Mad as hell (LL Class structure)

MotoX85 wrote:

District or local should be age as of Jan 1st.........ALL nationals should be day of EVENT...Day of EVENT. This would give everyone a certain advantage/disadvatage at...

District or local should be age as of Jan 1st.........ALL nationals should be day of EVENT...Day of EVENT. This would give everyone a certain advantage/disadvatage at certain Nationals since they are spaced out pretty well, Spring classics, Ponca, LL in summer, Branson in Fall and Mini O's in winter (ish).

My kid started racing at 7, 1 yr in 50 sr then to 65.

Now he is on 85 going into last year of 85 Jr (next year) He will still be in 5th grade until June racing against potential 7th graders. This is unfair and NO OTHER sport does this.

Next year when he has to move up to SR, he will be in 6TH GRADE competing against potential Sophmores in High School. Show me another sport that does that.............NONE!!!!!!!!!!!

NATIONALS, day of EVENT.

We are nothing more than gate fillers at the national level but would really like to hit more if we didn't arrive with a huge disadvatage.

SlowOldGuy wrote:

I don't really disagree with day of the event, but it poses some challenges. First of all, there are 4 different sanctioning bodies sanctioning the Spring...

I don't really disagree with day of the event, but it poses some challenges. First of all, there are 4 different sanctioning bodies sanctioning the Spring, summer, and fall amateur nationals, 5 if you count the Dodge. Getting the to all agree on ages and dates is impossible. Second, LLs and qualifiers start on Feb 18th and and run through the first week in August. So say you have a kid who is small, a great 65 rider, and turns 12 in May. That kid could ride the 65 at the spring nationals, qualify for regionals on a 65, but then would have to move up for the National.

All sports have a cut off date for age and typically it is the start of the season. My daughter plays U13 travel soccer and their cut off date for a season that runs through May was back on Aug 31st.

I could be sold on the age date for LLs being the date of the first qualifier, but does that extra 48 days mean that much? Many district race seasons start the first week in January. I don't see the system as being broken.

As for the 50 Senior class, the funny thing is that in a 12-15 Senior Mini class, the kids winning are almost always 12 or 13. The really good 14 and 15 year olds, for the most part, have already left the class for bigger bikes. LLs made their senior 85 class 12-14 (it used to be 12-13) two years ago. Only one out of the four winners was 14. 2 were 13 and 1 was 12. At LLs this year only 5 of the top 20 85 (top 10 in each class) riders was 14, the rest were 12-13. The large age group, despite appearances, just doesn't prove to be much of a disadvantage for the younger kids.

MotoX85 wrote:

No necessarily broken, just always unfair for AMA nationals. NMA events are already "Day of Event". Just make them all "day of event" and then plan...

No necessarily broken, just always unfair for AMA nationals. NMA events are already "Day of Event". Just make them all "day of event" and then plan accordingly.

partialperson wrote:

So a Kid that has been racing competitively since he was 4,and is 6, had all the financial support in the world and was born on...

So a Kid that has been racing competitively since he was 4,and is 6, had all the financial support in the world and was born on December 31 is at a greater disadvantage than the kid who got a piece of crap bike for Christmas and makes his 1st LL's the next August whose birthday fell on January 2 of the same year turning 7 ????? Live with the Damn age group rule, it's not as flawed as you make it, it is in every organized child sport other than school sports. Wrestling does have an age break at the highest levels in Jr High though.

Mspicer wrote:

There is some scientific evidence that suggest that birthdays at the amateur level in any sport does make a difference according to Matthew Syed's, "Bounce" and...

There is some scientific evidence that suggest that birthdays at the amateur level in any sport does make a difference according to Matthew Syed's, "Bounce" and Malcolm Gladwell's Outliers. Canadian hockey parents even plan there kids birthdays after the cutoff date so they get an extra year in each division. The same argument can be made for mini riders. But, it will even out once they get to a certain level like the Pro's.

knowitalloveragainnovice wrote:

Should i enroll my 6 year old kid in third grade because they stickered a gold star to his spelling test? Does the education system see...

