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That kind of behavior will not be tolerated on this board.
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Granted, the bikes have advanced incrementally over the years since 2005 as should be expected, but we should all consider a few points very carefully before succumbing to the sheeple belief that 2 strokes have submitted to the 4 $strokes in competition. I want to point out some things that can easily lead one to the conclusion that 2 strokes were completely eliminated from pro Supercross/Motocross starting in 2006 through changes in policy, NOT through defeat in competition.
First of all, we should remember that 2005 was the last year for factory supported 2 strokes in Supercross/Motocross. By that time, 4 $trokes were well along in their development, and certainly not unrecognizable by today's standards. The new 4 $trokes were powerful, had aluminum frames, and all the finest accouterments the factories could furnish to go along with the 200 extra cc's furnished by the AMA, but they still couldn't win out on the track.
The fact is that except for the opening round, in which Kevin Windham took 1st on his CRF450, no 4 $troke won a single supercross class event for the entire season! And that one 4 $troke victory probably only happened because RC fell 2 times during the race, Bubba crashed, and Chad Reed seized up his front wheel somehow.
In total, 4 $trokes only managed 19 finishes within the top 5 out of 80 possible for the 2005 season. 1 first place, 2 second places, 6 third places, 5 fourth places, and 5 fifth places.
This isn't really a great showing by any stretch of the imagination. Looking over these crap hole results, it's kind of hard to understand why the magazines and the race announcers were so lovey dovey over the fart bikes... I mean, god, some of the articles at the time were so sugary sweet on the heavy pigs that it's nauseating. And at the same time, the whole motocross press played a somber song each time they mentioned 2 strokes, saying the breed would surely be gone soon, talking about them as if they were dated "vintage" machinery even while they handed the new 4 $trokes their ass in race after race! What a joke!
As a fun example check out the race linked below where the leading 4 $troke piloted by Kevin Windham can only be said to be doing well among lappers, since he didn't go a lap down until lap #17! This didn't happen because of a crash or anything anomalous, he was upright and charging to the best of his fuel boiler's abilities until the end of the race, but that's all he could beat out of his superior, modern, kashima coated blah blah blah 4 $troke, and the dated 2 strokes lapped him, a whole friggin group of them!
He was the top finishing 4 stroke rider in the race, by the way...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ogGPrvX0x68 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TEX_EWWjP5Y
It's impossible to see races from this time period and not immediately recognize the vast superiority of the 2 stroke machines that were fielded by the top teams, and even the 2nd tier teams for that matter. (Larocco!)
The following year 2006 all of a sudden there wasn't a single 2 Stroke entry in the whole field??? Huh? WHAT?
You see, by this time the 2 strokes had clearly become a real thorn in the side for the manufacturer's and their big plan...
For years, they had been using every method available to try to convince everyone that "To win, you need to be on a 4 $troke". Only problem was, unless there were no 2 strokes to speak of in a race, the 4 strokes couldn't win even with their tremendous displacement handicap.
Kind of hard for them to successfully convince everyone of 4 $troke superiority while they are taking a cream pie in the face each weekend from the very machines they are trying to wave a fond farewell to and dismiss... Laughable bullshit really!
Get a load of these announce-a-tards from this 2003 Round. Are they pushing the 4 stroke agenda hard enough? People passing for the lead, and the bike they're on doesn't get a mention.... People passing for like 3rd place on a 4 $troke, and the announce-a-tards dutifully recite half the sales brochure for the piece of shit!!!
http://www.youtube.com/...s32Fwu5xkaQ&NR=1
One of my favorite parts in the above video is where Clark Stiles dumps in CRF. He picks it up and the camera shows his first 100 or so kicks as he tries to restart the thing... Eventually, a dirt bike savvy announce-a-tard comes in and says Clark is on a "Honda 250" HAHAHA! Any retard who's just watching on TV can take one look at the thing and see it's a 4 $troke, but they were trying so hard to hype them at the time that there was no way they wanted to broadcast 10 or 12 seconds of a guy kicking and kicking and kicking to try to get one of the cow patties started. So they just lied and said it was a 250 and hoped no one would notice as he pedaled away on the thing.
I only think it's funny because I know how unlikely it would be for them to legitimately make that mistake. They know exactly what everyone's riding!
Up until I saw some of these races, I thought bike manufacturers only advertised in expensive commercials... But you'd have to be an idiot to watch these races and not suspect that a couple of nice checks went out to the race announcers for the advertising THEY were doing IN BETWEEN commercials! HAHAHAHA!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Ks-eFYXxJM
Are people really supposed to believe that no professional racer would have run a 2 stroke in Supercross 06 if the manufacturer's hadn't made it known to all concerned that it was a "No can do" in 06?
