Shoei vs 6D?

BUT Troy Lee himself said the SE4 out performed the 6D in the independent testing.

I'm not saying he is right but how does the consumer really know which is better? Or what technology is actually smoke and mirrors just to bump the price up?

I understand the whole it's your head you should protect it better than anything else argument, and I'm a little old school and have never used a mips helmet. But I don't think just because it is more expensive it protects you better. I still think the fox v3 is the best helmet you can buy (never wore a v4). And you can get last years paint for $200. I remember looking at the tld se3s when they came out and thought holy cow $500 is a ton for a helmet, and now there's multiple companies charging $700 wow

I am curious to see the lab numbers when they come out. Currently 6D and Bell Flex are leading the way in the low to mid Impact region which other helmets don't even offer. MIPS does nothing for IMPACT force reduction especially in helmets that are not completely round and or have vents.

There is the MARKETING side and the SCIENCE side and as often occurs in the MOTO industry the MARKETING side PREVAILS.
I have yet to read or hear anyone from the moto industry quote independent studies or peer reviewed research. I know both Bell and 6D have labs that test their products but it would be nice to see some research done by a University to provide unbiased info.

My son received a SE4 a few weeks ago, I'm really impressed by how light it is. It ventilates really well, my son came off the track and said he was sweating everywhere but his head was dry. He also said sometimes he forgets he's wearing it, it's so light. He's taken one good digger in it and so far so good.

I'm not sure if TLD will release the safety findings on the helmet compared to the others tested but I can personally tell you.. Troy is a no B.S. guy who is true to his word and who he is through and through. If he's saying that the research they had independently done shows that it's safer than the other brands, I believe him. My kid lines up on the same gate as his and I know how important it is for him to have safe high quality protection products.

EddieC, do you guys in the Asterisk Unit keep tabs on the different helmets' effectiveness in SX crashes?
I'm sure this is a delicate subject, and I'm not looking for any numbers, but can you elaborate on the fact if these top 2 helmets actually make the difference they say they do "in the field"? (I own a 6D).

To the people saying that the 6D and Bell Moto 9 Flex are overpriced- I've read an interview with Bob Weber (6D) and he said that they would like to sell it cheaper, but due to the 2 different parts the assembly costs are way bigger than for a conventional helmet. I'm sure it's the same with the Bell Moto 9 Flex.

Personally I own a 6D for one and a half years now, and I can't really complain. I could tell you how hard I crashed here and there and got no concussion like some people do here, but that literally has no meaning. There are just too many factors. I lost the nose guard and they sent me one for free, so they've got an awesome support.

As far as MIPS, I think it's clear that an universal system for all types of helmets can't be as good as a specialized system like the 6D, Moto 9 Flex and Leatt have.

Since there were like 300 of threads like these, there was one were a podcast was mentioned where flaws of the 6D helmet were mentioned (too big?). I would really like to know those.

No doubt.

Wasn't questioning You or the effectiveness/technology of the 6D.

Troy seems like a straight shooter and I wouldn't doubt him either.

I just wish we (consumers) had some actual data to compare each helmet to. A more educated decision would help a lot when spending 600+ on a lid.

And for those not wanting to spend the extra
money, at least they could also see where their helmet of choice ends up after the testing is done.

I just picked up a new in box 2015 Just1 j12, I had a medium fox v3 and the medium just1 fit is not worlds different. Little more narrow in the cheeks and does not come down on the sides and back as far. I guess that is for neck brace interaction. Super light and seems well built.

Looking forward to riding with it and even though it does not have any of the crazy new tech, I wanted to add it to the discussion as it seems to be a pretty high end helmet

Dear Vital Readers:
For those looking for further clarification on the performance of motocross helmets with “technology” you might check this link and download the PDF file.

http://www.ircobi.org/wordpress/downloads/ircobi-head-workshop-2015.pdf

There is a ton of data within this PDF, all of it very interesting and important, but for specifics on the current crop of available motocross helmets with “technology” scroll down to page 233.
There you will find a summary report on motocross helmets with concussion risk reducing technologies asking the question; “do they work?” The presenter was Dr. Terry Smith from Dynamic Research. Terry is at top of the list of educated scientists testing helmets for both linear and angular acceleration.

