Another active shooter

2DoorKicker75
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5/10/2023 12:39pm
How do they treat mental illness? You go see the psychiatrist and they don’t “treat” you, they give out a prescription to big pharma’s newest wonder...

How do they treat mental illness? You go see the psychiatrist and they don’t “treat” you, they give out a prescription to big pharma’s newest wonder drug. How many of those say, “May Cause Suicidal/Homicidal Ideation”? How many “mass shooters”, we’re taking some form of psychotropic medication before the horrific incident.
 

Nobody tells you to go outside and get some exercise. Yes, exercise is the best, all natural pill for depression. There’s no profit in getting high on endorphins. 
 

They want you to stay inside and consume. Get on the internet and support China buying crap on Amazon. Order some convenient fast food and have it delivered to your door via GrubHub. We support obesity, don’t you be a body shamer, because it is a sign of consumption and overindulgence. 

 

early wrote:
I'm against long term use of any pills except in specific circumstances.  Antidepressant use among women is much higher than among men, yet mass shootings, gun...

I'm against long term use of any pills except in specific circumstances. 

Antidepressant use among women is much higher than among men, yet mass shootings, gun violence, and violent crime is much lower among women.

Testosterone. Men and women are wired differently, follow the science. 
 

Men aren’t made to sit in little boxes all day. Their deepest desire is a beauty to win, an adventure to live, and a battle to fight. Most men today, are well, bored.

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2DoorKicker75
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5/10/2023 12:45pm
early wrote:

You ever pulled a trigger on a man?

Unfortunately more than I care to remember.

early wrote:

Thank you for your service.

I'd imagine you don't think of yourself as mentally ill because your actions were justified?

War isn’t pretty. I am not a murderer. I did unto others, before they could do unto me. 
 

Most of these rally around the flag, let’s bust this thing open saber rattlers? They’ve never seen the horror of combat. 
 

Although, why does the government want to use “Red Flag” laws to take weapons away from Vets? Lost all respect for Dan Crenshaw for his support of that piece of legislation. 
 

There’s a clue in my username.

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TDeath21
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5/10/2023 12:50pm Edited Date/Time 5/10/2023 12:52pm

14 year old girl shot in the head while playing hide and seek on someone’s property. Dude just came out and starting shooting at kids who were running. Utter insanity. 

6
early
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5/10/2023 1:22pm
War isn’t pretty. I am not a murderer. I did unto others, before they could do unto me.    Most of these rally around the flag...

War isn’t pretty. I am not a murderer. I did unto others, before they could do unto me. 
 

Most of these rally around the flag, let’s bust this thing open saber rattlers? They’ve never seen the horror of combat. 
 

Although, why does the government want to use “Red Flag” laws to take weapons away from Vets? Lost all respect for Dan Crenshaw for his support of that piece of legislation. 
 

There’s a clue in my username.

Nor would I consider you a murderer. Frame of reference is important in making that judgement. 

The Overton window is being shifted on that frame of reference when it comes to civilian gun use, this is being done on purpose, the result is more civilian gun use.

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The Shop

2DoorKicker75
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5/10/2023 1:27pm
War isn’t pretty. I am not a murderer. I did unto others, before they could do unto me.    Most of these rally around the flag...

War isn’t pretty. I am not a murderer. I did unto others, before they could do unto me. 
 

Most of these rally around the flag, let’s bust this thing open saber rattlers? They’ve never seen the horror of combat. 
 

Although, why does the government want to use “Red Flag” laws to take weapons away from Vets? Lost all respect for Dan Crenshaw for his support of that piece of legislation. 
 

There’s a clue in my username.

early wrote:
Nor would I consider you a murderer. Frame of reference is important in making that judgement.  The Overton window is being shifted on that frame of...

Nor would I consider you a murderer. Frame of reference is important in making that judgement. 

The Overton window is being shifted on that frame of reference when it comes to civilian gun use, this is being done on purpose, the result is more civilian gun use.

It’s a weird time to be alive. Who ever thought the government would try to force us in to our homes, wear a face covering, take a unproven medical treatment, and carry identification of compliance? 
 

Not one positive thing has happened from the Scamdemic. It’s been a bane to the Nation. People who may have been on the verge, seem to have completely lost their shit during/after.

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Titan1
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5/10/2023 1:38pm
Titan1 wrote:
"The idea that improving mental Healthcare will stop the violence..." Nobody is saying that (well, I'm certainly not)...in fact, in this thread we aren't talking about...

"The idea that improving mental Healthcare will stop the violence..."

Nobody is saying that (well, I'm certainly not)...in fact, in this thread we aren't talking about generic violence (and certainly not violence for " protection of person or property, revenge, ambition, combat orders, etc") we are talking about mass murderers...people who walk into public places and kill random people.  And those are very different in my opinion.

And virtually all mass murderers are mentally ill.  Its irrefutable.  That mental health issue is what causes them to justify their actions in their mind...I honestly don't see how improving mental health wouldn't decrease-though not eliminate-mass murders (though it certainly wouldn't "stop the violence").

