A Chase style shakeup makes sense

Crush
Posts
21129
Joined
4/26/2009
Location
Sydney, AU
5/7/2015 8:56pm Edited Date/Time 5/7/2015 9:07pm
Zracer wrote:
I think the logic is based on the suggestion being unnecessary and just dumb. Yeah lets have more meaningless races and handicap the dominant racers so...
I think the logic is based on the suggestion being unnecessary and just dumb. Yeah lets have more meaningless races and handicap the dominant racers so you adhd buffoons dont get bored. Good idea.
So we've seen 25% or less of the last how ever many titles come down to a decider and you think that most people aren't at least a little bored...?

How many threads this year have been about the races being mreh?

The sport isn't really attracting new markets or sponsors...

Why not try it? What's to lose? It'd create more story lines–We've seen more weird shit in the last 3 monster cups than the last 3 series of racing... There'd be more chances for the racers and if nothing else, the common thread in the naysayers line runs around the one best guy suffering... Bower's and Regal's titles show that is not the case... yet the other 40 dudes who'd try to get in there, who'd race harder and provide better entertainment because they had a chance, well fuck them.

Besides, it's been 20 years since something was different, it could always go back after a 5 year trial or something... Were you this enraged in 85 with the two moto format?
5/7/2015 9:03pm Edited Date/Time 5/7/2015 9:11pm
I like qualifiers. This idea holds my interest. What are we looking at here...75-80% of the season would be only qualifiers right? I sure hope it's at least that much!
RX345
Posts
5
Joined
12/13/2012
Location
Henderson, CO, USA
5/7/2015 9:08pm
Some ideas: Eliminate semis, have longer heats (10 -12laps) Pay some type of points for the heat races. Still have a lcq that takes 4 riders, maybe all 4 lcq qualifiers just get 1 point each for qualifying? Main events you draw for gate picks, not based on heat finish? At least it would add some small level of unpredictability to the series's, and keep fans interested a bit more. I understand it could allow someone to pull away in points further as well, but if another rider got hot, they could sure get back in it quicker. Really would help determine the better all around rider, as heats would be more starts and sprint speed, mains be a little more stamina based. And drawing for gate picks in the main would add something fun for the fans. Not sure how much the riders would like this though?? May be too gimmicky? Do agree its time to try something for sure.

Obviously a Newbie, so flame away if it gets you your kicks
5/7/2015 9:14pm
My favorite reply in this thread is the one that tried to say that NASCAR isn't more technologically advanced than SX.

Say the points are reset so that the top 10 are one point apart from each other (three point bonus to 1st), top 10 enter the SX Chase that is the last four rounds.

After St Louis, the top 14 450 Overall:

1. Dungey 390
2. Tomac 305
3. Seely 277
4. Reed 226
5. Baggett 226
6. Canard 204
7. Anderson 200
8. Tickle 194
9. Short 180
10. Peick 160
11. Grant 159
12. Roczen 156
13. Millsaps 147

So now, you head in to Houston with 4 guys with a shot to make it in at 10. The problem with our sport is you have guys that are hurt, and won't finish the series.

Pretty much every professional sport has playoffs that give slight advantages to those who have performed well all season, but give everyone a shot at the championship.

What's the most exciting Vegas round of the past ten years?

The Shop

Crush
Posts
21129
Joined
4/26/2009
Location
Sydney, AU
5/7/2015 9:22pm
2006 is the only one in the last 10 years with 3 riders with a shot, there's been 4 that have come down to the last round, one of those was mathematical only. In 20 years its worse again.

Anything they can do to tighten up the points and therefore make the guys go harder, create drama and excitement is a win. The sport is really fucking hard and produces runaways more than the majority of the time.
tasco
Posts
48
Joined
4/26/2014
Location
Swannanoa, NC, USA
5/7/2015 9:34pm
I quit watching nascar after they started the chase crap. This isn't football where the field is the same every week with one team vs one team. Tracks are different and we all know some racers are better at different types of tracks. A racer can win every race but one, get taken out by a lapped rider in the last race and someone else wins the championship. To me that guy is not a champion, he just got lucky. And in my mind every nascar driver since the chase has started deserves a big asterisk because they are not a champion, just a chase contender who got the best result at homestead.
5/7/2015 9:38pm
tasco wrote:
I quit watching nascar after they started the chase crap. This isn't football where the field is the same every week with one team vs one...
I quit watching nascar after they started the chase crap. This isn't football where the field is the same every week with one team vs one team. Tracks are different and we all know some racers are better at different types of tracks. A racer can win every race but one, get taken out by a lapped rider in the last race and someone else wins the championship. To me that guy is not a champion, he just got lucky. And in my mind every nascar driver since the chase has started deserves a big asterisk because they are not a champion, just a chase contender who got the best result at homestead.
Even more rounds in NASCAR. More opportunity for "bad luck" to happen which keeps them out of the Chase.
5/7/2015 9:55pm Edited Date/Time 5/7/2015 9:58pm
That's not Moto, and I don't like it. Doesn't even feel like real racing.

