Prime Lenses for Motocross Photography?

COAL-TRAIN
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11/7/2024 5:27pm

I understand that the 70-200mm f2.8 is basically the standard, but could something like a 135mm f1.8 be a better budget alternative?

COAL-TRAIN wrote:
I read through this thread and sorry if I missed what camera you are using. I have a lot of photography knowledge and work with a...

I read through this thread and sorry if I missed what camera you are using. I have a lot of photography knowledge and work with a lot of photographers.  For sure mirrorless is way overrated. The canon 1d series all the way through are great. 70-200 2.8 Canon is great. That combo is hard to beat and more user friendly than the new mirrorless. Another lens that is fun is the 16-35 ii 2.8. you need to be pretty close to the subject for this lens. Then...for some real fun...Canon 8-15 but that requires a helmet and a chest protector lol.

I'll post some stuff I did with with a fisheye (8-15 type) when I get a moment. Unfortunately I used a Canon 7dii and that camera  is a crop and has focus issues for the most part.

 

COAL-TRAIN wrote:
PXL 20241108 012252610

That's Townley. I held camera up and was probably 3-4 feet away. Sorry for the shit example of a photo 🥂

1
COAL-TRAIN
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11/7/2024 5:34pm
COAL-TRAIN wrote:
I read through this thread and sorry if I missed what camera you are using. I have a lot of photography knowledge and work with a...

I read through this thread and sorry if I missed what camera you are using. I have a lot of photography knowledge and work with a lot of photographers.  For sure mirrorless is way overrated. The canon 1d series all the way through are great. 70-200 2.8 Canon is great. That combo is hard to beat and more user friendly than the new mirrorless. Another lens that is fun is the 16-35 ii 2.8. you need to be pretty close to the subject for this lens. Then...for some real fun...Canon 8-15 but that requires a helmet and a chest protector lol.

I'll post some stuff I did with with a fisheye (8-15 type) when I get a moment. Unfortunately I used a Canon 7dii and that camera  is a crop and has focus issues for the most part.

 

COAL-TRAIN wrote:
PXL 20241108 012252610
COAL-TRAIN wrote:

That's Townley. I held camera up and was probably 3-4 feet away. Sorry for the shit example of a photo 🥂

PXL 20241108 012923930 0.jpg?VersionId=xDNQmNIoRnweIcxgA8RJFyiT
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T-Fish
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11/7/2024 7:54pm

The plan is to upgrade to full frame (Canon R8) next year

I would suggest getting an R6 or R6II by then as they are more professional bodies with joysticks and proper dials.  The R8 will work, but...

I would suggest getting an R6 or R6II by then as they are more professional bodies with joysticks and proper dials.  The R8 will work, but smaller battery and it won't perform as well for moto with smaller buffer, etc.  You could pickup a used R6 right now for about $1k which would be your best investment to get you into mirrorless and use it with your 70-200 f/4.  You asked about a 135 f/1.8, but I would suggest the 135 f/2 for Canon as it's a great lens for moto and portraits.  The R6 can do it all for moto, and the R6II improves on that if you can stretch your budget for another $600 or so.

Depending on your budget for glass, the 70-200 2.8 will always be a great tool for Moto.  The 300 2.8 has been staple for moto photography since the 90's.  I've owned all the generations of lenses of both zooms and primes and I currently have the RF 100-300 which is a lens that is out of reach for most photographers and not necessary.  I still have my 300II which is an amazing lens paired with a 70-200 2.8.  The old EF 100-400II also works very well depending on how much reach you need, but it has smaller apertures throughout the range.

There are a lot of ways to get the proper setup for moto depending on budget as long as you choose the right tools.  I see a lot of people using the wrong tools (both bodies and lenses) all the time.  They can work, and they'll get you some images here and there, but if you want to be nailing professional shots and just want to focus on composition it's best to use the right tools.

If you don't have a lot of dough you could buy a 1DX right now for around $500 and pair it with your 70-200 and you will see a dramatic improvement with your images compared to your cropper.  I could take a 1DX/70-200 2.8 non IS ($1200 setup) and shoot it next to my R3/100-300 ($12.5k setup) and you wouldn't see much of a difference in the end result after posting to the web.  The R3 would bring home a lot more keepers obviously, but an old 1DX is still a very capable camera and it can still hold it's own when comparing final images.  People ask me all the time, can I use a Rebel/7D etc cropper and the answer is yes you can, but I would never suggest them for an aspiring moto photographer.  Spend $500 and get a 1DX, or 1K on an R6, etc.