Let me ask you this, who/what is pushing this "othering of people you don't agree with, don't like , or have been told not to like or agree with"?  Who/what is doing that?

Who/what is "promoting violence as a solution to those others"? 

If you are going to blame mass murderers on that...who/what is responsible?

early wrote:
Mass shootings are an extension of the use of asymmetric force, just like those 2 kids that got shot for going to the wrong houses. Asymmetric...

Mass shootings are an extension of the use of asymmetric force, just like those 2 kids that got shot for going to the wrong houses. Asymmetric force is expected to have a cooling effect on the targets. Don't go knocking on doors you don't know at night if you're a black kid. Don't like immigrants, drive from Dallas to El Paso to shoot Mexicans at Walmart, that will make them think twice before they come here. The violence is the point.

Mental health is a moving target so it's a good talking point. It also encapsulates mass shooters and LGBT into the same group which is advantageous to push to the right people.

Who's pushing it? Russia, China, NAR, those that would like to wreck the dollar as the reserve currency, secessionist, pushers of the Theocratic state.

So you blame an inanimate object?  And the solution is to remove that inanimate object from society?  Never mind the actual human being pulling the trigger on that inanimate object...just take the inanimate object away...that way he can't kill people with it...and he'll have to figure out another inanimate object to use. 

I'd much rather talk about why so many in America resort to mass murder...rather than get hung up on which inanimate object they are using...

Why is Mental health a moving target?

And though it could be argued that LGBT are also mentally ill, that isn't the point of this discussion, nor am I saying they are, nor is that the topic of this thread, nor am I trying to group them in with mass murderers. 

Anyway, maybe it's not mental health (and there is only correlation between mental health issues and mass murderers...not causation)...I'm not a scientist, I don't know...maybe it is what you say...it's "asymmetric force".

Can you give me an example of China, Russia, NAR, secessionists, and Theocratics pushing this?  

 

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early
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5/10/2023 1:47pm
Testosterone. Men and women are wired differently, follow the science.    Men aren’t made to sit in little boxes all day. Their deepest desire is a...

Testosterone. Men and women are wired differently, follow the science. 
 

Men aren’t made to sit in little boxes all day. Their deepest desire is a beauty to win, an adventure to live, and a battle to fight. Most men today, are well, bored.

You are right, women and men are different, but also everyone is different. 

I've seen people close to me struggle on and off anti-depressants. I don't have figures and given the number of homicides that go unsolved I don't think anyone really knows how many murderers are on or off antidepressants. Given the gender and racial make-up of people on antidepressants and the same makeup of convicted murderers I would lean towards that not being much of a factor in gun violence as a whole. 

You are right, it's not just men, all people of a certain disposition and most men find modern society a bit boring. It's important to foster healthy outlets. Physical activity, time in nature, good high quality food, fulfilling work, healthy interpersonal relationships, regular sex are all important for a healthy mind and body. 

I believe one of the biggest mistakes of modern America is the emphasis on team sports over individual sports. Team sports are where most of the money is and where most people got their glory days on the field or court in high school. After that's over they aren't left with knowledge, skills, and abilities to transition to fulfilling solo exercise so they become a spectator to the pros and maybe hit the boring gym to lift. That's ok but it doesn't scratch the itch the same. 

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2DoorKicker75
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5/10/2023 2:00pm
Titan1 wrote:
"The idea that improving mental Healthcare will stop the violence..." Nobody is saying that (well, I'm certainly not)...in fact, in this thread we aren't talking about...

"The idea that improving mental Healthcare will stop the violence..."

Nobody is saying that (well, I'm certainly not)...in fact, in this thread we aren't talking about generic violence (and certainly not violence for " protection of person or property, revenge, ambition, combat orders, etc") we are talking about mass murderers...people who walk into public places and kill random people.  And those are very different in my opinion.

And virtually all mass murderers are mentally ill.  Its irrefutable.  That mental health issue is what causes them to justify their actions in their mind...I honestly don't see how improving mental health wouldn't decrease-though not eliminate-mass murders (though it certainly wouldn't "stop the violence").

Let me ask you this, who/what is pushing this "othering of people you don't agree with, don't like , or have been told not to like or agree with"?  Who/what is doing that?

Who/what is "promoting violence as a solution to those others"? 

If you are going to blame mass murderers on that...who/what is responsible?

early wrote:
Mass shootings are an extension of the use of asymmetric force, just like those 2 kids that got shot for going to the wrong houses. Asymmetric...

Mass shootings are an extension of the use of asymmetric force, just like those 2 kids that got shot for going to the wrong houses. Asymmetric force is expected to have a cooling effect on the targets. Don't go knocking on doors you don't know at night if you're a black kid. Don't like immigrants, drive from Dallas to El Paso to shoot Mexicans at Walmart, that will make them think twice before they come here. The violence is the point.

Mental health is a moving target so it's a good talking point. It also encapsulates mass shooters and LGBT into the same group which is advantageous to push to the right people.

Who's pushing it? Russia, China, NAR, those that would like to wreck the dollar as the reserve currency, secessionist, pushers of the Theocratic state.

Titan1 wrote:
So you blame an inanimate object?  And the solution is to remove that inanimate object from society?  Never mind the actual human being pulling the trigger...