The goal shouldn't be to have playoffs or a big fancy ending. Think of what is lost in order to get your fireworks blown. After several months of virtually meaningless qualifying sessions you get a few real races.

In not big on NASCAR, but I've seen more than a few of their "races". Guess what? To a casual fan a chase still felt cheap. Makes me feel like the races I've seen are a bunch of worthless, boring qualifiers.
FlaNard
Posts
3620
Joined
10/13/2009
Location
Layton, UT, USA
5/7/2015 9:58pm
Its so fucking stupid. To the point that I'm tired of arguing with people about it. Go ahead and make the sport into a joke. Bring back the joker lane for every race and take out the turns and make it all 100 foot plus jumps with half naked Monster girls dancing all around the track holding tee shirt cannons. Oh and fireworks. Lots and lots of fireworks. You fuckers can have that sport. Just stop calling it Supercross. The records in that clown show don't belong with the likes of RJ or MC.
Ashleymx
Posts
694
Joined
8/12/2008
Location
Cumming, GA, USA
5/7/2015 10:02pm
Even after the title was wrapped up the racing was still awesome. Who cares if the title was wrapped up early. It simply doesnt matter. 1996 McGrath dominated and all these years later he's still a legend and the sport is still kicking ass. There's so much more going on anyway than who wins the title. We had so many different winners this year too. Nothing needs to change! Seriously I wish this crap would stop its just getting ridiculous now lol.
Crush
Posts
21129
Joined
4/26/2009
Location
Sydney, AU
5/7/2015 10:11pm
Ashleymx wrote:
Even after the title was wrapped up the racing was still awesome. Who cares if the title was wrapped up early. It simply doesnt matter. 1996...
Even after the title was wrapped up the racing was still awesome. Who cares if the title was wrapped up early. It simply doesnt matter. 1996 McGrath dominated and all these years later he's still a legend and the sport is still kicking ass. There's so much more going on anyway than who wins the title. We had so many different winners this year too. Nothing needs to change! Seriously I wish this crap would stop its just getting ridiculous now lol.
Kicking ass?

By what measure?

Ticket sales are probably comparative, not better, not worse...

TV is better, that's with a pay for airtime deal the last few years....

The show itself might be better produced or look better, fireworks sure, but the racing still produces a lot of run aways.
TDeath21
Posts
6515
Joined
2/22/2011
Location
Somewhere, MO, USA
5/7/2015 10:17pm
Other sports have playoffs because they don't compete against every other person every week of the year. When you do, like MX or SX, a chase isn't needed.
Ashleymx
Posts
694
Joined
8/12/2008
Location
Cumming, GA, USA
5/7/2015 10:21pm
Ashleymx wrote:
Even after the title was wrapped up the racing was still awesome. Who cares if the title was wrapped up early. It simply doesnt matter. 1996...
Even after the title was wrapped up the racing was still awesome. Who cares if the title was wrapped up early. It simply doesnt matter. 1996 McGrath dominated and all these years later he's still a legend and the sport is still kicking ass. There's so much more going on anyway than who wins the title. We had so many different winners this year too. Nothing needs to change! Seriously I wish this crap would stop its just getting ridiculous now lol.
Crush wrote:
Kicking ass? By what measure? Ticket sales are probably comparative, not better, not worse... TV is better, that's with a pay for airtime deal the last...
Kicking ass?

By what measure?

Ticket sales are probably comparative, not better, not worse...

TV is better, that's with a pay for airtime deal the last few years....

