Looking to learn more about E-bikes?

MxAddic
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11/28/2023 8:21am Edited Date/Time 11/28/2023 8:34am
Beagle wrote:
You do not seem to understand that the Varg has been built to meet the existing rules, which is why the FIM had to change the...

You do not seem to understand that the Varg has been built to meet the existing rules, which is why the FIM had to change the rules at the last minute to exclude it.

Anyway I doubt the Varg can be half as good in super Enduro as in SX, at least right out of the box. At such typical low speeds the extra weight should hinder them more than in SX. Also the lack of clutch will make more difference than in MX/SX, super Enduro riders will need to be so very precise with the throttle which may not be that easy when you're overcoming various crazy obstacles. Maybe they can develop special maps for this, taming throttle attack a bit?

We shall see when they will be allowed to compete.

I guess you missed the rules that where actually posted already so I will post them again.

"Here are the actual rules for Super Enduro:

066.5 MOTORCYCLES One machine is authorised per rider. For extraordinary circumstances, a rider can use the motorcycle of another entered rider if this motorcycle has satisfied the administrative and technical controls.

066.5.1 Classes Any motorcycle corresponding to one of the classes in Category 1, Group A1 and Category 2, Group C will be allowed to participate. The classes for the solo motorcycles for the FIM SuperEnduro World Championship are the following: FIM SuperEnduro World Championship 27 The classes for the categories PRESTIGE/OPEN, JUNIOR are free but derived from the Classes Enduro 1, Enduro 2, Enduro 3. Enduro 1: Up to 250cc 2 stroke and 4 stroke Enduro 2: Over 255cc up to 450cc 4 stroke Enduro 3: Over 255cc 2 stroke and over 455cc 4 stroke"

Maybe you can point out the rule the varg was built to meet or the rule that was changed according to you so they couldn't compete. What class was it supposed to compete in? I don't see anything for Ebikes with a 30% horsepower advantage on the competition listed.

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Beagle
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11/28/2023 9:13am

How can you still not understand that these are the new rules introduced by the FIM on the eve of the first super Enduro race of the season, last Thursday or Friday ?

jiFfM 0

 

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MxAddic
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11/28/2023 9:40am Edited Date/Time 11/28/2023 9:44am
Beagle wrote:
How can you still not understand that these are the new rules introduced by the FIM on the eve of the first super Enduro race of...

How can you still not understand that these are the new rules introduced by the FIM on the eve of the first super Enduro race of the season, last Thursday or Friday ?

jiFfM 0

 

So lets see the old rules if there ever was any...

You seem to know so much about them surely you have a source other than your imagination that is extraordinary I must say.

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JM485
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11/28/2023 10:00am
MxAddic wrote:
So lets see the old rules if there ever was any... You seem to know so much about them surely you have a source other than...

So lets see the old rules if there ever was any...

You seem to know so much about them surely you have a source other than your imagination that is extraordinary I must say.

What are you even debating?  The FIM gave them approval to race and then pulled the plug 24hrs before the race began and after Stark had already signed a rider and traveled to the event.  Stark should be suing their corrupt asses for the costs incurred.

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The Shop

8500rpm
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11/28/2023 10:05am

Went to the garage today... hour meter at 39h, oh, do I need to do another top-end again... Varg sparks my interest Wink

 

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LungButter
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11/28/2023 10:15am Edited Date/Time 11/28/2023 10:20am
MxAddic wrote:
So lets see the old rules if there ever was any... You seem to know so much about them surely you have a source other than...

So lets see the old rules if there ever was any...

You seem to know so much about them surely you have a source other than your imagination that is extraordinary I must say.

You wouldn't be able to man up and admit being wrong even if he did take the time to do that.  You'd just keep relocating the goal posts like you've been doing all along.

Edited to add:  This is a quote from a FB Comment that Enduro21 made.  Enduro21 is the premier media outlet for off road racing in Europe, they have forgotten more about FIM Rules than you will ever know.  This isn't a direct quote of the rule book but I'm 100% certain they know what they are talking about, is this good enough for you?
 

"The rules did include electric powered motorcycles (in that list of E1,E2, E3, etc) it was "Open" but the wording was changed on Thursday night to exclude electric powered motorcycles. KTM raced a Freeride about a decade ago under the former regulations."

 

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MxAddic
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11/28/2023 10:29am Edited Date/Time 11/28/2023 10:31am
JM485 wrote:
What are you even debating?  The FIM gave them approval to race and then pulled the plug 24hrs before the race began and after Stark had...

