Gajser and Herlings

Mavetism
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4/22/2026 7:01am
Gajser has the superior 450 resume, unquestionably. The question was who's career would you take? Man, thats a tough call. Do you value accolades or aura...

Gajser has the superior 450 resume, unquestionably. The question was who's career would you take? Man, thats a tough call. Do you value accolades or aura more? Tim has more big boy titles but peak Herlings could be the fastest rider ever. Its quite similar to RV and Dunge outdoors. Dunge has 39 wins vs RV's 13 wins. 3 titles vs RV's 2. Dunge also finished 2nd two season that he took the championship down to the last race. Do all the people who choose Herlings over Tim also choose Dungey over RV?

I'm torn between 2015 Tomac, 2016 Kenny, 2018 Herlings and Jett. I think those are the fastest guys/versions we have seen on a dirt bike. Just super hard to chose one, hypothetically anyone of those could probably win on their best day, probably depends more on the track they race on. Cairoli on his 350 was also unbeatable for 5 straight years, which still seems insane to me.

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Mavetism
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4/22/2026 7:07am
NicNak wrote:
What’s the stat on total times they’ve raced each other & who has beat who more ? I’m pretty confident Jeffrey would have beaten Tim more...

What’s the stat on total times they’ve raced each other & who has beat who more ? I’m pretty confident Jeffrey would have beaten Tim more times than not but it might be closer than I think. 

NVA57 wrote:
2016 - Gajser world title number one, Herlings still in MX2.2017 - Herlings came in injured, Gajser got injured halfway. Cairoli champ.2018 - Herlings world title...

2016 - Gajser world title number one, Herlings still in MX2.

2017 - Herlings came in injured, Gajser got injured halfway. Cairoli champ.

2018 - Herlings world title number one, Gajser broke his jaw pre-season in Mantova.

2019 - Gajser title number two, Herlings injured.

2020 - Gajser title number three, Herlings injured.

2021 - Herlings title number two, this was a very close one, despite Herlings picking up an injury halfway.

2022 - Gajser title number four, Herlings injured.

2023 - Both Herlings and Gajser injured, Prado champ.

2024 - A very close battle between Prado and Gajser, Herlings a little distant third.

2025 - Both Herlings and Gajser injured, Febvre champ.

 

So 2021 and 2024 are really the only years where they both went head to head for a full season. Herlings missed three motos though, so he was just outright better in 2021. In 2024, neither became champion, but Gajser came closer than Herlings. If not for destroying his footpeg in the penultimate round, he could've won his fifth title that year.

Gajsers pre season crash in 2018 was also one of the nastiest things I've ever seen in this sport. That could have been a career ending that day..

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4/22/2026 7:12am

Herlings stats are so inflated from the 250 days. Bottom line is he’s had a disappointing 450 career, considering the hype. Tim has overachieved the whole way thru. Even right now, huuuuge Herlings hype for winning on a bike that has 4 world titles since 2016. Meanwhile Tim celebrates winning a moto on a bike that hasn’t won shit in the same timeframe and people are like “calm down”.

Tim over Jeff and it’s not close. 4 titles to 2. 

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Johnny Ringo
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4/22/2026 7:28am
Edge to Herlings for not only his sheer amount of wins, but his dominant seasons and rides.  Greatest MXGP rider though, probably Stefan Everts or Tony...

Edge to Herlings for not only his sheer amount of wins, but his dominant seasons and rides.  Greatest MXGP rider though, probably Stefan Everts or Tony Cairoli, although some argue Joël Robert or Roger DeCoster.  

agn5008 wrote:
I lean more toward giving the edge to Gajser. The ultimate goal is to win championships, not races. My guess is Herlings would trade those wins...

I lean more toward giving the edge to Gajser. The ultimate goal is to win championships, not races. My guess is Herlings would trade those wins for championships in a heartbeat. This is coming from a huge Herlings fan, but the reality is one guy has 4 championships and the other has 2. It’s not like Herlings has 50 more wins than Gajser either, it’s only 6 more. Was Herlings more “dominant” in his prime? Sure. But that means nothing in the records books. 