Clearly there were already rules in place in 05. This explains why Tortelli, a die hard 2 stroke guy, was running the 450 porker in supercross 05 with Suzuki. It must have gone something like: "We are fielding 2 Supercross Class riders this season, one of you must ride the RM-Z 450.... We can't put both of you out there on the RM250 because that wouldn't be good for the image of the 450..." Then Carmichael says something like, "Well, I'm riding the RM250... I'm the #1 guy on this team and he's the support guy..." So there you go, Tortelli get's the 450.
I'm willing to bet that for 2006, it was made clear to everyone at the pro level that NO ONE who had a golden ticket would be riding a 2 stroke, AND that no one who hoped to get a golden ticket at any point in the future should ride one either, wink wink, nudge nudge... If no one was out there on a 2 stroke, the 4 strokes could finally shine! They could finally win!
You see after almost a decade of 4 strokes, they had realized that no matter how they reshuffled the rules, the only way to ensure 4 stroke victory was to get all the 2 strokes off the gate. Up until there were NO 2 stokes in the races, the 4 strokes lost ALMOST EVERY TIME.
And for some reason there is not one professional privateer able to qualify on one. Acually I think a couple of guys have qualified them but no one has raced em competitively since 2006.
James Stewart: "a 450".
And I'm one that misses the 2t racing! But there's something to that 4t putting it to the ground better than a 2t, I think.
RC has also stated, "yeah, that old 2t just doesn't put it to the ground like the 450s do". Speaking of his Suz RM250 2t at his track in FL.
Think of KDub sort of like a reference constant. After all, he's been on a 4 $troke from all the way back then until now. Let's assume for a moment that he hasn't gotten any older in 5 years, and his pace has stayed roughly the same.... He was NOT really a front running threat against Chad, James, Larocco, or apparently DV12.... when those guys rode their factory 2 strokes... I mean shit he got lapped on a dry track with no falls.... He's a front runner these days more often it seems, and if not he CERTAINLY isn't going to get LAPPED.
Do you think that is because the front runners back then on the 2 strokes were slower???
Of course all the pros said things like that. What else do you think they are allowed to say? I'll bet the fact is that the TOP guys had a choice up until the end of 2005, and then NO ONE had a choice anymore... Just look at Chad from 05 on the YZ and then 06 on the YZF...
Does that really look like a man who "Chose" to wrestle that pig around a supercross track? He's a shell of what he had been on the YZ. Do you think Tortelli actually "Wanted" to ride the RMZ450 in 05? While Ricky rode the RM??? Common sense alone makes it obvious that with 2 riders out there in the class, they made one of them ride the 4$troke and the lesser guy on the team was that guy.
I want to keep checking further into this, but I seriously doubt that there was a "Choice" about which way to go after 05.
That should be obvious. Problem #1 is that there is only 1 up to date 2 stroke at this time and although it's a fantastic machine it doesn't have linkage and in the Pro ranks every equipment advantage matters.
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Maybe Kawi should have had James on the 250f instead of the KX
well done .
" I don't know that I like the 250 four-strokes in the 125 class. It is too much of an advantage. They are double the size of our KX125's. Double! The legal four-strokes in the 250 class aren't double. The legal four strokes in the 80 class aren't double. You need to find a happy medium, and 250 ain't it. They are going to keep getting better, too. Right now, the 125's can run with them with momentum and speed in the corners, but what happens when you get behind them is that they slow down in the corners because they don't corner as well. They squirt the first ten or twenty feet, and then you have to try and run them down. That's hard. They get great starts too because of their traction. They have a big advantage here. You get little kids getting off an 80cc bike and they'll have to go to a 250. It is too big for tham, too heavy and they can't start the things. All the manufacturers are working on them, and unfortunately we'll all be racing them in a few years."
Quoted in MXA, Sept. 2001.
I especially like the "unfortunately" part. He knew what was coming and after dominating that class with his 2 strokes for the past decade had to completely rethink his way of doing business. I can completely understand why he would not want 250 2 strokes in with the 250 4 strokes now after all his investment in the 4 stroke program. It was as screwed up then as it is now. The 125 got killed off and shouldn't have. That is the one bike that still has its place in motocross both here in the U.S. and abroad. It needs to come back.
http://www.vitalmx.com/forums/Motodrive,19/Mitch-Payton-on-250s-in-the-…
Pit Row
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