Should i enroll my 6 year old kid in third grade because they stickered a gold star to his spelling test?

Does the education system see 1st and third graders " the same"

Mx sports will race them as equals.....same for fourth and sixth graders.......and none of 'em will ever be eligible for the c class at ll's when they get on big bikes.

JustMX wrote:

Wow, What a great comparison......Education is just like Motocross...... I guess you missed the day they talked about reality......... Oh, but everything would be just peachy...

Wow,

What a great comparison......Education is just like Motocross......

I guess you missed the day they talked about reality.........

Oh, but everything would be just peachy if they would move the age date to March 1 instead of January 1, right?

7 years, two months vs. 7 years 7 months...I guess that 5 months makes ALL the difference in the unicorn and rainbow world of fairness and happiness you seem to live in.

Hey, just curious there Ghandi, what month was your kid born?

It looks to me like if you didn't want your kid to be at such a disadvantage you should have bought that bottle of thunderbird and Barry White cassette a couple months earlier.

Take a little responsibility for your poor planning. I mean, this rule was probably already in place before you got your freak on.

Switch wrote:

[b]"7 years, two months vs. 7 years 7 months...I guess that 5 months makes ALL the difference in the unicorn and rainbow world of fairness and...

"7 years, two months vs. 7 years 7 months...I guess that 5 months makes ALL the difference in the unicorn and rainbow world of fairness and happiness you seem to live in."

The entire post was fucking awesome, but this line speaks the truth. At the end of the day, you can't please everyone.

partialperson wrote:

The whole age group thing can be argued either way. My son moved to a 125 in the middle of his season as a 12 year...

The whole age group thing can be argued either way. My son moved to a 125 in the middle of his season as a 12 year old 85 rider, only one year on a 60 at 9. I had friends whose kids were able to age out in the 80 class and the 60 class. I never really put much stock in worrying about the benefits of age as it never really applied in my case. Of course, I never took this racing thing seriously anyway after watching my father go through 100's of 1,000's racing on dirt. It's a moneypit and meant to be for fun, so sweating the small stuff...eh!

JustMX wrote:

Wow, What a great comparison......Education is just like Motocross...... I guess you missed the day they talked about reality......... Oh, but everything would be just peachy...

Wow,

What a great comparison......Education is just like Motocross......

I guess you missed the day they talked about reality.........

Oh, but everything would be just peachy if they would move the age date to March 1 instead of January 1, right?

7 years, two months vs. 7 years 7 months...I guess that 5 months makes ALL the difference in the unicorn and rainbow world of fairness and happiness you seem to live in.

Hey, just curious there Ghandi, what month was your kid born?

It looks to me like if you didn't want your kid to be at such a disadvantage you should have bought that bottle of thunderbird and Barry White cassette a couple months earlier.

Take a little responsibility for your poor planning. I mean, this rule was probably already in place before you got your freak on.

Switch wrote:

[b]"7 years, two months vs. 7 years 7 months...I guess that 5 months makes ALL the difference in the unicorn and rainbow world of fairness and...

"7 years, two months vs. 7 years 7 months...I guess that 5 months makes ALL the difference in the unicorn and rainbow world of fairness and happiness you seem to live in."

The entire post was fucking awesome, but this line speaks the truth. At the end of the day, you can't please everyone.

knowitalloveragainnovice wrote:

You are discussing these 5 months among SEVEN year olds racing in the 4-6 class......... ....Can you be any more stupid? Afugen Amazin~! Do you need...

You are discussing these 5 months among SEVEN year olds racing in the 4-6 class.........

....Can you be any more stupid? Afugen Amazin~!

Do you need a math lesson?

Switch wrote:

[b]"7 years, two months vs. 7 years 7 months...I guess that 5 months makes ALL the difference in the unicorn and rainbow world of fairness and...

