Never Leave Your Bike Alone

DC
Profile picture for user DC
Posts
3889
Joined
5/1/2009
Location
Morgantown, WV, USA
DC 5/27/2015 1:39pm
5/27/2015 1:39pm
seth505, I don't know the provenance of the engine or the deal or debt, nor is it my business to know. But I do know that there are many, many other ways and places to settle a financial debt or contract dispute than what happened here, not to mention how and when. Hopefully, it won't happen again.

DC
MX Sports
seth505
Profile picture for user seth505
Posts
10217
Joined
4/1/2008
Location
SD, CA, USA
seth505 5/27/2015 1:52pm
5/27/2015 1:52pm
DC wrote:
seth505, I don't know the provenance of the engine or the deal or debt, nor is it my business to know. But I do know that...
seth505, I don't know the provenance of the engine or the deal or debt, nor is it my business to know. But I do know that there are many, many other ways and places to settle a financial debt or contract dispute than what happened here, not to mention how and when. Hopefully, it won't happen again.

DC
MX Sports
Yes, I can appreciate that you don't want that kind of drama on race day no matter what the reason.
newmann
Profile picture for user newmann
Posts
24437
Joined
4/1/2008
Location
USA
newmann 5/27/2015 1:57pm
5/27/2015 1:57pm
When Don allowed the bike to leave his premises, he extended credit to the deadbeats. In Texas, they basically wouldn't have to pay him a dime. Shame on you if you accept a partial payment too. I would bet a dollar that this isn't the first time these deadbeats have done this. It's a way of life for some people. I learned the hard way dealing with a multi time older customer of mine. Old dude was a Shriner too! I donated money through him several times. The poor lady who called the following year when he was no longer coming around....she got an earful. Old guy got cancer a couple years later and died pretty quick. Too much bad karma no doubt.

Hot checks are fun too. Deadbeats are good at coming up with money when the detective shows up at their house on Thanksgiving day.

DC should run a credit and background check on all national entries, teams included. Got a blemish, can't race. We want to add a sense of credibility to this series...LOL.
Polishhammer 5/27/2015 2:01pm
5/27/2015 2:01pm
True Leib should have been paid, but they've done some sneaky things in the past which is not the way to run a business! They can keep they're comic book rocket exhaust systems. LOL!
I'm sure people are excited to have them build they're race engines.

The Shop

See All »
peelout
Profile picture for user peelout
Posts
18426
Joined
1/6/2011
Location
Ogden, UT, USA
peelout 5/27/2015 2:10pm
5/27/2015 2:10pm
pretty sure Leib posts here right?

surprised he hasn't come in to give his side of the story, it certainly is an interesting one.
IWreckALot
Profile picture for user IWreckALot
Posts
8677
Joined
3/12/2011
Location
Fort Worth, TX, USA
IWreckALot 5/27/2015 2:12pm
5/27/2015 2:12pm
peelout wrote:
pretty sure Leib posts here right?

surprised he hasn't come in to give his side of the story, it certainly is an interesting one.
Probably avoiding the legalees.
TailSoHard
Profile picture for user TailSoHard
Posts
1656
Joined
10/18/2014
Location
Beer City, MI, USA
TailSoHard 5/27/2015 2:18pm
5/27/2015 2:18pm
Who has the title for the bike?
lostboy819 5/27/2015 2:21pm
5/27/2015 2:21pm Edited Date/Time 5/27/2015 2:23pm
Is the deadbeat Cade Clason going to be at Lakewood this weekend? maybe someone will repo the bike until he pays his bill Evil and grandma Clason is no better ,I guess it runs in the family.

https://www.facebook.com/cade.clason
Starcrossed
Profile picture for user Starcrossed
Posts
3160
Joined
4/16/2014
Location
New Bedford, MA, USA
Starcrossed 5/27/2015 2:22pm
5/27/2015 2:22pm Edited Date/Time 5/27/2015 2:26pm
peelout wrote:
pretty sure Leib posts here right?

