Has anybody actually seen these chinese bikes?

mmain62
Profile picture for user mmain62
Posts
714
Joined
2/7/2013
Location
Knoxville, IL, USA
mmain62
Edited Date/Time 5/1/2016 9:34pm
http://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/best-quality-dirt-bike-450cc_6000…



Seems like they bought the plans off of suzuki for the 07-08 rmz.
|
lappedrider
Profile picture for user lappedrider
Posts
1555
Joined
8/26/2006
Location
Tooele, UT, USA
lappedrider 10/21/2014 1:07pm
10/21/2014 1:07pm
Bad link, and the Chinese don't buy plans from anyone. They reverse engineer and steal the plans.
mmain62
Profile picture for user mmain62
Posts
714
Joined
2/7/2013
Location
Knoxville, IL, USA
mmain62 10/21/2014 1:20pm
10/21/2014 1:20pm
it did it again . it was like alibaba.com best dirtbike it was like a zallman 250 or something.
Sorry guys

The Shop

See All »
Julian
Profile picture for user Julian
Posts
489
Joined
8/24/2014
Location
PL
Julian 10/21/2014 1:39pm
10/21/2014 1:39pm
don't bother trying to find the photos, they will just "look" like a real mx bike but that is about all, there were some Honda copies that showed up a while back and the best part about them was the funny articles written about them after testing them, I think one was done by MXA and maybe one by Pingree on RacerX. Just forget them.
mark_swart
Profile picture for user mark_swart
Posts
2524
Joined
11/2/2011
Location
Chapin, SC, USA
mark_swart 10/21/2014 1:50pm
10/21/2014 1:50pm
Here's a screen grab:



That is crazy - looks like they almost even stole the Makita graphics from that era!!

I do remember Ping testing one of the Chinese ones for RacerX a few years back, it was air cooled and couldn't even make it up the hills at Glen Helen, and then it blew up. I'm sure these are still crap, but it looks like they've come a long way. It's easy to make progress when you are just stealing other companies designs.

I'm guessing they can't get imported to countries that actually have patent protection - so where do they go?
WhipMeister
Profile picture for user WhipMeister
Posts
5259
Joined
8/15/2006
Location
Big D, TX, USA
WhipMeister 10/21/2014 1:57pm
10/21/2014 1:57pm
You realize that Alibaba ads are only a hair more credible than craigslist, right?
GrapeApe
Profile picture for user GrapeApe
Posts
8876
Joined
6/7/2010
Location
Mc Kinney, TX, USA
GrapeApe 10/21/2014 2:01pm
10/21/2014 2:01pm
WhipMeister wrote:
You realize that Alibaba ads are only a hair more credible than craigslist, right?
I don't know, man, it says "best quality".
Falcon
Profile picture for user Falcon
Posts
12421
Joined
11/16/2011
Location
Menifee, CA, USA
Falcon 10/21/2014 2:03pm
10/21/2014 2:03pm
Fuel:
Gas / Diesel



Uh.......... Blink
mark_swart
Profile picture for user mark_swart
Posts
2524
Joined
11/2/2011
Location
Chapin, SC, USA
mark_swart 10/21/2014 2:09pm
10/21/2014 2:09pm
WhipMeister wrote:
You realize that Alibaba ads are only a hair more credible than craigslist, right?
So the ad itself is just an elaborate spoof?
WhipMeister
Profile picture for user WhipMeister
Posts
5259
Joined
8/15/2006
Location
Big D, TX, USA
WhipMeister 10/21/2014 2:21pm
10/21/2014 2:21pm
WhipMeister wrote:
You realize that Alibaba ads are only a hair more credible than craigslist, right?
mark_swart wrote:
So the ad itself is just an elaborate spoof?
Just because they have a picture of something doesn't mean they have actually built S/N 00001. But they might try if they get some bites.

Order a container or two and let us know...Shocked

GATOR
Profile picture for user GATOR
Posts
266
Joined
10/19/2012
Location
FR
GATOR 10/21/2014 2:21pm
10/21/2014 2:21pm Edited Date/Time 10/21/2014 2:23pm
Falcon wrote:
Fuel:
Gas / Diesel



Uh.......... Blink
If you check the specs, it's also a 250 450, actually.


BAMX
Profile picture for user BAMX
Posts
2896
Joined
1/22/2012
Location
Fallbrook, CA, USA
BAMX 10/21/2014 2:26pm
10/21/2014 2:26pm
I saw this sick ride at Intermot this year.



BAMX
Profile picture for user BAMX
Posts
2896
Joined
1/22/2012
Location
Fallbrook, CA, USA
BAMX 10/21/2014 2:38pm
10/21/2014 2:38pm
I don't know but close up, the build quality isn't what the big 5 produce but it looked a lot better than I have seen in the past.
bonafide
Profile picture for user bonafide
Posts
63
Joined
11/6/2012
Location
USA
bonafide 10/21/2014 3:05pm
10/21/2014 3:05pm
I've been watching them for three years now. What I have learned is they bought Honda's tooling,they are heavy and underpowered. Looks like their market is the trail bike and street/trail. Most of the parts are direct copies from Honda, and parts are interchangeable with the 2009 year. They have also past the emission tests to be imported to US.

mark_swart
Profile picture for user mark_swart
Posts
2524
Joined
11/2/2011
Location
Chapin, SC, USA
mark_swart 10/21/2014 3:12pm
10/21/2014 3:12pm Edited Date/Time 10/21/2014 3:13pm
What I don't get... almost everything is made in China anyway. So why does their build quality for motorcycles suck so bad?

