Jeremy Mayfield tested + for Meth!

Nerd
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7/2/2009 10:45pm
Nerd wrote:
So back to the subject of the thread, if you guys think Adderall should be illegal in driving sports because "that ability to focus is part...
So back to the subject of the thread, if you guys think Adderall should be illegal in driving sports because "that ability to focus is part of the sport" and thus those people get an unfair advantage, what about drivers who are depressed?

Should they be allowed to take anti-depressants, which would even them out and make them a better driver over the course of a four-hour race?

I'm just trying to understand the line when we're talking about medically relevant and necessary drugs for a certain person. Obviously, if Mayfield didn't have a legitimate prescription, he should be banned. I get that. I'm saying what if he does have a legit Rx?

What if there was a drug that changed your vision from 20/50 to 20/10?
drmarkr wrote:
I think the stimulants should be banned, period. You need to take them, you don't drive/race. Anti-depressents? Why? They have no PE effect, as the stimulants...
I think the stimulants should be banned, period. You need to take them, you don't drive/race.

Anti-depressents? Why? They have no PE effect, as the stimulants do.

Hardware in bones that's stronger? That passes the smell test for me also.

Testosterone because your levels are "low"?? No way.
There are drugs that even people out who have mood instability, for example. That would undoubtedly make them concentrate better. Isn't that against what you guys have said? The case being made is that if you're not BORN with the ability to focus really well, you shouldn't be able to take drugs to fix it.

So what about people with mood instability? Or what about people with poor eyesight? If we want people to work with what they were born with, why is ANYTHING that isn't in food allowed?
Nerd
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7/2/2009 10:47pm
Nope, disagree with that if they make rules informed by sound information considering the full scope of the sport's interest. We may be talking about "objective"...
Nope, disagree with that if they make rules informed by sound information considering the full scope of the sport's interest. We may be talking about "objective" differently. To me, objective is "the leg is broken." The Tova test appears to be objective only in the sense that it filters results uniformly. That begs the question of whether it can be skewed on input, which is not an issue when someone is approaching the test sincerely (there appear to issue with being overinclusive on adults). http://books.google.com/books?id=dvE1mzbqI14C&pg=PA652&lpg=PA652&dq=tova+test+skew&source=bl&ots=5kyrCtYKAu&sig=zL--O4JmJB69t1FzU20ifxA8rwY&hl=en&ei=-UBNSormB5PgtgPz8_S3BQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=2

We're talking about a slice of the world that tries to game the system to circumvent rules, and the efforts to do so can go to great lengths and expense where there's a lot of money at stake.
You haven't taken the test, and you weren't even aware of it prior to me bringing it up, but you're the expert.
bullpen58
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7/2/2009 10:53pm
Very true and good points about "BH". Many of the dxs are nothing more than educated guesses based on patient/client report. Not exactly the most scientific of processes.

What is interesting to me is how they keep rewriting the DSM (our "Bible", if you will) and changing what's in it. Some dxs disappear (e.g., homosexuality) and new ones are invented all the time. Like I said earlier, ADD is no longer an actual dx in the DSM.

There are also distinct periods in hx where some dxs become "trendy". My favorite was when "Multiple Personality Disorder" became super trendy and doctors and psychiatrists everywhere were dx people with that crap. LMAO!!!

Lately, it appears (to me) that "Bi-Polar" is the most trendy dx of all. I swear to God, every kid that gets referred to me that has EVER had ANY change to his mood at all comes with that dx from someone. Lame. It doesn't add up to me.
Jabjr222
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7/2/2009 10:54pm
88sdad wrote:
I was prescribed citalopram today. After reading about it today on the internet, I'm scare to take it.

What can you tell me about this drug?
In my experience, it really helped. I feel like I had gotten so low that I couldn't pull myself up. It just evened me out. I would still get really happy, but not as sad... if that makes sense.

The first week was rough. It messed with my head a bit. But it passed. I didn't have a single physical side effect from it.

I was on it for about 14 months, felt like I needed to bump up the dose and just decided to stop. And yeah, coming off sucked.

In hindsight, I think I became kind of apathetic while on it. I wasn't as creative on it either. No doubt I needed it when I did. But I didn't plan on being on something long term.

