The latest edition of Classic Steel by yours truly is up on the 2001 Honda CR250R

slipdog
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slipdog 4/23/2016 9:07am
4/23/2016 9:07am
Loved my '00 and '01. Figured out the first weekend after a day of jetting to put my '00 carb on since she was in the local paper for sale. Ran like a champ on day 2 and sold the '00 2 days later with the crappy TMX carb on it, lol
Tokyo_Tiddler
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Tokyo_Tiddler 4/23/2016 10:05am
4/23/2016 10:05am
H4L wrote:
Yup. The case reed motor is deceptive & has plenty of potential. PC also has very good porting specs. Owned an 01 I bought new in...
Yup. The case reed motor is deceptive & has plenty of potential. PC also has very good porting specs.
Owned an 01 I bought new in the spring of that yr. & had some engine mods done. Apples to apples comparison to a current 03 model CR250r owned with PC mods the 01 motor falls short in the power dept. across the rpm range even in the lowend range. A friend also owned an 01 with engine mods & the 03 motor would pull his by a few bike lengths on the straights to the next turn.
The 3rd gen 02-07 chassis is also much improved over the 00-01 2nd gen AF chassis. The 2nd.gen AF chassis was improved over the 1st 97-99 AF (owned a 97), but not as noticeable as going from a 2nd AF to a 3rd AF chassis.

I strongly felt that there was a huge improvement in the gen 1 to gen 2 frame rededign and only a small improvement in going from the gen 2 to 3 design. I was able to ride a brand new 01 along side the first 2002 units out of the factory in Japan at the Honda track thanks to Honda. The 2001 handled and turned great with great ergonomics. I felt that the 2002 had nothing on the 2001 in the handling and cornering department. The things I noticed were that the 2002 felt a little lighter and the brakes were a little better, but just a little. The huge change was the engine and I was shocked and disappointed how slow it felt, but did realize it was a hitless almost electric powerband that made the bike feel light and easy to ride. maybe it was deceptive at higher rpm, but I felt that you could not loft the front wheel over an obstacle out of a slow tight low rpm turn on the 2002 the way your could w/o thinking on the 2001 which had more grunt. The 2002 felt like a sewing machine motor.

I guess the case reed did had more hop up potent over stock than the 01 motor, but stock to stock comparison, there is no contest in my mind.

I also feel the 2001 had better looking plastic on it. Although the frame was only a small improvement in my mind, the ideal CR250 for me would be a 2001 engine in a 2002+ frame. Better yet.. a 2001 motor in a 2012 CRF250 frame is my ideal CR250.
H4L
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H4L 4/23/2016 10:20am
4/23/2016 10:20am Edited Date/Time 4/23/2016 10:52am
Tokyo_Tiddler wrote:
I strongly felt that there was a huge improvement in the gen 1 to gen 2 frame rededign and only a small improvement in going from...
I strongly felt that there was a huge improvement in the gen 1 to gen 2 frame rededign and only a small improvement in going from the gen 2 to 3 design. I was able to ride a brand new 01 along side the first 2002 units out of the factory in Japan at the Honda track thanks to Honda. The 2001 handled and turned great with great ergonomics. I felt that the 2002 had nothing on the 2001 in the handling and cornering department. The things I noticed were that the 2002 felt a little lighter and the brakes were a little better, but just a little. The huge change was the engine and I was shocked and disappointed how slow it felt, but did realize it was a hitless almost electric powerband that made the bike feel light and easy to ride. maybe it was deceptive at higher rpm, but I felt that you could not loft the front wheel over an obstacle out of a slow tight low rpm turn on the 2002 the way your could w/o thinking on the 2001 which had more grunt. The 2002 felt like a sewing machine motor.

I guess the case reed did had more hop up potent over stock than the 01 motor, but stock to stock comparison, there is no contest in my mind.