The show itself might be better produced or look better, fireworks sure, but the racing still produces a lot of run aways.
Go to a race and tell me the sport isn't bigger than 1996. I went to 3 this year and they looked just fine. The crowds were big and enthusiast , the racing was great. On TV they look even better. Maybe I still compare to Australia? Now there's a huge difference. I havent been to a race in Australia for a few years now but I sure hope its making a comeback.
bvm111
Posts
10146
Joined
7/1/2008
Location
Las Vegas, NV, USA
5/7/2015 10:22pm


shortcourse
Posts
361
Joined
4/11/2013
Location
Lewiston, ID, USA
5/7/2015 10:29pm
TDeath21 wrote:
Other sports have playoffs because they don't compete against every other person every week of the year. When you do, like MX or SX, a chase...
Other sports have playoffs because they don't compete against every other person every week of the year. When you do, like MX or SX, a chase isn't needed.
A series is won by being in it, the chase format is not needed in moto or any other form of racing. You line up and race....may the best man or women win!
5/7/2015 10:30pm
Let's do away with a year end championship points battle altogether. The winner of each race will be that week's champion.

Tons of excitement, less hurt feelings, and no need for a drawn out chase! Each race will have its own micro chase before a select group rides for the week's title. I call these micro races "heats" or "semis".

That means you get a new chase set up each week! It means almost everyone can be champion! Think of the popularity and subsequent asses filling the seats!!
5/7/2015 10:48pm
Something needs to change in SX.

I lose interest the final quarter of the season.

I like the AX format.
Crush
Posts
21129
Joined
4/26/2009
Location
Sydney, AU
5/7/2015 11:01pm
Ashleymx wrote:
Go to a race and tell me the sport isn't bigger than 1996. I went to 3 this year and they looked just fine. The crowds...
Go to a race and tell me the sport isn't bigger than 1996. I went to 3 this year and they looked just fine. The crowds were big and enthusiast , the racing was great. On TV they look even better. Maybe I still compare to Australia? Now there's a huge difference. I havent been to a race in Australia for a few years now but I sure hope its making a comeback.
They were getting 40 thousand people to races back then too, that's why I said by what measure. Some stuff is better but lots is the same.

Fact is the growth of the sport has been pretty slow if it has and the industry is haemorrhaging cash faster than it can make it, with no new markets to market too, in a fiscal environment that has people looking for more bang for their buck, if they can afford to do anything at all...

All the teams talk about wanting to bring outside cash in and all but a very select few really have achieved that. Everyone talks about the privateers being better supported, but how? Lots of people wish there were more jobs, better racing, more cash... But instead the status quo has left it with a muddled, hard to follow, extremely biased product and to many is just a bunch of bikes going around in a circle follow the leader style. If they really want to grow it, quickly and into new markets, which is where the cash for everyone is, they need to try something else. The past 20 years is where they're at, it's time to try something new. Or continue...

5/7/2015 11:30pm
Outsider wrote:
Dude really? I usually agree with you on most stuff but this? What if this year was a chase format and Kenny came back after injury...
Dude really? I usually agree with you on most stuff but this? What if this year was a chase format and Kenny came back after injury and won the title over Dungey who kicked ass? I'm not a Dungey fan but holy shit that is not cool.

This sport is never gonna be Nascar no matter how many changes we make.,,. keep it real I say
Let's say the chase is the last 5 rounds. How 'bout, in order to qualify for it, in the 12 preceding rounds,

-You can only DNS 1 race
-And/Or you need an average points-per-night of 15+. (In the first 12 rounds, Canard had a 17, Tomac a 16.7, and Roczen a 13.) (I should've gone by average finish but whatever.)

James Stewart in 2013 was a 14.1, through the first 12.
In 2012 he was 14.8...so, uh...we could could maybe lower it just a bit..
Gazza
Posts
91
Joined
6/16/2010
Location
NZ
5/8/2015 1:13am
Is the fact that there is still a championship up for grabs the only thing that makes for good watching? The races I watched after Dungey wrapped up the Championship he still went out to win. Everyone still went out to win. Did you see that dudes speed at Vegas? If Eli hadn't of crashed that could have been an awesome 20 laps.

Yeah, it's a little disappointing when the championship is wrapped up early, but how much difference do you really think it will make if they change to a chase? If anything you move the races where nothing is on the line to the start of the season, you probably would actually have more races which are less exciting than the current format. If only the last 5 races count towards the championship why would I bother even watching earlier races? Why would spectators pay a buttload of money to go watch it live when you know they might not be hanging it all out?

There is a reason we are all sitting at our computers and they are racing for a living, they have that killer racer attitude where losing is not an option, to suggest that the when the championship is decided the field suddenly starts racing with less intensity is insulting to the riders.