So you blame an inanimate object?  And the solution is to remove that inanimate object from society?  Never mind the actual human being pulling the trigger on that inanimate object...just take the inanimate object away...that way he can't kill people with it...and he'll have to figure out another inanimate object to use. 

I'd much rather talk about why so many in America resort to mass murder...rather than get hung up on which inanimate object they are using...

Why is Mental health a moving target?

And though it could be argued that LGBT are also mentally ill, that isn't the point of this discussion, nor am I saying they are, nor is that the topic of this thread, nor am I trying to group them in with mass murderers. 

Anyway, maybe it's not mental health (and there is only correlation between mental health issues and mass murderers...not causation)...I'm not a scientist, I don't know...maybe it is what you say...it's "asymmetric force".

Can you give me an example of China, Russia, NAR, secessionists, and Theocratics pushing this?  

 

LGBT are mentally ill. It’s called, “Sexual Dysphoria”. 
 

And then, just like that, it wasn’t…….

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SEEMEFIRST
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5/10/2023 5:12pm

Unfortunately more than I care to remember.

early wrote:

Thank you for your service.

I'd imagine you don't think of yourself as mentally ill because your actions were justified?

War isn’t pretty. I am not a murderer. I did unto others, before they could do unto me.    Most of these rally around the flag...

War isn’t pretty. I am not a murderer. I did unto others, before they could do unto me. 
 

Most of these rally around the flag, let’s bust this thing open saber rattlers? They’ve never seen the horror of combat. 
 

Although, why does the government want to use “Red Flag” laws to take weapons away from Vets? Lost all respect for Dan Crenshaw for his support of that piece of legislation. 
 

There’s a clue in my username.

Clue?

That's a tag!

Git 'er done, son. Glad we had guys like you around. 

My brother in law was one of the guys that I guess was driving around in HumVees supporting you guys.

They blew up on a IED. Killed 2 or 3 of his crew, fucked him up permanently. 

He had just stepped out when it went off. He said when he came to, he just started mag dumping. 

They had to surgically remove a door handle from his shoulder. 

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5/10/2023 5:14pm Edited Date/Time 5/10/2023 5:15pm
SEEMEFIRST wrote:
Clue? That's a tag! Git 'er done, son. Glad we had guys like you around.  My brother in law was one of the guys that I...

Clue?

That's a tag!

Git 'er done, son. Glad we had guys like you around. 

My brother in law was one of the guys that I guess was driving around in HumVees supporting you guys.

They blew up on a IED. Killed 2 or 3 of his crew, fucked him up permanently. 

He had just stepped out when it went off. He said when he came to, he just started mag dumping. 

They had to surgically remove a door handle from his shoulder. 

That’s my thumbs down because damn I hate to hear that. Glad your BIL made it out of that one. 
 

 

Edit: RIP to the fallen soldiers. 

SEEMEFIRST
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5/10/2023 5:21pm
Dirtydeeds wrote:
That’s my thumbs down because damn I hate to hear that. Glad your BIL made it out of that one.      Edit: RIP to the...

That’s my thumbs down because damn I hate to hear that. Glad your BIL made it out of that one. 
 

 

Edit: RIP to the fallen soldiers. 

Yeah, me too.

I often wonder if the thumbs down are like yours. 

Glad you said something though. I wouldn't have said anything, but I would have been thinking WTF?

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early
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5/10/2023 5:39pm
Titan1 wrote:
So you blame an inanimate object?  And the solution is to remove that inanimate object from society?  Never mind the actual human being pulling the trigger...

So you blame an inanimate object?  And the solution is to remove that inanimate object from society?  Never mind the actual human being pulling the trigger on that inanimate object...just take the inanimate object away...that way he can't kill people with it...and he'll have to figure out another inanimate object to use. 

I'd much rather talk about why so many in America resort to mass murder...rather than get hung up on which inanimate object they are using...

Why is Mental health a moving target?

And though it could be argued that LGBT are also mentally ill, that isn't the point of this discussion, nor am I saying they are, nor is that the topic of this thread, nor am I trying to group them in with mass murderers. 

Anyway, maybe it's not mental health (and there is only correlation between mental health issues and mass murderers...not causation)...I'm not a scientist, I don't know...maybe it is what you say...it's "asymmetric force".

Can you give me an example of China, Russia, NAR, secessionists, and Theocratics pushing this?  

 

I don't blame the guns for shooting, I don't want to take guns away, I don't want to ban "assault weapons", I don't want to have a hotline to rat on your neighbors mental health, I don't want to make any changes to the Bill of Rights. 

What I do want to do is condemn people that use their guns inappropriately and hold them accountable. 

I want stiffer sentences for violent crime and sexual assault and property theft, as well as stricter parole for those people, since repeat offenders are responsible for lots of assaults. 

I want the NRA and any other dipshit that ties their idea of "freedom" exclusively to owning guns to promote the idea that with great power comes great responsibility, not that it's your right to shoot somebody that looks at you wrong.