There's some photos in this thread I shot from the stands with a 70-200:

https://www.vitalmx.com/forums/moto-related/a2-observations-and-few-photos-2024?page=0

 

ando wrote:

What would examples of the wrong tools be?

Adapters. It's like using a ratchet in place of a hammer. 

11/9/2024 5:26pm Edited Date/Time 11/9/2024 5:27pm
COAL-TRAIN wrote:
I read through this thread and sorry if I missed what camera you are using. I have a lot of photography knowledge and work with a...

I read through this thread and sorry if I missed what camera you are using. I have a lot of photography knowledge and work with a lot of photographers.  For sure mirrorless is way overrated. The canon 1d series all the way through are great. 70-200 2.8 Canon is great. That combo is hard to beat and more user friendly than the new mirrorless. Another lens that is fun is the 16-35 ii 2.8. you need to be pretty close to the subject for this lens. Then...for some real fun...Canon 8-15 but that requires a helmet and a chest protector lol.

I'll post some stuff I did with with a fisheye (8-15 type) when I get a moment. Unfortunately I used a Canon 7dii and that camera  is a crop and has focus issues for the most part.

 

I currently use the Canon T7 and the Canon 70-200mm f4L USM, my plan is to upgrade to the Canon R8 next year because i would like to try some photo and video. Until then, i thought it might be a good idea to sell the 70-200 f4 for a 135mm f2. If you know of any Canon full frame cameras that have decent specs for both photo and video that would be helpful. My goal is to stay under 1k for the camera body, i plan on buying used.

1

The Shop

COAL-TRAIN
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11/10/2024 2:45pm
COAL-TRAIN wrote:
I read through this thread and sorry if I missed what camera you are using. I have a lot of photography knowledge and work with a...

I read through this thread and sorry if I missed what camera you are using. I have a lot of photography knowledge and work with a lot of photographers.  For sure mirrorless is way overrated. The canon 1d series all the way through are great. 70-200 2.8 Canon is great. That combo is hard to beat and more user friendly than the new mirrorless. Another lens that is fun is the 16-35 ii 2.8. you need to be pretty close to the subject for this lens. Then...for some real fun...Canon 8-15 but that requires a helmet and a chest protector lol.

I'll post some stuff I did with with a fisheye (8-15 type) when I get a moment. Unfortunately I used a Canon 7dii and that camera  is a crop and has focus issues for the most part.

 

I currently use the Canon T7 and the Canon 70-200mm f4L USM, my plan is to upgrade to the Canon R8 next year because i would...

I currently use the Canon T7 and the Canon 70-200mm f4L USM, my plan is to upgrade to the Canon R8 next year because i would like to try some photo and video. Until then, i thought it might be a good idea to sell the 70-200 f4 for a 135mm f2. If you know of any Canon full frame cameras that have decent specs for both photo and video that would be helpful. My goal is to stay under 1k for the camera body, i plan on buying used.

Are your lenses EF or RF?

11/11/2024 2:49pm
COAL-TRAIN wrote:
I read through this thread and sorry if I missed what camera you are using. I have a lot of photography knowledge and work with a...

I read through this thread and sorry if I missed what camera you are using. I have a lot of photography knowledge and work with a lot of photographers.  For sure mirrorless is way overrated. The canon 1d series all the way through are great. 70-200 2.8 Canon is great. That combo is hard to beat and more user friendly than the new mirrorless. Another lens that is fun is the 16-35 ii 2.8. you need to be pretty close to the subject for this lens. Then...for some real fun...Canon 8-15 but that requires a helmet and a chest protector lol.

I'll post some stuff I did with with a fisheye (8-15 type) when I get a moment. Unfortunately I used a Canon 7dii and that camera  is a crop and has focus issues for the most part.

 

I currently use the Canon T7 and the Canon 70-200mm f4L USM, my plan is to upgrade to the Canon R8 next year because i would...

I currently use the Canon T7 and the Canon 70-200mm f4L USM, my plan is to upgrade to the Canon R8 next year because i would like to try some photo and video. Until then, i thought it might be a good idea to sell the 70-200 f4 for a 135mm f2. If you know of any Canon full frame cameras that have decent specs for both photo and video that would be helpful. My goal is to stay under 1k for the camera body, i plan on buying used.

