Chase sexton ghost ride bike in kawi pits hitting Marchbanks

DonM wrote:

I’m not suggesting that Chase is giving them an ultimatum at all and I doubt he is…Just saying if nothing changes it will not get better...

I’m not suggesting that Chase is giving them an ultimatum at all and I doubt he is…Just saying if nothing changes it will not get better and these morans have already had one top tier rider walk because of their inability to get the bike where it needs to be and to have another one do the same will put this team in a position that nobody will want to ride for them

RDnutz wrote:

I didn't say you did. You suggested Changing MANAGEMENT to resolve a RIDER problem on the team for a 2nd year in a row. A contract...

I didn't say you did. You suggested Changing MANAGEMENT to resolve a RIDER problem on the team for a 2nd year in a row. A contract is a contract is a contract. BOTH parties willing agreed to this contract with their own obligations spelled out. Kawi would be totally within their rights to make Chase honor his obligation under contract here.

erik_94COBRA wrote:

I am really tempted to make memes of this situation, but really do want Chase to get his shit together. He looked the most consistently good on...

I am really tempted to make memes of this situation, but really do want Chase to get his shit together. 

He looked the most consistently good on the Honda racing Jett and almost as good against Tomac. 

Then had flashes of greatness on the KTM. 

Hasn’t done shit yet on the Kawasaki. 

DonM wrote:

I’m not suggesting that Chase is giving them an ultimatum at all and I doubt he is…Just saying if nothing changes it will not get better...

I’m not suggesting that Chase is giving them an ultimatum at all and I doubt he is…Just saying if nothing changes it will not get better and these morans have already had one top tier rider walk because of their inability to get the bike where it needs to be and to have another one do the same will put this team in a position that nobody will want to ride for them

RDnutz wrote:

I didn't say you did. You suggested Changing MANAGEMENT to resolve a RIDER problem on the team for a 2nd year in a row. A contract...

I didn't say you did. You suggested Changing MANAGEMENT to resolve a RIDER problem on the team for a 2nd year in a row. A contract is a contract is a contract. BOTH parties willing agreed to this contract with their own obligations spelled out. Kawi would be totally within their rights to make Chase honor his obligation under contract here.

LouisianaMotocross wrote:

If you have many employees saying the same thing, you at least look at your management to see if improvements can be made. You can’t put...

If you have many employees saying the same thing, you at least look at your management to see if improvements can be made. You can’t put your head in the sand and not evaluate everyone because they are management. That’s crazy talk. 

DonM wrote:

If they get rid of the team management it will solve 75% of the issues….They can’t afford another top rider walking from the team as they...

If they get rid of the team management it will solve 75% of the issues….They can’t afford another top rider walking from the team as they will lose the rest of their credibility within the racing community….I personally don’t think Chase will walk if they make the right moves to get better people in leadership positions….If they don’t make any changes then nobody in the top tier will ride for them and they will only attract riders that nobody else wants…

RDnutz wrote:

ever hear the term "tail wagging the dog"? that's what you are advocating for- the rider having all the power and blame everything on management. If...

ever hear the term "tail wagging the dog"? that's what you are advocating for- the rider having all the power and blame everything on management. If Kawi doesn't make an example out of Chase and force him to honor this contract- it will spread like a disease to all the other teams as well with expectations that the rider will always drive changes in organizations, or they can just ignore the contract they signed and still cash out.

DonM wrote:

I’m not suggesting that Chase is giving them an ultimatum at all and I doubt he is…Just saying if nothing changes it will not get better...

I’m not suggesting that Chase is giving them an ultimatum at all and I doubt he is…Just saying if nothing changes it will not get better and these morans have already had one top tier rider walk because of their inability to get the bike where it needs to be and to have another one do the same will put this team in a position that nobody will want to ride for them

DonM wrote:

I’m not suggesting that Chase is giving them an ultimatum at all and I doubt he is…Just saying if nothing changes it will not get better...