I also feel the 2001 had better looking plastic on it. Although the frame was only a small improvement in my mind, the ideal CR250 for me would be a 2001 engine in a 2002+ frame. Better yet.. a 2001 motor in a 2012 CRF250 frame is my ideal CR250.
You are the first person I've ever heard of or read where they felt the 00-01 chassis had nothing on the 02-07 chassis by saying "I felt that the 2002 had nothing on the 2001 in the handling and cornering department". Then you contradict your self by saying this " the ideal CR250 for me would be a 2001 engine in a 2002+ frame".

There is a reason why so many people put the 92-01 HPP motor in a newer 02 + AF chassis. The 1st 97-99 & 2nd 00-01 AF CR250r chassis weren't that good. Honda made a lot more changes from the 2nd to 3rd AF & really improved the AF chassis design in 02-07.

Although I don't agree with that logic since it doesn't take much to make the case reed motor sing. Putting the older design 92-01 HPP motor requires a lot of work & fabrication that is also involved.

"The things I noticed were that the 2002 felt a little lighter"
If I remember correctly the mx mags stated they were 7-8 lb's lighter.
Tokyo_Tiddler
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Tokyo_Tiddler 4/23/2016 11:20am
4/23/2016 11:20am
Tokyo_Tiddler wrote:
I strongly felt that there was a huge improvement in the gen 1 to gen 2 frame rededign and only a small improvement in going from...
I strongly felt that there was a huge improvement in the gen 1 to gen 2 frame rededign and only a small improvement in going from the gen 2 to 3 design. I was able to ride a brand new 01 along side the first 2002 units out of the factory in Japan at the Honda track thanks to Honda. The 2001 handled and turned great with great ergonomics. I felt that the 2002 had nothing on the 2001 in the handling and cornering department. The things I noticed were that the 2002 felt a little lighter and the brakes were a little better, but just a little. The huge change was the engine and I was shocked and disappointed how slow it felt, but did realize it was a hitless almost electric powerband that made the bike feel light and easy to ride. maybe it was deceptive at higher rpm, but I felt that you could not loft the front wheel over an obstacle out of a slow tight low rpm turn on the 2002 the way your could w/o thinking on the 2001 which had more grunt. The 2002 felt like a sewing machine motor.

I guess the case reed did had more hop up potent over stock than the 01 motor, but stock to stock comparison, there is no contest in my mind.

I also feel the 2001 had better looking plastic on it. Although the frame was only a small improvement in my mind, the ideal CR250 for me would be a 2001 engine in a 2002+ frame. Better yet.. a 2001 motor in a 2012 CRF250 frame is my ideal CR250.
H4L wrote:
You are the first person I've ever heard of or read where they felt the 00-01 chassis had nothing on the 02-07 chassis by saying "I...
You are the first person I've ever heard of or read where they felt the 00-01 chassis had nothing on the 02-07 chassis by saying "I felt that the 2002 had nothing on the 2001 in the handling and cornering department". Then you contradict your self by saying this " the ideal CR250 for me would be a 2001 engine in a 2002+ frame".

There is a reason why so many people put the 92-01 HPP motor in a newer 02 + AF chassis. The 1st 97-99 & 2nd 00-01 AF CR250r chassis weren't that good. Honda made a lot more changes from the 2nd to 3rd AF & really improved the AF chassis design in 02-07.

Although I don't agree with that logic since it doesn't take much to make the case reed motor sing. Putting the older design 92-01 HPP motor requires a lot of work & fabrication that is also involved.

"The things I noticed were that the 2002 felt a little lighter"
If I remember correctly the mx mags stated they were 7-8 lb's lighter.
OK slick, you got me, you are just too dam smart for me Smile If you read a little more carefully, you would have read that I stated that the 2002 frame was a slight improvement as it felt lighter (and maybe a little narrower in the boot area).. I just dont think the improvements were in the turning/ handling area. Unlike most, I got to ride a brand new stock 2001 and brand new stock 2002 side by side at the same track. But just my opinion.