The goal is to win titles, but there are many other variables at play.  For example, RC has more 125 titles than James Stewart, but many...

The goal is to win titles, but there are many other variables at play.  For example, RC has more 125 titles than James Stewart, but many consider James the greatest 125cc racer of all time -- mostly because of his wins and sheer dominance over the competition.  Likewise, many consider Roger DeCoster or Antonio Cairoli the GOAT of Europe, but both have less titles than Stefan Everts. Some would argue that Everts faced less competition than Cairoli, or that he'd likely have less titles if certain riders didn't make the move out of the class and to America to race.

The record books record wins/win percentages/titles and things like that, but they do not account for other variables such as how competitive the class was. Roman Febvre won the 2025 MXGP title, and that in an of itself is a major accomplishment that he should be very proud of.  But the facts are that some major players were out for most of the season and the class wasn't as stacked as previous years.  All this should be considered when talking about all-time greats.

RC and James both have 4 125 titles

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The Shop

pietjan
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4/22/2026 7:47am

like David Vuillemin said in his podcast. JH is the best GP rider ever. 

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Press516
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Both are all time GP greats!  But I give the edge to Gajser just for the 450 titles alone.  That’s why they are paid to race and Tim has twice as many as Jeffrey.  

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philG
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4/22/2026 8:18am

Someone tell me a memorable race that Gajser won .  

The only one that leaps out at me is MXoN where he did Jett on the last turn. 

He isnt an exciting rider, he just gets the job done, very very well. 

I can think of 2 races already this season where JH has just astounded everyone.. Race 1 in Argentina, and Race 1 at Arco. 

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4/22/2026 8:46am
philG wrote:
Someone tell me a memorable race that Gajser won .  The only one that leaps out at me is MXoN where he did Jett on the...

Someone tell me a memorable race that Gajser won .  

The only one that leaps out at me is MXoN where he did Jett on the last turn. 

He isnt an exciting rider, he just gets the job done, very very well. 

I can think of 2 races already this season where JH has just astounded everyone.. Race 1 in Argentina, and Race 1 at Arco. 

That race against Cairoli in Mantova was pretty memorable. 

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NVA57
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4/22/2026 9:19am
philG wrote:
Someone tell me a memorable race that Gajser won .  The only one that leaps out at me is MXoN where he did Jett on the...

Someone tell me a memorable race that Gajser won .  

The only one that leaps out at me is MXoN where he did Jett on the last turn. 

He isnt an exciting rider, he just gets the job done, very very well. 

I can think of 2 races already this season where JH has just astounded everyone.. Race 1 in Argentina, and Race 1 at Arco. 

Moto 2 in russia. Can’t remember what year, but crashed at the start and came back to P1. Yes he also passed Jeffrey. 

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4/22/2026 9:24am Edited Date/Time 4/22/2026 9:25am
philG wrote:
Someone tell me a memorable race that Gajser won .  The only one that leaps out at me is MXoN where he did Jett on the...

Someone tell me a memorable race that Gajser won .  

The only one that leaps out at me is MXoN where he did Jett on the last turn. 

He isnt an exciting rider, he just gets the job done, very very well. 

I can think of 2 races already this season where JH has just astounded everyone.. Race 1 in Argentina, and Race 1 at Arco. 

There's a LOT

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pietjan
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4/22/2026 11:15am
philG wrote:
Someone tell me a memorable race that Gajser won .  The only one that leaps out at me is MXoN where he did Jett on the...

Someone tell me a memorable race that Gajser won .  

The only one that leaps out at me is MXoN where he did Jett on the last turn. 

He isnt an exciting rider, he just gets the job done, very very well. 

I can think of 2 races already this season where JH has just astounded everyone.. Race 1 in Argentina, and Race 1 at Arco. 

NVA57 wrote:

Moto 2 in russia. Can’t remember what year, but crashed at the start and came back to P1. Yes he also passed Jeffrey. 

Almost no one remembers this. That is the whole point.

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Press516
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4/22/2026 11:25am
philG wrote:
Someone tell me a memorable race that Gajser won .  The only one that leaps out at me is MXoN where he did Jett on the...

