He was using it as a....

6/19/2014 8:43pm
This is the exact same argument that MMA fighters have been using to try and get away with taking TRT "its a disability so I need...
This is the exact same argument that MMA fighters have been using to try and get away with taking TRT "its a disability so I need meds to be normal, its not making me better then everyone else its putting me at their level" That's so bogus, if you are not as good without the stuff as you are with it, then its enhancing YOUR performance end of story, if James or any other rider is taking stuff that's on a banned list to get better results, its cheating end of story. Racing motocross is not a persons right, if you need banned meds to do it weather or not it gives you an edge, maybe its time to hang up the boots.
plowboy wrote:
You are proving my point. Little Johnny can't see the blackboard. His parents get him glasses and now he's the smartest kid in class. Expel the...
You are proving my point. Little Johnny can't see the blackboard. His parents get him glasses and now he's the smartest kid in class. Expel the little cheating fucker. He should succeed or fail on what God gave him...no assistance allowed. I get ya...
This isn't school, its a sport, its not James or any other persons God given right to race.......
mx836
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6/19/2014 8:48pm
So let me get this straight. You'd rather James retire than take adderall to cure an ADD condition if he indeed does have one? Don't read into my post, because that's all it is. A simple question.
6/19/2014 8:56pm
mx836 wrote:
So let me get this straight. You'd rather James retire than take adderall to cure an ADD condition if he indeed does have one? Don't read...
So let me get this straight. You'd rather James retire than take adderall to cure an ADD condition if he indeed does have one? Don't read into my post, because that's all it is. A simple question.
Unless he can cope with it in a manner that is legal under the rules set up by the racing bodies.... yeah I would. If you can't compete within the rules of a sport you shouldn't compete in it. For the record the only thing I know about Adderall is that its banned, so I'm not interested in arguing about weather or not its a PED
mx836
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6/19/2014 8:59pm
No worries. I'm not going to argue with you. I have a feeling it would be pointless.

The Shop

6/19/2014 9:02pm
mx836 wrote:
No worries. I'm not going to argue with you. I have a feeling it would be pointless.
As are most arguments on vital lol
plowboy
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6/19/2014 9:07pm
Unless he can cope with it in a manner that is legal under the rules set up by the racing bodies.... yeah I would. If you...
Unless he can cope with it in a manner that is legal under the rules set up by the racing bodies.... yeah I would. If you can't compete within the rules of a sport you shouldn't compete in it. For the record the only thing I know about Adderall is that its banned, so I'm not interested in arguing about weather or not its a PED
So you are calling Dennis Jonon a gimlet who should never have tried to race? You need to tell yer story walking dude.
zedbike
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6/19/2014 9:09pm


zedbike
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6/19/2014 9:15pm



one of my better photochops... :-)

drmarkr
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6/19/2014 9:15pm
Adderall is a PED. End of discussion.

In fact, when used chronically, it will have less of a PE effect than if used acutely for a sporting event.

Why he may have tested negative before won't be known, as only positive's are announced. Negatives are assumed from no positives.

Frankly, I consider it more damning that he HASN'T tested positive before....that actually suggests it was being used only for the competition, which is how you would gain the most benefit from it use.

Finally, there is absolutely NO excuse for his not filing a TUE for the med. With all he had/has to lose from this positive test...?? What the eff would he and his handlers be thinking to not do this?

plowboy
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6/19/2014 9:16pm
plowboy wrote:
So if an old boy was missing a thumb or had one leg shorter than the other or used corrective lenses they should be penalized or...
So if an old boy was missing a thumb or had one leg shorter than the other or used corrective lenses they should be penalized or banned cause they are using performance enhancing devices? A legally prescribed drug is no different than a prosthetic that corrects a physical or mental defect. IMHO.
hvaughn88 wrote:
Are those things on the list for being illegal? While I respect you guys' opinion on whether adderal is a PED or not, the fact remains...
Are those things on the list for being illegal? While I respect you guys' opinion on whether adderal is a PED or not, the fact remains that it's a non point because that's a different argument altogether. It doesn't matter how ridiculous a rule is. So yes, if the rules were to say that corrective lenses are illegal and you use them, you should be penalized. If it is a rule, it's a rule and you have to either follow it, serve punishment for violating the procedures, or get out. Some of you guys really need to seperate your personal opinion about a rule from your ability to understand a rule, because they are not always one and the same.
Hey buddy...I agree 100% about rules. But stupid rules made by stupid people need to be changed. Having all the top riders standing up and saying "let'sget rid of chewters but don't interfere with my doctors diagnosis and treatment". Seems like the smart way to get a balance between un-prescribed illegal drugs and legitimate doctor prescribed healing/coping meds.
6/19/2014 9:18pm
Unless he can cope with it in a manner that is legal under the rules set up by the racing bodies.... yeah I would. If you...
Unless he can cope with it in a manner that is legal under the rules set up by the racing bodies.... yeah I would. If you can't compete within the rules of a sport you shouldn't compete in it. For the record the only thing I know about Adderall is that its banned, so I'm not interested in arguing about weather or not its a PED
plowboy wrote:
So you are calling Dennis Jonon a gimlet who should never have tried to race? You need to tell yer story walking dude.
That's not what I'm saying at all.. don't twist my words!! If you can rise above injury and still compete your a champ in my book, but if rising above that injury means you have to take meds or any other equipment that is in a rule book listed as banned then no you shouldn't compete. How is that hard to understand?
Olson
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6/19/2014 9:22pm
Smeg , yes your right it greatly changed him this year, in fact im gna start selling mine at the track cause dr mark says it...
Smeg , yes your right it greatly changed him this year, in fact im gna start selling mine at the track cause dr mark says it will imorove you as a racer lol.
You can start selling EPO by the road too, the average Joe wont win Tour de France anyway.
Juss
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6/19/2014 9:24pm
smeg wrote:
....performance enhancer. Get real people. PED testing has been around how long??? Adderal has been on the ban list how long??? The sports community, every college...
....performance enhancer. Get real people.

