Enzo tuned 4CS vs stock AER48 forks?

Braaaphole
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Braaaphole
Edited Date/Time 1/22/2018 3:58pm
I've been on the hunt for a KTM350sxf and just ran across one I really like. It's a 17, but the owner swapped the forks for the 4CS and had Enzo set them up. The guy is a well known racer and he won 2 of 3 motos at Loretta's last year on these forks.
The forks are the only thing holding me back from buying this bike. Everything I've read about the 4CS forks is terrible, but I'm curious about what Enzo could have done to them to make them choose those forks over the AER. I'm going to call Enzo today to see if they can tell me anything about them and what was done internally.

Just curious if anyone here has any experience with properly setup 4CS forks and how they would compare.

Thanks
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agn5009
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agn5009 1/22/2018 7:43am
1/22/2018 7:43am
I've been trying to get my 4CS forks set up so they're somewhat rideable. Hasn't happened yet.
Asimo
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Asimo 1/22/2018 8:24am
1/22/2018 8:24am
Ive had set up 4CS and I can tell you I've ridden far worse, both air and spring.
Panic_Rev
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Panic_Rev 1/22/2018 8:30am
1/22/2018 8:30am
They aren't terrible, but they aren't good.

I'm a slow vet B (if that is even a category) and I bottomed my forks out 3 times yesterday. Mine have been revalved from FC.
ns503
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ns503 1/22/2018 8:30am
1/22/2018 8:30am
Can't be all that terrible if they won 2 of 3 Loretta motos. No?

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Bruce372
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Bruce372 1/22/2018 9:06am
1/22/2018 9:06am
If you ever decide to sell the bike down the road, potential buyers would probably have the same reservations as you are having now.
xr70
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xr70 1/22/2018 9:15am
1/22/2018 9:15am Edited Date/Time 1/22/2018 9:17am
I had the Enzo 4cs with the sss conversion on my 16 and 1/2 FE , best fork ever .That fork was the best thing on that bike .
mx317
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mx317 1/22/2018 9:28am
1/22/2018 9:28am Edited Date/Time 1/22/2018 9:30am
xr70 wrote:
I had the Enzo 4cs with the sss conversion on my 16 and 1/2 FE , best fork ever .That fork was the best thing on...
I had the Enzo 4cs with the sss conversion on my 16 and 1/2 FE , best fork ever .That fork was the best thing on that bike .
Check to see if it had this mod like xr70 is talking about. It it does, you are good to go. If the top cap is recessed with screw slots to adjust damping, it probably had this conversion. The 4CS had the 3 corner spinner with reb on one side and comp on the other.
mx317
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mx317 1/22/2018 9:34am
1/22/2018 9:34am



These are KYB SSS forks

Asimo
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Asimo 1/22/2018 9:41am
1/22/2018 9:41am
Panic_Rev wrote:
They aren't terrible, but they aren't good. I'm a slow vet B (if that is even a category) and I bottomed my forks out 3 times...
They aren't terrible, but they aren't good.

I'm a slow vet B (if that is even a category) and I bottomed my forks out 3 times yesterday. Mine have been revalved from FC.
They aren't set up right and valving doesn't prevent bottoming. My old ones wouldn't bottom at all, even on a full SX track. Close, but you'd have to land flat on a triple face to get them to bottom.