"7 years, two months vs. 7 years 7 months...I guess that 5 months makes ALL the difference in the unicorn and rainbow world of fairness and happiness you seem to live in."

The entire post was fucking awesome, but this line speaks the truth. At the end of the day, you can't please everyone.

knowitalloveragainnovice wrote:

You are discussing these 5 months among SEVEN year olds racing in the 4-6 class......... ....Can you be any more stupid? Afugen Amazin~! Do you need...

You are discussing these 5 months among SEVEN year olds racing in the 4-6 class.........

....Can you be any more stupid? Afugen Amazin~!

Do you need a math lesson?

Switch wrote:

It doesn't matter how you set it up, there will always be somewhat of an overlap because of the MONTHS that it takes to qualify for...

It doesn't matter how you set it up, there will always be somewhat of an overlap because of the MONTHS that it takes to qualify for LL. Sounds like your kid fell on the shitty end of it... or was he one of the other 41 riders in the 4-6 class that got SMOKED by Ryder Defrancessco (sp?)....who was FIVE YEARS OLD this year. Where were all those 7 year olds you are bitching about again?

And actually, it would be a-fuggin-mazing.

knowitalloveragainnovice wrote:

You are discussing these 5 months among SEVEN year olds racing in the 4-6 class......... ....Can you be any more stupid? Afugen Amazin~! Do you need...

You are discussing these 5 months among SEVEN year olds racing in the 4-6 class.........

....Can you be any more stupid? Afugen Amazin~!

Do you need a math lesson?

Switch wrote:

It doesn't matter how you set it up, there will always be somewhat of an overlap because of the MONTHS that it takes to qualify for...

It doesn't matter how you set it up, there will always be somewhat of an overlap because of the MONTHS that it takes to qualify for LL. Sounds like your kid fell on the shitty end of it... or was he one of the other 41 riders in the 4-6 class that got SMOKED by Ryder Defrancessco (sp?)....who was FIVE YEARS OLD this year. Where were all those 7 year olds you are bitching about again?

And actually, it would be a-fuggin-mazing.

knowitalloveragainnovice wrote:

Ryder is an amazing kid and rider, but he turned 6 in march making him " AMA 5" He will be eligible to race the class...

Ryder is an amazing kid and rider, but he turned 6 in march making him " AMA 5"

He will be eligible to race the class next year as a 7 year old as there is no rule requiring him to move out of the class.

Please come back for the debate later when you get your facts straight and don't waste our time telling us about james stewart being born in december.

knowitalloveragainnovice wrote:

You are discussing these 5 months among SEVEN year olds racing in the 4-6 class......... ....Can you be any more stupid? Afugen Amazin~! Do you need...

You are discussing these 5 months among SEVEN year olds racing in the 4-6 class.........

....Can you be any more stupid? Afugen Amazin~!

Do you need a math lesson?

Switch wrote:

It doesn't matter how you set it up, there will always be somewhat of an overlap because of the MONTHS that it takes to qualify for...

It doesn't matter how you set it up, there will always be somewhat of an overlap because of the MONTHS that it takes to qualify for LL. Sounds like your kid fell on the shitty end of it... or was he one of the other 41 riders in the 4-6 class that got SMOKED by Ryder Defrancessco (sp?)....who was FIVE YEARS OLD this year. Where were all those 7 year olds you are bitching about again?

And actually, it would be a-fuggin-mazing.

knowitalloveragainnovice wrote:

Ryder is an amazing kid and rider, but he turned 6 in march making him " AMA 5" He will be eligible to race the class...

Ryder is an amazing kid and rider, but he turned 6 in march making him " AMA 5"

He will be eligible to race the class next year as a 7 year old as there is no rule requiring him to move out of the class.

Please come back for the debate later when you get your facts straight and don't waste our time telling us about james stewart being born in december.