The Shop

mcphilly
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7/2/2009 11:15pm
drmarkr wrote:
Adderal is absolutely clean, laboratory-produced speed. Methamphetamine. Very similar to Ritalin. It's prescribed in smaller doses to treat "ADHD" and, of course, helps you get more...
Adderal is absolutely clean, laboratory-produced speed. Methamphetamine. Very similar to Ritalin.


It's prescribed in smaller doses to treat "ADHD" and, of course, helps you get more things done. Street speed in equivalent doses would do exactly the same. And your statement that someone without ADHD wouldn't be similarly affected is just plain wrong....pretty much anyone that takes speed (or Adderal, or Ritalin) will have sharper focus and be less likely to be distracted from a task at hand. Larger doses will be just as likely to make you "tweaky" as it would a "non-ADHD" person, assuming you're both acclimated to the drug(s).


Here's my opinion. Adderal and Ritalin should be banned from motorsports, as all other forms of methamphetamine already are (hell, maybe they already are?) ADHD is a nonsense, quasi-diagnosis to begin with, and to use that as an excuse to allow certain competitors to gain an advantage with these drugs is bullshit. You want to use these drugs to treat your "medical condition"?? Fine. Find another line of work. You don't get to race motorsports while using these drugs. Easy enough.


Society decided a few years ago it was ok to create huge numbers of meth addicts (oooh, did I say that??) by drugging our children instead of using time, effort and discipline to control their unwanted behaviors. About the same time they decided anyone with pain has a "right" to whatever narcotic they request. Look around to see the results of this absolutely ridiculous decision.... makes be ashamed of my profession, really.


As for Mayfield's test being positive for both "meth" and Adderal, I'm pretty certain the testing used today can easily differentiate the two. Not that that matters to the judge they found to give him a stay on the suspension. Surprise, surprise.
mcphilly wrote:
I take it you have never been around a so called adhd individual . I guess what you are saying is that all the Doctors out...
I take it you have never been around a so called adhd individual . I guess what you are saying is that all the Doctors out there that prescribe these medications to adults and children are just idiots because its just a made up disease . You obviously dont know what you are talking about and have never done any real research about add and adhd . You should really try and do that before you come on here and act like you know what you are talking about .


Your last little bit you said that they should easily be able to differentiate the two in a lab test but in your first sentence you said that they are the same thing ? They are not the same thing and if you did any research into it you would find that out for your self .


Why do you think these drugs should be banned from motorsports ? What if they really help the person who is taking them and his life is better because of it ? If they are prescribed by a doctor and taken responsibly they can be very helpful .


Speed has a reverse affect on people who are ADHD . I drink coffee and mellow out a normal person drinks coffee and wakes up . If I drink a monster energy drink it calms me down and I could lay down and take a nap if a wanted to . A normal person would probably find it a bit harder . When I dont take my meds I am off the wall all over the place and dont get shit done . When I take my meds I am just like a normal person is. I have seen normal people take adderall and Ritlan and they are all over the place and they act like me when I dont take my meds.

I guess you just proved why being a Doctor is mostly guess work lmao

Smile
drmarkr wrote:
Yep. All guess work. And your qualifications, besides having this "disease" are what, again? I see you paid close attention in pharmacology also....
You are right , I am not a doctor so I must not have a clue what I am talking about . pfffttt lol.

I guess I pretty much haven`t studied this for over twenty years and all the knowledge I have gained and experienced is just a bunch of shit . Sure you are a doctor , but a doctor of what ? Did you have a couple brief chapters in med school on the subject or have you come up with your own conclusions based on years of practice in this area?



Check out the DSM-IV-TR ............it might help you with your confusion.