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Titan1
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5/10/2023 7:52pm
Titan1 wrote:
So you blame an inanimate object?  And the solution is to remove that inanimate object from society?  Never mind the actual human being pulling the trigger...

So you blame an inanimate object?  And the solution is to remove that inanimate object from society?  Never mind the actual human being pulling the trigger on that inanimate object...just take the inanimate object away...that way he can't kill people with it...and he'll have to figure out another inanimate object to use. 

I'd much rather talk about why so many in America resort to mass murder...rather than get hung up on which inanimate object they are using...

Why is Mental health a moving target?

And though it could be argued that LGBT are also mentally ill, that isn't the point of this discussion, nor am I saying they are, nor is that the topic of this thread, nor am I trying to group them in with mass murderers. 

Anyway, maybe it's not mental health (and there is only correlation between mental health issues and mass murderers...not causation)...I'm not a scientist, I don't know...maybe it is what you say...it's "asymmetric force".

Can you give me an example of China, Russia, NAR, secessionists, and Theocratics pushing this?  

 

early wrote:
I don't blame the guns for shooting, I don't want to take guns away, I don't want to ban "assault weapons", I don't want to have...

I don't blame the guns for shooting, I don't want to take guns away, I don't want to ban "assault weapons", I don't want to have a hotline to rat on your neighbors mental health, I don't want to make any changes to the Bill of Rights. 

What I do want to do is condemn people that use their guns inappropriately and hold them accountable. 

I want stiffer sentences for violent crime and sexual assault and property theft, as well as stricter parole for those people, since repeat offenders are responsible for lots of assaults. 

I want the NRA and any other dipshit that ties their idea of "freedom" exclusively to owning guns to promote the idea that with great power comes great responsibility, not that it's your right to shoot somebody that looks at you wrong.

Okay…you are talking about deterring them with stiffer consequences, and I don’t disagree with any of that.  Though the consequences for murder are already pretty harsh.  Do you support the death penalty then?
 

But, again, what do you think causes so many Americans to commit mass murder?  You mentioned Asymmetric Force from Russia ,China, NRA etc…can you give some examples?  

Could you elaborate on what you mean by “I want the NRA and any other dipshit that ties their idea of "freedom" exclusively to owning guns…”. It sounds to me like it could be a back handed attack on the 2nd amendment (after stating you don’t want to ban guns), and a direct attack on supporters of the 2nd.    I’d love to hear more about  your view on that.

5/10/2023 8:28pm
early wrote:
I don't blame the guns for shooting, I don't want to take guns away, I don't want to ban "assault weapons", I don't want to have...

I don't blame the guns for shooting, I don't want to take guns away, I don't want to ban "assault weapons", I don't want to have a hotline to rat on your neighbors mental health, I don't want to make any changes to the Bill of Rights. 

What I do want to do is condemn people that use their guns inappropriately and hold them accountable. 

I want stiffer sentences for violent crime and sexual assault and property theft, as well as stricter parole for those people, since repeat offenders are responsible for lots of assaults. 

I want the NRA and any other dipshit that ties their idea of "freedom" exclusively to owning guns to promote the idea that with great power comes great responsibility, not that it's your right to shoot somebody that looks at you wrong.

How are stiffer penalties going to deter mass shootings?

Most mass shooters are killed at the scene.

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ns503
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5/11/2023 3:12am

All countries have mental illness issues. That's not just a USA thing. They also have guns. I have 6 of them 20 feet from me now. The thing other countries don't have is the second amendment and the kind of gun culture it has produced. The fervent way that all is and has been for years promoted by some has some people 'on the fringe' thinking they are quite justified to handle their problems with guns (which are everywhere and easy to get), or maybe even that it's the only way to handle their problems. It's quite a tangled mess and has taken quite a while to build to this point. I think if the authors of the amendment could see things today, they might want to rewrite what they wrote a little bit.

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early
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5/11/2023 4:55am
Titan1 wrote:
Okay…you are talking about deterring them with stiffer consequences, and I don’t disagree with any of that.  Though the consequences for murder are already pretty harsh...

Okay…you are talking about deterring them with stiffer consequences, and I don’t disagree with any of that.  Though the consequences for murder are already pretty harsh.  Do you support the death penalty then?
 

But, again, what do you think causes so many Americans to commit mass murder?  You mentioned Asymmetric Force from Russia ,China, NRA etc…can you give some examples?  

Could you elaborate on what you mean by “I want the NRA and any other dipshit that ties their idea of "freedom" exclusively to owning guns…”. It sounds to me like it could be a back handed attack on the 2nd amendment (after stating you don’t want to ban guns), and a direct attack on supporters of the 2nd.    I’d love to hear more about  your view on that.

That won't deter the mass shooter, nothing can really stop them. Someone can start shooting literally anywhere you go. The point of stiffer penalties is to decrease repeat offenders who are way more likely to commit violent acts. There needs to be a holistic approach to reducing violence and violent rhetoric to bring the temperature down in America. The NRA is not doing a good job of that. The media is not doing a good job of that. Politicians are not doing a good job of that. We are not doing a good job of that.