surprised he hasn't come in to give his side of the story, it certainly is an interesting one.
IWreckALot wrote:
Probably avoiding the legalees.
*legalese

Don was a participant in a ten page fiasco, regarding Vince Friese, not long ago, with parties on both sides threatening legal action...think is screen name is "DL" with Rocket Exhaust avatar.
pete24
Profile picture for user pete24
Posts
2733
Joined
10/20/2011
Location
Marlborough, MA, USA
pete24 5/27/2015 2:22pm
5/27/2015 2:22pm
ive seen stuff that i havent been paid for at tracks and it pisses me off but i let it out the door with out my money so im the asshole if you do it enough times you learn from it, ,,, or you have a buddy that was a prison gard for 20 years and weighs 260,and collects YOUR money for ten percent,, yup i woulda been thrown out of that national too, but i woulda had my shit and i can watch races on tv
PEPE001
Profile picture for user PEPE001
Posts
708
Joined
3/4/2015
Location
NRW, DE
PEPE001 5/27/2015 2:25pm
5/27/2015 2:25pm
Polishhammer wrote:
True Leib should have been paid, but they've done some sneaky things in the past which is not the way to run a business! They can...
True Leib should have been paid, but they've done some sneaky things in the past which is not the way to run a business! They can keep they're comic book rocket exhaust systems. LOL!
I'm sure people are excited to have them build they're race engines.
I bought a used engine prepped by them with an exhaust (yes I paid) and have to say the quality and performance is good.

From my point of view there will be no winner!
Both parties lost a lot of reputation.

As a business owner I would have never done it there are other ways to get your money.
Considering the paperwork was done correctly.

If I deliver something I will have proper paperwork and invoice just in case.
However I would never deliver something without getting paid!
Did it once and learned my lesson.

At the end everybody will hear the story a little different and take as a result consequences.
But maybe half of the people might be afraid dealing with a manufacturer who act like this.

As I mentioned no winner!

dirtdog36
Profile picture for user dirtdog36
Posts
426
Joined
8/6/2010
Location
Nashville, TN, USA
dirtdog36 5/27/2015 2:39pm
5/27/2015 2:39pm
Kind of a dirty move, right? And also not a way to actually get your money because, if I’m Cade, I’m definitely not going to pay you or get my sponsors (or whomever) to pay you after that sneaky move. - Mathes

I CAN NOT UNDERSTAND THIS!

So you don't like the way your debt is collected so you decide to not pay it even MORE!! Don't have debt and then you don't have to worry about how it is collected

What the F! Try that with the bank and see how far you get - I don't like how your bill collector dinged my credit so now I am REALLY not going to pay you! HA!

this sport and country have some serious problems, No one wants to accept responsibility or work for anything
Mr. Info
Profile picture for user Mr. Info
Posts
1671
Joined
5/3/2010
Location
Perris, CA, USA
Mr. Info 5/27/2015 2:45pm
5/27/2015 2:45pm
Mr. Info wrote:
Just a little note to leave you guys with. Last Saturday in the pits a rider left his bike for a while and when he was...
Just a little note to leave you guys with. Last Saturday in the pits a rider left his bike for a while and when he was gone 2 people came up and said they were there to help and reprogramed the bike and the rider who qualified could then not get his bike to run and could not race. It was done on purpose.Now there is more to the story from both sides that I do not know but this person wants respect from others and does this. I will never do any business with this person again and he will never be allowed in Glen Helens gates and should be banned from any and all tracks in SoCal. I will not say his name or that of the person who helped him do this. It might come out soon or might not but no matter what the story was for why it was done, what he did was about as low as a person could get. He knows who he is and his partner in crime. All I ask is just show up at a National or Glen Helen and see where it gets him. Sorry I can't say who but that's the legal system. They could sue me. Ask around I am sure its out there. Would you do business with a person who does this?
Looking forward to great racing in Colorado.
coolhand
Profile picture for user coolhand
Posts
474
Joined
9/10/2006
Location
Atlanta, GA, USA
coolhand 5/27/2015 2:47pm
5/27/2015 2:47pm
Newmann,

You are spot on, screw the BS PC..they are thieves, plain and simple.

