Careers in 250 & 450 classes

I think a racing career should be a way for very talented riders to have a chance to make a living from their skills. If that is from 250's or 450's who cares? They are both pro classes and they should both have elite riders. "Feeder class" is dumb that is why there is arenacross.

Something about davalos still being in the 250s and beating rookies out of wins doesn't sit well with me. I think you should have to move up. But then again who am I to say anything.. Maybe some guys don't gel with the 450 like they do the 250.
Just imagine if tomac or someone never moved up and just kept winning and winning. I think that would piss everyone off eventually. There's a reason they call it the premier class.

Yeah, wonder how many people called Joel Roberts a sandbagger to his face...

I " used to " be a firm believer in making a guy move up after a while , but I kind of changed my mind on that over the years. I agree with both of Ryan and Nrosso.

You know someone here posted just the other day , that the best riders always move up to the 450 class. I disagree with that. Both the 250 and 450 ride very different , and just because you're great on one , doesn't mean you'll be great on the other. And visa-versa ....not all the guys on 450's that move down can produce good results on a 250. Ala : KW14 when he attempted it.

Both should be premier classes. And I think if a rider wants to make a living riding the size bike he's most comfortable on....then so be it.

I still am lost as to how Davalos is able to still run the 250 class. I thought he would have pointed out by now but I seem to remember him disappearing for a year or two due to injury which must be why? Also, if a rider is moved up after their 3 seasons in the 250 class, and they take time off for a few years, are they eligible to move back down to the 250? I guess I never understood how guys like Hansen and Davalos were able to stay so long.

They are both pro series.
I think the rider should be able to choose which series to ride.

Musquin is proving to me that it's ok to stay in the 250 class longer than just a couple years. Now if Davalos does good.....

I think only 1 class should be Pro and could care less what bike you ride.

If the younger guys cannot beat the older guys, too bad.:-)

Exactly how I feel about it. Why should we (fans, the sport, etc) expect every rookie coming up from amateurs to win during his first season in the pro class?

If the 250 class is open to any racer, the rookies who do show up and win in their first season are just that much more impressive.

Brown won his outdoor title as an "old guy" on a 125. Dowd did it indoors on the 125. I think both are pretty cool.

the idea that a rider is limited to a number of titles on a 250 just makes it the idea that this class is not a pro class.

Im not as familiar with other motorsports but ive seen guys not racing in the 'premier' class. Nascar drivers are known to race in more than just the main series.

if its all professionals racing, there shouldnt be any limit based on skill. thats why its the PROS. its very ironic that the pro level is the only point in a racers career that you are limited to one class. on a given weekend as an amatuer a guy can race anywhere between 1-4 classes.

and up until the 2000's it was common for guys to try to qualify on both a 125 and a 250, and in fact some guys did make both main events and many guys used to occilate between both classes over their careers. Ryan hughes and Mike Brown were both examples of getting where ever they could. They both did 125s, raced on 250s and even went to europe. If they were restricted (more than they had been) they wouldve ended their careers much sooner. here's a fun fact, mike brown raced for Yamaha of troy on 3 separate occasions. He raced for Honda of Troy in the early 90's then came back to them in 2004, then again as a fill in in 2007.


Now while having guys does make it harder for new talent to come in, if they are faster then they shouldnt have a problem making mains (the new guys) but if they cant beat the 'old guard' do they really deserve to be there? being Pro means being one of the 40 fastest guys around. not simply younger. this sport is a young mans sport already as age easily beats more guys than the riders around him

exactly, being the best means beating the top guys when they are there. You always hear guys say how they dont like winning when the 'other guy' crashed out. They like beating them straight up.

it establishes manhood, its a right of passage

what good is "being the best" if your only on top when everyone else is gone. Thats like saying you won the class because you were the only guy who showed up

I think after you win three championships in either Sx or MX you should have to move up. That's fair enough to everyone, and it would keep the racing from getting too stale with one guy crushing everybody.

I feel that there shouldnt be a limit at all. Imo there is enough room for two pro-classes: The fans like the races, the manufacturers have the money for teams in 250, the 250 and 450 differ that much in technology as well as customers that it makes sense from a marketing perspective, and there is enough talent to have a good championship in 250. And some riders are simply a better fit on a smaller bike (Chiodi is a great example of that, but the guy in my avatar as well).