I’m not suggesting that Chase is giving them an ultimatum at all and I doubt he is…Just saying if nothing changes it will not get better and these morans have already had one top tier rider walk because of their inability to get the bike where it needs to be and to have another one do the same will put this team in a position that nobody will want to ride for them

RDnutz wrote:

I didn't say you did. You suggested Changing MANAGEMENT to resolve a RIDER problem on the team for a 2nd year in a row. A contract...

I didn't say you did. You suggested Changing MANAGEMENT to resolve a RIDER problem on the team for a 2nd year in a row. A contract is a contract is a contract. BOTH parties willing agreed to this contract with their own obligations spelled out. Kawi would be totally within their rights to make Chase honor his obligation under contract here.

RDnutz wrote:

ever hear the term "tail wagging the dog"? that's what you are advocating for- the rider having all the power and blame everything on management. If...

ever hear the term "tail wagging the dog"? that's what you are advocating for- the rider having all the power and blame everything on management. If Kawi doesn't make an example out of Chase and force him to honor this contract- it will spread like a disease to all the other teams as well with expectations that the rider will always drive changes in organizations, or they can just ignore the contract they signed and still cash out.

DonM wrote:

I’m not suggesting that Chase is giving them an ultimatum at all and I doubt he is…Just saying if nothing changes it will not get better...

I’m not suggesting that Chase is giving them an ultimatum at all and I doubt he is…Just saying if nothing changes it will not get better and these morans have already had one top tier rider walk because of their inability to get the bike where it needs to be and to have another one do the same will put this team in a position that nobody will want to ride for them

Kenny Banyan wrote:

I believe there isn’t a rider in the field that isn’t already riding for a factory team , that wouldn’t jump at the chance to sign...

I believe there isn’t a rider in the field that isn’t already riding for a factory team , that wouldn’t jump at the chance to sign with Kawi.

DonM wrote:

I’m not suggesting that Chase is giving them an ultimatum at all and I doubt he is…Just saying if nothing changes it will not get better...

I’m not suggesting that Chase is giving them an ultimatum at all and I doubt he is…Just saying if nothing changes it will not get better and these morans have already had one top tier rider walk because of their inability to get the bike where it needs to be and to have another one do the same will put this team in a position that nobody will want to ride for them

Kenny Banyan wrote:

I believe there isn’t a rider in the field that isn’t already riding for a factory team , that wouldn’t jump at the chance to sign...

I believe there isn’t a rider in the field that isn’t already riding for a factory team , that wouldn’t jump at the chance to sign with Kawi.

DonM wrote:

Nobody that wants to win…

Kenny Banyan wrote:

I believe there isn’t a rider in the field that isn’t already riding for a factory team , that wouldn’t jump at the chance to sign...

I believe there isn’t a rider in the field that isn’t already riding for a factory team , that wouldn’t jump at the chance to sign with Kawi.

DonM wrote:

Nobody that wants to win…

Kenny Banyan wrote:

The bike that Chase is riding would be an upgrade to 80% of the field in SX and Nationals, and is a good machine. Chase won...

The bike that Chase is riding would be an upgrade to 80% of the field in SX and Nationals, and is a good machine. Chase won 2 races on it and Marchbanks has been running in the top 10 so far. 

RDnutz wrote:

I didn't say you did. You suggested Changing MANAGEMENT to resolve a RIDER problem on the team for a 2nd year in a row. A contract...

I didn't say you did. You suggested Changing MANAGEMENT to resolve a RIDER problem on the team for a 2nd year in a row. A contract is a contract is a contract. BOTH parties willing agreed to this contract with their own obligations spelled out. Kawi would be totally within their rights to make Chase honor his obligation under contract here.

LouisianaMotocross wrote:

If you have many employees saying the same thing, you at least look at your management to see if improvements can be made. You can’t put...

If you have many employees saying the same thing, you at least look at your management to see if improvements can be made. You can’t put your head in the sand and not evaluate everyone because they are management. That’s crazy talk. 

RDnutz wrote:

I don't know if there are "many" employees saying the same thing, but even if there was, it's irrelevant. Riders are independent contractors and beyond their...