What are you even debating?  The FIM gave them approval to race and then pulled the plug 24hrs before the race began and after Stark had already signed a rider and traveled to the event.  Stark should be suing their corrupt asses for the costs incurred.

I am debating the fact they changed the rules to allow the varg and re-changed them to prevent it as is being stated. Beagle keeps insisting they built a bike to the rules. What rules? Should not be difficult for him to answer. I understand they gave them permission to race and pulled the plug. Not the same thing.

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LungButter
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11/28/2023 10:32am
MxAddic wrote:
I am debating the fact they changed the rules to allow the varg and re-changed them to prevent it as is being stated. Beagle keeps insisting...

I am debating the fact they changed the rules to allow the varg and re-changed them to prevent it as is being stated. Beagle keeps insisting they built a bike to the rules. What rules? Should not be difficult for him to answer. I understand they gave them permission to race and pulled the plug. Not the same thing.

KTM has previously raced a Freeride in SuperEnduro, that is 100% a fact.

You're wrong, do you have the balls to actually admit it or are you just going to keep on spinning shit to fit your narrative?

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MxAddic
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11/28/2023 10:45am Edited Date/Time 11/28/2023 2:34pm
LungButter wrote:
You wouldn't be able to man up and admit being wrong even if he did take the time to do that.  You'd just keep relocating the...

You wouldn't be able to man up and admit being wrong even if he did take the time to do that.  You'd just keep relocating the goal posts like you've been doing all along.

Edited to add:  This is a quote from a FB Comment that Enduro21 made.  Enduro21 is the premier media outlet for off road racing in Europe, they have forgotten more about FIM Rules than you will ever know.  This isn't a direct quote of the rule book but I'm 100% certain they know what they are talking about, is this good enough for you?
 

"The rules did include electric powered motorcycles (in that list of E1,E2, E3, etc) it was "Open" but the wording was changed on Thursday night to exclude electric powered motorcycles. KTM raced a Freeride about a decade ago under the former regulations."

 

KTM freerides are 24HP. Sounds like they made a good move. Kudo's to the FIM. The rules where written for a time when the varg did not exist and needed updating.

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RACING
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11/28/2023 10:51am
Beagle wrote:
How can you still not understand that these are the new rules introduced by the FIM on the eve of the first super Enduro race of...

How can you still not understand that these are the new rules introduced by the FIM on the eve of the first super Enduro race of the season, last Thursday or Friday ?

jiFfM 0

 

How can you still not understand that anyway, FIM has had for a while a dedicated electric bikes rulebook which starts by "We do what we want and if you're not happy, well f**k you"?

"A motorcycle must conform to the requirements of the FIM regulations, to the Supplementary Regulations, as well as to a number of specific conditions that the FIM may require for certain competitions."

Not clear enough? Obviously, the FIM requirements were not met...

Laughing

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LungButter
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11/28/2023 10:54am

What's so ironic about the SuperEnduro situation is that it's a 99% chance that KTM/Husky/GasGas are the ones who threw a shit fit to get the rules changed last minute and....KTM has previously raced an electric bike in SuperEnduro.

I'm getting a good laugh at you naysayers, you'll do, say and agree with anything as long as it keeps pushing your anti e-bike agenda.  Some of ya'll musta lost your old ladies to vibrators or something as scared as you are of electronic shit.

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RACING
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11/28/2023 11:03am

I'm disappointed I wasn't there to see how pissed salesman of the month Tortelli must have been.

Listening to him talk about Stark is like listening to Tom Cruise talk about scientology.

Laughing

 

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Silas444
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11/28/2023 11:31am Edited Date/Time 11/28/2023 11:32am
LungButter wrote:
What's so ironic about the SuperEnduro situation is that it's a 99% chance that KTM/Husky/GasGas are the ones who threw a shit fit to get the...

What's so ironic about the SuperEnduro situation is that it's a 99% chance that KTM/Husky/GasGas are the ones who threw a shit fit to get the rules changed last minute and....KTM has previously raced an electric bike in SuperEnduro.

I'm getting a good laugh at you naysayers, you'll do, say and agree with anything as long as it keeps pushing your anti e-bike agenda.  Some of ya'll musta lost your old ladies to vibrators or something as scared as you are of electronic shit.