It is also not something new, there have been many examples in the past where riders won multiple titles while not racing in the ''premier'' class. Think Chiodi, Smets, Robert, but even Stefan Everts had a period where he was out of the premier class and won 2 500cc titles.

But for me the biggest reason to not have an age limit is that it forces good riders but not great out of a ride, because there are just limited factory rides in 450/MXGP. Basically you'll have like ~15 good rides in 450/MXGP and that's it.

With the way the 250 classes in US and in the GPs get almost the same coverage and media attention as the 450s, there should not be any age rules.

The worst example has to be 250 SX class when they get national points from a regional series, that is ridiculous. And i feel like it's obvious that the 250 class get way too much attention. There are not enough good teams in the 450s, and i feel like there could be a scenario when good 250 riders has to move up and there are no good 450 rides available. There is a problem with the system if you as a 250 rider can finish 18th in a regional SX race and get roughly the same amount of attention and credibility as a guy who finishes 18th in the 450 class.

But remove all the age rules and pointing out rules of the 250 classes and this isn't a problem anymore. Have Davalos, Cunningham, Osborne riding with a 250 if they want to.

The GPs could change a few things and make it almost perfect. The EMX250 series is a huge success. Have an age limit on that and remove all the age limits in the mx2 class.

But Herlings is a sandbagger?

There are some riders that ride a 125/250f better than a 250t/450 and vica versa, has always been the case.

Well if there wasnt an age limit in MX2 i'm not sure who would have stayed in MX2 that could challenge Herlings anyway. Febvre, Gasjer and Guillod all moved up before they were to old, so no reason to think they would have stayed if the age limit wasnt in place. (regardless of the discussion if they could have challenged Herlings).

I do think without an age limit we would have additional guys in MX2 who would be able to challenge the top 5. Think of guys like Dean Ferris, Jake Nicholls, Nicolas Aubin or even Todd Waters (don't know if he is a good ''fit'' on an MX2).
Heck, Glenn Coldenhoff was forced out of MX2 due to the age rule, and i'm not sure he would have moved up last year if he wasnt forced to.

Bring back 125 and 250 2 stroke classes

They are already back. The 125s are not racing at Valkenswaard but the 300s are.

Since kids don't grow up racing supercross, there has to be a system in place for them to learn supercross skills. Right now, that is the 250 class. MX has 80 spots on the gate each weekend (40 for each class). SX has only 40 total. If you let experienced riders stay in the 250 class indefinitely, where are you going to make room for the fresh blood to learn the sport. There would have to be a third class. How is that going to fit into the 1 day race schedule at SX? Right now, the practice starts at noon. You'd have to move the start of the day to 9am to fit in a third class. More bikes means more wear and tear on the track. The track is already getting wrecked before the 450 main, and there is only so much that the dirt crew can do between races.

Make it a 2 day format like every other highend motorsport does?

As much as i'd like that it won't be a pro class. No money from Honda, Suzuki, Kawasaki and maybe Yamaha.

I completely agree with the OP and many others in this thread. You make it to that level, you're a pro, and if you ride a 250 well and that's what you want to ride and make a career on, then go for it as far as I'm concerned. That's why I don't have a problem with Davalos being in the 250 class, Herlings being in the 250 class, or anyone being in the 250 class for that matter. Those guys are badass on a 250 and if they want to ride them then they should be allowed to

I never have understood why guys are forced to move up. Seems like it has ruined some guys career earning potential due to the injuries they sustain coming to grips with the weight and power of the 450's.

This also hurts the manufacturer's too as they don't have there star rider out there competing and representing their brand. This is kind of ironic as I think the class structure that we have exists just so the manufacturer's can market different displacement models but seems that very structure backfires on them all to often.

If it's s full sized bike, well, no age limits / pointing out at all. Be it MXGP, EMX. or any other pro / adult series.

Yes, have age classes for amateurs, but F"*k this BS of ageing out etc. They are legitimate capacity classes.