As I was informed by Terry, this report was commissioned by an undisclosed motorcycle helmet manufacturer wanting to know the answer to this very question about new helmet technologies. The results are very favorable supporting the value of the various technologies available. So, from this data (and everything we founded our company on), the obvious take-away is that for anyone in the market for a new or replacement helmet, they are foolish if they are not considering a helmet with “technology”. This data is extremely complicated and difficult to digest as there are many metrics at play in any given crash or lab impact test. However, the key take-away is that “less is more” – meaning less energy/force transferred to the brain is better than more energy/force transferred to the brain during any given crash event.

For all of us that ride, race, and love 2-wheeled action sports, this topic of CTE being directly linked to multiple head impacts, should be of utmost concern! ESPN’s piece on Dave Mirra during the recent X-Games broadcast delivers a very powerful message about head injuries. 6D has been working on angular acceleration and low-threshold solutions for over 5 and a-half years now. We were the pioneering company that addressed the problem head-on with our ATR-1 motocross helmet.

You will see in the information presented, that the 6D helmet out preformed every other helmet (and helmet technology) in the comparison in every injury metric, except the Max Principle Strain. On Max Principle Strain, the MIPS helmets did slightly better. While this is great for MIPS, one must keep in mind that all of this testing was done only at 45 degree oblique angle strikes. This is the ideal circumstance for the MIPS technology to perform, as the more vertical the impact gets (closer to 90 degrees), the less capability for MIPS to sheer and be effective. Theoretically, MIPS can do little to no work to improve impact attenuation at a 90 degree impact. MIPS also has constraints influenced by the shape of the human head.

If you do the math on the various metrics presented, the 6D performed as much as 50% better on some of the testing metrics over the competitive technologies and helmets, with the key injury metrics of Linear Acceleration, HIC, HIP, and Gambit showing the 6D far ahead of the other helmets tested. The Angular Acceleration metric also shows the 6D slightly ahead of both Bell and MIPS, with all three of the technologies way ahead of the traditional helmets tested. So for the question that started this thread, therein lies your answer!!

In Summary:
- Keep in mind this data was requested by an undisclosed competitive helmet company, these findings had nothing to do with 6D except to be included in the testing.
- 6D coined the term “low-threshold energy” in 2012 and the 6D manages it the best at this time
- Now others are talking about mid-speed, and you can call it whatever you want, but the 6D performs the best in most impact scenarios we have tested and this data prepared for IRCOBI reflects the same outcome. This testing was conducted at 4.4, 5.4, 6.2, and 7.5 m/sec. Just for awareness sake in linear testing 4.0 m/sec is equal to about 127 G’s in some traditional MX helmets we’ve tested, with the 6D coming in at 97 on the same impact – 127 G’s is a big hit! Nearly 2x the G’s of a baseline figure for concussion in an adult male. And testing started at 4.4 m/sec, 10% above that velocity in this testing!
- 6D leads by significant margins in Linear, HIC, HIP, and GAMBIT injury metrics
- 6D costs more because its more expensive to manufacture from a BOM (Bill of Materials) and time (assembly time) perspective
- 6D receives overall high marks for fit, but everyone is different. I have one very close friend that we just cannot fit with our current shape and that is a bummer to me personally. Hopefully we can improve that in the future!
- 6D was the only helmet manufacturer (bar none) accepted into the NFL’s Head Health Challenge III with our ODS technology. Head Health Challenge III is a NFL funded grant program designed to find superior energy management solutions for head protection. We were selected based on the merit of our patented Omni-Directional Suspension system.

What the market needs to learn and understand:
- Helmets are consumable items. They are designed to “do work” when called to action. That work subsequently damages the helmet in order reduce energy transfer to the brain. In serious amateur or professional motocross, you should realistically budget for a couple of helmets a year.
- A visibly damaged helmet did “work” to protect you, however you may still have been concussed or worse. A helmet that shows no impact damage or compression, most likely did little or no “work” to protect you.
- Motocross is an expensive sport, but head protection is one place you should not be looking to save money. Think about the difference between the cost of a premium helmet, of whatever brand, and the cost of a 6D. It’s really not that much money… and compared to a brain injury or ride in the ambulance, it’s a no brainer!

