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Thanks for the input/feedback. We are simply trying to get our side "out there" and wanted to be sure we clarified any misinformation.
At the end of the day, MXS and GH are two separate entities that have to mutually agree on terms for an event. We don't blame MXS for what they are requesting on their side any more than they should blame GH for having things we need to hold the event. If we can't make a deal, then we can't make a deal.
Here's the numbers GH posted on their website. Seems to me the big problem is the $1,000,000 series license fee paid to DMG. The $100k track licensing fees are going straight to Daytona not Morgantown, thanks AMA.
"Some of the reasoning may be that GH has the ability to "hold out" for things that we think are critical for our long-term success, as well as the long-term success of MX in general."
Taken from a post from @GlenHelen
On the surface this seems pretty self-righteous. Maybe I'm reading it incorrectly?
In your opinion you have "the ability to hold out" but ultimately you don't have a national, so that "ability" appears to look like taking your ball and going home.
He is complaining about the Will Call tent. That sells passes to industry or riders friends family ETC. You can not just walk up and purchase a ticket without a rider with a Hard Card or being an approved industry/business guest. Every Hard card is counted as one of those free passes he is complaining about. It has been a little while since I have gone to a national. But for me to be able to buy an industry pass I had to Email MX sports my info, fill out a form to get my company approved. And then reserve the passes ahead of time.
He says its not about the money, yet is complaining about the passes being "Sold" to the riders and crew members that come from the tickets the tracks supply. Lets say that you have a maxed out entry of 90 racers per class, 180 total. Each rider can have 2 mechanic's only one at the gate. That is almost 600 tickets right there. Every crew member from Team Honda counts as a ticket. etc. Racers used to be limited to 4 passes they could purchase for friends and family. They were sometimes flexible on that but not always. Racers would get a single free pass and 4 they could buy. Think about all the help that riders get. And often riders will purchase those passes to give to their sponsors.
In the interview Bud constantly makes it clear that he dislikes the Coombs and just doesn't want to give them money. Said he would give it to the riders, or teams. Even though he complains about giving out the tickets that go to those people. MX sports charges for them. But they also handle selling them and the vetting process etc. With many tickets going towards the team packages.
It sounds to me that it is about the money and he feels like MX sports has not done enough to deserve the money they get. And or Budd feels like He and the other tracks should get that money instead. But MX sports has been the company that has helped elevate the series and get live coverage along with a ton of other positives that bring value to the series. Getting together with Feld has helped boost tickets too. When You add the right people the pie grows and the slices everybody gets become larger. Without those people and connections, that pie is not going to grow to the same size.
In my opinion after listening to both interviews, Bud is allowing things to be personal while Davey is keeping it more of a just business deal.
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You would have to wait for their contract to run out so that could be years. I thought this would be the first track to come up.
You can't just walk up off the street and buy tickets at Industry Services.
So the multiple accounts of Bud losing his shit because the riders wouldn't participate in his high five parade was all made up?
Appreciate the clarifications by the way, I think we can all agree it'd be the best thing for fans and the sport if GH was on the schedule but it sure seems like that is a fairy tale at this point.
Ya'll ever work it out and I'll buy a ticket.
Is that different for the other tracks or are they all the same? I also noticed that you value those tickets at $80 while MXS was selling them in advance for $50 and at will call for $60. So did you want to sell them to Crew Members, Rider Guests, and Industry Personnel at a higher rate than MXS?
The bottom line is that you are unwilling to agree to the same terms and conditions that the other 11 do agree to. That doesn't mean that anybody is right or wrong it just means that GH doesn't want to agree to those terms and that is 100% on GH. As a fan I would love to see GH back on the schedule but as I see it with the unwillingness to agree to the same terms as the other tracks we are not going to see that happen.
Pala
If you are referring to the podium incident with Eli, of course it happened. What I am disputing is the reasoning behind it. There was no VIP promise of handshakes. The idea for the fence line ride was simply an attempt for some "good will" with fans and a great addition to the trip to the finish line. The fact that people thought there was some "monetary" reasoning from the idea is comical. Also, if you listen to the podcast and the story regarding the finish line, you can learn why it was another example of a broken promise by DC/MXS. And yes, I was there and witnessed the handshake with DC on the day leading up to the race when he agreed to the podium path to include fan interaction in exchange for a track change he wanted. Not sure what else to tell you on that.
