Posts
1324
Joined
7/1/2008
Location
Eureka, CA, USA
Edited Date/Time
1/21/2012 3:45pm
It is crazy how this is brought up all the time and how people can say that GPs are way better than the AMA series. This isn't an U.S. riders verse the world battle, but a battle of the series and which series is the premier one in the world. We can all I am sure that for the last 20 years it has been the AMA series. But I along with many people would say that the GPs have closed the gap and are just a few big name stars away from maybe taking the title back. However, I don't see how anyone can claim that they have done that yet. To many top of there game Euros are still coming to the AMA while no, and I mean no top level Americans are going to Europe or have gone to Europe recently. Osborne, the most recent, could hardly be considered a top tear AMA racer based on his results in the states. A good rider yes, but a championship contender, no way.
Lets just compare some of these riders who currently ride on each side of the pond.
AMA in order of speed/ability/results/championships/wins all subjective or course.
(Some may only ride select rounds)
Stewart
Reed
RV
Alessi
Townley
Dungey
Ferry
Short
Tedesco
Langston
Millsaps
Stroupe
Metcalf
C. Pourcel
Josh Grant
Lawrance
Cooper
McFarland
Wey
World Fim MX
Rattray
Searle
Cariol
De Dycker
Ramon
S Pourcel
De ruver
Coppins
Nagl
Barragan
Mackenzie
Phillipaerts
Leok
Goncalves
Simpson
Aubin
Ok so we have at least 6 guys that could on any day beat your top guys in MX1 and you have no one that can beat our top guy.
We have two guys that could beat your top MX2 guys and you have no one that could beat our top guy. (he has won 5 of 6 races against your top at the last two mxdn.)
When we look at those list it is possible that if all those racers lined up together the top 6-8 could be AMA riders. That can't be said of the FIM guys. So which series still has the best and fastest racers, the AMA of course. But the FIM is getting deeper and as it does the speed of their riders will improve as it currently is and real soon these series may be even.
Lets just compare some of these riders who currently ride on each side of the pond.
AMA in order of speed/ability/results/championships/wins all subjective or course.
(Some may only ride select rounds)
Stewart
Reed
RV
Alessi
Townley
Dungey
Ferry
Short
Tedesco
Langston
Millsaps
Stroupe
Metcalf
C. Pourcel
Josh Grant
Lawrance
Cooper
McFarland
Wey
World Fim MX
Rattray
Searle
Cariol
De Dycker
Ramon
S Pourcel
De ruver
Coppins
Nagl
Barragan
Mackenzie
Phillipaerts
Leok
Goncalves
Simpson
Aubin
Ok so we have at least 6 guys that could on any day beat your top guys in MX1 and you have no one that can beat our top guy.
We have two guys that could beat your top MX2 guys and you have no one that could beat our top guy. (he has won 5 of 6 races against your top at the last two mxdn.)
When we look at those list it is possible that if all those racers lined up together the top 6-8 could be AMA riders. That can't be said of the FIM guys. So which series still has the best and fastest racers, the AMA of course. But the FIM is getting deeper and as it does the speed of their riders will improve as it currently is and real soon these series may be even.
Taking the former GP guys out of your AMA - which shows how strong GPs are the riders populate a quarter of ur top 20 ! and easily still have over 20 fantastic riders currently in GP! their isn't to many US riders who could challenge for a world mx title right now bar bubba Rv and maybe Dungey.
And don't forget guys like Frossard, Musquin and Desalle. On the other had Nico Izzi should also be on this list.
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I do agree the AMA is the premier series, I would like to see the guys from both series mix it up more often. Let's be honest though, I can't think of one sport that is played world wide that Americans follow. When a world championship type of event is going on your talking different languages, the time difference factor.
I dont want to come off as ignorant , or close minded, I used to Tivo the GP's whenever they were aired , cause I love MX. It just seems they will always remain two diff series, with equal importance ,and the MxoN is the cool race where we come together and all have a great time, and a great race.
It also seems like since the 70's, early 80's the only riders that export out of here are mediocre at best. In the last few yrs Brown, Mills, and now Osbourne, come to mind. Where as the AMA series has some of the top contenders of the GP's heading over like Townley.
(Who on a side note , I really wish would heal up and show what he is capable of for a whole series.)
Is it possible that injuries over the last 2 seasons has really made it seem like the speed is comparable? Look at who we lost in SX and MX combined, its staggering.
Just like the British, Begian, French etc Predominantly home grown talent with a few imports.