Someone tell me a memorable race that Gajser won .  

The only one that leaps out at me is MXoN where he did Jett on the last turn. 

He isnt an exciting rider, he just gets the job done, very very well. 

I can think of 2 races already this season where JH has just astounded everyone.. Race 1 in Argentina, and Race 1 at Arco. 

NVA57 wrote:

Moto 2 in russia. Can’t remember what year, but crashed at the start and came back to P1. Yes he also passed Jeffrey. 

That was 2021 and the one that I remember also.  He didn't actually go down, but did start dead last after an off track excursion ignited by Prado.

https://youtu.be/7Rpv7MoBhl8?si=-4Cd_Uz8Xb6M_QmQ

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cesar_rc4
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4/22/2026 11:27am

To me its Herlings the fastest and Gajser acomplish more.

I checked on Sunday and Gajser had 47 MXGP win and Herlings 53.

 

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NicNak
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4/22/2026 1:31pm

thanks for all the responses guys. I was just curious more on races than championships. how many times have gasjer & herlings been in the same race & who has beat who more? that's probably a lot to dig up but these statisticians are next level nowadays so figured it's worth a shot.

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The Wolf Man
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4/22/2026 2:35pm
Herlings stats are so inflated from the 250 days. Bottom line is he’s had a disappointing 450 career, considering the hype. Tim has overachieved the whole...

Herlings stats are so inflated from the 250 days. Bottom line is he’s had a disappointing 450 career, considering the hype. Tim has overachieved the whole way thru. Even right now, huuuuge Herlings hype for winning on a bike that has 4 world titles since 2016. Meanwhile Tim celebrates winning a moto on a bike that hasn’t won shit in the same timeframe and people are like “calm down”.

Tim over Jeff and it’s not close. 4 titles to 2. 

Yes, but it depends on whether you think titles are the most important metric in judging how great a rider is. Sometimes the number of titles match the overall greatness - think RV with 450 SX - but oftentimes not. Webb is the prime example. If anyone thinks he is a better SX rider than JS because he has 3 titles to the latter's 2, they are tripping on some very strong acid. 

The same applies for Gaiser. I don't know how you could watch The Bullet (at his peak) and Gaiser ride and not select Herlings. Finally, Dunge and RV outdoors? Apart from a few races during the 2011 season where RV was strugglng with the bike - he still won anyway - he always had Dunge covered. 

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philG
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4/22/2026 3:06pm
philG wrote:
Someone tell me a memorable race that Gajser won .  The only one that leaps out at me is MXoN where he did Jett on the...

Someone tell me a memorable race that Gajser won .  

The only one that leaps out at me is MXoN where he did Jett on the last turn. 

He isnt an exciting rider, he just gets the job done, very very well. 

I can think of 2 races already this season where JH has just astounded everyone.. Race 1 in Argentina, and Race 1 at Arco. 

NVA57 wrote:

Moto 2 in russia. Can’t remember what year, but crashed at the start and came back to P1. Yes he also passed Jeffrey. 

pietjan wrote:

Almost no one remembers this. That is the whole point.

Exactly this. 

Gajser is a great rider and 5 time Champion, nobody can take that away from him, i am a big fan, and while i know he has won lots of races, he does it by getting good starts and amassing points, and very rarely crashing. And he is fast, no doubt.  

But i could say the same about Prado, i cant remember a race where i said ' wow that was unreal' simply because he gets starts and wins, but i dont remember him doing anything other than that ( i know he probably has) , its his MO, whereas Herlings has done so many that you cant remember them all. 

Everyone remembers Sexton winning at Hangtown , epic race, some riders have those, and some just dont, and that was my point. 

Everyone remembers Mike Larrocco being a charger, but he had to be cos he could never get out of the gate. 

Nobody lucks into a Championship anywhere, but if nobody was injured, Herlings would have won way more.  

But whatever your opinion is, MXGP this year, with all riders fit, so far , it has been epic.  Gajser finding his form will only add to that , as will KdW getting back to fitness. 