Braaaphole
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Braaaphole 1/22/2018 10:07am
1/22/2018 10:07am
Thanks for the info. These are not SSS converted forks unfortunately. If they were, I'd buy it with no hesitation.
I called Craig Decker at Enzo and he informed me that he hadn't touched these forks and that someone else had done them. I know he was with Powerband before so I spoke with Billy. Billy told me he hadn't setup any 4CS forks for this rider either and that he always ran the AER forks on his race bikes.
It sounds like they either pieced together a bike, or swapped forks because they prefer the AER.
It makes me question what I was told about him winning 2 motos at Loretta's on these forks when his suspension guy told me point blank that he much prefers the AER and always ran them. Might have to pass on the bike based on this info.
motox11
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motox11 1/22/2018 10:14am
1/22/2018 10:14am
Braaaphole wrote:
Thanks for the info. These are not SSS converted forks unfortunately. If they were, I'd buy it with no hesitation. I called Craig Decker at Enzo...
Thanks for the info. These are not SSS converted forks unfortunately. If they were, I'd buy it with no hesitation.
I called Craig Decker at Enzo and he informed me that he hadn't touched these forks and that someone else had done them. I know he was with Powerband before so I spoke with Billy. Billy told me he hadn't setup any 4CS forks for this rider either and that he always ran the AER forks on his race bikes.
It sounds like they either pieced together a bike, or swapped forks because they prefer the AER.
It makes me question what I was told about him winning 2 motos at Loretta's on these forks when his suspension guy told me point blank that he much prefers the AER and always ran them. Might have to pass on the bike based on this info.
What people are doing that have a spare set of 4cs laying around or have a 16 and a 17 is selling their 17+ ktm/husky's with the 4cs forks and keeping the AER forks and giving people a line of bullshit like "prefer the feel of spring forks". I've seen it about 5 times already. Sounds like that's your situation to an extent.
Braaaphole
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Braaaphole 1/22/2018 10:26am
1/22/2018 10:26am
motox11 wrote:
What people are doing that have a spare set of 4cs laying around or have a 16 and a 17 is selling their 17+ ktm/husky's with...
What people are doing that have a spare set of 4cs laying around or have a 16 and a 17 is selling their 17+ ktm/husky's with the 4cs forks and keeping the AER forks and giving people a line of bullshit like "prefer the feel of spring forks". I've seen it about 5 times already. Sounds like that's your situation to an extent.
It's somewhat close to what I'm seeing here. This kid is a top level amateur. I'm not going to throw his name out there because he's a good kid and I don't want to make anyone look bad. I'm talking with his dad and it's very likely he may have confused something and isn't trying to BS me, so I'll give him the benefit of doubt.
That said, he has a garage full of bikes. Everything he's riding now is 18. I can't tell you why he would have a set of 4CS forks laying around other than they keep getting swapped off of bikes because they actually prefer AER. If I had to guess, it started in 16 when he was on a FE250 with AER and then wanted to upgrade his 350 with AER or conevalves.
Either way, I've decided I'm not going to mess with the 4CS. I text them and said I'm ready to buy the bike if he puts AER forks on it.
Panic_Rev
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Panic_Rev 1/22/2018 10:28am
1/22/2018 10:28am
Panic_Rev wrote:
They aren't terrible, but they aren't good. I'm a slow vet B (if that is even a category) and I bottomed my forks out 3 times...
They aren't terrible, but they aren't good.

I'm a slow vet B (if that is even a category) and I bottomed my forks out 3 times yesterday. Mine have been revalved from FC.
Asimo wrote:
They aren't set up right and valving doesn't prevent bottoming. My old ones wouldn't bottom at all, even on a full SX track. Close, but you'd...
They aren't set up right and valving doesn't prevent bottoming. My old ones wouldn't bottom at all, even on a full SX track. Close, but you'd have to land flat on a triple face to get them to bottom.



Cool, please tell me how to set them up. I was slightly over jumping the few times I did bottom out. The valving comment was just to say they weren’t in stock form.
Myke
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Myke 1/22/2018 10:31am
1/22/2018 10:31am
Panic_Rev wrote:
They aren't terrible, but they aren't good. I'm a slow vet B (if that is even a category) and I bottomed my forks out 3 times...
They aren't terrible, but they aren't good.

I'm a slow vet B (if that is even a category) and I bottomed my forks out 3 times yesterday. Mine have been revalved from FC.
Asimo wrote:
They aren't set up right and valving doesn't prevent bottoming. My old ones wouldn't bottom at all, even on a full SX track. Close, but you'd...
They aren't set up right and valving doesn't prevent bottoming. My old ones wouldn't bottom at all, even on a full SX track. Close, but you'd have to land flat on a triple face to get them to bottom.



Stiffen compresson, if fork gets harsh raise your oil height some instead.
Schmidt452
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Schmidt452 1/22/2018 10:38am
1/22/2018 10:38am
I have a 15 FC450 with a MX Tech re-valve with Huck valves, I have no issues with the forks. I did the the KTM demo days when they came to my area last fall, I would say the re-valved 4CS worked just as good as the 18 AER's. If its always going to bother wondering if you would have been better off the different forks then by all means go for the AER setup.
RCMXracing
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RCMXracing 1/22/2018 1:24pm
1/22/2018 1:24pm
Braaaphole wrote:
I've been on the hunt for a KTM350sxf and just ran across one I really like. It's a 17, but the owner swapped the forks for...
I've been on the hunt for a KTM350sxf and just ran across one I really like. It's a 17, but the owner swapped the forks for the 4CS and had Enzo set them up. The guy is a well known racer and he won 2 of 3 motos at Loretta's last year on these forks.
The forks are the only thing holding me back from buying this bike. Everything I've read about the 4CS forks is terrible, but I'm curious about what Enzo could have done to them to make them choose those forks over the AER. I'm going to call Enzo today to see if they can tell me anything about them and what was done internally.