PED testing has been around how long???
Adderal has been on the ban list how long???
The sports community, every college kid and the testing authorities have known for a decade or more it can improve concentration but somehow the Stewart camp was unaware they needed prior approval???

LOL........ anyone who thinks he "just happened to take a double dose on race day.... by accident..... really"(I would think the story will be something along those lines) is an idiot.


....and don't give me shit for starting a new thread... i start about 1 a year.
Who really gives a rats ass? Does it affect you and I?
Crush
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6/19/2014 9:29pm
drmarkr wrote:
Adderall is a PED. End of discussion. In fact, when used chronically, it will have less of a PE effect than if used acutely for a...
Adderall is a PED. End of discussion.

In fact, when used chronically, it will have less of a PE effect than if used acutely for a sporting event.

Why he may have tested negative before won't be known, as only positive's are announced. Negatives are assumed from no positives.

Frankly, I consider it more damning that he HASN'T tested positive before....that actually suggests it was being used only for the competition, which is how you would gain the most benefit from it use.

Finally, there is absolutely NO excuse for his not filing a TUE for the med. With all he had/has to lose from this positive test...?? What the eff would he and his handlers be thinking to not do this?

Interesting...

I asked else where, if he's on a prescription, then that would always come up. So in theory, is this likely to be a deviation from that?

Or if its positive does that mean it has acutely been used as you say?
plowboy
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6/19/2014 9:29pm
I get you completely. A rule is a rule. What I'm saying that a prosthitic device that is considered legal is no different REALLY.than a drug that makes a defective brain work more normally. I know this concept takes some experience and maturity to understand. I have lived it with family members so I finally "gotit". Not saying that your opinion makes you a fucktard just not completely knowledgeable of all the facts.
Crush
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6/19/2014 9:32pm
plowboy wrote:
I get you completely. A rule is a rule. What I'm saying that a prosthitic device that is considered legal is no different REALLY.than a drug...
I get you completely. A rule is a rule. What I'm saying that a prosthitic device that is considered legal is no different REALLY.than a drug that makes a defective brain work more normally. I know this concept takes some experience and maturity to understand. I have lived it with family members so I finally "gotit". Not saying that your opinion makes you a fucktard just not completely knowledgeable of all the facts.
Then again everyone can see Nelson is missing a thumb.... Just saying
mx836
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6/19/2014 9:35pm
drmarkr wrote:
Adderall is a PED. End of discussion. In fact, when used chronically, it will have less of a PE effect than if used acutely for a...
Adderall is a PED. End of discussion.

In fact, when used chronically, it will have less of a PE effect than if used acutely for a sporting event.

Why he may have tested negative before won't be known, as only positive's are announced. Negatives are assumed from no positives.

Frankly, I consider it more damning that he HASN'T tested positive before....that actually suggests it was being used only for the competition, which is how you would gain the most benefit from it use.

Finally, there is absolutely NO excuse for his not filing a TUE for the med. With all he had/has to lose from this positive test...?? What the eff would he and his handlers be thinking to not do this?