LEGAL DISCLAIMER: None of us (helmet manufacturers) have concussion proof helmets, not even 6D. We are working our hardest to reduce the transfer of energy to the brain. I am proud to be part of this new movement!

Thanks for reading, I just felt compelled to jump into this conversation based on some of the questions and comments within the thread. Hopefully this will provide some clarification on the subject. Also, we will launch a new website very soon and we will have a blog post on the new site. For updates and the latest on what 6D is up to, check us out at www.6Dhelmets.com

Bob Weber
Co-Founder
6D Helmets

Great write up Bob! Thanks, very informative.

Hey can I get a pro form deal for my son?

I have worn all the helmets above. And this is my short two cents as I unfortunelty have been Ko many times.....

If I were to guy buy a helmet right now I would buy the new Bell Flex , or 6D. I've had great luck in those helmets., Just want to see fellow riders put something good on their head!

With regard to fit on the 6D's: I'm a perfect Shoei medium and the 6D's seem to run slightly larger than that so their medium was a bit loose for me. I called them and found out a "small/medium" liner was available. I purchased it and am very happy with the fit. Don't give up just because a 6D doesn't fit you "off the shelf", they have a variety of liner and cheek pad sizes that you can mix and match to get a good fit. I do realize that the basic shape of some people's heads is wrong for some helmets no matter how many pads you swap out, just sayin it's worth a try.

6D seemed kinda cheap when compared side by side with Shoei. I ended up going with a Fly Carbon though becuase it fit me better and was cheaper.

It's funny how opinions can vary so much. I bought a 6D carbon last year after wearing Shoei.
I think the quality on the 6D is just as good as the VFX-W.

But that's why we have these forums.

Take the 6D. I already was sold and was wearing one and went to the 6D ride day in Lommel last year, had a big crash (4th gear pinned highsider) right there and the 6D did his work. I came out of it without any injuries but the helmet was damaged. Went to Bob Weber who still was there and he was happy how the helmet did his job. He actually gave me a new helmet because he had compassion with me, I actually bought the helmet by myself and i'm still going to college full-time. I'm really happy with the service and will ride with 6D helmets for the rest of the time that I will be on a dirtbike.

I crashed yesterday at local race and hit my head really hard (LItPro showed 24G's), but much of my surprise I didn't black out and I was able to finish the race. Although Arai doesn't have the MIPS technology, I still feel that the round shape and hard shell are definitely way to go (versus Airoh's soft shell or Shoei's shape with edges), especially if you crash in track that has lots of rocks.

Well here is my 6D promo... My son crashed with a Bell monster energy helmet, and got a concussion. The helmet didn't appear damaged. Still have it.

Ordered a 6D! He has cracked two of them. They were harder hits and yes the helmet cracked... Both times 6D took the time to look at both helmets and gave us a great price on a replacement. I don't know of any other helmet company that offers this type of discount. Both times he was fine.... One time he saw a few stars but no concussions...


One of our local mini riders had a horrific crash a year ago, took him out on the helicopter unresponsive. I forgot the exact details but the doctors were emphatic that helmet saved him... He is 100% okay!

To me this is choice is almost trivial.

Most motocrossers who adjust their suspension posses at least a novice understanding of mechanical systems and dampening. You understand that if you properly manage compression (deceleration of the suspension) it's less harsh.

Translate this less harsh feeling in suspension to the 6D dual shell system, with minature shock absorbers. These allow the shells to move and absorb shock in translation (XYZ) and rotation (Pitch Roll Yaw). 6 Degrees of motion are being dampened and the hit is less harsh.

A less harsh (dampened) hit means your head experience less force and the hit is less damaging. This is fact.

Compare this to a thick shell that is one piece and doesn't allow a tuned dampening of force, the decision is trivial.