Does this not sound like today's victim mentality ?

RealityCheck
Profile picture for user RealityCheck
Posts
232
Joined
7/1/2012
Location
Davidsonville, MD, USA
RealityCheck 5/27/2015 2:50pm
5/27/2015 2:50pm
newmann wrote:
[i]If this bike builder got fooled and didn't CYA, you cant fully blame the people that got him,, right?[/i] Oh for shits sake. That's what's wrong...
If this bike builder got fooled and didn't CYA, you cant fully blame the people that got him,, right?

Oh for shits sake. That's what's wrong with this country, people trying to justify stealing from others. Damn shame when a handshake or someones word isn't worth shit. The pussification of America continues.
Nailed it.

This country had devolved into a place where it's OK to act like a jacka** and then act like a victim when someone actually calls you out for your crappy behavior. Live by the sword, die the sword.
Hut
Profile picture for user Hut
Posts
10281
Joined
4/27/2010
Location
USA
Hut 5/27/2015 3:12pm
5/27/2015 3:12pm
lostboy819 wrote:
Is the deadbeat Cade Clason going to be at Lakewood this weekend? maybe someone will repo the bike until he pays his bill :evil: and grandma...
Is the deadbeat Cade Clason going to be at Lakewood this weekend? maybe someone will repo the bike until he pays his bill Evil and grandma Clason is no better ,I guess it runs in the family.

https://www.facebook.com/cade.clason
Kid says it wasn't him and that he is caught in the middle. I am not familiar with him or the team so I don't know what to think about it. Bad deal for sure.
731chopper
Profile picture for user 731chopper
Posts
4239
Joined
1/2/2015
Location
DFW, TX, USA
731chopper 5/27/2015 3:23pm
5/27/2015 3:23pm
Rizzo wrote:
Would you repo the thing or sabotage it with the possibility that you end a persons life in the process?(lostboy question). Rest of post....No dog in...
Would you repo the thing or sabotage it with the possibility that you end a persons life in the process?(lostboy question).

Rest of post....No dog in this fight, but 1 thing almost everyone can relate to. If you own a car with a loan and you don't pay it, does the bank repo the car or do they send some vigilante to cut the brake lines in the hopes you drive down hill, crash and possibly die? Not gonna lie, I'd want to break heads and beat someone up, BUT, I couldn't sabotage someone's car like that, I couldn't live with the consequences.

Second, any business owner will tell you, you win some, you lose some. You should have specific terms AND stick to them. If you venture from those terms and get burned, LOOK IN THE MIRROR, its your fucking fault. I have a small biz and I've never been burned when I've stuck 100% to my terms. Why, the people either go elsewhere (probably burn someone else), or they accept my terms. Have I been burned, YES, many times and each time, I broke MY terms and then suffered, my fault. You want your stuff, WELL, I want my money, its simple cash/merchandise in hand like a drug deal....SIMPLE. Run a survey on who gets burned more, drug dealers, or honest business men. Dealers NEVER let go of the product until there is cash in hand, they trust NOBODY.