COAL-TRAIN wrote:

Are your lenses EF or RF?

EF

1
11/11/2024 4:13pm

Really good pictures you took from Breezewood! I thought I recognized your avatar from somewhere else haha

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FreshTopEnd
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11/12/2024 9:37am

I understand that the 70-200mm f2.8 is basically the standard, but could something like a 135mm f1.8 be a better budget alternative?

Can only speak to Canon, not third party or Nikon/Sony/Whatever.  Can't speak to the Canon RF series.  

Re the Canon 135 f2, it's a wonderful lens for almost everything but action - the af drive motor is too sluggish in my experience, especially in motordrive bursts.  I tried it once in moto and put aside after that.   It's a must have lens apart from that.  I don't think it's been reissued in upgraded versions, but the combo of focal length and fast, shallow depth of field is spectacular.  The 200 f2 has the same qualities and a faster drive, but they tend to be expensive, even used last time I looked a few years ago.  Really good "brand" primes are not a lot less expensive than quality zooms, again, can't speak to aftermarkets.

As Michael mentioned, any 300 f2.8is is gold for moto (your feet are the zoom).  The 300 I bought from TFS in 2005-6 is still exceptional and probably would be the last lens I would part from.  Just about any of the version I, II or III 70-200 2.8s are fantastic.  There are tons of new and old shorter primes and zooms at lesser focal lengths that will work just fine.  And don't discount the "lesser" Canon L and non L lenses.   Not biased against third party lenses, some especially now are good, but I stuck to Canon.

Honestly to me a lot of the nitpicking between brands and aged lenses is like hipster music posing.  The rig is not going to be the excuse for bad capture, just like riding a 96 Cr250 is not going to be your excuse for losing your intermediate class motos.

I will probably be liquidating my kit soon, but not piecing it out unless that is the only way to clear this stuff out.  The core of that is a 1DXII, series 1 300 2.8is, series 1 70-200 2.8is, 135 2, series I 24-70 2.8, and a few other shorter focal length primes from Canon, Zeiss, Tokina, and batteries and all the other crap accumulated over 25 years.  Anyone that might be seriously be interested can ping me a private message, it will probably go to local craigslist or commercial used buyer by early new year.

All the best to all of you.

5
11/13/2024 11:11am

I understand that the 70-200mm f2.8 is basically the standard, but could something like a 135mm f1.8 be a better budget alternative?

Can only speak to Canon, not third party or Nikon/Sony/Whatever.  Can't speak to the Canon RF series.  Re the Canon 135 f2, it's a wonderful lens...

Can only speak to Canon, not third party or Nikon/Sony/Whatever.  Can't speak to the Canon RF series.  

Re the Canon 135 f2, it's a wonderful lens for almost everything but action - the af drive motor is too sluggish in my experience, especially in motordrive bursts.  I tried it once in moto and put aside after that.   It's a must have lens apart from that.  I don't think it's been reissued in upgraded versions, but the combo of focal length and fast, shallow depth of field is spectacular.  The 200 f2 has the same qualities and a faster drive, but they tend to be expensive, even used last time I looked a few years ago.  Really good "brand" primes are not a lot less expensive than quality zooms, again, can't speak to aftermarkets.

As Michael mentioned, any 300 f2.8is is gold for moto (your feet are the zoom).  The 300 I bought from TFS in 2005-6 is still exceptional and probably would be the last lens I would part from.  Just about any of the version I, II or III 70-200 2.8s are fantastic.  There are tons of new and old shorter primes and zooms at lesser focal lengths that will work just fine.  And don't discount the "lesser" Canon L and non L lenses.   Not biased against third party lenses, some especially now are good, but I stuck to Canon.

Honestly to me a lot of the nitpicking between brands and aged lenses is like hipster music posing.  The rig is not going to be the excuse for bad capture, just like riding a 96 Cr250 is not going to be your excuse for losing your intermediate class motos.

I will probably be liquidating my kit soon, but not piecing it out unless that is the only way to clear this stuff out.  The core of that is a 1DXII, series 1 300 2.8is, series 1 70-200 2.8is, 135 2, series I 24-70 2.8, and a few other shorter focal length primes from Canon, Zeiss, Tokina, and batteries and all the other crap accumulated over 25 years.  Anyone that might be seriously be interested can ping me a private message, it will probably go to local craigslist or commercial used buyer by early new year.