The easiest way to influence people is to unite around a common enemy.  That's why local, college, and pro sports are so popular and fun, it creates an enemy in a fairly low stakes way. 22 years ago when the "war on terror" began I thought to myself it's gonna be ugly when we lose interest in making Muslims the enemy and make each other the enemy, and here we are.

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Titan1
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5/11/2023 6:08am
Titan1 wrote:
Okay…you are talking about deterring them with stiffer consequences, and I don’t disagree with any of that.  Though the consequences for murder are already pretty harsh...

Okay…you are talking about deterring them with stiffer consequences, and I don’t disagree with any of that.  Though the consequences for murder are already pretty harsh.  Do you support the death penalty then?
 

But, again, what do you think causes so many Americans to commit mass murder?  You mentioned Asymmetric Force from Russia ,China, NRA etc…can you give some examples?  

Could you elaborate on what you mean by “I want the NRA and any other dipshit that ties their idea of "freedom" exclusively to owning guns…”. It sounds to me like it could be a back handed attack on the 2nd amendment (after stating you don’t want to ban guns), and a direct attack on supporters of the 2nd.    I’d love to hear more about  your view on that.

early wrote:
That won't deter the mass shooter, nothing can really stop them. Someone can start shooting literally anywhere you go. The point of stiffer penalties is to...

That won't deter the mass shooter, nothing can really stop them. Someone can start shooting literally anywhere you go. The point of stiffer penalties is to decrease repeat offenders who are way more likely to commit violent acts. There needs to be a holistic approach to reducing violence and violent rhetoric to bring the temperature down in America. The NRA is not doing a good job of that. The media is not doing a good job of that. Politicians are not doing a good job of that. We are not doing a good job of that.

The easiest way to influence people is to unite around a common enemy.  That's why local, college, and pro sports are so popular and fun, it creates an enemy in a fairly low stakes way. 22 years ago when the "war on terror" began I thought to myself it's gonna be ugly when we lose interest in making Muslims the enemy and make each other the enemy, and here we are.

Most mass murderers aren’t repeat offenders?  In fact I don’t know of any that was a repeat offender.

Can you give any examples of the NRA using violent rhetoric?

I agree with you that the media and politicians are actively trying to divide America and make each other the enemy.   In fact, I could easily give several examples of politicians-via the media-encouraging their supporters to commit acts of violence on the “other side”…But I think you are well aware of those instances so I won’t bother finding them.

I'm genuinely interested in ways that you think Russia and China and using asymmetric force in America to cause mass murders?

indy_maico
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5/11/2023 7:27am
Titan1 wrote:
Most mass murderers aren’t repeat offenders?  In fact I don’t know of any that was a repeat offender. Can you give any examples of the NRA...

Most mass murderers aren’t repeat offenders?  In fact I don’t know of any that was a repeat offender.

Can you give any examples of the NRA using violent rhetoric?

I agree with you that the media and politicians are actively trying to divide America and make each other the enemy.   In fact, I could easily give several examples of politicians-via the media-encouraging their supporters to commit acts of violence on the “other side”…But I think you are well aware of those instances so I won’t bother finding them.

I'm genuinely interested in ways that you think Russia and China and using asymmetric force in America to cause mass murders?

 

 

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vet323
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5/11/2023 8:17am
Titan1 wrote:
Okay…you are talking about deterring them with stiffer consequences, and I don’t disagree with any of that.  Though the consequences for murder are already pretty harsh...

Okay…you are talking about deterring them with stiffer consequences, and I don’t disagree with any of that.  Though the consequences for murder are already pretty harsh.  Do you support the death penalty then?
 

But, again, what do you think causes so many Americans to commit mass murder?  You mentioned Asymmetric Force from Russia ,China, NRA etc…can you give some examples?  

Could you elaborate on what you mean by “I want the NRA and any other dipshit that ties their idea of "freedom" exclusively to owning guns…”. It sounds to me like it could be a back handed attack on the 2nd amendment (after stating you don’t want to ban guns), and a direct attack on supporters of the 2nd.    I’d love to hear more about  your view on that.

early wrote:
That won't deter the mass shooter, nothing can really stop them. Someone can start shooting literally anywhere you go. The point of stiffer penalties is to...

That won't deter the mass shooter, nothing can really stop them. Someone can start shooting literally anywhere you go. The point of stiffer penalties is to decrease repeat offenders who are way more likely to commit violent acts. There needs to be a holistic approach to reducing violence and violent rhetoric to bring the temperature down in America. The NRA is not doing a good job of that. The media is not doing a good job of that. Politicians are not doing a good job of that. We are not doing a good job of that.

The easiest way to influence people is to unite around a common enemy.  That's why local, college, and pro sports are so popular and fun, it creates an enemy in a fairly low stakes way. 22 years ago when the "war on terror" began I thought to myself it's gonna be ugly when we lose interest in making Muslims the enemy and make each other the enemy, and here we are.

I may disagree that it won't deter the mass shooter. The only way that most media sources can make the claim that there have been hundreds of mass shootings this year is to include gang shootings and shootings that occur during the commission of another crime. 

Those types of mass shootings would certainly be diminished if laws were aggressively enforced and sentences increased. 