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philG
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4/22/2026 3:25pm
NVA57 wrote:

Moto 2 in russia. Can’t remember what year, but crashed at the start and came back to P1. Yes he also passed Jeffrey. 

That was round 8 of the 2021 series. 

Herlings missed the first 7 through a pre season injury. 

And he didnt crash, he ran off track , in a flyaway field. 

Still good, but not memorable.  Else i would have remembered LOL. 

 

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Derpin' DJ
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4/22/2026 3:32pm
Mavetism wrote:
Gajsers pre season crash in 2018 was also one of the nastiest things I've ever seen in this sport. That could have been a career ending...

Gajsers pre season crash in 2018 was also one of the nastiest things I've ever seen in this sport. That could have been a career ending that day..

Far out, don't know if I had ever seen that. Brutal

4/22/2026 4:35pm

what matters is who has the most titles. Yeah Herlings has the raw speed but has missed a lot with injuries and tim is more calculated with raw speed himself.  I'll give the nod to tim for now. 

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4/22/2026 6:03pm
NVA57 wrote:

Moto 2 in russia. Can’t remember what year, but crashed at the start and came back to P1. Yes he also passed Jeffrey. 

philG wrote:
That was round 8 of the 2021 series. Herlings missed the first 7 through a pre season injury. And he didnt crash, he ran off track , in...

That was round 8 of the 2021 series. 

Herlings missed the first 7 through a pre season injury. 

And he didnt crash, he ran off track , in a flyaway field. 

Still good, but not memorable.  Else i would have remembered LOL. 

 

Not 2021. 2021 was the epic season where Herlings won. 

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Park Boys
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4/22/2026 6:46pm
philG wrote:
Exactly this. Gajser is a great rider and 5 time Champion, nobody can take that away from him, i am a big fan, and while i know...

Exactly this. 

Gajser is a great rider and 5 time Champion, nobody can take that away from him, i am a big fan, and while i know he has won lots of races, he does it by getting good starts and amassing points, and very rarely crashing. And he is fast, no doubt.  

But i could say the same about Prado, i cant remember a race where i said ' wow that was unreal' simply because he gets starts and wins, but i dont remember him doing anything other than that ( i know he probably has) , its his MO, whereas Herlings has done so many that you cant remember them all. 

Everyone remembers Sexton winning at Hangtown , epic race, some riders have those, and some just dont, and that was my point. 

Everyone remembers Mike Larrocco being a charger, but he had to be cos he could never get out of the gate. 

Nobody lucks into a Championship anywhere, but if nobody was injured, Herlings would have won way more.  

But whatever your opinion is, MXGP this year, with all riders fit, so far , it has been epic.  Gajser finding his form will only add to that , as will KdW getting back to fitness. 

I don’t think Gajsers is that great of a starter. Every great rider goes in spurts where they go on a start run it seems but overall I think that’s arguably his biggest weakness. Herlings starts are vastly underrated and Gajsers overrated. 

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Ozy
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4/22/2026 6:49pm

did Herlings adapt to the HRC 450  really quickly? I wonder if Tiga just started getting his Yamaha dialed to his liking? He has been off the pace until his moto 2 win

 

MXMattii
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4/22/2026 7:45pm
cesar_rc4 wrote:

To me its Herlings the fastest and Gajser acomplish more.

I checked on Sunday and Gajser had 47 MXGP win and Herlings 53.

 

Cairoli has 70 MXGP wins and Everts (if you combine his 500cc, 250cc and MXGP wins together) 87 wins in the premier classes. Herlings stayed too long in the MX2 class, till this day he has more MX2 wins then MXGP wins. If he would've made the jump after his second title he wouldn't end up with his endless injury record. Because with staying down in the MX2 class, he tried to find crazy challenges for himself (Riding faster than 450 class, lapping the complete field, ...) to stay motivated and not to lose anything of his speed, and at the same time he knew in the back of his mind that he could win that class when he raced at 85%. That wasn't a healthy situation.

If he jumped to the MXGP class after his first two championships, with that momentum of invincibility, he could've destroyed all records in the record books!