My kid brother had a Chinese CRF 70 knockoff a few years ago, three rides in and the footpegs broke off. It shouldn't be that hard for them to use decent metals.

If they were smart, they would try to make something reliable and go a low-tech route instead of trying to directly rip-off the big brands because of the limited ability to export due to patent issues. Don't patents run out after a certain amount of years?

Call me crazy, but I think there would be a market for a $3K bike (maybe even two stroke and/or air cooled) with a decent chassis that could get around a motocross track and rip in the trails - IF it was reasonably durable and you could actually buy replacement parts for it.
RMT
Profile picture for user RMT
Posts
1269
Joined
8/16/2006
Location
USA, CA, USA
RMT 10/21/2014 3:38pm
10/21/2014 3:38pm
mark_swart wrote:
What I don't get... almost everything is made in China anyway. So why does their build quality for motorcycles suck so bad? My kid brother had...
What I don't get... almost everything is made in China anyway. So why does their build quality for motorcycles suck so bad?

My kid brother had a Chinese CRF 70 knockoff a few years ago, three rides in and the footpegs broke off. It shouldn't be that hard for them to use decent metals.

If they were smart, they would try to make something reliable and go a low-tech route instead of trying to directly rip-off the big brands because of the limited ability to export due to patent issues. Don't patents run out after a certain amount of years?

Call me crazy, but I think there would be a market for a $3K bike (maybe even two stroke and/or air cooled) with a decent chassis that could get around a motocross track and rip in the trails - IF it was reasonably durable and you could actually buy replacement parts for it.
The Chinese only make what they are asked to make. If you ask for a cheap minibike, you get a cheap minibike. If you asked for a $2,500 minibike or mini ATV, you get what the Japanese sell right now (on the ATV side).

Look up CFMoto and you will see what they can make when you want to spend a little coin. In fact, KTM has a joint venture with that company for some non US products right now.

Look at CFmoto like you looked at Hyundai and Kia 20 years ago. You probably didn't think they were worth owning. Now look at the cars they are producing as they rival or beat most out there on reliability.

Things change and we will probably be including some Chinese companies down the road as we talk about the "big 7" as they get ready for the 2029 all electric supercross series.

I've ridden an SSR 250 and it was nothing like the CRF250 it looks like. Much slower and heavy, but not all that bad and dare I say, better than the RMZ250 I had in 04. For a non racer, it would be awesome but you would get smoked lining up at a race with one.

Pit Row

See All »
Pembroke36
Profile picture for user Pembroke36
Posts
835
Joined
6/22/2014
Location
Brick, NJ, USA
Pembroke36 10/21/2014 3:39pm
10/21/2014 3:39pm
It's like anything else, you get what you pay for. Cheap price is because it is cheap materials, terrible factory conditions, and stolen designs that are loosely followed. I doubt there is any quality control on parts or at the end of the assembly. All steel is not equal. A real manufacturer will test different materials to meet their required strength, hence the quality and higher price.
ashwerx7
Profile picture for user ashwerx7
Posts
5
Joined
1/5/2013
Location
Philadelphia, PA, USA
ashwerx7 10/21/2014 6:58pm
10/21/2014 6:58pm
I have a lot of experience with the Asia wing... It's terrible.. If you,'ve ever seen a christini 450 it is an Asia wing with AWD. Drive system is great but you don't put cool technology on a pinto! We had to fix so many problems with transmissions to terrible bearings and hardware... All they did was copy an older version of a crf450x.. Clone of sorts including the motor.. They just have no idea how things work because they just copy... They miss vital components of the engine that cause failures the original suspension the clickers did nothing.. Heavy as a tank!! Do go there
queen of spodes 10/21/2014 7:25pm
10/21/2014 7:25pm
mark_swart wrote:
What I don't get... almost everything is made in China anyway. So why does their build quality for motorcycles suck so bad? My kid brother had...
What I don't get... almost everything is made in China anyway. So why does their build quality for motorcycles suck so bad?

My kid brother had a Chinese CRF 70 knockoff a few years ago, three rides in and the footpegs broke off. It shouldn't be that hard for them to use decent metals.

If they were smart, they would try to make something reliable and go a low-tech route instead of trying to directly rip-off the big brands because of the limited ability to export due to patent issues. Don't patents run out after a certain amount of years?

Call me crazy, but I think there would be a market for a $3K bike (maybe even two stroke and/or air cooled) with a decent chassis that could get around a motocross track and rip in the trails - IF it was reasonably durable and you could actually buy replacement parts for it.
Easy. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planned_obsolescence
mark_swart
Profile picture for user mark_swart
Posts
2524
Joined
11/2/2011
Location
Chapin, SC, USA
mark_swart 10/21/2014 7:57pm
10/21/2014 7:57pm
mark_swart wrote:
What I don't get... almost everything is made in China anyway. So why does their build quality for motorcycles suck so bad? My kid brother had...
What I don't get... almost everything is made in China anyway. So why does their build quality for motorcycles suck so bad?