I don't know if there are "many" employees saying the same thing, but even if there was, it's irrelevant. Riders are independent contractors and beyond their contract terms they have no say in how a company runs the business. This is not like a union here where employees can file grievances, etc. You better hope it never comes to that, or the sport is ruined the same way MLB, NFL, etc. are subject to work stoppages, strikes, etc. You think Feld would ever go for that? Be careful what you advocate for here...

DonM wrote:

Nobody that wants to win…

Kenny Banyan wrote:

The bike that Chase is riding would be an upgrade to 80% of the field in SX and Nationals, and is a good machine. Chase won...

The bike that Chase is riding would be an upgrade to 80% of the field in SX and Nationals, and is a good machine. Chase won 2 races on it and Marchbanks has been running in the top 10 so far. 

DonM wrote:

And Marchbanks type of riders are the only ones that will ride for them…I was talking about riders that can win not the ones that can’t...

And Marchbanks type of riders are the only ones that will ride for them…I was talking about riders that can win not the ones that can’t. If Kawi’s goal is to be 5th-10th then by all means keep on doing what they do….they just got beat by a team that’s in their 1st year… this is nothing more than Keith McCarty and Yam all over again.

Kenny Banyan wrote:

The bike that Chase is riding would be an upgrade to 80% of the field in SX and Nationals, and is a good machine. Chase won...

The bike that Chase is riding would be an upgrade to 80% of the field in SX and Nationals, and is a good machine. Chase won 2 races on it and Marchbanks has been running in the top 10 so far. 

DonM wrote:

And Marchbanks type of riders are the only ones that will ride for them…I was talking about riders that can win not the ones that can’t...

And Marchbanks type of riders are the only ones that will ride for them…I was talking about riders that can win not the ones that can’t. If Kawi’s goal is to be 5th-10th then by all means keep on doing what they do….they just got beat by a team that’s in their 1st year… this is nothing more than Keith McCarty and Yam all over again.

racinstation wrote:

I remember seeing this same statement over and over regarding Suzuki and Roczen.     It is always surprising what a positive atmosphere, testing, and a team...

I remember seeing this same statement over and over regarding Suzuki and Roczen.     

It is always surprising what a positive atmosphere, testing, and a team that gels can do to "fix" a bike.

LouisianaMotocross wrote:

I can tell you don’t run a company.I’m sure you will claim you do though.If you own a company you should want it to succeed. You...

I can tell you don’t run a company.

I’m sure you will claim you do though.

If you own a company you should want it to succeed. You can let the inmates run the asylum. At the same time you can’t have the prison guards killing the inmates. We can agree to disagree though. It’s ultimately a business philosophy and how you think an approach to succeeding works. 

LouisianaMotocross wrote:

I can tell you don’t run a company.I’m sure you will claim you do though.If you own a company you should want it to succeed. You...

I can tell you don’t run a company.

I’m sure you will claim you do though.

If you own a company you should want it to succeed. You can let the inmates run the asylum. At the same time you can’t have the prison guards killing the inmates. We can agree to disagree though. It’s ultimately a business philosophy and how you think an approach to succeeding works. 

RDnutz wrote:

correct, never ran a company.incorrect, never claimed to. Happily, retired for 12 years and you couldn't pay me enough to get back in the rat race.WTF...

correct, never ran a company.

incorrect, never claimed to. Happily, retired for 12 years and you couldn't pay me enough to get back in the rat race.

WTF does my work experiences have to do with it? Irrelevant to this discussion.

I'm very aware of employer/employee relations in their various forms and it's real easy to diagnose this one. You have an Independent Contractor working for a company who both signed the employment contract willingly. The bitch is in the details and whether each side upholds their obligations under said contract. Everything else is speculation and opinion.

LouisianaMotocross wrote:

I can tell you don’t run a company.I’m sure you will claim you do though.If you own a company you should want it to succeed. You...

I can tell you don’t run a company.

I’m sure you will claim you do though.

If you own a company you should want it to succeed. You can let the inmates run the asylum. At the same time you can’t have the prison guards killing the inmates. We can agree to disagree though. It’s ultimately a business philosophy and how you think an approach to succeeding works. 