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early
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5/11/2023 9:56am
vet323 wrote:
I may disagree that it won't deter the mass shooter. The only way that most media sources can make the claim that there have been hundreds...

I may disagree that it won't deter the mass shooter. The only way that most media sources can make the claim that there have been hundreds of mass shootings this year is to include gang shootings and shootings that occur during the commission of another crime. 

Those types of mass shootings would certainly be diminished if laws were aggressively enforced and sentences increased. 

You're right, I thought about this but didn't mention it. 

Keeping a tighter leash on previously violent people and lowering the temperature of the rhetoric in this country would have better collateral benefits than making everyone paranoid their neighbor is narcing on them for mental health.

1
1
5/11/2023 10:34pm
Titan1 wrote:
Okay…you are talking about deterring them with stiffer consequences, and I don’t disagree with any of that.  Though the consequences for murder are already pretty harsh...

Okay…you are talking about deterring them with stiffer consequences, and I don’t disagree with any of that.  Though the consequences for murder are already pretty harsh.  Do you support the death penalty then?
 

But, again, what do you think causes so many Americans to commit mass murder?  You mentioned Asymmetric Force from Russia ,China, NRA etc…can you give some examples?  

Could you elaborate on what you mean by “I want the NRA and any other dipshit that ties their idea of "freedom" exclusively to owning guns…”. It sounds to me like it could be a back handed attack on the 2nd amendment (after stating you don’t want to ban guns), and a direct attack on supporters of the 2nd.    I’d love to hear more about  your view on that.

early wrote:
That won't deter the mass shooter, nothing can really stop them. Someone can start shooting literally anywhere you go. The point of stiffer penalties is to...

That won't deter the mass shooter, nothing can really stop them. Someone can start shooting literally anywhere you go. The point of stiffer penalties is to decrease repeat offenders who are way more likely to commit violent acts. There needs to be a holistic approach to reducing violence and violent rhetoric to bring the temperature down in America. The NRA is not doing a good job of that. The media is not doing a good job of that. Politicians are not doing a good job of that. We are not doing a good job of that.

The easiest way to influence people is to unite around a common enemy.  That's why local, college, and pro sports are so popular and fun, it creates an enemy in a fairly low stakes way. 22 years ago when the "war on terror" began I thought to myself it's gonna be ugly when we lose interest in making Muslims the enemy and make each other the enemy, and here we are.

vet323 wrote:
I may disagree that it won't deter the mass shooter. The only way that most media sources can make the claim that there have been hundreds...

I may disagree that it won't deter the mass shooter. The only way that most media sources can make the claim that there have been hundreds of mass shootings this year is to include gang shootings and shootings that occur during the commission of another crime. 

Those types of mass shootings would certainly be diminished if laws were aggressively enforced and sentences increased. 

Gang members haha in 04 in Chicago. I,m inside the bldg delivering a tanker of chocolate. A lot of setup stuff I,m busy. Then I here a noise & it’s a Mexican gang member flashing his hand signs then points at me then a gun to the head like he’s going to blow my brains out. I said you little f,er & ran after him.  It was a down slope to the 5 ft higher concrete where he was. He darted into the chocolate factory. When the employee c a me around . I said your not cutting the seal until you bring him out here. They wouldn’t so I said I,m leaving & I did. I didn’t go back either.  S side Chicago in 09-2011 it had more shootings than the 2 wars we where in.  When I ran nights I had the trk shot a few times.  They wouldn’t send the x  military in there, that didn’t make sense.  It’s really not big of a deal getting shot or seeing the dead laying in the street.  It’s so common that it doesn’t surprise you .  Tv covers shootings  for political reasons.  A ton of accidents killed more people instantly than any shooting. Bodies exploded everywhere ah yeah , blood is everywhere ah yeah .  My 4th to 6th time at Chicago rail yard job. They show us a few movies & pics of huge fatality wrecks. If your too upbeat & say do you hv any movies with audio ? You know some screaming & stuff . . Old trucking joke they get all pissed. 

1
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IanMac138
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5/11/2023 11:09pm

I don't know...but every country in the world has mentally ill people. But every other country in the world does not have mass shootings on a weekly basis like the U.S. Because they can't just walk into gun store and walk out with a fucking rifle. Let alone a rifle that shoots with such accuracy with 30 rounds which can kill so many in such a short amount of time... such a velocity and force of impact that the round literally tumbles inside of human tissue creating a shock wave that blows off faces, skulls, obliterates vital organs and leaves cavernous holes where bone and tissue once were. The rate of survival from a handgun vs. a semi-automatic rifle isn't even comparable. Get shot by an "AR" and you're probably toast, if you survived the shot, you're bleeding out and fast. There is no rationale in the world as to why any civilian needs to own such a rifle. Can't change my mind. Don't @ me.

Keep your shotguns, handguns and hunting rifles...I'm fine with that. Hell, I own an M1 Garand that can blow a face off from 300 yards...I'd like to keep mine and keep them legal. But the difference is that they are heavier, have more recoil, need more maintenance and a single round costs about $2 a pop. And 8 rounds before you have to reload and hope to not smash your thumb in the process when you're trying to annihilate as many of your fellow citizens at a school, mall, movie theater, you name it.