KAWboy14
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7/3/2009 5:55am
.....chiropractor? homeopothy?
KAWboy14
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7/3/2009 5:56am
seems like it would be pretty easy to agree with nerd....there are real people with real needs.

in this case, if the need is proved, medically, let the guy take the drugs and let him go to work.
zippy895
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7/3/2009 7:03am
cdm806 wrote:
He tested positive for three (3) different substances: Adderal, Claritin-D, and meth.
RMZ819 wrote:
Adderal + Claritin D together will make you test postive for meth. True Story!!!!
bubba the love sponge show did a test of these drugs and it showed bubba positive for meth. just saying.
Nerd
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7/3/2009 9:20am
KAWboy14 wrote:
seems like it would be pretty easy to agree with nerd....there are real people with real needs. in this case, if the need is proved, medically...
seems like it would be pretty easy to agree with nerd....there are real people with real needs.

in this case, if the need is proved, medically, let the guy take the drugs and let him go to work.
It's logical. People have a built-in aversion to drugs in any form. I really believe if laser-eye surgery and glasses/contacts didn't exist, and we asked about a pill that would temporarily improve eyesight to 20/10, these same people would say that it's unfair. But since eye correction has been around for so long, everyone says it's okay, but it's the same concept as treating someone with ADHD or any other brain disorder.

If there were a laser surgery to fix the brain and help people with ADHD concentrate better, people wouldn't have a problem with it. But because it's a drug, it's a problem.
ProMed
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7/3/2009 9:54am
MXWordNerd is back... 10 pages easy.
bullpen58
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7/3/2009 10:36am
Down with drugs!!! In with lasers!!!!
Nerd
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7/3/2009 10:40am
Hey, by the way, did you guys know that cyclists and other similar athletes are taking Viagra now as a performance-enhancing drug? Studies have shown that cyclists who take Viagra show an improvement by as much as 45% when cycling at altitude.

It's a vasodilator, which means it opens up your blood vessels, which is potentially beneficial in a lot of ways, and could even be beneficial in terms of concentration, although that hasn't been studied.
bullpen58
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7/3/2009 10:42am
Nerd wrote:
Hey, by the way, did you guys know that cyclists and other similar athletes are taking Viagra now as a performance-enhancing drug? Studies have shown that...
Hey, by the way, did you guys know that cyclists and other similar athletes are taking Viagra now as a performance-enhancing drug? Studies have shown that cyclists who take Viagra show an improvement by as much as 45% when cycling at altitude.

It's a vasodilator, which means it opens up your blood vessels, which is potentially beneficial in a lot of ways, and could even be beneficial in terms of concentration, although that hasn't been studied.
Wonder how they ride those bikes with a boner?
Nerd
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7/3/2009 10:42am
Nerd wrote:
Hey, by the way, did you guys know that cyclists and other similar athletes are taking Viagra now as a performance-enhancing drug? Studies have shown that...
Hey, by the way, did you guys know that cyclists and other similar athletes are taking Viagra now as a performance-enhancing drug? Studies have shown that cyclists who take Viagra show an improvement by as much as 45% when cycling at altitude.

It's a vasodilator, which means it opens up your blood vessels, which is potentially beneficial in a lot of ways, and could even be beneficial in terms of concentration, although that hasn't been studied.
bullpen58 wrote:
Wonder how they ride those bikes with a boner?
I don't think Viagra just gives you a boner. I think it HELPS you get and MAINTAIN a boner when sexually aroused.
Trip
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7/3/2009 10:50am
I've missed Nerd...Welcome Back!!! The more this place changes, the more it stays the same.
Nerd
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7/3/2009 11:05am
Trip wrote:
I've missed Nerd...Welcome Back!!! The more this place changes, the more it stays the same.
HA! You guys keep saying you missed me, but that just proves the nostalgia is not objective.

Smile
bullpen58
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7/3/2009 11:07am
Nerd wrote:
I don't think Viagra just gives you a boner. I think it HELPS you get and MAINTAIN a boner when sexually aroused.
Well, according to the commercials you might "experience an erection lasting more than four hours". Imagine if a girl flashed her titties at the peloton as it went by. Half the field would have to drop out of the Tour!!!!
Nerd
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7/3/2009 11:14am
Nerd wrote:
I don't think Viagra just gives you a boner. I think it HELPS you get and MAINTAIN a boner when sexually aroused.
bullpen58 wrote:
Well, according to the commercials you might "experience an erection lasting more than four hours". Imagine if a girl flashed her titties at the peloton as...
Well, according to the commercials you might "experience an erection lasting more than four hours". Imagine if a girl flashed her titties at the peloton as it went by. Half the field would have to drop out of the Tour!!!!
Yeah, but that's a potential side effect. It's not the direct effect of the drug. All drugs have side effects. Aspirin thins your blood, for example. That's not really a purpose of Aspirin, it's a side-effect. It just so happens that it's so well-known and so consistent that people have started taking Aspirin directly for this effect.

