Aldon Baker's forearm tool

jeffro503 wrote:

All i know is this..... 4arm strong took the time and effort to make and design this product. A product that for someone like me...

All i know is this.....

4arm strong took the time and effort to make and design this product. A product that for someone like me , would be worth it's weight in gold if it works the way i hope it does. I'll gladly pay $160.00 to support a company like this , even if i knew i could make my own . it's a way for me to say " thanks " for making my riding more enjoyable.

You want to make your own , that's your choice. But it's NOT cool to come in here and basically slam a company's product because you cheaped out , stole his design , made one for yourself and then post pics of it.

That kind of bullshit ruins companies by doing the same thing the Chinese do , by having no morals at all and steals everyone elses designs.

Like i said...not cool. And 4arm strength will be getting my money. Just because that's what my morals are telling me.

My 2 cents.

pietscher wrote:

I really don't want to "slam a company's product". And I'm sorry if that's what it looked like. And I also know how hard it is...

I really don't want to "slam a company's product". And I'm sorry if that's what it looked like. And I also know how hard it is to build a company and develop products. That's what I do for several years now.

You know why I build that device? I wanted to understand what it does and see how it feels before I pay 160 bucks for it. Maybe I shouldn't have posted that picture. But I was hoping to get more detailed information on why this product works. What I see is "Get me 160$ and believe me, it works".

So please let's get this down to a technical discussion, not a moral one.

jeffro503 wrote:

All i know is this..... 4arm strong took the time and effort to make and design this product. A product that for someone like me...

All i know is this.....

4arm strong took the time and effort to make and design this product. A product that for someone like me , would be worth it's weight in gold if it works the way i hope it does. I'll gladly pay $160.00 to support a company like this , even if i knew i could make my own . it's a way for me to say " thanks " for making my riding more enjoyable.

You want to make your own , that's your choice. But it's NOT cool to come in here and basically slam a company's product because you cheaped out , stole his design , made one for yourself and then post pics of it.

That kind of bullshit ruins companies by doing the same thing the Chinese do , by having no morals at all and steals everyone elses designs.

Like i said...not cool. And 4arm strength will be getting my money. Just because that's what my morals are telling me.

My 2 cents.

pietscher wrote:

I really don't want to "slam a company's product". And I'm sorry if that's what it looked like. And I also know how hard it is...

I really don't want to "slam a company's product". And I'm sorry if that's what it looked like. And I also know how hard it is to build a company and develop products. That's what I do for several years now.

You know why I build that device? I wanted to understand what it does and see how it feels before I pay 160 bucks for it. Maybe I shouldn't have posted that picture. But I was hoping to get more detailed information on why this product works. What I see is "Get me 160$ and believe me, it works".

So please let's get this down to a technical discussion, not a moral one.

UpTiTe wrote:

So much stuff to complicate fitness and make it harder than what it is today. The most complcated tool i used was a digital watch with...

So much stuff to complicate fitness and make it harder than what it is today. The most complcated tool i used was a digital watch with a timer, now uou have Fitbits, heart rate monitors, testing for lactic acid etc. Makes me wonder how I ever went 45 minute motos without getting tired by simply running, weight training, eating right and riding.

UpTiTe wrote:

So much stuff to complicate fitness and make it harder than what it is today. The most complcated tool i used was a digital watch with...

So much stuff to complicate fitness and make it harder than what it is today. The most complcated tool i used was a digital watch with a timer, now uou have Fitbits, heart rate monitors, testing for lactic acid etc. Makes me wonder how I ever went 45 minute motos without getting tired by simply running, weight training, eating right and riding.

swtwtwtw wrote:

x2

UpTiTe wrote:

So much stuff to complicate fitness and make it harder than what it is today. The most complcated tool i used was a digital watch with...

So much stuff to complicate fitness and make it harder than what it is today. The most complcated tool i used was a digital watch with a timer, now uou have Fitbits, heart rate monitors, testing for lactic acid etc. Makes me wonder how I ever went 45 minute motos without getting tired by simply running, weight training, eating right and riding.

swtwtwtw wrote:

x2

MXD wrote:

Times change and technology evolves. Remember when if you wanted to talk to your relative in England, you had to write a letter and put it...