If you want to change it up a little, maybe drop the worst round. You could potentially have a couple rounds with double points (A1, Daytona and Vegas?) although see how that plan went down with F1 fans...
MudPup545
Posts
1700
Joined
11/14/2014
Location
Imlay City, MI, USA
5/8/2015 1:42am
No.
Indy mxer
Posts
1871
Joined
6/15/2010
Location
The Villages, FL, USA
5/8/2015 2:36am
Zracer wrote:
I think the logic is based on the suggestion being unnecessary and just dumb. Yeah lets have more meaningless races and handicap the dominant racers so...
I think the logic is based on the suggestion being unnecessary and just dumb. Yeah lets have more meaningless races and handicap the dominant racers so you adhd buffoons dont get bored. Good idea.
Crush wrote:
So we've seen 25% or less of the last how ever many titles come down to a decider and you think that most people aren't at...
So we've seen 25% or less of the last how ever many titles come down to a decider and you think that most people aren't at least a little bored...?

How many threads this year have been about the races being mreh?

The sport isn't really attracting new markets or sponsors...

Why not try it? What's to lose? It'd create more story lines–We've seen more weird shit in the last 3 monster cups than the last 3 series of racing... There'd be more chances for the racers and if nothing else, the common thread in the naysayers line runs around the one best guy suffering... Bower's and Regal's titles show that is not the case... yet the other 40 dudes who'd try to get in there, who'd race harder and provide better entertainment because they had a chance, well fuck them.

Besides, it's been 20 years since something was different, it could always go back after a 5 year trial or something... Were you this enraged in 85 with the two moto format?
Exactly. Give it a try. Doesn't have to be exactly like NASCAR. Just tweek it for SX.
The series turned into a snoozer. Every sport changes and evolves to stay relevant.
SX and MX should be no different.
Oh and btw, I'm over the 250 east west thing as well. Put the best riders on the track every week.
MudPup545
Posts
1700
Joined
11/14/2014
Location
Imlay City, MI, USA
5/8/2015 2:38am
How about in football, they play 3 quarters and then reset the score back to zero?
In baseball the losing team gets 2 free runs added in after the 7th inning?
In golf, if your 3 strokes behind you get 2 extra mulligans?
Everyone in bowling with a score lower than the leader gets a free strike added in the 5th frame?
Or....call me crazy, in Supercross we just leave it the way it is? May the best man win.
reded
Posts
3682
Joined
3/26/2011
Location
USA
5/8/2015 4:17am
MudPup545 wrote:
How about in football, they play 3 quarters and then reset the score back to zero? In baseball the losing team gets 2 free runs added...
How about in football, they play 3 quarters and then reset the score back to zero?
In baseball the losing team gets 2 free runs added in after the 7th inning?
In golf, if your 3 strokes behind you get 2 extra mulligans?
Everyone in bowling with a score lower than the leader gets a free strike added in the 5th frame?
Or....call me crazy, in Supercross we just leave it the way it is? May the best man win.
Exactly what I was about put down.

I don't believe in handicapping the leader just to appease the fans or help the players who don't possess as much skill as the leader.
hellion
Posts
1089
Joined
12/19/2009
Location
Westfield, MA, USA
5/8/2015 4:39am
Get used to these kinds of ideas because the attention span of fans and participants gets shorter every year.
Crush
Posts
21129
Joined
4/26/2009
Location
Sydney, AU
5/8/2015 5:06am
hellion wrote:
Get used to these kinds of ideas because the attention span of fans and participants gets shorter every year.
I don't get this comment though, it'd create more interest. How does it have anything to do with shorter attention spans?
edgo897
Posts
579
Joined
1/3/2010
Location
Land O Lakes, FL, USA
5/8/2015 5:21am
Outsider wrote:
Yeah... Nascar.. [img]https://jour20313.files.wordpress.com/2010/10/nascarfan3.jpg[/img]
Yeah... Nascar..

And lets go to a one moto format so that this guy doesn't have to do math.
B-EVANS
Posts
259
Joined
4/8/2013
Location
Oklahoma City, OK, USA
5/8/2015 5:31am
Why does everyone want to "grow the sport"? It will just bring in idiots that want to change it.
IWreckALot
Posts
8677
Joined
3/12/2011
Location
Fort Worth, TX, USA
5/8/2015 5:32am
Hey did you guys hear that they found something suspicious in Milsaps locker, and Tomac will be on green next season?

Post a reply to: A Chase style shakeup makes sense

The Latest