It is surprising that you dont think there was a big improvement with the 2000 frame. It was a night and day difference. The 97-99 frame vibrated and did not turn as well.

The Shop

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avidchimp
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avidchimp 4/23/2016 11:26am
4/23/2016 11:26am
Tokyo_Tiddler wrote:
OK slick, you got me, you are just too dam smart for me :) If you read a little more carefully, you would have read that...
OK slick, you got me, you are just too dam smart for me Smile If you read a little more carefully, you would have read that I stated that the 2002 frame was a slight improvement as it felt lighter (and maybe a little narrower in the boot area).. I just dont think the improvements were in the turning/ handling area. Unlike most, I got to ride a brand new stock 2001 and brand new stock 2002 side by side at the same track. But just my opinion.

It is surprising that you dont think there was a big improvement with the 2000 frame. It was a night and day difference. The 97-99 frame vibrated and did not turn as well.
I got to ride my 3-4 hour old '00 back to back with my buddy's meticulously maintained '99 and the difference was jaw dropping. I hadn't ridden a 1st gen CR at that point and couldn't believe how awful it was.

Like you said, the 2002 was better in some ways, but it's certainly debatable.
bob567
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bob567 4/23/2016 2:03pm
4/23/2016 2:03pm
The frame would look better if it was painted black or red (or steel). The pipe would look better if it was a raw metal cone pipe. I appreciate your opinion. Please appreciate mine.
H4L
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H4L 4/23/2016 5:10pm
4/23/2016 5:10pm Edited Date/Time 4/24/2016 8:51am
Tokyo_Tiddler wrote:
OK slick, you got me, you are just too dam smart for me :) If you read a little more carefully, you would have read that...
OK slick, you got me, you are just too dam smart for me Smile If you read a little more carefully, you would have read that I stated that the 2002 frame was a slight improvement as it felt lighter (and maybe a little narrower in the boot area).. I just dont think the improvements were in the turning/ handling area. Unlike most, I got to ride a brand new stock 2001 and brand new stock 2002 side by side at the same track. But just my opinion.

It is surprising that you dont think there was a big improvement with the 2000 frame. It was a night and day difference. The 97-99 frame vibrated and did not turn as well.
"Unlike most, I got to ride a brand new stock 2001 and brand new stock 2002 side by side at the same track".

Tokyo - Same here the 01 I purchased was new in the spring of that yr. as well as the 02 I bought used with 3-5 hrs. which was essentially new.
I was disappointed in the 01 after my initial break in at a local track & felt it lacked lowend power in comparison to the previous 97 & 93 CR250r models owned. I also felt the 2nd AF chassis had not improved much over the 1st & felt the 93 model was actually a better overall package. The only advantage I would give the 01 over the 93 would be the 47mm showa forks vs. the 43mm KYB's.

"It is surprising that you dont think there was a big improvement with the 2000 frame. It was a night and day difference. The 97-99 frame vibrated and did not turn as well".

If you look at the frames from the 1st & 2nd gen CR's they look very similar with the exception of the 2nd gen looking thinner in the twin spar area. I felt those frames were similar with them being stiff / rigid & didn't turn well.
When Honda introduced the 3rd gen AF they changed the geometry of the head tube area & also at the twin spar area. The twin spar area has a curved dimension on the frame that allows for more flex.
Those changes to the 3rd gen AF resulted in a much better turning bike that also had great stability at high speeds.
I remember some of the mx mags comparing the frame / chassis geometry to the 93 CR model which was an exceptional turning bike.

In late 03 I was practicing at a local track with the 01 model & had done some work to it since buying it with engine mods & suspension work. I thought the bike was dialed until I rode another local racers 03 model that was set up very good with engine / suspension work. After a few laps I knew the 01 was inferior in many ways as a package to the 3rd gen CR so I sold the 01 & purchased an 03 a week later. I don't have any regrets & still own the 03 till this day since I haven't found a better motor / chassis & suspension combo package.