Times change and technology evolves. Remember when if you wanted to talk to your relative in England, you had to write a letter and put it on a boat? Makes me wonder how they ever survived.

UpTiTe wrote:

So much stuff to complicate fitness and make it harder than what it is today. The most complcated tool i used was a digital watch with...

So much stuff to complicate fitness and make it harder than what it is today. The most complcated tool i used was a digital watch with a timer, now uou have Fitbits, heart rate monitors, testing for lactic acid etc. Makes me wonder how I ever went 45 minute motos without getting tired by simply running, weight training, eating right and riding.

MXD wrote:

I suffer from the worst arm pump. At the beginning of the season, I can't ride 1/2 a lap without my arms blowing up. By about...

I suffer from the worst arm pump. At the beginning of the season, I can't ride 1/2 a lap without my arms blowing up. By about the 4th or 5th week of riding twice a week, it's manageable but never gets any better than that. I know it is holding me back resultswise. I purchased one about a month back or so as I am extremely desperate to make progress with my arm pump issues. I use it roughly 4-5 times a week. The tracks aren't open yet so I can't speak to the arm pump relief yet as I have not ridden but what I can say is that my grip strength definitely increased. I workout 5 days a week with a trainer but before you all jump down my throat, he understands moto so we focus on all core, legs, back, stability and exercises like that. My workouts have no impact on my arm pump. I've had it for 20 years, long before I started with this program. Anyway, one exercise we do is a farmer walk where you hold 2 dumbbells and walk down the turf and back. Using 70's in each hand, I used to be able to go down fine but on the way back my arms would be on fire, hands numb and grip strength fading fast. We did them again last week for the first time in a month or so (and after about 3 weeks of 4arm strong use) and I noticed a dramatic improvement. With the same 70 pound dumbbells, I was now walking down and back with a fraction of the numbness and weakness that I used to feel.

Again, I have no clue what impact it will have on my arm pump but I'm anxious to find out based on the improvement in that one exercise alone. I will certainly come back and give my .02 once I ride.

jeffro503 wrote:

All i know is this..... 4arm strong took the time and effort to make and design this product. A product that for someone like me...

All i know is this.....

4arm strong took the time and effort to make and design this product. A product that for someone like me , would be worth it's weight in gold if it works the way i hope it does. I'll gladly pay $160.00 to support a company like this , even if i knew i could make my own . it's a way for me to say " thanks " for making my riding more enjoyable.

You want to make your own , that's your choice. But it's NOT cool to come in here and basically slam a company's product because you cheaped out , stole his design , made one for yourself and then post pics of it.

That kind of bullshit ruins companies by doing the same thing the Chinese do , by having no morals at all and steals everyone elses designs.

Like i said...not cool. And 4arm strength will be getting my money. Just because that's what my morals are telling me.

My 2 cents.

pietscher wrote:

I really don't want to "slam a company's product". And I'm sorry if that's what it looked like. And I also know how hard it is...

I really don't want to "slam a company's product". And I'm sorry if that's what it looked like. And I also know how hard it is to build a company and develop products. That's what I do for several years now.

You know why I build that device? I wanted to understand what it does and see how it feels before I pay 160 bucks for it. Maybe I shouldn't have posted that picture. But I was hoping to get more detailed information on why this product works. What I see is "Get me 160$ and believe me, it works".

So please let's get this down to a technical discussion, not a moral one.

419250f wrote:

If you want an understanding, pay someone that is certified in ART to work on your arm pump problem. 1st appointment is $100 (USA) and then...

If you want an understanding, pay someone that is certified in ART to work on your arm pump problem.
1st appointment is $100 (USA) and then $60 - $70 for every follow up.
I've done it. So I understand how this works and why it works and why you need to keep up with it.
Now I'm not going to purchase this device, because I've found my own technique to deal with this issue.
But if you want an understanding, ART by a professional is the way.

pietscher wrote:

I really don't want to "slam a company's product". And I'm sorry if that's what it looked like. And I also know how hard it is...

