Fixing a dent - FMF Titanium Header

Titan777
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Titan777 6/1/2020 4:49pm
6/1/2020 4:49pm Edited Date/Time 6/1/2020 4:51pm
BUTWHY? wrote:
Try a glycol fluid, it reacts to the titanium differently then water and saves half the time on freezing. Have had 2 successful dent removals with...
Try a glycol fluid, it reacts to the titanium differently then water and saves half the time on freezing. Have had 2 successful dent removals with that method.
Was your dent the same as mine?
Will mono ethylene glycol (green anti freeze) do the job?
Why and how does it react differently to titanium?

I think it's not working since I only fill a few inches past the dent, and not blocking any ends. But I'm afraid if I try to fill it all, the welds will crack.

Should I just inflate it with high pressure (100 psi?) and heat the dent area?
garagedog 6/1/2020 4:57pm
6/1/2020 4:57pm
Titan777 wrote:
Was your dent the same as mine? Will mono ethylene glycol (green anti freeze) do the job? Why and how does it react differently to titanium...
Was your dent the same as mine?
Will mono ethylene glycol (green anti freeze) do the job?
Why and how does it react differently to titanium?

I think it's not working since I only fill a few inches past the dent, and not blocking any ends. But I'm afraid if I try to fill it all, the welds will crack.

Should I just inflate it with high pressure (100 psi?) and heat the dent area?
I had best results with putting as much water in as possible. More water, more expansion.

If you have the means to plug it up and heat it then go for that!!!
Titan777
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Titan777 6/1/2020 5:33pm
6/1/2020 5:33pm
garagedog wrote:
I had best results with putting as much water in as possible. More water, more expansion. If you have the means to plug it up and...
I had best results with putting as much water in as possible. More water, more expansion.

If you have the means to plug it up and heat it then go for that!!!
I'm worried about filling it up and blocking both ends because of the mega bomb. I read ice can break the header.
jmo443
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jmo443 6/1/2020 5:47pm
6/1/2020 5:47pm
So there is no reason to ever get an aftermarket header? Any size or length works exactly the same? Like I said I’ve been wrong before but why go aftermarket if a crushed header works the same as a new one? Please do fill me in. But a new header smash it almost closed and run it on a dyno in both conditions.
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jmo443
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jmo443 6/1/2020 5:48pm
6/1/2020 5:48pm
Buy a new header*
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Rick Amatuzio
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Rick Amatuzio 6/1/2020 8:22pm
6/1/2020 8:22pm
mx691 wrote:
Pour water in down-bend part, put pipe bend down in freezer, next day dent is gone...
He is right. We fix hydraulic cylinders do that all the time, with the freeze method. You can Actually aim the direction it pushes when you learn and do it enough

Also, drop a socket down in the header, once something solid is there, you can tap around the outside of the dent and it will come right out (as the socket keeps moving deeper and deeper) into the dent. Body work is an art, I watch a guy at work pound stuff out like magic. It’s fun to watch, but requires patience.

Timo_2824
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Timo_2824 6/1/2020 8:38pm
6/1/2020 8:38pm
jmo443 wrote:
So there is no reason to ever get an aftermarket header? Any size or length works exactly the same? Like I said I’ve been wrong before...
So there is no reason to ever get an aftermarket header? Any size or length works exactly the same? Like I said I’ve been wrong before but why go aftermarket if a crushed header works the same as a new one? Please do fill me in. But a new header smash it almost closed and run it on a dyno in both conditions.
It's already been done... a single dent doesn't change the volume enough to make a difference. It would almost be pinched closed before it really mattered.


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SLAPAHO
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SLAPAHO 6/1/2020 8:43pm
6/1/2020 8:43pm
SLAPAHO wrote:
Is that the SX header or the normal one?
Titan777 wrote:
It's the normal one.
Going for 6th cycle in the freezer. Still zero improvement.
Guess it won't work.
perfect reason to get the sx header.... that's the one that works best on that bike anyway....
jmo443
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jmo443 6/1/2020 10:11pm
6/1/2020 10:11pm
jmo443 wrote:
So there is no reason to ever get an aftermarket header? Any size or length works exactly the same? Like I said I’ve been wrong before...
So there is no reason to ever get an aftermarket header? Any size or length works exactly the same? Like I said I’ve been wrong before but why go aftermarket if a crushed header works the same as a new one? Please do fill me in. But a new header smash it almost closed and run it on a dyno in both conditions.
Timo_2824 wrote:
It's already been done... a single dent doesn't change the volume enough to make a difference. It would almost be pinched closed before it really mattered...
It's already been done... a single dent doesn't change the volume enough to make a difference. It would almost be pinched closed before it really mattered.