But most side-effects of drugs happen to a small percentage of people who take it.
FreshTopEnd
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7/3/2009 11:24am Edited Date/Time 4/17/2016 12:43am
Nope, disagree with that if they make rules informed by sound information considering the full scope of the sport's interest. We may be talking about "objective"...
Nope, disagree with that if they make rules informed by sound information considering the full scope of the sport's interest. We may be talking about "objective" differently. To me, objective is "the leg is broken." The Tova test appears to be objective only in the sense that it filters results uniformly. That begs the question of whether it can be skewed on input, which is not an issue when someone is approaching the test sincerely (there appear to issue with being overinclusive on adults). http://books.google.com/books?id=dvE1mzbqI14C&pg=PA652&lpg=PA652&dq=tova+test+skew&source=bl&ots=5kyrCtYKAu&sig=zL--O4JmJB69t1FzU20ifxA8rwY&hl=en&ei=-UBNSormB5PgtgPz8_S3BQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=2

We're talking about a slice of the world that tries to game the system to circumvent rules, and the efforts to do so can go to great lengths and expense where there's a lot of money at stake.
Nerd wrote:
You haven't taken the test, and you weren't even aware of it prior to me bringing it up, but you're the expert.
No, I'm not the expert, and neither are you an expert simply because you took the test.


The clinical review (cited) said it is subject to manipulation and where the results are extreme they need to be checked against other diagnostic criteria. The test is not objective in the sense that it filters subjective input that the test subject can skew. It is objective to the extent that it provides an unbiased filter on that input. Beyond that, it apparently overdiagnoses ADHD when checked against other tests; it is good at catching true cases but also errs in including people without ADHD. So it is a tool, not a definitive tool by itself. Sometimes it will cut to the chase, as in your case, or sometime be the beginning of the chase. You can read that as well as I.


We're not talking about whether your diagnosis is valid and the treatment is effective. I am incredibly happy for you, sincerely. I have been chest deep for more than a decade in more medical testing than I would wish on anyone. Sometimes accurate answers come quickly, sometime longer, and sometimes after reversing from wrong paths struck by bright doctors with the best of intentions. Good for you that they nailed your diagnoses right away. Now get the fuck over yourself as some sort of authority. No one has questioned the reality of your diagnosis, the efficacy of your treatment and the benefit you've enjoyed.


What we are talking about is the potential for using therapeutic drugs for illicit purposes, in this case for purposes of gaining a competitive advantage. There are many drugs that have therapeutic applications (for example, I take EPO to counteract side effects of other anti-rejection meds I have to take), but also can function as performance enhancers outside apart from their therapeutic application. There isn't any question that some drugs used to treat ADHD are abused by non-ADHD individuals as neuro enhancers. No question whatsoever.


So the question is whether someone in a competitive occupation is truly ADHD and using the drug for a valid purpose or someone feigning that to validate use that in fact is not therapeutic but to enhance performance. What's a sanctioning body to do about that? I think it depends on the drug, and the ability for a neutral evaluator to validate a diagnosis. It absolutely would be a charade to rely solely on the athlete's prescribing physician. And, in this setting, the test that worked for you would be a beginning, but the not the final word if a sanctioning body was being vigilant and had concluded it could strike that balance rather than absolutely ban the drug in question.
Nerd
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7/3/2009 11:35am
Nope, disagree with that if they make rules informed by sound information considering the full scope of the sport's interest. We may be talking about "objective"...
Nope, disagree with that if they make rules informed by sound information considering the full scope of the sport's interest. We may be talking about "objective" differently. To me, objective is "the leg is broken." The Tova test appears to be objective only in the sense that it filters results uniformly. That begs the question of whether it can be skewed on input, which is not an issue when someone is approaching the test sincerely (there appear to issue with being overinclusive on adults). http://books.google.com/books?id=dvE1mzbqI14C&pg=PA652&lpg=PA652&dq=tova+test+skew&source=bl&ots=5kyrCtYKAu&sig=zL--O4JmJB69t1FzU20ifxA8rwY&hl=en&ei=-UBNSormB5PgtgPz8_S3BQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=2

We're talking about a slice of the world that tries to game the system to circumvent rules, and the efforts to do so can go to great lengths and expense where there's a lot of money at stake.
Nerd wrote:
You haven't taken the test, and you weren't even aware of it prior to me bringing it up, but you're the expert.
No, I'm not the expert, and neither are you an expert simply because you took the test. The clinical review (cited) said it is subject to...
No, I'm not the expert, and neither are you an expert simply because you took the test.