I really don't want to "slam a company's product". And I'm sorry if that's what it looked like. And I also know how hard it is to build a company and develop products. That's what I do for several years now.

You know why I build that device? I wanted to understand what it does and see how it feels before I pay 160 bucks for it. Maybe I shouldn't have posted that picture. But I was hoping to get more detailed information on why this product works. What I see is "Get me 160$ and believe me, it works".

So please let's get this down to a technical discussion, not a moral one.

419250f wrote:

If you want an understanding, pay someone that is certified in ART to work on your arm pump problem. 1st appointment is $100 (USA) and then...

If you want an understanding, pay someone that is certified in ART to work on your arm pump problem.
1st appointment is $100 (USA) and then $60 - $70 for every follow up.
I've done it. So I understand how this works and why it works and why you need to keep up with it.
Now I'm not going to purchase this device, because I've found my own technique to deal with this issue.
But if you want an understanding, ART by a professional is the way.

4Arm Strong wrote:

That is actually a very good test as that is how I invented the 4Arm Strong. As an ART certified therapist I was getting great results...

That is actually a very good test as that is how I invented the 4Arm Strong. As an ART certified therapist I was getting great results using ART. It just mades sense to think I could develop a self therapy device based on creating similar tension and traction ART protocols. That being said, I always want to disclose that 4Arm Strong is NOT ART. ART can only be performed by a human, however the results of the 4Arm Strong speaks for itself.

419250f wrote:

If you want an understanding, pay someone that is certified in ART to work on your arm pump problem. 1st appointment is $100 (USA) and then...

If you want an understanding, pay someone that is certified in ART to work on your arm pump problem.
1st appointment is $100 (USA) and then $60 - $70 for every follow up.
I've done it. So I understand how this works and why it works and why you need to keep up with it.
Now I'm not going to purchase this device, because I've found my own technique to deal with this issue.
But if you want an understanding, ART by a professional is the way.

4Arm Strong wrote:

That is actually a very good test as that is how I invented the 4Arm Strong. As an ART certified therapist I was getting great results...

That is actually a very good test as that is how I invented the 4Arm Strong. As an ART certified therapist I was getting great results using ART. It just mades sense to think I could develop a self therapy device based on creating similar tension and traction ART protocols. That being said, I always want to disclose that 4Arm Strong is NOT ART. ART can only be performed by a human, however the results of the 4Arm Strong speaks for itself.

4Arm Strong wrote:

Jeffro - send me an email when you have a chance. Lee@4arm-strong.com

jeffro503 wrote:

Well , I can't do 45min motos any more , but used to slam out 30min ones right and left ( and still do today if...

Well , I can't do 45min motos any more , but used to slam out 30min ones right and left ( and still do today if I'm in good shape ). What kills me ( and always has ) is my damn arm pump. Just like what MXD posted above , my arms kill me the first 4 - 6 weeks. My forearms give out on me before I can even get a sweat going. After about 6 weeks , my forearms start to feel a little better , but they still pump up pretty bad. I think some of it may be due to my job , since I sling around 50lb - 80lb sheets all day with lifting , pushing and pulling. I'm pretty thrashed by the end of the day.

I've had to slow my pace on the bikes because my arms hurt so bad sometimes that my hands can easily get blown off the grips. It can make for a scary situation at times and I've paid the price by going down hard because I lost my grip.

When I'm fit , the rest of me feels great in long moto's , it is and always has been my forearms that kill me. They started bugging me really bad by the time I hit about 25yrs old. Been going down hill with them ever since.

@ Pietscher....bud , I didn't mean to come off like a dick , so sorry if it sounded like that. I just thought it was kind of a low blow by posting your pics. I know some guys don't suffer from arm pump and may think this thing is a joke , but to me , if it works It'll be worth every penny.