So there is no performance gain between a stock header than any other header? I’m not doubting you like I’ve said I’ve been wrong before and this isn’t my cup of tea to try and argue facts was just stating my own personal opinion.
DA498
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DA498 6/2/2020 5:19am
6/2/2020 5:19am
Just go ride!
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Titan777
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Titan777 6/2/2020 5:31am
6/2/2020 5:31am
SLAPAHO wrote:
perfect reason to get the sx header.... that's the one that works best on that bike anyway....
It's a 2020 250. There's no SX header for it.
Titan777
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Titan777 6/2/2020 5:32am
6/2/2020 5:32am
Rick Amatuzio wrote:
He is right. We fix hydraulic cylinders do that all the time, with the freeze method. You can Actually aim the direction it pushes when you...
He is right. We fix hydraulic cylinders do that all the time, with the freeze method. You can Actually aim the direction it pushes when you learn and do it enough

Also, drop a socket down in the header, once something solid is there, you can tap around the outside of the dent and it will come right out (as the socket keeps moving deeper and deeper) into the dent. Body work is an art, I watch a guy at work pound stuff out like magic. It’s fun to watch, but requires patience.

Can you show me what kind of socket?
Sounds weird tapping it when it's frozen inside, will pop out the dent..
Rick Amatuzio
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Rick Amatuzio 6/2/2020 6:06am
6/2/2020 6:06am Edited Date/Time 6/2/2020 6:09am
Rick Amatuzio wrote:
He is right. We fix hydraulic cylinders do that all the time, with the freeze method. You can Actually aim the direction it pushes when you...
He is right. We fix hydraulic cylinders do that all the time, with the freeze method. You can Actually aim the direction it pushes when you learn and do it enough

Also, drop a socket down in the header, once something solid is there, you can tap around the outside of the dent and it will come right out (as the socket keeps moving deeper and deeper) into the dent. Body work is an art, I watch a guy at work pound stuff out like magic. It’s fun to watch, but requires patience.

Titan777 wrote:
Can you show me what kind of socket?
Sounds weird tapping it when it's frozen inside, will pop out the dent..
Lol. I must not type well. Either freeze it OR use a socket. If you drop a socket that’s slightly smaller that the size of the dent into the header, as you tap around the outside of the dent the socket will work it’s way deeper and deeper into the dent and eventually you will get it through. I’ve watched out guy do it a thousand times. It helps if you can push on the socket but I’ve watched him do it with gravity too. If you tap on metal without something solid behind it, it will not yield.

Filling a chamber with water and freezing it also works well. We have pushed out a lot of expansion chambers for two strokes. We also filled a pipe with water once, welded both ends up with a freeze plug and installed a zerk, using a grease gun you can pump the dent out. It was messy, but a grease gun can put out about 10,000psi
hamncheeze
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hamncheeze 6/2/2020 11:51am
6/2/2020 11:51am
Rick Amatuzio wrote:
He is right. We fix hydraulic cylinders do that all the time, with the freeze method. You can Actually aim the direction it pushes when you...
He is right. We fix hydraulic cylinders do that all the time, with the freeze method. You can Actually aim the direction it pushes when you learn and do it enough

Also, drop a socket down in the header, once something solid is there, you can tap around the outside of the dent and it will come right out (as the socket keeps moving deeper and deeper) into the dent. Body work is an art, I watch a guy at work pound stuff out like magic. It’s fun to watch, but requires patience.

Titan777 wrote:
Can you show me what kind of socket?
Sounds weird tapping it when it's frozen inside, will pop out the dent..
Rick Amatuzio wrote:
Lol. I must not type well. Either freeze it OR use a socket. If you drop a socket that’s slightly smaller that the size of the...
Lol. I must not type well. Either freeze it OR use a socket. If you drop a socket that’s slightly smaller that the size of the dent into the header, as you tap around the outside of the dent the socket will work it’s way deeper and deeper into the dent and eventually you will get it through. I’ve watched out guy do it a thousand times. It helps if you can push on the socket but I’ve watched him do it with gravity too. If you tap on metal without something solid behind it, it will not yield.

Filling a chamber with water and freezing it also works well. We have pushed out a lot of expansion chambers for two strokes. We also filled a pipe with water once, welded both ends up with a freeze plug and installed a zerk, using a grease gun you can pump the dent out. It was messy, but a grease gun can put out about 10,000psi
Have you seen this socket trick work on titanium alloy? I ask because Ti has a tremendous "memory" (Young's modulus) and does not like to be reset.
SLAPAHO
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SLAPAHO 6/2/2020 1:01pm
6/2/2020 1:01pm
SLAPAHO wrote:
perfect reason to get the sx header.... that's the one that works best on that bike anyway....
Titan777 wrote:
It's a 2020 250. There's no SX header for it.
Oh, my bad.....well good luck with it..

otherwise...
https://www.piperepair.com/collections/2000-present-dent-repair
Mr. Info
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Mr. Info 6/2/2020 2:22pm
6/2/2020 2:22pm
Its on a Kawi so it won't make any difference with the dent or without. They are slow either way.
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Timo_2824 6/2/2020 6:22pm
6/2/2020 6:22pm
jmo443 wrote:
So there is no reason to ever get an aftermarket header? Any size or length works exactly the same? Like I said I’ve been wrong before...
So there is no reason to ever get an aftermarket header? Any size or length works exactly the same? Like I said I’ve been wrong before but why go aftermarket if a crushed header works the same as a new one? Please do fill me in. But a new header smash it almost closed and run it on a dyno in both conditions.
Timo_2824 wrote:
It's already been done... a single dent doesn't change the volume enough to make a difference. It would almost be pinched closed before it really mattered...
It's already been done... a single dent doesn't change the volume enough to make a difference. It would almost be pinched closed before it really mattered.