The clinical review (cited) said it is subject to manipulation and where the results are extreme they need to be checked against other diagnostic criteria. The test is not objective in the sense that it filters subjective input that the test subject can skew. It is objective to the extent that it provides an unbiased filter on that input. Beyond that, it apparently overdiagnoses ADHD when checked against other tests; it is good at catching true cases but also errs in including people without ADHD. So it is a tool, not a definitive tool by itself. Sometimes it will cut to the chase, as in your case, or sometime be the beginning of the chase. You can read that as well as I.


We're not talking about whether your diagnosis is valid and the treatment is effective. I am incredibly happy for you, sincerely. I have been chest deep for more than a decade in more medical testing than I would wish on anyone. Sometimes accurate answers come quickly, sometime longer, and sometimes after reversing from wrong paths struck by bright doctors with the best of intentions. Good for you that they nailed your diagnoses right away. Now get the fuck over yourself as some sort of authority. No one has questioned the reality of your diagnosis, the efficacy of your treatment and the benefit you've enjoyed.


What we are talking about is the potential for using therapeutic drugs for illicit purposes, in this case for purposes of gaining a competitive advantage. There are many drugs that have therapeutic applications (for example, I take EPO to counteract side effects of other anti-rejection meds I have to take), but also can function as performance enhancers outside apart from their therapeutic application. There isn't any question that some drugs used to treat ADHD are abused by non-ADHD individuals as neuro enhancers. No question whatsoever.


So the question is whether someone in a competitive occupation is truly ADHD and using the drug for a valid purpose or someone feigning that to validate use that in fact is not therapeutic but to enhance performance. What's a sanctioning body to do about that? I think it depends on the drug, and the ability for a neutral evaluator to validate a diagnosis. It absolutely would be a charade to rely solely on the athlete's prescribing physician. And, in this setting, the test that worked for you would be a beginning, but the not the final word if a sanctioning body was being vigilant and had concluded it could strike that balance rather than absolutely ban the drug in question.
Viagra is being used to increase performance, but so far cycling federations haven't banned it because they have it prescribed from an actual physician for a legitimate use.

Like I said, it's not for the racing organization to decide what is medically necessary for a participant. It's for doctors to do. That's what they're trained for. If as a racing organization you make decisions that are only to be made by doctors, I think that is way beyond your level of expertise.

On top of that, if the doctors are providing drugs for fake reasons, then they need to be reported to the government and the government will handle it.
FreshTopEnd
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7/3/2009 12:11pm Edited Date/Time 7/3/2009 4:00pm
EPO is prescribed by actual physicians for therapeutic uses and it is banned by various sports bodies. I expect there are therapeutic applications for anabolic steroids and HGH as well, and those substances are banned by some sports bodies. If the viagra issue continues, a dollar will get you five it gets banned as well. Sports bodies have to chase the athletes and their providers' innovation all the time.



If a sporting body chooses to regulate performance enhancing drugs, then there is nothing wrong with them implementing a system to validate allegedly therapeutic prescriptions, and if there is no means to distinguish valid from performance enhancing uses, to ban use of the substance entirely. The notion that somehow a sports body could not preclude use of a drug, but could test for it and then report the individual and his physician to the government for legal action on the assumption that it was illicitly prescribed, but not directly affect the athlete's participation has far more problems, legal and otherwise, than directly regulating, testing and enforcing the agency's own drug rules.
KAWboy14
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7/3/2009 3:34pm
again.....ALL businesses and sports that have adopted a drug program ALSO have a program to inform of the need of a specific drug so that the random test doesnt turn up an athlete as someone trying to hide something.
KAWboy14
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7/3/2009 4:12pm
France defends NASCAR's drug policy
By JENNA FRYER – 4 hours ago

DAYTONA BEACH, Fla. (AP) — Brian France defended NASCAR's drug testing policy as the toughest in professional sports, despite a federal judge's ruling that overturned driver Jeremy Mayfield's suspension.