MXD wrote:

I suffer from the worst arm pump. At the beginning of the season, I can't ride 1/2 a lap without my arms blowing up. By about...

I suffer from the worst arm pump. At the beginning of the season, I can't ride 1/2 a lap without my arms blowing up. By about the 4th or 5th week of riding twice a week, it's manageable but never gets any better than that. I know it is holding me back resultswise. I purchased one about a month back or so as I am extremely desperate to make progress with my arm pump issues. I use it roughly 4-5 times a week. The tracks aren't open yet so I can't speak to the arm pump relief yet as I have not ridden but what I can say is that my grip strength definitely increased. I workout 5 days a week with a trainer but before you all jump down my throat, he understands moto so we focus on all core, legs, back, stability and exercises like that. My workouts have no impact on my arm pump. I've had it for 20 years, long before I started with this program. Anyway, one exercise we do is a farmer walk where you hold 2 dumbbells and walk down the turf and back. Using 70's in each hand, I used to be able to go down fine but on the way back my arms would be on fire, hands numb and grip strength fading fast. We did them again last week for the first time in a month or so (and after about 3 weeks of 4arm strong use) and I noticed a dramatic improvement. With the same 70 pound dumbbells, I was now walking down and back with a fraction of the numbness and weakness that I used to feel.

Again, I have no clue what impact it will have on my arm pump but I'm anxious to find out based on the improvement in that one exercise alone. I will certainly come back and give my .02 once I ride.

4Arm Strong wrote:

Thanks for the good report! The grip strength benefit is what Aldon really likes. None of his current riders get arm pump so they use the...

Thanks for the good report! The grip strength benefit is what Aldon really likes. None of his current riders get arm pump so they use the 4Arm Strong for the grip strength benefit. I do want to give you some advice on your training though. The "Farmer Walk" is NOT a good exercise for an MX racer. The Farmer walk WILL increase the size of your forearm muscles, as gripping anything with resistance activates or creates a load on these muscles. At the very least, you should be doing it with your thumb on the same side as your fingers. Any time an MX racer trains in the gym, they shouldn't ever grip what they are pushing or pulling. Whether they are rowing, doing pull ups, pressing, whatever, an MX racer should put their thumbs in the same side of the bar as their fingers. This will lessen the load on the forearm muscles and lessen the risk of building the forearm muscles. The point is, the larger the forearm muscles get, the more volume they take up in the forearm compartment. When this compartment fills with blood from twisting the throttle, pulling, pushing, braking, etc, the bigger the forearm muscles, the quicker the compartment is tightened. Make sense?

swtwtwtw wrote:

x2

MXD wrote:

Times change and technology evolves. Remember when if you wanted to talk to your relative in England, you had to write a letter and put it...

Times change and technology evolves. Remember when if you wanted to talk to your relative in England, you had to write a letter and put it on a boat? Makes me wonder how they ever survived.

UpTiTe wrote:

The human body is the same and you cant tell me these guys are anymore fit than the top guys of the 80s.

MXD wrote:

I suffer from the worst arm pump. At the beginning of the season, I can't ride 1/2 a lap without my arms blowing up. By about...

I suffer from the worst arm pump. At the beginning of the season, I can't ride 1/2 a lap without my arms blowing up. By about the 4th or 5th week of riding twice a week, it's manageable but never gets any better than that. I know it is holding me back resultswise. I purchased one about a month back or so as I am extremely desperate to make progress with my arm pump issues. I use it roughly 4-5 times a week. The tracks aren't open yet so I can't speak to the arm pump relief yet as I have not ridden but what I can say is that my grip strength definitely increased. I workout 5 days a week with a trainer but before you all jump down my throat, he understands moto so we focus on all core, legs, back, stability and exercises like that. My workouts have no impact on my arm pump. I've had it for 20 years, long before I started with this program. Anyway, one exercise we do is a farmer walk where you hold 2 dumbbells and walk down the turf and back. Using 70's in each hand, I used to be able to go down fine but on the way back my arms would be on fire, hands numb and grip strength fading fast. We did them again last week for the first time in a month or so (and after about 3 weeks of 4arm strong use) and I noticed a dramatic improvement. With the same 70 pound dumbbells, I was now walking down and back with a fraction of the numbness and weakness that I used to feel.