My kid brother had a Chinese CRF 70 knockoff a few years ago, three rides in and the footpegs broke off. It shouldn't be that hard for them to use decent metals.

If they were smart, they would try to make something reliable and go a low-tech route instead of trying to directly rip-off the big brands because of the limited ability to export due to patent issues. Don't patents run out after a certain amount of years?

Call me crazy, but I think there would be a market for a $3K bike (maybe even two stroke and/or air cooled) with a decent chassis that could get around a motocross track and rip in the trails - IF it was reasonably durable and you could actually buy replacement parts for it.
queen of spodes wrote:
Easy. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planned_obsolescence
Great, now you're going to turn this into a two stroke versus four stroke debate lol!!
queen of spodes 10/21/2014 8:18pm
10/21/2014 8:18pm
mark_swart wrote:
Great, now you're going to turn this into a two stroke versus four stroke debate lol!!
haha you went there not me!
Racerx930
Profile picture for user Racerx930
Posts
774
Joined
4/1/2008
Location
Stillwater, OK, USA
Racerx930 10/21/2014 9:10pm
10/21/2014 9:10pm
I actually own the first US prototype Asia wing 250. We've tried to tear the damn thing up but it's still going. It has some weaknesses and things we had to replace right out of the box but the thing has shocked us in the 2 years we've had it.
Racerx930
Profile picture for user Racerx930
Posts
774
Joined
4/1/2008
Location
Stillwater, OK, USA
Racerx930 10/21/2014 9:12pm
10/21/2014 9:12pm Edited Date/Time 10/21/2014 9:12pm
The Chinese steal hasn't been a problem. It's the Chinese cast aluminum that sneaks up on you. Including the bar mount bolts!

As far as the engine it's about like riding an XR250. Reminds me of a Honda style bottom end with an RFS KTM style head.
JeepnMike
Profile picture for user JeepnMike
Posts
2525
Joined
10/18/2012
Location
Enumclaw, WA, USA
JeepnMike 10/21/2014 9:21pm
10/21/2014 9:21pm
BAMX wrote:
I saw this sick ride at Intermot this year. [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2014/10/21/68166/s1200_IMG_0666.jpg[/img]
I saw this sick ride at Intermot this year.



Looks a bit like the RCR bikes, just a little nicer Wink
Racerx930
Profile picture for user Racerx930
Posts
774
Joined
4/1/2008
Location
Stillwater, OK, USA
Racerx930 10/22/2014 10:37am
10/22/2014 10:37am Edited Date/Time 10/22/2014 10:38am
Me and a buddy have a thing for odd ball bkes, we thought what could be more odd than this thing.i

We've raced it several times in some some offroad "Team" races. The only time it didn't finish was right out of the crate. They mounted the coil literally up against the head. Thing started cutting out really bad and we found the coil was melted. Your standard $2 chinese coil had it up and running.


Cast aluminum bar mount bolt was broke in the crate, cast aluminum peg / stand mount broke. Front brake locked up the first time we rode it. After we sorted everything out it's been fine. Nether one of us ride it much anymore but it's the perfect buddy bike.
philG
Profile picture for user philG
Posts
11000
Joined
5/12/2012
Location
GB
philG 10/22/2014 10:51am
10/22/2014 10:51am
chinese stuff is always copies, they reverse engineer everything they can , and guess the rest... piss poor materials and everything ... just made of cheese.
jeffro503
Profile picture for user jeffro503
Posts
27632
Joined
7/22/2007
Location
St Helens, OR, USA
jeffro503 10/22/2014 11:31am
10/22/2014 11:31am
One thing though....China may take a while to catch up , but in inevitable that they will get it right sooner or later. 40yrs ago , nobody thought the Jap bikes would be worth it either.
mark_swart
Profile picture for user mark_swart
Posts
2524
Joined
11/2/2011
Location
Chapin, SC, USA
mark_swart 10/22/2014 3:55pm
10/22/2014 3:55pm
Racerx930 wrote:
Me and a buddy have a thing for odd ball bkes, we thought what could be more odd than this thing.i[img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2014/10/22/68204/s1200_asiawing.jpg[/img] We've raced it several times...
Me and a buddy have a thing for odd ball bkes, we thought what could be more odd than this thing.i

We've raced it several times in some some offroad "Team" races. The only time it didn't finish was right out of the crate. They mounted the coil literally up against the head. Thing started cutting out really bad and we found the coil was melted. Your standard $2 chinese coil had it up and running.


Cast aluminum bar mount bolt was broke in the crate, cast aluminum peg / stand mount broke. Front brake locked up the first time we rode it. After we sorted everything out it's been fine. Nether one of us ride it much anymore but it's the perfect buddy bike.
I'm really curious on this -- what did it cost? Is it dog slow? Where did you even buy it from?

Post a reply to: Has anybody actually seen these chinese bikes?