The 01 is a decent bike, but IMHO it's overrated.
nickm
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nickm 4/24/2016 6:47am
4/24/2016 6:47am
NorcalVet wrote:
I had a '01 as my first bike coming back after a 20+ Years hiatus - I was browsing around on eBay in 2004 and it...
I had a '01 as my first bike coming back after a 20+ Years hiatus

- I was browsing around on eBay in 2004 and it popped up for a killer price about an hr away
Sent an email and picked it up the next am

- great shape, fmf pipe, V-2 reeds and revalved also

Had a blast on that bike. It was set up sweet .... I added Woody graphics, red anodized excells and a black rear fender to be different Smile

Sold it to the neighbors kid for 3500 (bought it for 2500)
- used it to pay off the brand new 05 RMZ 450 I had on order



We lead parallel lives, I bought one of these on eBay after a 15 year hiatus, came up on eBay the guy lived about an hour away, I emailed him and a couple of hours later I was loading it into the back of my truck. It came with the v2 reeds and I added woody graphics. Love the bike, it was no 1988cr 250 on the beauty scale but a close second for me. I sold it to buy an 05 KTM 450
gsxr6
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gsxr6 4/24/2016 12:14pm
4/24/2016 12:14pm Edited Date/Time 4/24/2016 12:20pm
I also sold off an 01 recently and will never sell my 02. The 01 had fatty and 2000 pwk, my 02 is mildy ported , 05 base gasket, gnarly and a non batwing pwk. Walk the 01 in a drag race every time, and probably has 5-7 mph more on top from so much higher rpm ceiling. After mods I prefer the case Reed engine by far. Smooth tractable roll on, wheel lifting midrange hit, and much more overrev even with the gnarly pipe. Won't ever sell my 02 lol the 01 are lower, and turn tighter, however the 02 rear end really follows the front much better, esp in a slide. High speed corners on the 01 ID always be ready to wash out. 02 you can overcook the corner 5mph and just slide the bike wherever u desire.
gsxr6
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gsxr6 4/24/2016 12:17pm
4/24/2016 12:17pm
01 we just sold two weeks ago

gsxr6
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gsxr6 4/24/2016 12:18pm
4/24/2016 12:18pm
My baby the 02 haha

NorcalVet
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NorcalVet 4/24/2016 1:49pm
4/24/2016 1:49pm
NorcalVet wrote:
I had a '01 as my first bike coming back after a 20+ Years hiatus - I was browsing around on eBay in 2004 and it...
I had a '01 as my first bike coming back after a 20+ Years hiatus

- I was browsing around on eBay in 2004 and it popped up for a killer price about an hr away
Sent an email and picked it up the next am

- great shape, fmf pipe, V-2 reeds and revalved also

Had a blast on that bike. It was set up sweet .... I added Woody graphics, red anodized excells and a black rear fender to be different Smile

Sold it to the neighbors kid for 3500 (bought it for 2500)
- used it to pay off the brand new 05 RMZ 450 I had on order



nickm wrote:
We lead parallel lives, I bought one of these on eBay after a 15 year hiatus, came up on eBay the guy lived about an hour...
We lead parallel lives, I bought one of these on eBay after a 15 year hiatus, came up on eBay the guy lived about an hour away, I emailed him and a couple of hours later I was loading it into the back of my truck. It came with the v2 reeds and I added woody graphics. Love the bike, it was no 1988cr 250 on the beauty scale but a close second for me. I sold it to buy an 05 KTM 450
Ha ha
Hey bro Smile

Yep my last bike before I got back at it was a brand new off the showroom '79 RM 125 that I remember buying for $1040 OTD

It was a great bike, besides numbing my hands to my elbows
- for me I remember it was all mid- top