Again, I have no clue what impact it will have on my arm pump but I'm anxious to find out based on the improvement in that one exercise alone. I will certainly come back and give my .02 once I ride.

4Arm Strong wrote:

Thanks for the good report! The grip strength benefit is what Aldon really likes. None of his current riders get arm pump so they use the...

Thanks for the good report! The grip strength benefit is what Aldon really likes. None of his current riders get arm pump so they use the 4Arm Strong for the grip strength benefit. I do want to give you some advice on your training though. The "Farmer Walk" is NOT a good exercise for an MX racer. The Farmer walk WILL increase the size of your forearm muscles, as gripping anything with resistance activates or creates a load on these muscles. At the very least, you should be doing it with your thumb on the same side as your fingers. Any time an MX racer trains in the gym, they shouldn't ever grip what they are pushing or pulling. Whether they are rowing, doing pull ups, pressing, whatever, an MX racer should put their thumbs in the same side of the bar as their fingers. This will lessen the load on the forearm muscles and lessen the risk of building the forearm muscles. The point is, the larger the forearm muscles get, the more volume they take up in the forearm compartment. When this compartment fills with blood from twisting the throttle, pulling, pushing, braking, etc, the bigger the forearm muscles, the quicker the compartment is tightened. Make sense?

MXD wrote:

Thanks for the advice. I realize that the farmer walks are less than ideal but in reality, we do them about every 4-6 weeks. However, it...

Thanks for the advice. I realize that the farmer walks are less than ideal but in reality, we do them about every 4-6 weeks. However, it was a great test and I was happy with the result.

MXD wrote:

Times change and technology evolves. Remember when if you wanted to talk to your relative in England, you had to write a letter and put it...

Times change and technology evolves. Remember when if you wanted to talk to your relative in England, you had to write a letter and put it on a boat? Makes me wonder how they ever survived.

UpTiTe wrote:

The human body is the same and you cant tell me these guys are anymore fit than the top guys of the 80s.

MXD wrote:

I definitely can't tell you that today's riders are more fit. What I can suggest, however, is that advances in technology and understanding have maybe made...

I definitely can't tell you that today's riders are more fit. What I can suggest, however, is that advances in technology and understanding have maybe made it possible to train and condition the body with more efficiency and target specific areas more precisely.

TbonesPop wrote:

Gang, I bought one of the 4Arm gadgets last Saturday, got it in the mail Tuesday. Started using it Tuesday and Thursday this week already. I...

Gang, I bought one of the 4Arm gadgets last Saturday, got it in the mail Tuesday. Started using it Tuesday and Thursday this week already. I am going riding Saturday and Sunday this weekend and I'll use it each day before riding. Looking forward to posting my results.

4Arm Strong wrote:

Today's MX racer trains differently than we did back in the 70s and 80s, but it is all relative. The riders in the 70s and 80s...

Today's MX racer trains differently than we did back in the 70s and 80s, but it is all relative. The riders in the 70s and 80s (I was one of them) had to be in the best condition possible for the relevant conditions. We primarily practiced during the week. We rode on shitty, dry, rough tracks for 45 minutes, twice per day, 3 to 4 days a week. I remember when Marty Smith and I started using Nautilus machines in the late 70s. There wasn't too much cross training going on. With technological advances and trainers that drive these guys, like Aldon Baker, Johnny O, Johnny Louch, etc, I would say today's rider is gaining a high level of fitness than the riders of the 70s and 80s. Bikes today work FAR better than they did back then which means the speeds today are far superior. Any time you ride faster, you are going to require more out of your body, especially more out of your cardio. There was a day when I raced that the pro classes went back to back. On more than one occasion I raced a 250 pro race at Carlsbad, finished, leaned my 250 against the fence and jumped on my open bike and raced another 30 minutes and never even got winded. We just weren't asking as much from our bodies at the speed we were going back then. Sure we were in great condition, but it was all relative.