That's funny as hell, it really is. I actually chuckled. Having said that, I fear this thread is slowly becoming a parody of the others that preceded it. Strangely, I now find myself longing for posts from that dude that got banned who kept saying the fate of electric motorcycles was sealed back in 1790 or whenever, and that other guy that kept insisting the Varg didn't actually exist and that Stark was a Ponzi scheme. Those guys, while admittedly being kooky, were, if nothing else, INTERESTING. These news guys, on the other hand, are just slow-witted and tedious. If someone actually takes the time to read this whole thread, there's actually some things in it worth considering. Trouble is, you have top get past all the........... well, you know.

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Beagle
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11/28/2023 11:43am

Dude you should definitely check out this article by Enduro21, they're even talking about you:

It’s clear from social media comments that opinion is divided on the whole electric bike thing. We get that and understand the feelings (though some of the wildly misguided comments are getting a bit tired by now…).

https://enduro21.com/en/racing/latest/superenduro/say-what-riders-quote…

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RACING
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11/28/2023 11:56am Edited Date/Time 11/28/2023 11:58am

I was about to post it. Damn commies!

LMFAO!

🤣

And I even got my pissed Tortelli pic!

 

Oh, BTW, I really don't see how a Stark fitted with a headlight in 5 minutes suddenly becomes "a production enduro motorcycle"...

Wink

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LungButter
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11/28/2023 12:04pm
RACING wrote:
I was about to post it. Damn commies! LMFAO! 🤣 And I even got my pissed Tortelli pic!   Oh, BTW, I really don't see how...

I was about to post it. Damn commies!

LMFAO!

🤣

And I even got my pissed Tortelli pic!

 

Oh, BTW, I really don't see how a Stark fitted with a headlight in 5 minutes suddenly becomes "a production enduro motorcycle"...

Wink

Jeezus..... you anti Stark clowns will cling to absolutely anything to try to be right, it's both hilarious and pathetic at the same time.

So tell me then what exactly is a "production enduro motorcycle" ?? 

Does it have to come stock with a headlight? 

So does that mean if someone wanted to race a YZ 250 they wouldn't be allowed? 

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RACING
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11/28/2023 12:13pm Edited Date/Time 11/28/2023 3:04pm

He wouldn't. A stock YZ250 is not an enduro bike by the FIM rules. You know the US are not the whole world, don't you.

And no, sorry, I won't shed a tear on Anton, Seb and Taddy's administrative problems.

 

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LungButter
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11/28/2023 12:20pm Edited Date/Time 11/28/2023 12:31pm
RACING wrote:
He wouldn't. A stock YZ250 is not an enduro bike by the FIM rules. You know the US are not the whole world, don't you. And...

He wouldn't. A stock YZ250 is not an enduro bike by the FIM rules. You know the US are not the whole world, don't you.

And no, sorry, I won't shed a tear on Anton, Seb and Taddy's administrative problems.

 

Show me where the FIM rules describe what an "enduro bike" is please. 

You're desperation to discredit Stark shows by calling it "Administrative problems".  The FIM changed the fucking rules last minute, period, that is an absolute fact that you can't debate.  There was no "administrative problem". 

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MxAddic
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11/28/2023 12:49pm
LungButter wrote:
Show me where the FIM rules describe what an "enduro bike" is please.  You're desperation to discredit Stark shows by calling it "Administrative problems".  The FIM...

Show me where the FIM rules describe what an "enduro bike" is please. 

You're desperation to discredit Stark shows by calling it "Administrative problems".  The FIM changed the fucking rules last minute, period, that is an absolute fact that you can't debate.  There was no "administrative problem". 

It's the politically correct way of saying they got fucked.

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MxAddic
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11/28/2023 1:01pm
LungButter wrote:
You wouldn't be able to man up and admit being wrong even if he did take the time to do that.  You'd just keep relocating the...

You wouldn't be able to man up and admit being wrong even if he did take the time to do that.  You'd just keep relocating the goal posts like you've been doing all along.

Edited to add:  This is a quote from a FB Comment that Enduro21 made.  Enduro21 is the premier media outlet for off road racing in Europe, they have forgotten more about FIM Rules than you will ever know.  This isn't a direct quote of the rule book but I'm 100% certain they know what they are talking about, is this good enough for you?
 

"The rules did include electric powered motorcycles (in that list of E1,E2, E3, etc) it was "Open" but the wording was changed on Thursday night to exclude electric powered motorcycles. KTM raced a Freeride about a decade ago under the former regulations."

 

post2

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RACING
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11/28/2023 3:03pm
LungButter wrote:
Show me where the FIM rules describe what an "enduro bike" is please.  You're desperation to discredit Stark shows by calling it "Administrative problems".  The FIM...

Show me where the FIM rules describe what an "enduro bike" is please. 