With that being said, do you really think it would provide enough of an advantage or that James would be stupid enough to take it for enhancing purposes and risk getting caught? This is adderall we are talking about. I highly doubt that James would take it for strictly enhancement purposes knowing what's on the line. There is no way that it can help that much.
2thefront
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6/19/2014 9:35pm
plowboy wrote:
I get you completely. A rule is a rule. What I'm saying that a prosthitic device that is considered legal is no different REALLY.than a drug...
I get you completely. A rule is a rule. What I'm saying that a prosthitic device that is considered legal is no different REALLY.than a drug that makes a defective brain work more normally. I know this concept takes some experience and maturity to understand. I have lived it with family members so I finally "gotit". Not saying that your opinion makes you a fucktard just not completely knowledgeable of all the facts.
You're assuming James needs the Adderall to make his brain "normal". That may or may not be the case here, whether he has a prescription or not.
ando
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6/19/2014 9:53pm
mx836 wrote:
So let me get this straight. You'd rather James retire than take adderall to cure an ADD condition if he indeed does have one? Don't read...
So let me get this straight. You'd rather James retire than take adderall to cure an ADD condition if he indeed does have one? Don't read into my post, because that's all it is. A simple question.
If those were the only two options, then yes.

However there is a third option - PRIOR to being tested, approach WADA with all the appropriate evidence to obtain a TUE, have it approved, and continue racing while taking Adderall.
mx836
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6/19/2014 9:55pm
mx836 wrote:
So let me get this straight. You'd rather James retire than take adderall to cure an ADD condition if he indeed does have one? Don't read...
So let me get this straight. You'd rather James retire than take adderall to cure an ADD condition if he indeed does have one? Don't read into my post, because that's all it is. A simple question.
ando wrote:
If those were the only two options, then yes. However there is a third option - PRIOR to being tested, approach WADA with all the appropriate...
If those were the only two options, then yes.

However there is a third option - PRIOR to being tested, approach WADA with all the appropriate evidence to obtain a TUE, have it approved, and continue racing while taking Adderall.
That is what I meant. Didn't think I had to break it down, but I guess I should have.
6/19/2014 9:55pm
peelout wrote:
Anyone else think it's fucking dorky they tested in Seattle and Lakewood?

I mean come on.
Dory indeed.

Coincidence??
rallendude
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6/19/2014 10:18pm
peelout wrote:
Anyone else think it's fucking dorky they tested in Seattle and Lakewood?

I mean come on.
What's dorky is the fact that they tested in Seattle and Lakewood and someone got busted for Adderol!!!!

All these years we've heard about people using EPOs and steroids and such. Who'd have guessed the drug that got the first person busted would be a downer?
FlaNard
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Layton, UT, USA
6/19/2014 10:23pm
drmarkr wrote:
Adderall is a PED. End of discussion. In fact, when used chronically, it will have less of a PE effect than if used acutely for a...
Adderall is a PED. End of discussion.

In fact, when used chronically, it will have less of a PE effect than if used acutely for a sporting event.

Why he may have tested negative before won't be known, as only positive's are announced. Negatives are assumed from no positives.

Frankly, I consider it more damning that he HASN'T tested positive before....that actually suggests it was being used only for the competition, which is how you would gain the most benefit from it use.

Finally, there is absolutely NO excuse for his not filing a TUE for the med. With all he had/has to lose from this positive test...?? What the eff would he and his handlers be thinking to not do this?

Interesting...I guess we have to wait and hear all the facts but that's interesting to know.
toroP
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6/19/2014 11:22pm
Just curious. Why is everyone convinced JS test positive for Adderall?
oldAFI
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6/19/2014 11:22pm
peelout wrote:
Anyone else think it's fucking dorky they tested in Seattle and Lakewood?

I mean come on.
rallendude wrote:
What's dorky is the fact that they tested in Seattle and Lakewood and someone got busted for Adderol!!!! All these years we've heard about people using...
What's dorky is the fact that they tested in Seattle and Lakewood and someone got busted for Adderol!!!!

All these years we've heard about people using EPOs and steroids and such. Who'd have guessed the drug that got the first person busted would be a downer?
It's an upper. Like a mild dose of speed.
oldAFI
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6/19/2014 11:23pm
toroP wrote:
Just curious. Why is everyone convinced JS test positive for Adderall?
no reason. It's a just a rumor that's starting to become "fact". Total bullshit.
IceMan446
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6/19/2014 11:52pm
drmarkr wrote:
Adderall is a PED. End of discussion. In fact, when used chronically, it will have less of a PE effect than if used acutely for a...
Adderall is a PED. End of discussion.

In fact, when used chronically, it will have less of a PE effect than if used acutely for a sporting event.

Why he may have tested negative before won't be known, as only positive's are announced. Negatives are assumed from no positives.

Frankly, I consider it more damning that he HASN'T tested positive before....that actually suggests it was being used only for the competition, which is how you would gain the most benefit from it use.

Finally, there is absolutely NO excuse for his not filing a TUE for the med. With all he had/has to lose from this positive test...?? What the eff would he and his handlers be thinking to not do this?

With all due respect, I am calling bullshit with this.