4Arm Strong wrote:

Today's MX racer trains differently than we did back in the 70s and 80s, but it is all relative. The riders in the 70s and 80s...

Today's MX racer trains differently than we did back in the 70s and 80s, but it is all relative. The riders in the 70s and 80s (I was one of them) had to be in the best condition possible for the relevant conditions. We primarily practiced during the week. We rode on shitty, dry, rough tracks for 45 minutes, twice per day, 3 to 4 days a week. I remember when Marty Smith and I started using Nautilus machines in the late 70s. There wasn't too much cross training going on. With technological advances and trainers that drive these guys, like Aldon Baker, Johnny O, Johnny Louch, etc, I would say today's rider is gaining a high level of fitness than the riders of the 70s and 80s. Bikes today work FAR better than they did back then which means the speeds today are far superior. Any time you ride faster, you are going to require more out of your body, especially more out of your cardio. There was a day when I raced that the pro classes went back to back. On more than one occasion I raced a 250 pro race at Carlsbad, finished, leaned my 250 against the fence and jumped on my open bike and raced another 30 minutes and never even got winded. We just weren't asking as much from our bodies at the speed we were going back then. Sure we were in great condition, but it was all relative.

swtwtwtw wrote:

Are you still riding and racing today? I am and most of the time I run back-to-back 20 minutes motos and I can can tell you...

Are you still riding and racing today? I am and most of the time I run back-to-back 20 minutes motos and I can can tell you it is NO different than in our CMC days. I rarely get winded or get any sort of arm-pump. I have gotten arm pump, but it is only when I begin to ride over my head and my form begins to suffer. Typically, proper MX riding requires a very loose grip on the bars altogether.

Since this product helps in grip strength, I can see the benefit in just the everyday stuff I do and moving my bike around a the pit. Recently, and I have posted this before, I have found practicing slow push-ups 3-4 times a week to build my strength have really helped me handle the demands of my MX bike tremendously at my ripe age of 55.

TbonesPop wrote:

Gang, I bought one of the 4Arm gadgets last Saturday, got it in the mail Tuesday. Started using it Tuesday and Thursday this week already. I...

Gang, I bought one of the 4Arm gadgets last Saturday, got it in the mail Tuesday. Started using it Tuesday and Thursday this week already. I am going riding Saturday and Sunday this weekend and I'll use it each day before riding. Looking forward to posting my results.

TbonesPop wrote:

Ok, so here's an update in case anyone was curious. I rode MX today and put 2.3 hours of ride time in (I usually get to...

Ok, so here's an update in case anyone was curious.

I rode MX today and put 2.3 hours of ride time in (I usually get to ride 2-3 times a month). As noted in this thread, I have suffered badly from arm pump in the past. Usually I start pumping up between lap 1 and lap 2, regardless of the track (familiar or unfamiliar track). Today I rode a track I have probably ridden 50 times - but even in the past I have always gotten arm pump on it.

I bought the 4arm Strong device last weekend, and used it this week on Tuesday, Thursday, and then today right before I rode. I definitely saw a tremendous decrease in arm pump - I'd estimate at least 90% reduction. I'm willing to bet that if I continue to use this device more consistently and especially before riding, I won't get arm pump anymore. My hands were a little tight, but almost nothing in the forearms. In fact, my legs are completely toast - they are so sore (800 mg of Ibuprofen coming soon). In the past, I couldn't get enough track time without arm pump to work my legs hard enough for them to be sore. Well, today my ass and quads are spent - forearms feel great.

I'll be riding again tomorrow. But I just wanted to update and say this product definitely worked for me - SIGNIFICANT reduction in arm pump (almost completely eliminating it). If you suffer from arm pump, this device will almost assuredly help reduce it. I'm in no way associated with the company that makes this product - just trying to give a brutally honest review.