Get where I'm going with this? We can still have guns and yes, we will still have gun deaths because 'Merica. We have too many citizens who have a hard on for weapons and a borderline mental illness worshipping "inanimate objects" which are meant to kill a living organism, human or otherwise, to ever rid ourselves of this plague. 

But, if we could ban the sale of rifles that were designed for combat/obliterate a human body that would be a great start. If a banker in Louisville with mental problems can just walk into a store and buy an AR type rifle one day and the next, take the lives of 5 people, and drastically affecting the lives of 8 other wounded including a police officer all in the span of 3 minutes, ...what the actual fuck are we doing as a society to think this is ok? Take away weapons of war first to save as many lives as possible because it's going to happen again and again every damn week with this same type of rifle, and then let's simultaneously start to address the root causes and solutions to mental health. But if everyone keeps pointing at mental health only, then why the hell are we giving mentally ill people easy access to a weapon that can decimate lives in a matter of seconds? 

Americans can still get off on their gun-porno addiction, but just not with THAT type of porno. Thoughts and prayers in the meantime.

3
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IanMac138
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West Linn, OR US
5/11/2023 11:21pm

Case in point...but for all the Rambo's defending any swinging dick civilian to have an AR, just enjoy the science and engineering part of this, it's even got pictures and animation for ya'll but disregard the autopsy findings of the dead kids killed with this stupid weapon. 
 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/interactive/2023/ar-15-damage-to-human-body/

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5/11/2023 11:46pm
IanMac138 wrote:
I don't know...but every country in the world has mentally ill people. But every other country in the world does not have mass shootings on a...

I don't know...but every country in the world has mentally ill people. But every other country in the world does not have mass shootings on a weekly basis like the U.S. Because they can't just walk into gun store and walk out with a fucking rifle. Let alone a rifle that shoots with such accuracy with 30 rounds which can kill so many in such a short amount of time... such a velocity and force of impact that the round literally tumbles inside of human tissue creating a shock wave that blows off faces, skulls, obliterates vital organs and leaves cavernous holes where bone and tissue once were. The rate of survival from a handgun vs. a semi-automatic rifle isn't even comparable. Get shot by an "AR" and you're probably toast, if you survived the shot, you're bleeding out and fast. There is no rationale in the world as to why any civilian needs to own such a rifle. Can't change my mind. Don't @ me.

Keep your shotguns, handguns and hunting rifles...I'm fine with that. Hell, I own an M1 Garand that can blow a face off from 300 yards...I'd like to keep mine and keep them legal. But the difference is that they are heavier, have more recoil, need more maintenance and a single round costs about $2 a pop. And 8 rounds before you have to reload and hope to not smash your thumb in the process when you're trying to annihilate as many of your fellow citizens at a school, mall, movie theater, you name it.

Get where I'm going with this? We can still have guns and yes, we will still have gun deaths because 'Merica. We have too many citizens who have a hard on for weapons and a borderline mental illness worshipping "inanimate objects" which are meant to kill a living organism, human or otherwise, to ever rid ourselves of this plague. 

But, if we could ban the sale of rifles that were designed for combat/obliterate a human body that would be a great start. If a banker in Louisville with mental problems can just walk into a store and buy an AR type rifle one day and the next, take the lives of 5 people, and drastically affecting the lives of 8 other wounded including a police officer all in the span of 3 minutes, ...what the actual fuck are we doing as a society to think this is ok? Take away weapons of war first to save as many lives as possible because it's going to happen again and again every damn week with this same type of rifle, and then let's simultaneously start to address the root causes and solutions to mental health. But if everyone keeps pointing at mental health only, then why the hell are we giving mentally ill people easy access to a weapon that can decimate lives in a matter of seconds? 

Americans can still get off on their gun-porno addiction, but just not with THAT type of porno. Thoughts and prayers in the meantime.

These mass shooters are not using guns that will blow faces off. 

 

Check this out though. If you consider a mass shooting to just be an incident where two or more people were killed, not including the shooter then there were only 49 incidents from 1999 to 2013. I wish someone would collect data in that same way, but would include more recent years. Screenshot 20230512-013332 Samsung Internet

 https://www.cga.ct.gov/2013/rpt/2013-r-0057.htm

 

5/11/2023 11:54pm

 

Jackpot, this is real data on what seems like a more reasonable definition of a mass shooting. 

 

811487-1
"**Since 2013, the source defines a mass shooting as any single attack in a public place with three or more fatalities, in line with the definition by the FBI. Before 2013, a mass shooting was defined as any single attack in a public place with four or more fatalities."

https://www.statista.com/statistics/811487/number-of-mass-shootings-in-…

 

1
swordfish
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Somewhere , AB CA
5/12/2023 3:19am
IanMac138 wrote:
Case in point...but for all the Rambo's defending any swinging dick civilian to have an AR, just enjoy the science and engineering part of this, it's...