We dont know if he hasnt filed a TUE or not.

Not to mention, you are lumping adderall into a category with EPO and thats not even close. As a doctor, you should know better than that. Under NO circumstances will EPO be allowed even with a TUE. But adderall would be allowed, that should tell you something as far as whats really a PED and whats not.

Under that logic, using an inhaler for asthma should be considered a PED. So should aspirin, BCAAs or anything else that makes you better than you would normally be with out them. Under a doctors care EPO is helpful to those who need it. But it wont ever be allowed in competition no matter the circumstances.

I highly doubt James would be getting the support he is if he took EPO or was caught blood doping. And we dont even know what he tested positive for.

Lastly, if he filed a TUE and failed a test, no one would have known about it.



Crush
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6/20/2014 12:01am
IceMan446 wrote:
With all due respect, I am calling bullshit with this. We dont know if he hasnt filed a TUE or not. Not to mention, you are...
With all due respect, I am calling bullshit with this.

We dont know if he hasnt filed a TUE or not.

Not to mention, you are lumping adderall into a category with EPO and thats not even close. As a doctor, you should know better than that. Under NO circumstances will EPO be allowed even with a TUE. But adderall would be allowed, that should tell you something as far as whats really a PED and whats not.

Under that logic, using an inhaler for asthma should be considered a PED. So should aspirin, BCAAs or anything else that makes you better than you would normally be with out them. Under a doctors care EPO is helpful to those who need it. But it wont ever be allowed in competition no matter the circumstances.

I highly doubt James would be getting the support he is if he took EPO or was caught blood doping. And we dont even know what he tested positive for.

Lastly, if he filed a TUE and failed a test, no one would have known about it.



We can pretty much assume he hasn't filed a TUE or why would we even be hearing about this test, they would have got a positive, checked their records, oh James has a prescription cause he's got ADHD. Sweet. Let's goto Vegas.

But regardless, none of that doesn't change the rules or what is in the list. I don't like that I have to pay taxes. But fuck, you know what. That's the rules.

If I have a tax exemption because i'm registered as a prime producer, I get an allowance. But I have to do that ahead of time. That's the rules. If I don't, they go batshit. If I try tell them afterwards, they want proof.
theToothPerry
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6/20/2014 12:03am Edited Date/Time 6/20/2014 12:03am
Crush wrote:
We can pretty much assume he hasn't filed a TUE or why would we even be hearing about this test, they would have got a positive...
We can pretty much assume he hasn't filed a TUE or why would we even be hearing about this test, they would have got a positive, checked their records, oh James has a prescription cause he's got ADHD. Sweet. Let's goto Vegas.

But regardless, none of that doesn't change the rules or what is in the list. I don't like that I have to pay taxes. But fuck, you know what. That's the rules.

If I have a tax exemption because i'm registered as a prime producer, I get an allowance. But I have to do that ahead of time. That's the rules. If I don't, they go batshit. If I try tell them afterwards, they want proof.
Crush i know youre all over this and this is all just ammo for you, but you really need to look at the banned list WADA has and really consider what you wouldnt take without the knowledge or second guessing of it being on this list. Its absurd. And you think he was the only one that failed? hahah please. This was just the first press release.
Crush
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6/20/2014 12:10am Edited Date/Time 6/20/2014 12:13am
Crush i know youre all over this and this is all just ammo for you, but you really need to look at the banned list WADA...
Crush i know youre all over this and this is all just ammo for you, but you really need to look at the banned list WADA has and really consider what you wouldnt take without the knowledge or second guessing of it being on this list. Its absurd. And you think he was the only one that failed? hahah please. This was just the first press release.
I could give a fuck what's on the list bud.

Absurd or not, that's the list. Because Doctors much smarter than you or I have deemed it is an advantage.

The ones that have a medical reasoning behind them to take them, such as Adderall, have been given a frame work to allow them to be used, with due consideration of prior lodged paper work. Process. James, his Doctors, his crew, team whatever, all could have avoided this just by following procedure.

I know I take asthma medication. I know it. James would know what he's taking. Any sane person would just go, hey, what's in this shit, am I allowed to take it since i'm getting drug tested? Which, btw, again, this was the 2nd to last round.

It's not hard. If you don't follow the list tho, you run into a bunch of ethical and philosophical questions about what is performance enhancing, why not just let them cheat etc etc. You're almost saying it's a long list so I should be ok to get away with it because i'm fucking ignorant!

Have you read the laws around taxes? Around finances? Around loads of stuff. It's pretty complex and people abide by it fairly easily.

As for being the only one that has failed, he's the only one that has been made known, so since that's all i'm interested in, or what you or anyone else should be, why don't we keep the tin foil armadillo hat theories in the dumbgeon.

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