'll also be more prone to riding lazy on the 4 stroke, especially through corners.
Think about when you were on an 80 and had to make a pass, you really had to choose your spots and latch onto the guy in front of you to either wait for him to make a mistake or to leave the door open in a corner. Even then, it was hard as hell to make a pass stick if you're taking the inside line. One mistake in a rhythm section and you're pretty much rolling every jump into the next turn because you've lost all of your momentum. The 4 stroke effectively covers up all of these challenges.
This is why you see a lot more passes to the inside compared to the McGrath days where a rider would charge for 10 laps on the leader's fender before making a move.
Sorry for the novel.
at the track my cr250r runs down 250f's like its nothing, the may be similar in hp but that ends right there.
Since when are motors equal when they make the same HP... but one does it at 6k rpm and one at 12k?
That instant rush is not replaceable.
Also, has no one seen the 90hp CR500 based motor built by a regular guy?
450's are no longer a replacement for 250 2 strokes though, they've gone well past that. 4 strokes do everything 2 strokes do but easier these days. Yes maybe to easy and out the box they are already probably to much for the average guy.
As for the OP, his new 450 is faster than his 250 and anybody who's spent any decent amount of time on a bike would agree.
Ps. I only own 2 strokes at present so I'm not against them, I'm just realistic
F1 motors are only built to spin 18k because of rules not because its the best motor layout.
To each his own, i'm impressed by the ability of an engine to rev that high and hold together. Spin your 9000rpm engine to 18k and see what happens.
Different strokes for different folks I guess
I used 2.4 liters because that it what the last generation formula 1 cars used
Pit Row
Since 250-F's make around the same HP as older 250 two strokes, it's basically the new "old" 250 class.
We gained an open bike at the expense of 125 class. Maybe all the injuries are worth it. I dunno.
The rules limited the engine design, actually similar to now. They won't let equal displacement race so 2 stroke development is stagnant.
You could rip wide open everywhere banging gears on a 125 two stroke. Just slamming everything. The 250 two stroke on the other hand needed to be finessed a lot more. Keep it in the sweet spot of the RPM range so as not to over rev it so you could create maximum power. Was a smoother ride because it weighed more, and you just had to ride it with more technique. That's why a lot of great 125 riders never transitioned well to the 250's. And there are a lot of riders who were not great on 125's but excelled on 250's because it fit their riding style better.
F1 limits the displacement to limit speed. Of course they could make more power with more displacement. But they are trying to not kill people
2 strokes were on podiums until the best riders stopped riding them. I believe the best riders stopped riding them when they stopped becoming competitive at a professional level. You believe in the manufacturer conspiracy if you like.
And thats mostly OEM with a few mods. More if you wanted to spend more dough.
I'm saying the open bikes of before are totally different animals because they produce the same power in half the rpm curve.
Its like the Honda crowd over here. No understanding of how significant power differences at different rpm translates to a different experience.
You brought up f1. Yeah f1 evolved to 18k rpm engines because of the rules, not because it makes sense from an engine standpoint.
Post a reply to: Are 450's open class bikes, or 2 stroke 250 replacements in your opinion?