RDnutz wrote:

correct, never ran a company.incorrect, never claimed to. Happily, retired for 12 years and you couldn't pay me enough to get back in the rat race.WTF...

correct, never ran a company.

incorrect, never claimed to. Happily, retired for 12 years and you couldn't pay me enough to get back in the rat race.

WTF does my work experiences have to do with it? Irrelevant to this discussion.

I'm very aware of employer/employee relations in their various forms and it's real easy to diagnose this one. You have an Independent Contractor working for a company who both signed the employment contract willingly. The bitch is in the details and whether each side upholds their obligations under said contract. Everything else is speculation and opinion.

Motofinne wrote:

I don't think it's a big question at all. It's just not sustainable to continue a relationship that is heading to the abyss like it is with...

I don't think it's a big question at all. 

It's just not sustainable to continue a relationship that is heading to the abyss like it is with Chase and the team. Nobody is a winner in a scenario where Chase is "forced" to stay, everybody would be miserable and Kawasaki would be wasting millions of dollars in salary expenses.

They will part ways like with Prado. It's the least shitty outcome out of many shitty outcomes (i assume nobody thinks they can turn this around anymore).

RDnutz wrote:

not a chance. I bet Kawi draws a red line here instead and tells Chase you're under contract to race- get your ass out there and...

not a chance. I bet Kawi draws a red line here instead and tells Chase you're under contract to race- get your ass out there and race- otherwise stay home and pout, but without paychecks and see you in court. This headcase rider can't always have the upper hand to dictate to his employers- it's not the way employment works in the real world- nor should it here.

DonM wrote:

If they get rid of the team management it will solve 75% of the issues….They can’t afford another top rider walking from the team as they...

If they get rid of the team management it will solve 75% of the issues….They can’t afford another top rider walking from the team as they will lose the rest of their credibility within the racing community….I personally don’t think Chase will walk if they make the right moves to get better people in leadership positions….If they don’t make any changes then nobody in the top tier will ride for them and they will only attract riders that nobody else wants…

DonM wrote:

And Marchbanks type of riders are the only ones that will ride for them…I was talking about riders that can win not the ones that can’t...

And Marchbanks type of riders are the only ones that will ride for them…I was talking about riders that can win not the ones that can’t. If Kawi’s goal is to be 5th-10th then by all means keep on doing what they do….they just got beat by a team that’s in their 1st year… this is nothing more than Keith McCarty and Yam all over again.

racinstation wrote:

I remember seeing this same statement over and over regarding Suzuki and Roczen.     It is always surprising what a positive atmosphere, testing, and a team...

I remember seeing this same statement over and over regarding Suzuki and Roczen.     

It is always surprising what a positive atmosphere, testing, and a team that gels can do to "fix" a bike.

Renner153 wrote:

Yeah, but if you dont have the right people to make the team gel, you wont get HEP results. Hence why Kawi is about to lose...

Yeah, but if you dont have the right people to make the team gel, you wont get HEP results. Hence why Kawi is about to lose more riders in two years than they have won races.

Sandberm656 wrote:

And it was at this point in the multi page thread where I went looking for the Stop Notifications tab.... 😑

Dirty Points wrote:

If Chase nearly hit Garrett with his bike during his little huff, and Keir decided Garret was the one who needed his behavior adjusted rather than...

If Chase nearly hit Garrett with his bike during his little huff, and Keir decided Garret was the one who needed his behavior adjusted rather than his own son, you really don't need to look much further to understand the dynamic at play.

The Wolf Man wrote:

It's disgraceful that most of the moto 'media' don't actually report anything. It's completely unacceptable. As mentioned earlier, they all say they know what happened, that...

It's disgraceful that most of the moto 'media' don't actually report anything. It's completely unacceptable. As mentioned earlier, they all say they know what happened, that someone told them 'exactly' what happened and yet never tell the public. Are they 'bros' or media? Clearly bros. The exception in this particular case is Weege. He said on the Racer X podcast that he heard it wasn't a ghostride so much as a not putting the bike on the stand and letting it drop to the ground. 