Also a nice stat from Herlings, if you only count the races he really entered his win ratio is 53%, if you count all races he could've raced but didn't due to injury his win ratio drops to 39%, that is about the same as Everts who has 38% win ratio if you count all races he could've raced.

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super_fan_38
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4/22/2026 8:25pm Edited Date/Time 4/22/2026 8:30pm

RC and James both have 4 125 titles

Not talking about regional sx titles.  RC has three 125 outdoor titles and James has two, but many people consider James the greatest 125cc racer of all-time. It's an opinion I happen to share, though I'd put Mark Barnett a close second (possibly even a tie) because he faced stronger competition than James did.  I view Herlings in the same way when talking about Herlings vs Gajser.  Tim has a better MXGP record as far as titles, but Herlings still gets the nod from me since he has more GP wins and his wins were usually dominant. Herlings lapped our then 250 National Champion, Brake Bagget, at the 2012 MXdN, and nearly lapped Dungey.  I've never seen a ride like that from Gajser.

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Adam43
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4/22/2026 8:45pm

Broc Glover has more AMA titles than James Stewart, but they are not viewed in the same way.

Herlings all the way.

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rym
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4/23/2026 1:45am
cesar_rc4 wrote:

To me its Herlings the fastest and Gajser acomplish more.

I checked on Sunday and Gajser had 47 MXGP win and Herlings 53.

 

MXMattii wrote:
Cairoli has 70 MXGP wins and Everts (if you combine his 500cc, 250cc and MXGP wins together) 87 wins in the premier classes. Herlings stayed too...

Cairoli has 70 MXGP wins and Everts (if you combine his 500cc, 250cc and MXGP wins together) 87 wins in the premier classes. Herlings stayed too long in the MX2 class, till this day he has more MX2 wins then MXGP wins. If he would've made the jump after his second title he wouldn't end up with his endless injury record. Because with staying down in the MX2 class, he tried to find crazy challenges for himself (Riding faster than 450 class, lapping the complete field, ...) to stay motivated and not to lose anything of his speed, and at the same time he knew in the back of his mind that he could win that class when he raced at 85%. That wasn't a healthy situation.

If he jumped to the MXGP class after his first two championships, with that momentum of invincibility, he could've destroyed all records in the record books!

Also a nice stat from Herlings, if you only count the races he really entered his win ratio is 53%, if you count all races he could've raced but didn't due to injury his win ratio drops to 39%, that is about the same as Everts who has 38% win ratio if you count all races he could've raced.

Imo the 500cc class was allready for a long time not being considered the premier class by the time Everts started riding it. 

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kage173
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4/23/2026 3:53am Edited Date/Time 4/23/2026 4:01am
pietjan wrote:

like David Vuillemin said in his podcast. JH is the best GP rider ever. 

He is, by objective measurement, NOT the best GP rider ever. Maybe the best MX2 rider. Maybe the greatest hype.

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MX Maaike
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4/23/2026 4:11am

Think of Stefan Everts; he won another 6 titles in a row starting from the age of 28. Herlings and Gajser are not out of the game yet. Herlings is behind Gajser, that much is clear.

My prediction is that De Wolf is going to thwart that. He is developing into the alpha male this year, and his entourage will explain to him that he really is the best and most complete. He doesn't see it himself yet, but as soon as he believes it, his track record starts to count.

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MBR
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4/23/2026 4:20am

I have to go with Gajser: More MXGP championships, he is maybe the most down to earth pro athlete that I have ever met and of course this scrub, that I filmed back in the day at MXGP of Germany 😄 

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philG
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4/23/2026 4:30am

Not 2021. 2021 was the epic season where Herlings won. 

You are correct, i had too many windows open .  

I didnt find the results for 2021 because its down as MFR and not Russia. 

He came from 9th at the end of lap 1 to win, it doesnt leap out of my memory banks, but i do remember a few good battles at that track. 

 

Anyway, we are blessed for sure this year. 

I saw that Herlings is in to ride a race in the UK again, that isnt a British Championship, but not sure when /where. 

 

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