You're desperation to discredit Stark shows by calling it "Administrative problems".  The FIM changed the fucking rules last minute, period, that is an absolute fact that you can't debate.  There was no "administrative problem". 

MxAddic wrote:

It's the politically correct way of saying they got fucked.

Which I already wrote earlier.

Wink

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11/28/2023 3:49pm
MxAddic wrote:
So lets see the old rules if there ever was any... You seem to know so much about them surely you have a source other than...

So lets see the old rules if there ever was any...

You seem to know so much about them surely you have a source other than your imagination that is extraordinary I must say.

JM485 wrote:
What are you even debating?  The FIM gave them approval to race and then pulled the plug 24hrs before the race began and after Stark had...

What are you even debating?  The FIM gave them approval to race and then pulled the plug 24hrs before the race began and after Stark had already signed a rider and traveled to the event.  Stark should be suing their corrupt asses for the costs incurred.

No, they should complain to the European Commission, if the Commission finds collusion between the FIM and another party (KTM?), they have the power to fine each party 10% of gross annual turnover.

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RACING
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11/28/2023 4:02pm

Yeah, right, that's gonna work out.

Laughing

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MxAddic
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11/28/2023 4:08pm
No, they should complain to the European Commission, if the Commission finds collusion between the FIM and another party (KTM?), they have the power to fine...

No, they should complain to the European Commission, if the Commission finds collusion between the FIM and another party (KTM?), they have the power to fine each party 10% of gross annual turnover.

I am not a gambler but I bet a dollar to a doughnut safety concerns could be justified. No collusion, stamp it.

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11/28/2023 4:16pm
No, they should complain to the European Commission, if the Commission finds collusion between the FIM and another party (KTM?), they have the power to fine...

No, they should complain to the European Commission, if the Commission finds collusion between the FIM and another party (KTM?), they have the power to fine each party 10% of gross annual turnover.

MxAddic wrote:

I am not a gambler but I bet a dollar to a doughnut safety concerns could be justified. No collusion, stamp it.

Using that logic, dirt bikes aren't safe, all brands of dirt bike should be banned from competition.

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11/28/2023 8:05pm
RACING wrote:
I'm disappointed I wasn't there to see how pissed salesman of the month Tortelli must have been. Listening to him talk about Stark is like listening...

I'm disappointed I wasn't there to see how pissed salesman of the month Tortelli must have been.

Listening to him talk about Stark is like listening to Tom Cruise talk about scientology.

Laughing

 

So, do you think that ICE bike is easier to ride and faster? Or is your dislike because you think they are too fast? Like what is your actual dislike?

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[YM]
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12/2/2023 1:10pm
 

 

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38special
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12/2/2023 2:57pm

^^^ Not even going to click on that clickbait, even just to see how ridiculous it is ^^^ 

Especially since the channel is called "Sur Ronster"  Laughing

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RACING
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12/2/2023 4:10pm

The video was originally titled "My engine is dead because I suck at taking care of it and since I didn't know what to do with the chassis I put together a crappy electric bike and pretend I'm gonna change the world", but it was a bit long.

Laughing

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JM485
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12/2/2023 5:53pm Edited Date/Time 12/2/2023 5:55pm

Oh boy, before everyone loses their shit let’s give a little background on this video.  
 

First off, Vital is not the intended audience for that video or his channel, he caters to a different audience and does it very well (as proven by the following he has).  There are a lot of new eyeballs seeing this type of content now.

 

Second, this was his first time on a real motocross track.  He generally sticks to pitbikes and Surron type bikes, but it worked out for him to give the bike a try so we coordinated a day for him to come out to a local track.  I didn’t know what to expect but I have to say he did really well and didn’t look out of place at all, I was very impressed.  Riding a real track surrounded by other riders for the first time is a very intimidating experience, and I’m hoping it’s something he’ll want to do again because I thought he did extremely well.

 

Third, I’m sure more gatekeepers will come along shortly, but we should be celebrating more people transitioning from the Surron world into motocross.  I hate to break it to you but without growth toward that demographic a lot of the companies you know and love in this industry are going to die off from stagnation.  We have a really good opportunity to reach a whole new demographic of people who would normally have no interest in riding moto, and many of them will want to give it a shot if they aren’t met with a bunch of self-righteous dickheads turning them away.  
 

Say what you want, but I don’t want to hear shit from anyone of you “grow the sport” people who do nothing but push people away, at least some of us are out here trying to make a difference and try new things.  
 

Edit: I’m the guy in the black and white A-Stars gear fyi.

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