Of course, we would love to see an MX National at GH again, I'm just not sure we are anxious to do it with the current parties. For now we will continue to focus on the local races and hosting our own events until something else arises. 👍
MXS can do whatever they want with the tickets that are allotted to them. The market will decide how much they want to sell them for, not us. Our position is that ~1500-2000 tickets should be plenty for a series promoter to take care of riders/mechanics/sponsors etc. If they are fighting so hard for more, then you have to start asking yourself "Why". GH is in the bullseye of the MX community, so almost everyone is "in the industry" (you should know that well, right?) and capable of purchasing passes from MX sports. By the way, MXS is selling an ALL-DAY pit access ticket at a gate and to an event where GH was only allowed to have 1,000 of those "special" tickets. At the end of the day, we just aren't willing to give up 20% of our admission gate so that MXS can participate financially at both the series level (TV, sponsors, etc...) AND participate at the track level.
In the court of public opinion, you are losing. Badly. I understand that may not matter to you, and that's fine. But the fact you came on here to "clear things up" tells us maybe you do care.
At this point I see it boiling down to Glen Helen thinks they deserve different/better treatment than the other national venues. That's also your right to think.
Glen Helen-
How about a compromise for the fans, since a National seems to be a dead issue?
Glen Helen hosts the 2028 (or 2029 depending on the rotation) MXoN?
There-problem solved, fans are happy and GH would be an epic MXoN venue!
I know GH got burned on the last MXGP for low ticket sales (that was really disappointing to see such a shit turnout), but MXoN is not in the same league as hosting a MXGP.
I love Red Bud, it was a bucket list trip for the family at the last round. But October weather in SoCal is perfect, very little chance of the weather issues that we have had at Red Bud the last 2 times in October.
Please...?
Ok now you just sound purely arrogant and greedy. Sorry.
I love your analogy but to say GH is 10/10 is insane. It’s located in what is arguably the biggest shithole city in the country. It’s a hot, sandy, shadeless, ugly track located next to a crime ridden ghetto. It has one nice up/downhill, other than that it is another Pala in a much worse neighborhood
3500 tickets does seem pretty outrageous. Especially considering they came all the way down to 2250 lmfao.
I don’t know shit though.
This is the same company that charges families thousands of dollars for the Loretta’s scam. Just my opinion.
And you have every right to feel the way you do it doesn't make you a bad person or company but there are 11 others that apparently don't feel it's an issue. Is it really MXS fighting so hard for more or is it GH fighting for less/different than what the 11 others have? Now if all the others have a better deal and are giving fewer tickets than what was being requested by MXS from GH then it is understandable, but if they all are giving the same amount then it becomes a GH issue and not a MXS issue.
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Pit Row
We agree! An MXDN at GH would be a bucket list event for us to host and hopefully the worldwide MX community would support it as well.
Only time will tell!
We would drive all the way from Georgia to see that event at glen helen.
Honestly this is the only thing where it seems like GH has a reasonable argument, and the one place where it seems like DC fails to explain convincingly.
Perhaps you could explain the various revenue streams that occur for a national and who gets how much of each piece?
If that was such a shitty deal that MXSports pulled....don't you think at least one of the other tracks that was part of NPG woulda had a problem with it too?
GH is the only track that took their ball and went home.
For me, that is always the thing I come back to, all these other tracks continue to happily (from what we know) work with MXSports yet poor little Glen Helen can't seem to make it work. Why are they a victim and nobody else is?
I know I'll never get an answer to that question obviously.
That's not a 10.
Exactly, one would think that there would be more than just one disgruntled track complaining about it. In fact if it occurred as GH describes it, in any other business setting there would have been legal action. I was just commenting that it is the one area that DC fails to fully explain.
Obviously none of us have any inside info and can really only judge whether we find GH or DC more believable. DC wins that one by a landslide.