If I built a bike, I wouldnt let it out my shop and if I did, I would repo it and or chalk it up. To sabotage a bike or car or house, whatever, to me, that's worse than beating the people up. WHAT IF, I know, I know, but really, what if this cade kid crashed on a triple and Wil Hahn(far from lucky) crashes into him and BOTH are paralyzed? Could you live with that? Is that worth 10-15K? IF that's what happened(whats posted), that's some BULLSHIT, I don't care how much is owed and not only should GH step up, but so should the AMA, etc etc. There is plenty of nonsense in NASCAR and these guys settle it like MEN out back, but to sabotage a racecar.....mmmm not sure on that one and even then, they got a roll cage on the car and a fence around the track.
Actually, some lenders do have software installed in cars of sub-prime borrowers that will disable the car if they get too far behind in their payments.
ktm212
Profile picture for user ktm212
Posts
608
Joined
11/30/2009
Location
Lafayette, NJ, USA
ktm212 5/27/2015 3:56pm
5/27/2015 3:56pm
If you knew how many of these privateer teams in the pits owned someone somewhere a check with a bunch of zeros at the end of it then you'd all feel pretty dumb for blaming the rider. In most cases the team has a makeshift deal with a motor company, in this case rocket, where they build, service, map, blah blah the bikes and they pay them as they go. I HIGHLY doubt Cade had any knowledge of outstanding bills because the riders on these types of teams usually don't have that info. They show up on the weekends and go racing and the team manager says everything is taken care of or yeah we settled up with them or good luck and everyone goes about their business. As for the #92 he's filling in on the Redemption Racing squad in Canada so you guys wont get to harass him in Colorado. Good Luck up there Cade, kick some ass.

Pit Row

See All »
BAMX
Profile picture for user BAMX
Posts
2905
Joined
1/22/2012
Location
Fallbrook, CA, USA
BAMX 5/27/2015 3:57pm
5/27/2015 3:57pm
newmann wrote:
[i]If this bike builder got fooled and didn't CYA, you cant fully blame the people that got him,, right?[/i] Oh for shits sake. That's what's wrong...
If this bike builder got fooled and didn't CYA, you cant fully blame the people that got him,, right?

Oh for shits sake. That's what's wrong with this country, people trying to justify stealing from others. Damn shame when a handshake or someones word isn't worth shit. The pussification of America continues.
RealityCheck wrote:
Nailed it. This country had devolved into a place where it's OK to act like a jacka** and then act like a victim when someone actually...
Nailed it.

This country had devolved into a place where it's OK to act like a jacka** and then act like a victim when someone actually calls you out for your crappy behavior. Live by the sword, die the sword.
Newmann nailed it and I would add that those who are saying to go about it the legal route have probably never done so. Even if you get a judgment, that is no guarantee of you getting paid.
newmann
Profile picture for user newmann
Posts
24437
Joined
4/1/2008
Location
USA
newmann 5/27/2015 3:59pm
5/27/2015 3:59pm
GuyB wrote:
It's unlikely that you'll see either of these guys with a credential or in the pits at a National any time soon. Personally, I like both...
It's unlikely that you'll see either of these guys with a credential or in the pits at a National any time soon.

Personally, I like both of them, but that wasn't the way to handle it.
I would hope all parties involved were interviewed before a decision like that was reached.
WhipMeister
Profile picture for user WhipMeister
Posts
5284
Joined
8/15/2006
Location
Big D, TX, USA
WhipMeister 5/27/2015 4:33pm
5/27/2015 4:33pm
newmann wrote:
[i]If this bike builder got fooled and didn't CYA, you cant fully blame the people that got him,, right?[/i] Oh for shits sake. That's what's wrong...
If this bike builder got fooled and didn't CYA, you cant fully blame the people that got him,, right?

Oh for shits sake. That's what's wrong with this country, people trying to justify stealing from others. Damn shame when a handshake or someones word isn't worth shit. The pussification of America continues.
Yeppers.
fidiot
Profile picture for user fidiot
Posts
661
Joined
3/18/2014
Location
Denver, CO, USA
fidiot 5/27/2015 4:43pm
5/27/2015 4:43pm
My motto when doing work:
In god we trust. All others bring cash.
TeamGreen
Profile picture for user TeamGreen
Posts
37793
Joined
11/25/2008
Location
Thru-out, CA, USA
TeamGreen 5/27/2015 5:09pm
5/27/2015 5:09pm
I've already chewed Don a new one for letting Cade's Grandmother have the bike..."on credit"...he's a fool for being a nice guy. It seems the lady said SHE'D pay for it...via electronic communication that's been "saved"...