jmo443 wrote:
So there is no performance gain between a stock header than any other header? I’m not doubting you like I’ve said I’ve been wrong before and...
So there is no performance gain between a stock header than any other header? I’m not doubting you like I’ve said I’ve been wrong before and this isn’t my cup of tea to try and argue facts was just stating my own personal opinion.
I'm just talking about the dent not affecting the power. Also I don't think the performance gain on a modern bike is work the money for an aftermarket exhaust system.
Titan777
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Titan777 6/2/2020 6:44pm
6/2/2020 6:44pm Edited Date/Time 6/2/2020 6:47pm
Does someone know if I fill the entire header (mega bomb) with water and close both ends and let if freeze (can check every hour).
Can it damage the header or will it fix the dent? My last try before sending to a professional for $100.

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SLAPAHO
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SLAPAHO 6/2/2020 6:53pm
6/2/2020 6:53pm
Timo_2824 wrote:
It's already been done... a single dent doesn't change the volume enough to make a difference. It would almost be pinched closed before it really mattered...
It's already been done... a single dent doesn't change the volume enough to make a difference. It would almost be pinched closed before it really mattered.


jmo443 wrote:
So there is no performance gain between a stock header than any other header? I’m not doubting you like I’ve said I’ve been wrong before and...
So there is no performance gain between a stock header than any other header? I’m not doubting you like I’ve said I’ve been wrong before and this isn’t my cup of tea to try and argue facts was just stating my own personal opinion.
Timo_2824 wrote:
I'm just talking about the dent not affecting the power. Also I don't think the performance gain on a modern bike is work the money for...
I'm just talking about the dent not affecting the power. Also I don't think the performance gain on a modern bike is work the money for an aftermarket exhaust system.
Honestly, I don’t think any weekend warrior cares that much about it affecting performance. But if you have a brand new bike sitting in your garage and it has a big dent in the expensive exhaust you bought for it, it’s going to bother the fuck out of you until it’s fixed. I’m only speaking for myself, but I don’t think I’m the only person that feels this way.
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walent215
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walent215 6/3/2020 6:41am
6/3/2020 6:41am
When i ran this program i would fill the complete header up, plug one end with a wash plug and leave the other end open . it took a few tries but finally worked. I wouldnt be too afraid of plugging both ends though as i would think the dent should be area of least resistance.
Titan777
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Titan777 6/6/2020 8:38am
6/6/2020 8:38am
Managed to fix it with water. Filling only the curved header, blocking both sides somehow. It's not 100% perfect but I'll live with it.



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slowgti
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slowgti 6/6/2020 8:48am
6/6/2020 8:48am
That’s a pretty damn good job
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GeorgiePorgie
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GeorgiePorgie 6/6/2020 9:11am
6/6/2020 9:11am
Now get out there and dent that SOB again!!!
Momus
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Momus 6/6/2020 10:04am
6/6/2020 10:04am
Looks like it's been heated to me.
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Titan777
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Titan777 6/6/2020 10:30am
6/6/2020 10:30am
Momus wrote:
Looks like it's been heated to me.
It wasn't. I wonder how the dent got a different color. It can't go back to gold from the bluish color so that's weird.
jmo443
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jmo443 6/6/2020 10:36am
6/6/2020 10:36am
Looks good man!
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Motoxdoc
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Motoxdoc 6/6/2020 10:39am
6/6/2020 10:39am Edited Date/Time 6/6/2020 10:44am
Fill it with water and stick it in the freezer. If it doesn’t work the first time try in a second. I Did it once and it didn’t work the first time but I did it again and presto! It’s worth a try, it’s free and only takes two days. If that doesn’t work try something else..

Edit after I post it I saw that you tried it. It works better with smaller dents and it’s better than doing nothing. Nice! That’s much better. The change in color adds character.
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garagedog 6/6/2020 12:01pm
6/6/2020 12:01pm
Titan777 wrote:
Managed to fix it with water. Filling only the curved header, blocking both sides somehow. It's not 100% perfect but I'll live with it. [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2020/06/06/431336/s1200_20200604_234024.jpg[/img] [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2020/06/06/431335/s1200_20200604_234129.jpg[/img]...
Managed to fix it with water. Filling only the curved header, blocking both sides somehow. It's not 100% perfect but I'll live with it.



Good Job! Way to not give up and keep trying. Free fix too!!
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Momus
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Momus 6/7/2020 1:28am
6/7/2020 1:28am
Momus wrote:
Looks like it's been heated to me.
Titan777 wrote:
It wasn't. I wonder how the dent got a different color. It can't go back to gold from the bluish color so that's weird.
Heat.

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