As for Chase's dad. He was lucky Marchbanks didn't drop him...

cappelmans wrote:

Oh come on, I like Weege, he’s great but hes also very much ‘broto media’. Just view one episode of the Weege show.

3strokemx wrote:

I think you're missing context about the "Contractors", there are only 8-10 in the world that can do the job you want, and most of them...

I think you're missing context about the "Contractors", there are only 8-10 in the world that can do the job you want, and most of them are already contracted somewhere else.  If your job is known as the worst one available, then even if you're lucky enough to hire a contractor, it's going to cost a lot more.

3strokemx wrote:

I think you're missing context about the "Contractors", there are only 8-10 in the world that can do the job you want, and most of them...

I think you're missing context about the "Contractors", there are only 8-10 in the world that can do the job you want, and most of them are already contracted somewhere else.  If your job is known as the worst one available, then even if you're lucky enough to hire a contractor, it's going to cost a lot more.

RDnutz wrote:

not sure I understand your point, but there is a list of experienced racers without contracts for next year posted here somewhere. Guys like Mookie and...

not sure I understand your point, but there is a list of experienced racers without contracts for next year posted here somewhere. Guys like Mookie and a couple others that are steady 5-10 racers each week and occasional podium. No worse than Barcia, Ferrandis, and the other guys riding Triumph, Beta, etc. 

Keep in mind the new KX450 drops for next year and supposedly has many or all the changes and fixes people said were needed. Plenty of the unsigned riders would jump at the chance to ride it and if I was Chase I would just lay low and ride the new bike before trying to force an exit- but that's just me.

DonM wrote:

I’m not suggesting that Chase is giving them an ultimatum at all and I doubt he is…Just saying if nothing changes it will not get better...

I’m not suggesting that Chase is giving them an ultimatum at all and I doubt he is…Just saying if nothing changes it will not get better and these morans have already had one top tier rider walk because of their inability to get the bike where it needs to be and to have another one do the same will put this team in a position that nobody will want to ride for them

RDnutz wrote:

I didn't say you did. You suggested Changing MANAGEMENT to resolve a RIDER problem on the team for a 2nd year in a row. A contract...

I didn't say you did. You suggested Changing MANAGEMENT to resolve a RIDER problem on the team for a 2nd year in a row. A contract is a contract is a contract. BOTH parties willing agreed to this contract with their own obligations spelled out. Kawi would be totally within their rights to make Chase honor his obligation under contract here.

DonM wrote:

I’m not suggesting that Chase is giving them an ultimatum at all and I doubt he is…Just saying if nothing changes it will not get better...

I’m not suggesting that Chase is giving them an ultimatum at all and I doubt he is…Just saying if nothing changes it will not get better and these morans have already had one top tier rider walk because of their inability to get the bike where it needs to be and to have another one do the same will put this team in a position that nobody will want to ride for them

RDnutz wrote:

I didn't say you did. You suggested Changing MANAGEMENT to resolve a RIDER problem on the team for a 2nd year in a row. A contract...

I didn't say you did. You suggested Changing MANAGEMENT to resolve a RIDER problem on the team for a 2nd year in a row. A contract is a contract is a contract. BOTH parties willing agreed to this contract with their own obligations spelled out. Kawi would be totally within their rights to make Chase honor his obligation under contract here.

DonM wrote:

Well this management team did choose the last two riders….It’s not a rider problem…

RDnutz wrote:

I didn't say you did. You suggested Changing MANAGEMENT to resolve a RIDER problem on the team for a 2nd year in a row. A contract...

I didn't say you did. You suggested Changing MANAGEMENT to resolve a RIDER problem on the team for a 2nd year in a row. A contract is a contract is a contract. BOTH parties willing agreed to this contract with their own obligations spelled out. Kawi would be totally within their rights to make Chase honor his obligation under contract here.

DonM wrote:

Well this management team did choose the last two riders….It’s not a rider problem…

ando wrote:

It is a rider problem… AND a team management problem.