Mayfield was indefinitely suspended May 9 for what NASCAR said was a positive test for methamphetamines. He sued to be reinstated, and a federal judge issued an injunction Wednesday that allowed Mayfield to race this weekend based on Mayfield's argument that NASCAR's testing system is flawed.

U.S. District Court Judge Graham Mullen questioned the test results, saying the possibility of a false positive was quite substantial and ruled the harm to Mayfield significantly outweighed the harm to NASCAR.

But NASCAR's chairman said the sport needs a tough system that bans impaired drivers from competition.

"We remain very comfortable and very calm despite the ruling, that our policy is thorough, it's accurate, and it's fair," France said Friday at Daytona International Speedway, site of Saturday night's race.

"It's our responsibility to protect the drivers, the fans, other participants within the events. We have a very unique challenge relative to all sports, which is the inherent danger of somebody impaired on the racetrack."
drmarkr
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7/3/2009 8:53pm
Nerd wrote:
Hey, by the way, did you guys know that cyclists and other similar athletes are taking Viagra now as a performance-enhancing drug? Studies have shown that...
Hey, by the way, did you guys know that cyclists and other similar athletes are taking Viagra now as a performance-enhancing drug? Studies have shown that cyclists who take Viagra show an improvement by as much as 45% when cycling at altitude.

It's a vasodilator, which means it opens up your blood vessels, which is potentially beneficial in a lot of ways, and could even be beneficial in terms of concentration, although that hasn't been studied.
Interesting....commonly used for primary pulmonary hypertension. But 45%? 45% of what?

Nerd
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7/3/2009 10:00pm
Nerd wrote:
Hey, by the way, did you guys know that cyclists and other similar athletes are taking Viagra now as a performance-enhancing drug? Studies have shown that...
Hey, by the way, did you guys know that cyclists and other similar athletes are taking Viagra now as a performance-enhancing drug? Studies have shown that cyclists who take Viagra show an improvement by as much as 45% when cycling at altitude.

It's a vasodilator, which means it opens up your blood vessels, which is potentially beneficial in a lot of ways, and could even be beneficial in terms of concentration, although that hasn't been studied.
drmarkr wrote:
Interesting....commonly used for primary pulmonary hypertension. But 45%? 45% of what?

This study is from 2006, so it's been at least three years and Viagra is still not banned for cyclists.

http://www.the-aps.org/press/journal/06/15.htm

Viagra Boosts High Altitude Exercise Up To 45% For Some Cyclists

But others don’t benefit at all; Possible side effects still a concern

BETHESDA, MD. (June 27, 2006) – Sildenafil (Viagra) significantly improved the cardiovascular and exercise performance measures of trained cyclists at high altitude, mostly because the drug helped some participants improve a lot -- up to 45% -- while others showed little change. Sildenafil provided no benefit at sea level.

Ten cyclists who took sildenafil at altitude collectively lowered the time it took to cover six kilometers by 15% compared to placebo trials at altitude. The cyclists also significantly improved stroke volume (the volume of blood moved out of one ventricle of the heart per beat) and cardiac output (stroke volume times heart rate) compared to the placebo trial. Sildenafil also minimized the decline of arterial oxygen saturation of the arteries when the cyclists were at simulated altitude of 12,700 feet.

But the researchers discovered that these improvements occurred largely because some people achieve major gains with sildenafil at altitude while others improve much less or not at all. The responders improved 39% in the time trial performance at altitude compared to their performance at altitude with a placebo. Some in the responder group improved as much as 45%, according to a study in the Journal of Applied Physiology published by The American Physiological Society. Non-responders improved an insignificant 1%.

The study, “Sildenafil improves cardiac output and exercise performance during acute hypoxia but not normoxia,” by Andrew R. Hsu, Kimberly E. Barnholt, and Nicolas K. Grundmann, Veterans Affairs Palo Alto Health Care System; Joseph H. Lin and Stewart W. McCallum, Stanford University Medical Center; and Anne L. Friedlander, Veterans Affairs Palo Alto Health Care System and Stanford University appears in the June issue of the Journal of Applied Physiology.