Case in point...but for all the Rambo's defending any swinging dick civilian to have an AR, just enjoy the science and engineering part of this, it's even got pictures and animation for ya'll but disregard the autopsy findings of the dead kids killed with this stupid weapon. 
 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/interactive/2023/ar-15-damage-to-human-body/

😂😂WP puff piece. Holy fuck you are a guilable lump. you really think a .223/5.56 round is special? 
I’d rather take a 5.56 round than a whole lot of others out there. 
Combat medics would mostly agree. 

1
3
swordfish
Posts
1950
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Location
Somewhere , AB CA
5/12/2023 3:26am Edited Date/Time 5/12/2023 3:36am
IanMac138 wrote:
I don't know...but every country in the world has mentally ill people. But every other country in the world does not have mass shootings on a...

I don't know...but every country in the world has mentally ill people. But every other country in the world does not have mass shootings on a weekly basis like the U.S. Because they can't just walk into gun store and walk out with a fucking rifle. Let alone a rifle that shoots with such accuracy with 30 rounds which can kill so many in such a short amount of time... such a velocity and force of impact that the round literally tumbles inside of human tissue creating a shock wave that blows off faces, skulls, obliterates vital organs and leaves cavernous holes where bone and tissue once were. The rate of survival from a handgun vs. a semi-automatic rifle isn't even comparable. Get shot by an "AR" and you're probably toast, if you survived the shot, you're bleeding out and fast. There is no rationale in the world as to why any civilian needs to own such a rifle. Can't change my mind. Don't @ me.

Keep your shotguns, handguns and hunting rifles...I'm fine with that. Hell, I own an M1 Garand that can blow a face off from 300 yards...I'd like to keep mine and keep them legal. But the difference is that they are heavier, have more recoil, need more maintenance and a single round costs about $2 a pop. And 8 rounds before you have to reload and hope to not smash your thumb in the process when you're trying to annihilate as many of your fellow citizens at a school, mall, movie theater, you name it.

Get where I'm going with this? We can still have guns and yes, we will still have gun deaths because 'Merica. We have too many citizens who have a hard on for weapons and a borderline mental illness worshipping "inanimate objects" which are meant to kill a living organism, human or otherwise, to ever rid ourselves of this plague. 

But, if we could ban the sale of rifles that were designed for combat/obliterate a human body that would be a great start. If a banker in Louisville with mental problems can just walk into a store and buy an AR type rifle one day and the next, take the lives of 5 people, and drastically affecting the lives of 8 other wounded including a police officer all in the span of 3 minutes, ...what the actual fuck are we doing as a society to think this is ok? Take away weapons of war first to save as many lives as possible because it's going to happen again and again every damn week with this same type of rifle, and then let's simultaneously start to address the root causes and solutions to mental health. But if everyone keeps pointing at mental health only, then why the hell are we giving mentally ill people easy access to a weapon that can decimate lives in a matter of seconds? 

Americans can still get off on their gun-porno addiction, but just not with THAT type of porno. Thoughts and prayers in the meantime.

Your M1 is a battle rifle with a big, powerful round. You think it’s ok to own that and not a sporting rifle with a little bullet? 
A few years ago in my sleepy little east coat CDN town, a guy killed 2 cops and 2 civilians with a bolt action hunting rifle from a window. 
Then a guy with a pistol committed the largest mass shooting in the history of the country killing 22 people including a responding cop. 
Banning that scary black rifle won’t do shit to stop mass shootings, especially when the majority of the shootings included in the stats happen in the hood by a bunch of gang bangers. 
Even in Canada with all its firearms regulations, I can buy a scary black 5.56 online, at a store with not a lot of effort. 1 day firearm safety course at the local community college and wait for your PAL card in the mail. Way harder to buy a handgun, in fact our current communist government has banned purchases. 

4
early
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University Heights, OH US
5/12/2023 4:15am
swordfish wrote:
😂😂WP puff piece. Holy fuck you are a guilable lump. you really think a .223/5.56 round is special?  I’d rather take a 5.56 round than a...

😂😂WP puff piece. Holy fuck you are a guilable lump. you really think a .223/5.56 round is special? 
I’d rather take a 5.56 round than a whole lot of others out there. 
Combat medics would mostly agree. 

What commonly available rounds would a .223 be preferable over?

2
swordfish
Posts
1950
Joined
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Location
Somewhere , AB CA
5/12/2023 4:32am
swordfish wrote:
😂😂WP puff piece. Holy fuck you are a guilable lump. you really think a .223/5.56 round is special?  I’d rather take a 5.56 round than a...

😂😂WP puff piece. Holy fuck you are a guilable lump. you really think a .223/5.56 round is special? 
I’d rather take a 5.56 round than a whole lot of others out there. 
Combat medics would mostly agree. 

early wrote:

What commonly available rounds would a .223 be preferable over?

.308, 7.62, .30-06 would be most common. Less common, 6.5, 300 Blackout, 338, etc. 

1
early
Posts
9802
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Location
University Heights, OH US
5/12/2023 4:47am
swordfish wrote:

.308, 7.62, .30-06 would be most common. Less common, 6.5, 300 Blackout, 338, etc. 

Why do you think those rounds aren't more common in mass shooting situations?

1

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