All the best to all of you.

It saddens me to hear you are part ways with your artistic tools. I have always enjoyed your moto imagery of the years especially you're historic captures of Hangtown national. You should compile your Hangtown imagery into a photo book for many generations to enjoy.

You're bright saturated colors, crisp perspective and artistic speed shots will be surely missed. Take care FTE!  

BTW, your FTE handle, is perfect!

1
11/13/2024 2:04pm

Really good pictures you took from Breezewood! I thought I recognized your avatar from somewhere else haha

Thanks! I do my best 😂

ML512
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11/13/2024 5:29pm
COAL-TRAIN wrote:
PXL 20241108 012252610
COAL-TRAIN wrote:

That's Townley. I held camera up and was probably 3-4 feet away. Sorry for the shit example of a photo 🥂

COAL-TRAIN wrote:
PXL 20241108 012923930 0.jpg?VersionId=xDNQmNIoRnweIcxgA8RJFyiT

That’s actually Tommy Searle, during his short two years in the US.

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COAL-TRAIN
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11/13/2024 5:34pm
COAL-TRAIN wrote:

That's Townley. I held camera up and was probably 3-4 feet away. Sorry for the shit example of a photo 🥂

COAL-TRAIN wrote:
PXL 20241108 012923930 0.jpg?VersionId=xDNQmNIoRnweIcxgA8RJFyiT
ML512 wrote:

That’s actually Tommy Searle, during his short two years in the US.

You are correct...my bad haha

ML512
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11/13/2024 5:42pm
COAL-TRAIN wrote:
PXL 20241108 012923930 0.jpg?VersionId=xDNQmNIoRnweIcxgA8RJFyiT
ML512 wrote:

That’s actually Tommy Searle, during his short two years in the US.

COAL-TRAIN wrote:

You are correct...my bad haha

That jump was so badass to have for the nationals, the Cudby/Grant photo is one of the most iconic in moto (imo).

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FreshTopEnd
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11/14/2024 7:54am
tmphotoart wrote:
It saddens me to hear you are part ways with your artistic tools. I have always enjoyed your moto imagery of the years especially you're historic...

It saddens me to hear you are part ways with your artistic tools. I have always enjoyed your moto imagery of the years especially you're historic captures of Hangtown national. You should compile your Hangtown imagery into a photo book for many generations to enjoy.

You're bright saturated colors, crisp perspective and artistic speed shots will be surely missed. Take care FTE!  

BTW, your FTE handle, is perfect!

That's kind, thank you.  Grateful to DC that he gave me the chance to live out my love of the sport. Miss it, but content to have made the most of my time while I could. ✌️

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Snoqualmie
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11/14/2024 10:33am
tmphotoart wrote:
It saddens me to hear you are part ways with your artistic tools. I have always enjoyed your moto imagery of the years especially you're historic...

It saddens me to hear you are part ways with your artistic tools. I have always enjoyed your moto imagery of the years especially you're historic captures of Hangtown national. You should compile your Hangtown imagery into a photo book for many generations to enjoy.

You're bright saturated colors, crisp perspective and artistic speed shots will be surely missed. Take care FTE!  

BTW, your FTE handle, is perfect!

That's kind, thank you.  Grateful to DC that he gave me the chance to live out my love of the sport. Miss it, but content to...

That's kind, thank you.  Grateful to DC that he gave me the chance to live out my love of the sport. Miss it, but content to have made the most of my time while I could. ✌️

FTE,

Best of luck moving forward. You were in the inner circle of MX photography - up there with the best.

I, too have gotten rid of my moto hardware. I moved on to a Leica! It's a whole new world of photography and I feel like just a novice. 

Michael, stay healthy, stay creative. We look forward to seeing more of your work.

Rex

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BS12
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11/14/2024 4:50pm

I'm a Sony guy (video predominantly) and am/was eyeing off the Tamron 35-150 F2-2.8.  Great comparative price for a stellar and versatile bit of kit for the Sony/Nikon folk. You can get F2.0 up to 70mm which is super handy but I feel like I'd always be longing for that extra 50mm in an outdoor moto setting. Shooting in 4k by default always helps, but still. That said I've concluded that my next lens is the 70-200 GM OSS II. For the 2 shoots a year I do. I currently adapt a Canon EF 70-200 II which has amazing picture quality, but lens adapting = no auto focus (realistically) and pulling manual focus in the bright of the day isn't easy and by no means reliable. 