Drug expands the blood vessels

Sildenafil citrate is best known as Viagra, a drug used to treat erectile dysfunction. The drug was originally developed to relieve high blood pressure. It causes blood vessels in certain tissues, such as the lungs, to relax. This improves blood flow from the heart and increases oxygen transport to working muscles. Because the high altitude atmosphere contains less oxygen, it is more difficult to get enough oxygen to support strenuous physical activity than it is at sea level.

Sildenafil works by inhibiting phosphodiestrase-5, an enzyme which degrades cyclic guanosine monophosphate (cGMP) a cell messenger that causes the blood vessels to relax, Friedlander explained. By inhibiting the enzyme, the drug allows greater vasodilation and greater blood flow. Although the drug works in different target sites, this study focused on the lungs.

The researchers hypothesized that the drug would allow the study’s participants to improve their performance at altitude because it would reduce the constriction of vessels in the lungs that sometimes occurs at altitude. In turn, that would allow greater blood flow through the heart, better transfer of oxygen from the lungs to the blood and improved oxygen delivery to working muscles.

The participants, all trained cyclists, performed a total of 10 cycling trials, with and without sildenafil at sea level and at simulated altitude of 3,874 meters. Neither the participants nor the researchers knew whether the trial included a placebo or one of the two sildenafil doses, 50 mg or 100 mg.

The high altitude simulation was achieved by changing the mix of air. The cyclists began breathing the high altitude mix starting one hour before the exercise session and continuing through the session. The simulation did not include the lower air pressure that would occur at altitude, Friedlander said.

Researchers analyzed the changes in each individual’s performance under various exercise conditions and also compared the group’s performance under different drug conditions.

Responders versus non-responders

Four of the 10 participants responded to sildenafil while the remaining six did not, Friedlander said. The responders showed the greatest drops in stroke volume, cardiac output, and cycling performance between the sea level and high altitude trials without the drug.

“Without sildenafil, their performance went down more than others,” Friedlander said. “With it, it brought them back up to the levels of the non-responders.” The results suggest that the responders experienced a greater degree of constriction of the vessels in the lungs at altitude and therefore benefited more from the vessel relaxation effects of sildenafil.

“One of the messages of the paper is that not everybody benefits,” Friedlander said. Sildenafil could be considered as a treatment for those who suffer most at altitude but, because of side effects that can include severe headaches and the apparent inability to help some people, it should not be taken as an exercise aid by everyone, she said.

The bigger picture

This study adds to the scientific knowledge of what physiological factors limit performance at altitude, including the role that cardiac output plays, Friedlander said. For instance, physiologists don’t know why some people have trouble at altitude and may develop illnesses such as acute mountain sickness or high altitude pulmonary edema while others adapt quickly. Studies like this may help identify some of the underlying differences between people and lead to better treatments.

In future studies, Friedlander wants to identify:

*

what steps individuals could take to acclimatize before they go to altitude
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who is likely to acclimatize quickly at altitude and who may need additional help
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how to minimize performance declines at altitude

Friedlander and her team are working on issues that could apply to those who have to rapidly acclimatize to high altitude. For instance, when soldiers deploy to Afghanistan, they must quickly undertake physically taxing work at 12,000-14,000 feet, conditions that can severely affect performance under potentially life-threatening conditions.

In a study Friedlander and colleagues conducted at 14,000 feet on Pike’s Peak, Colorado, participants showed marked hormonal changes at altitude. These changes facilitate oxygen delivery. However, this benefit is suppressed when individuals don’t eat enough and the body shifts focus to store more energy, Friedlander explained. That study appears in the June issue of the American Journal of Physiology-Endocrinology and Metabolism, also published by APS.

Next steps

One next step is to do a study with women, to see if they react the same way to sildenafil and altitude. The researchers also want to take a closer look at sildenafil responders to see if they can identify ahead of time who will benefit from treatment. In addition, a question still outstanding is whether non-responders would benefit from sildenafil at a higher elevation.