Just curious if anyone here has any experience with properly setup 4CS forks and how they would compare.

Thanks
I can give you an exact answer. Enzo in TX (Craig Decker) did the base valve conversion on my 4cs (the kit is $300). Very very happy with them and if you don’t like screwing with air they are solid for not a lot of investment.
Fade to future...I couldn’t leave well enough alone and came across a used set of AER. Did back to back tests at a track I’m very familiar with (mod 4cs vs. stock AER). Spent all day messing with pressure and clickers on AER. The mod 4cs were better in virtually all areas. So then I had him revalve the AER, and now like the AER more overall. Small bump absorption better with AER, slap landings annoying, but overall sticking with AER. Also boils down to a feel. Don’t feel the settle in corners as much with AER compared to spring, something I’ve gotten used to. Prob too much info, 1 Red Bull in the tank, avoiding bike maintenance.
Rickyisms
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Rickyisms 1/22/2018 2:41pm
1/22/2018 2:41pm
No complaints with my 4cs revelaved from powerband racing on my 16 125
Braaaphole
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Braaaphole 1/22/2018 2:49pm
1/22/2018 2:49pm
RCMXracing wrote:
I can give you an exact answer. Enzo in TX (Craig Decker) did the base valve conversion on my 4cs (the kit is $300). Very very...
I can give you an exact answer. Enzo in TX (Craig Decker) did the base valve conversion on my 4cs (the kit is $300). Very very happy with them and if you don’t like screwing with air they are solid for not a lot of investment.
Fade to future...I couldn’t leave well enough alone and came across a used set of AER. Did back to back tests at a track I’m very familiar with (mod 4cs vs. stock AER). Spent all day messing with pressure and clickers on AER. The mod 4cs were better in virtually all areas. So then I had him revalve the AER, and now like the AER more overall. Small bump absorption better with AER, slap landings annoying, but overall sticking with AER. Also boils down to a feel. Don’t feel the settle in corners as much with AER compared to spring, something I’ve gotten used to. Prob too much info, 1 Red Bull in the tank, avoiding bike maintenance.
I talked with Craig earlier and he was trying to sell me on the base valve. I then spoke with Billy at Powerband and he told me not to waste my time with the 4CS. That's the main reason I don't want them is because of all the conflicting info. It would always be in my head and have me believing that the bike could be better no matter how good I got the forks.

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RCMXracing
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RCMXracing 1/22/2018 3:09pm
1/22/2018 3:09pm
Braaaphole wrote:
I talked with Craig earlier and he was trying to sell me on the base valve. I then spoke with Billy at Powerband and he told...
I talked with Craig earlier and he was trying to sell me on the base valve. I then spoke with Billy at Powerband and he told me not to waste my time with the 4CS. That's the main reason I don't want them is because of all the conflicting info. It would always be in my head and have me believing that the bike could be better no matter how good I got the forks.
Fair enuff.
bigmaico
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bigmaico 1/22/2018 3:58pm
1/22/2018 3:58pm
RCMXracing wrote:
I can give you an exact answer. Enzo in TX (Craig Decker) did the base valve conversion on my 4cs (the kit is $300). Very very...
I can give you an exact answer. Enzo in TX (Craig Decker) did the base valve conversion on my 4cs (the kit is $300). Very very happy with them and if you don’t like screwing with air they are solid for not a lot of investment.
Fade to future...I couldn’t leave well enough alone and came across a used set of AER. Did back to back tests at a track I’m very familiar with (mod 4cs vs. stock AER). Spent all day messing with pressure and clickers on AER. The mod 4cs were better in virtually all areas. So then I had him revalve the AER, and now like the AER more overall. Small bump absorption better with AER, slap landings annoying, but overall sticking with AER. Also boils down to a feel. Don’t feel the settle in corners as much with AER compared to spring, something I’ve gotten used to. Prob too much info, 1 Red Bull in the tank, avoiding bike maintenance.
Braaaphole wrote:
I talked with Craig earlier and he was trying to sell me on the base valve. I then spoke with Billy at Powerband and he told...
I talked with Craig earlier and he was trying to sell me on the base valve. I then spoke with Billy at Powerband and he told me not to waste my time with the 4CS. That's the main reason I don't want them is because of all the conflicting info. It would always be in my head and have me believing that the bike could be better no matter how good I got the forks.
I took my 4CS forks to Adam at Kreft, when he was in Texas.

They work so much better then stock. They can be made to work.

Just not a lot of guys can really do them right.

I'll let you take a ride on my 14Fe at Rio if you like, but I need to fix my sub frame from getting center punch 2 weeks ago.

Give me until next week, still working on a Maico 490 rebuild.

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