Then I drank the Kool-Aid. Got me the '05 RMZ 450
- had to go yellow again. Everywhere I rode/ hit a track there were 90% Red Honda's. I don't like to follow everyone, so I went w/ something different --- but the same Smile

Ps: sorry for side tracking this thread
H4L
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H4L 4/24/2016 2:15pm
4/24/2016 2:15pm
gsxr6 wrote:
I also sold off an 01 recently and will never sell my 02. The 01 had fatty and 2000 pwk, my 02 is mildy ported...
I also sold off an 01 recently and will never sell my 02. The 01 had fatty and 2000 pwk, my 02 is mildy ported , 05 base gasket, gnarly and a non batwing pwk. Walk the 01 in a drag race every time, and probably has 5-7 mph more on top from so much higher rpm ceiling. After mods I prefer the case Reed engine by far. Smooth tractable roll on, wheel lifting midrange hit, and much more overrev even with the gnarly pipe. Won't ever sell my 02 lol the 01 are lower, and turn tighter, however the 02 rear end really follows the front much better, esp in a slide. High speed corners on the 01 ID always be ready to wash out. 02 you can overcook the corner 5mph and just slide the bike wherever u desire.
More than likely your sag & suspension is not set up correctly on the 02. I noticed in the pic the 01 forks are moved higher in the clamps which I'm sure helped the tuning of the chassis. When the 3rd gen susp. is set up right it will out turn the 00-01 2nd gen chassis with ease.
gsxr6
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gsxr6 4/24/2016 3:51pm
4/24/2016 3:51pm
The suspension is gobs better on the 02. It feels like it hits the steering stops sooner than that.01 did. I go right around that 01 anywhere I want, and with more mph. Even my yz450 (14) feels like the bars turn farther than the 02. But I'm faster through any corner on the 02 for sure, it just feels like it hit the stops a lil sooner. I'm gonna grind a lil if it will get me anything. Haven't looked yet
Big Lenny
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Big Lenny 4/24/2016 3:58pm
4/24/2016 3:58pm
gsxr6 wrote:
My baby the 02 haha[img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2016/04/24/132897/s1200_IMG_20160326_114935363.jpg[/img]
My baby the 02 haha

Damn!...Shocked
kiwifan
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kiwifan 4/24/2016 4:29pm
4/24/2016 4:29pm
gsxr6 wrote:
My baby the 02 haha[img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2016/04/24/132897/s1200_IMG_20160326_114935363.jpg[/img]
My baby the 02 haha

whats the green bike in the background??
gsxr6
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gsxr6 4/24/2016 5:20pm
4/24/2016 5:20pm
gsxr6 wrote:
My baby the 02 haha[img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2016/04/24/132897/s1200_IMG_20160326_114935363.jpg[/img]
My baby the 02 haha

kiwifan wrote:
whats the green bike in the background??
It's trouble lol. Gsxr600 I got stupid on for awhile. Been gathering dust for 3 years and sold this week. No wheelie tickets on the dirt bikes lol.

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gsxr6
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gsxr6 4/24/2016 5:56pm
4/24/2016 5:56pm
The 06 forks on my 02 are deceptive as the tubes are shorter to begin with. The first line when u move the 02 forks up? That's where 06 forks sit flush.... The steering lug at the bottom pulls the axle in a few mm as well... ...
kiwifan
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kiwifan 4/24/2016 7:06pm
4/24/2016 7:06pm
gsxr6 wrote:
It's trouble lol. Gsxr600 I got stupid on for awhile. Been gathering dust for 3 years and sold this week. No wheelie tickets on the dirt...
It's trouble lol. Gsxr600 I got stupid on for awhile. Been gathering dust for 3 years and sold this week. No wheelie tickets on the dirt bikes lol.
lol true, I got a H2R the front wheel goes up way too easy lol
Dutchman
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Dutchman 4/26/2016 11:12am
4/26/2016 11:12am
In this interview Gordon Crockard shares some information about his GP '01 cr250 (starts at 32:34).



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