Example

Sully
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11/14/2024 5:13pm
BS12 wrote:
I'm a Sony guy (video predominantly) and am/was eyeing off the Tamron 35-150 F2-2.8.  Great comparative price for a stellar and versatile bit of kit for...

I'm a Sony guy (video predominantly) and am/was eyeing off the Tamron 35-150 F2-2.8.  Great comparative price for a stellar and versatile bit of kit for the Sony/Nikon folk. You can get F2.0 up to 70mm which is super handy but I feel like I'd always be longing for that extra 50mm in an outdoor moto setting. Shooting in 4k by default always helps, but still. That said I've concluded that my next lens is the 70-200 GM OSS II. For the 2 shoots a year I do. I currently adapt a Canon EF 70-200 II which has amazing picture quality, but lens adapting = no auto focus (realistically) and pulling manual focus in the bright of the day isn't easy and by no means reliable. 

Example

I have a Sigma 70-200 2.8 for my Sony A7 that I absolutely love. I've never shot Sony's, so I don't know what/how big the differences are, but for $1300 (USD) less, I'm ok with it.

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FreshTopEnd
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11/15/2024 9:37am
Snoqualmie wrote:
FTE,Best of luck moving forward. You were in the inner circle of MX photography - up there with the best.I, too have gotten rid of my...

FTE,

Best of luck moving forward. You were in the inner circle of MX photography - up there with the best.

I, too have gotten rid of my moto hardware. I moved on to a Leica! It's a whole new world of photography and I feel like just a novice. 

Michael, stay healthy, stay creative. We look forward to seeing more of your work.

Rex

Thanks Rex.   Way past the staying healthy element, but doing my best while the docs sort things out.  I appreciate the good vibes.  A full day at an outdoor track became unmanageable by about 2019.  Likely stepping away from work early in the new year, but shooting to stick around for my wife's and my 40th anniversary in 2026 if the fates allow that.  Hoping to finish a couple vintage bike builds once I step back from work.

I would never put myself on par with the established guys who are there week in and week out, but even a blind squirrel finds a nut now and then.  Those folks not only are exceptional shooters, but work really, really hard on short deadlines. I never competed with them, or could.  It was so much fun, and I really respect and enjoyed the bit of relationship I was able to have with a handful of the pros.  DC's genius was allowing competent people to get out there to possibly catch a money shot the regulars missed.  My old school images were the key that opened that door in 2002.

I probably have 100,000 images since 2002 and now am putting them behind me unless there's something that prompts a dig.  I do have some favorites where I ask myself who shot that.  Largely just posting the 1970s stuff on a couple private Facebook groups from time to time, but don't run a general feed there and largely stay off social media now to focus on real life, and to that end have wiped and terminated my Instagram and Twitter accounts.

Best to everyone here, including those I triggered or offended.  I can be as much an ass as anyone.  I like to argue, its rarely personal (although at least two times someone suggested I should die, which was fun), but after being on moto boards since 2000 right after my transplant I find that I've already said anything I have to say, and probably repeated myself way too many times at that.  And the tone and population these days is considerably different from my early days on MT, MD, and Fresh Dirt.  I love motocross, but board participation became the only negative thing dragging that down.  

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SoftSand
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11/15/2024 11:21pm
ML512 wrote:
Primes get amazing results but more work to run around. Sounds like you’re on a crop sensor, some of your lens choices will depend on if...

Primes get amazing results but more work to run around. Sounds like you’re on a crop sensor, some of your lens choices will depend on if you stay crop for a bit or go full frame soon. At least on the prime side.

Best prime I had for shooting moto was a 300 2.8

As the canon market moves more into RF lenses (mirrorless), the old EF primes are becoming amazing bargains.

You can never go wrong with a 70-200 though.

Currently saving for a 100-300mm

100-400 or 100-500s are great budget options. Terrible for low light due to the high and changing aperature though.

JGZ150 wrote:
I found the Sigma 120-300 f2.8 to be a less expensive option to the 100-300 & thoroughly enjoyed the images…

I found the Sigma 120-300 f2.8 to be a less expensive option to the 100-300 & thoroughly enjoyed the images…

I’ve got one. It’s great but a bit of a monster. Monopod only. 

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