Also, and Don "owned" this...

Even though they informed Cabe's mechanic of EXACTLY WHAT THEY'D DONE...AND IT WASN'T DONE SECRETLY OR IN ANY WAY TO CAUSE HARM TO THE RIDER...the bike was set to a 5K RPM rev-limit...think "hi-idle"...
Even though it was the 1st time they'd seen their UNPAID FOR BIKE IN MONTHS...(actually, it was a new/different frame with Don's Engine & Electrics) ...
Even though these race bikes usually have MSO's instead of Titles...which makes the civil/legal process waaaay more complicated...
Even though Cabe's G'ma COMMITTED to pay for the Bike...& then tried to push it off on to other peoples shoulders...

None of this justifies What they did, How they did it, WHERE they did it & WHEN THEY DID IT (at a National). Yup, there-in lies the real problem: all the while "I get it". I understand why they did it, they were desperate and their assets had been "Stolen"...someone doesn't pay for something and won't give it back; so, what do you call it?
That's exactly where they were coming from. That's how I understand it.

Then there's MX Sports's Position: "WTF, PEOPLE!? We're trying to Run a Race, HERE! Who did What to a Tech'd & Qual'd Bike? W T F?!"
MX Sports can't have ANY Concern or Involvement in this beyond The Events that occurred on their watch (at THEIR EVENT). Beyond that? They're not involved and to quote Metallica, "Ain't my Bitch!"...that's the position they MUST TAKE...Legal or otherwise.

In the End, I feel sorriest for Cabe.

I've had athletes that've had to deal with this type of drama; and, you know what? It often takes place "Outside their Purview". Yup, Families & Entourages are why you see those chains, ropes and signs on Team transporters that say,"Crew Only".

This whole thing is just messed up & sad.

I'll bet ya there's no actual "bad people" in all of this...

Just bad deeds.
Graybeard 5/27/2015 5:12pm
5/27/2015 5:12pm
So on his Facebook page he said he has no intention of paying, it's his sponsor's bill. OK--but why, then, are you comfortable running that "hot" engine in a different frame? Where's Grandma--she knows the straight story!!!!
Rizzo
Profile picture for user Rizzo
Posts
1019
Joined
2/2/2010
Location
USA
Rizzo 5/27/2015 5:16pm
5/27/2015 5:16pm
Rizzo wrote:
Exactly my point in your scenario. The person that purchased that vehicle knowing there was a remote kill switch AGREED to the terms in writing knowing...
Exactly my point in your scenario. The person that purchased that vehicle knowing there was a remote kill switch AGREED to the terms in writing knowing the consequences ie. remote shutoff. Is that the case for this MX kid? Were there terms in place for programming this bike to FAIL if a payment wasn't made? I don't know. Did the bike builder enforce the terms of his contract or did he make them up on the fly? Why did he release the bike without payment? Listen, I'm all for getting what is owed to me and I HATE scumbags that don't pay their bills, I'm just questioning the tactics used here. Some people deserve everything that comes to them and if its in writing, then, I'm not sympathetic. Its a case of CYA or fool me once......that type of thing. If this bike builder got fooled and didn't CYA, you cant fully blame the people that got him,, right? Its shady but true these days.
newmann wrote:
[i]If this bike builder got fooled and didn't CYA, you cant fully blame the people that got him,, right?[/i] Oh for shits sake. That's what's wrong...
If this bike builder got fooled and didn't CYA, you cant fully blame the people that got him,, right?