Source

“Sildenafil improves cardiac output and exercise performance during acute hypoxia, but not normoxia,” by Andrew R. Hsu, Kimberly E. Barnholt and Nicolas K. Grundmann, Exercise Physiology Laboratory, Clinical Studies Unit, Veterans Affairs Palo Alto Health Care System, Palo Alto, CA; Joseph H. Lin, Department of Medicine, Pulmonary and Critical Care, Stanford University School of Medicine; Stewart W. McCallum, Department of Urology, Stanford Medical Center; and Anne L. Friedlander, Exercise Physiology Laboratory, Clinical Studies Unit and Geriatric Research, Education and Clinical Center, Veterans Affairs Palo Alto Health Care System. The study will appear in the June issue of Journal of Applied Physiology published by The American Physiological Society.

Editor’s note: The media may obtain a copy of Hsu et al. by contacting Christine Guilfoy, American Physiological Society, (301) 634-7253, (978) 290-2400 (cell), or cguilfoy@the-aps.org.

* * *

The American Physiological Society was founded in 1887 to foster basic and applied bioscience. The Bethesda, Maryland-based society has 10,500 members and publishes 14 peer-reviewed journals containing almost 4,000 articles annually.

* * *

APS provides a wide range of research, educational and career support and programming to further the contributions of physiology to understanding the mechanisms of diseased and healthy states. In 2004, APS received the Presidential Award for Excellence in Science, Mathematics and Engineering Mentoring (PAESMEM).

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zookrider62!
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7/4/2009 12:22am
Nerd wrote:
Hey, by the way, did you guys know that cyclists and other similar athletes are taking Viagra now as a performance-enhancing drug? Studies have shown that...
Hey, by the way, did you guys know that cyclists and other similar athletes are taking Viagra now as a performance-enhancing drug? Studies have shown that cyclists who take Viagra show an improvement by as much as 45% when cycling at altitude.

It's a vasodilator, which means it opens up your blood vessels, which is potentially beneficial in a lot of ways, and could even be beneficial in terms of concentration, although that hasn't been studied.
Didnt a baseball player get busted for essentially the same thing earlier this year? Failed a drug test and it was supposedly for ED?
sakana
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3/24/2015 3:16pm
Nerd wrote:
NASCAR isn't the NCAA or NFL. No one's running around the track. If someone legitimately has a diagnosis of ADD/ADHD and is given Adderall, they are...
NASCAR isn't the NCAA or NFL. No one's running around the track.

If someone legitimately has a diagnosis of ADD/ADHD and is given Adderall, they are FAR SAFER on the track than if their ADD kicks in. Think about it. Would you want the guy next to you at 200 mph to be thinking, "Did I leave the iron on? Huh. I don't know. I wonder if I did. Next pit stop, I should probably tell someone to ask my wife."?

No, you want them thinking about what they're doing, period.
Jabjr222 wrote:
I totally get your point but concentration is part of NASCAR just like it is in other sports... Plus, Adderal is speed... It is clean, laboratory...
I totally get your point but concentration is part of NASCAR just like it is in other sports... Plus, Adderal is speed... It is clean, laboratory produced speed.

I might be a little behind on my add studies but I don't think it works like that.... I might be wrong thou... hey, look at that coffee mug...
Nerd wrote:
Well, I'm not behind on my ADD studies, and what Adderall (and other stimulants) does in people with ADD is it raises their distraction threshold. So...
Well, I'm not behind on my ADD studies, and what Adderall (and other stimulants) does in people with ADD is it raises their distraction threshold. So, whereas before being on the drug, you would be very easily distracted, when you're on the drug, you're not. You're able to concentrate much, much better.

And you're right, concentration is part of NASCAR. So is vision. Should they ban laser-eye surgery? Hey, if you weren't born with 20/20, you lose. Sorry.
Interesting to look back how some of us felt/looked at adderall when it involved somebody [Jeremy Mayfield] outside of our sport back in 2009.
Doug S.
4stroke4DWIN
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3/25/2015 6:07am
That moment when you realize you are reading a thread from 2009Shocked It's to early lol
Old-Man
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3/25/2015 12:27pm Edited Date/Time 3/25/2015 1:19pm
Too bad Mayfield took the low road..he beat Earnhardt Sr straight up at Pocono by using the "Chrome bumper" Earnhardt established his whole career. True talent gone to shit because of the drug

Post a reply to: Jeremy Mayfield tested + for Meth!

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