For that reason the F.I.M World Championship will always be the premier series - it has way more history and prestige than the AMA nationals will ever have.
The reason that the F.I.M World Championship series lost riders to the US is purely down to the AMA Supercross Championships and the lure of big time salaries and exposure. I think if anybody in here thinks it's cause they want to ride the Outdoor nationals you're all kidding yourself. Hell, your US riders don't even want to ride outdoors anymore.
The AMA Nationals are surviving purely because it gives the chance for a rider who lawn darts himself during supercross to redeem himself that season......
Hi to all the STFU Noobie squad :o)
However, does having Stewart and Villopoto make that series the Premier? I beg to differ.
It's all about exciting racing and that only comes with depth of talent. The nationals just do not have that - every race is a procession whereas the both MX1 and MX2 championships have had multiple GP winners and nailbiting races. For me that swhat makes a series.
I'm not US bashing - the AMA have the premier odd road series in the Supercross chamionship.
However, the premier MOTOCROSS series belongs to the F.I.M World Championship.
Last three years has only seen Pourcel move over to the US and McFarlane. And next year Searle. I think no MX1 rider will make the move now they focus too much on MX and not SX. A guy like Seb Pourcel use to do a lot of SX and thought about going to the US to race SX. But think he just realised he's already old and better off staying in the GP and avoiding SX. Only the best MX2 rider with a good SX record (Paulin and Musquin for example) will move to the US. I've never seen Searle in a SX so quite scared for him! French riders are still quite into SX so might see more of them.
US tracks (not facilities) are still the best hands down!
The reason for which most American riders don't even consider racing in the World Championship is the same for their Country is losing its edge: they have become complacent and afraid (as opposed to interested/ curious) of what is outside the US. Remember when Windham refused to go the MXdN in 2001 because afraid of terrorism or when this year he invited Reed to go back to Australia? Experiencing life abroad makes you a stronger person, hence a better rider: look at those American riders [Brown, Button, Hamblin (Go Hambone!!!), Hughes, Vohland] who went to Europe to revamp their career and came back to the US stronger and faster than when they left!
Why no promoter organizes a 4 events series (1 races in Australia, 1 in North America, 1 in Europe and 1 in Japan) and have the best 2 riders for manufacturer in each series (1rider for the Japanese series) compete for the title of Master of Motocross or something like that?
Ok, well don't bring it up anymore. Problem solved.
Pit Row
Show them what you got at Southwick.
When the best in the world all go to one series, doesn't that prove the point.
Everyone comes to the NBA to play basketball, it is the premier league, yet it is only a national one.
And yes I left off a couple on both list! Not on purpose of course.
Hopefully Marc kicks ass at Southwick, would be nice to see someone push Stewey for once. I think we all love good racing and don't care where the riders come from. But you got to give respect where respect is due. The AMA nationals might not be what they were a few years ago, but they are far from dead horse some of you Euros think they are!!
Also, I think the top World Championship riders are more down to earth than the majority of the top American riders. Watch on Freecaster.tv the interviews to Coppins, de Reuver, Ramon and Philappaerts, just to name a few: they come across as real people and you get very frank opinions, especially from Coppins.
Yeah Gio, but you aren't one of the guys slagging off the GP riders, as you say you have attended both, like myself, so you are more realistic in your posts, you are not just coming on and saying Americans are the fastest riders blah blah, you are seeing both the good and bad in both, like me.
I don't think any one rider could come from the US and dominate and that includes Stewart, maybe in a one race shot yes, but over the season no, and the same goes for any Gp guys going over to the US.
Some guys go on about the culture changes for US riders coming here, the change of food, language, etc, and that's why guys that come here don't do to well but, they seem to forget the GP guys are also doing that, they are all going to different countries every week with different food, culture, language, Coppins is from NZ, Rattray from SA, guys from Spain, Italy, UK, all basing themselves in places like Belgium, and Holland. Coppins splits his time between Belgium, and Italy, to completely different countries with different food, language, culture.
I think a good example of the GP talent depth is Steve Boniface, regular top 10 every weekend maybe top 5 but can't seem to crack the top 10 in GP's on a full factory bike. If the depth of talent is not as good in Europe as it is in the US, why is he not running a lot higher than he is.
My honest opinion is that the GP and US riders are like for like, but if a top GP rider went to the US they would not beat JS anywhere on home ground, but if Stewart, done a season in GP he would not dominate the way he does at home.
A series that doesn't attract its best local riders (stewart, reed, windham, MC and all the guys who have /had/will have SX only deals) is the serie slowly dying!!!
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