Oh for shits sake. That's what's wrong with this country, people trying to justify stealing from others. Damn shame when a handshake or someones word isn't worth shit. The pussification of America continues.
TeamGreen wrote:
Newmann, This is where I'm at, too. For Rizzo...as I understand it...they mapped the bike and told'em what the deal was: no-one was "endangered". This ain't...
Newmann, This is where I'm at, too.

For Rizzo...as I understand it...they mapped the bike and told'em what the deal was: no-one was "endangered". This ain't no Lifetime Movie Channel Drama.
Either I'm bad at writing or some people are bad at reading, prob combo of both. I was asking questions about this as clearly, all the information wasn't there. Also, I was giving a possible scenario and used a vehicle loan as reference. The info available made it sound like they screwed his bike and he went out and rode it without knowing. The words IF and the use of a question mark in a sentence, did that get missed here? You cant take the words from a sentence/paragraph out of context and use that as verbatim.

Now it sounds like the team was on the hook for payment and not the rider, the story changes and gets more complex by the minute. There is however, one constant and that is that the bike builder sabotaged the bike. Based on the info provided, that is B.S as his terms weren't in writing and his actions did nothing but work against him. Am I wrong on that? I have a small business, I believe in getting paid BUT, I'm not going to little Joey's soccer game to strong arm some dad that didn't pay me(exaggeration here) and tear down the goal and flatten soccer balls. I'm all about the handshake and your word conversely, I'm all about tuning the guy up behind the dumpster when he flakes, unfortunately, times have changed. Now can we be friends?
motokiwi 5/27/2015 5:26pm
5/27/2015 5:26pm Edited Date/Time 5/27/2015 5:40pm
DC wrote:
seth505, I don't know the provenance of the engine or the deal or debt, nor is it my business to know. But I do know that...
seth505, I don't know the provenance of the engine or the deal or debt, nor is it my business to know. But I do know that there are many, many other ways and places to settle a financial debt or contract dispute than what happened here, not to mention how and when. Hopefully, it won't happen again.

DC
MX Sports
Yeah but scumbags find a way to slow down / ignore every other avenue.

Sometimes a man just has to do what he has to do man!

Clason was aware of the mods before he rode - so no danger.

If this was Mitch Payton doing the same thing I dont think he would be indefinitely barred from the pits?

I know you cant be seen to be condoning this sort of behavior, however from everything I have read the Clasons sounds like the scumbags here... scumbags who couldn't handle being hustled as much as they clearly hustles others.

Brad460
Profile picture for user Brad460
Posts
4606
Joined
5/15/2012
Location
Richfield, WI, USA
Fantasy
230th
Brad460 5/27/2015 5:34pm
5/27/2015 5:34pm
newmann wrote:
If you like your bike, you can keep your bike.

Obammy
Woohoo
jsmx198
Profile picture for user jsmx198
Posts
104
Joined
10/16/2006
Location
Knoxville, TN, USA
jsmx198 5/27/2015 5:41pm
5/27/2015 5:41pm
This is a civil issue. Go the courts, file a judgment with a Lein on their property and you will get paid.
DownSouth
Profile picture for user DownSouth
Posts
9969
Joined
7/5/2008
Location
Tallapoosa, GA, USA
DownSouth 5/27/2015 5:52pm
5/27/2015 5:52pm
motokiwi wrote:
Yeah but scumbags find a way to slow down / ignore every other avenue. Sometimes a man just has to do what he has to do...
Yeah but scumbags find a way to slow down / ignore every other avenue.

Sometimes a man just has to do what he has to do man!

Clason was aware of the mods before he rode - so no danger.

If this was Mitch Payton doing the same thing I dont think he would be indefinitely barred from the pits?

I know you cant be seen to be condoning this sort of behavior, however from everything I have read the Clasons sounds like the scumbags here... scumbags who couldn't handle being hustled as much as they clearly hustles others.

I think Mitch Payton would have the good sense not to handle his business in that manner.

Post a reply to: Never Leave Your Bike Alone