Jase doing gods work
MX Sports has two production meetings just ahead of the events. They have been happening for more then ten years and happen at every race, every weekend. The meetings are held to plan out all interaction between MX Sports and the local promoter. The meetings cover things like local dignitaries, the national anthem signer, any special recognition for family staff members or local racers, or whatever the local promoter might want for the event. It is where the series promoter and local promoter meet to make things happen. There are a TON of moving pieces at these events, and these meetings are in place to help manage all staff members.
The 2018 event was no different - and multiple Glen Helen staffer attended not one, but both event production meetings (from memory, there were about 5 GH staffers, including Mr. Info and John Perry). The first one was held on Friday before the event at 5pm and then the "final" one, where all the last last minute details are worked out, was held on Saturday at 7am. I think (but could be wrong?) Lori only attended the Saturday meeting.
During these meetings, not a single Glen Helen representative ever mentioned anything whatsoever about Bud's wish to direct riders at track exit to pass the VIP area. Doing so would have been possible, but it would have added some distance and time to the track exit, and with TV scripts calling for 1 minute to podium, the shows were already planned pretty carefully.
However, it wasn't until 2.30pm and during the second 250 moto where Bud was somewhat frantically pacing around the finish line and moving cones and banners that it became known to any of the onsite staff (both MX Sports and GH staff) about this. There are tight times for TV interviews and podium stuff, and adding an extra 45 seconds to one minute to this would complicate the broadcast. Plus, and more importantly, it was also felt that this also posed a safety risk, coming at 2.30pm and long after riders have been on the track multiple times for practice and parade laps. Changing course direction (even if just an exit) is simply a bad idea halfway through the moto on high speed track like Glen Helen. Plus there was a MONSTER double after the finish line that weekend, and some riders would still hit it after the checkers, and some would just roll it, which can create risk of riders being landed on. Buds requested change would mean riders turn to the right after the jump and not the left. It was just a bad idea at that time of the day, and from a safety perspective.
It was suggested to Bud that we "fix it for next year" and it was said that "it was a bad idea" by Jeff Canfield, who was in charge of course safety at that time. It was a very heated conversation between Bud, Davey and Jeff Canfield. But Bud insisted that he wanted it to happen, and so course workers did there best to change the course direction, and Davey reluctantly agreed in order to appease Bud. So, about 50% of the riders followed the new route, and the other group took the old route and just got off the track. The situation came to head with Bud trying to take Eli off the podium after going 1-1 at the end of the day, and telling him to go ride back past the fan zone, and taking him off the podium. Incidentally, by that point, roughly 4 minutes after the checkers, the fan zone was empty as the people were leaving the track.
Simply put, the Glen Helen his staff was not informed properly of Buds wishes.
When running a large event like this, communication and a calm demeanor is the key to success, and on that day. Bud displayed neither of those.
Appreciate your coming on here to tell your side, but who are you? Bud, Lori, Bud Jr?
You said that MX Sports "canceled" a national but it really didn't - my recollection is that an ad with the nationals schedule (with GH listed) ran in the printed SX program before MX Sports had formally announced the schedule and before GH and MX Sports had actually agreed terms. While I would have resisted publishing the schedule without a signed contract in place with each track, this is clearly distinguishable from MX Sports canceling a national.
While there's some back and forth here about whether GH has more bargaining power because it doesn't need a national as much as some of the other tracks on the schedule, it smells fishy when GH is the only other track that can't agree terms with MX Sports. If they were truly that egregious then by now some of the other tracks would presumably have left? MX Sports is a business and I find it hard to believe that they're trying to push more onerous terms on GH than other tracks. As an ex-girlfriend once told me, "It's not me, so it must be you".
Finally, I'm all for a bit of banter, but it's not a good look bad-mouthing a potential business partner on a public forum. But sadly this is where we are today.
Cheers
Simon
Just my opinion, but this little snippet from a post by Glen Helen themselves seems to give some insight into your wondering....
"Some of the reasoning may be that GH has the ability to "hold out" for things that we think are critical for our long-term success, as well as the long-term success of MX in general."
The AMA subject was the one thing I wanted more clarification on. Thanks!
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