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The consumer never really even had a choice to "speak with their wallet" as the market was artificially skewed by a number of factors that combined to form a perfect and vicious circle.
- Rules were changed to clearly favor 4s over 2s.
- Almost immediately all Pro and amateur teams switched to 4s. Most likely there was zero support $$ to carry on as a 2s team.
- Mfgr. development was dropped from 2s altogether and put into 4s. ( KTM the lone exception )
- Within a short period 3 of the big 4 dropped their 2s ( big bike ) line altogether ( in the USA).
- Yamaha, the lone exception of the big four, has made only token changes for the last 5 years, yet has continued to raise the price year to year.
- The Big Four have clearly pushed all their advertising $$ into their 4s line ... and probably see the 2s line as, at best, a minor nuisance to their 4s sales figures.
Now, against all of that .... a totally skewed and manipulated market place ... you want to claim the consumer spoke? The fact is, the consumer was herded into the 4s world like so many sheep. You may like a 2s or a 4s but the market place you made your choice in was a completely artificial one created by the mfgrs ... and the AMA.
The fact that there are ANY 2s bikes still offered is a testament to the demand that is still out there. Unfortunately, the choice, with the exception of a few small Euro brands, has been whittled down to KTM .... and the aging YZ250. Both of which sell out almost immediately each year.
This is the type of response that confirms to many that you are "out of touch" with the fan base of the sport.
Have you seperated yourself so much that you are that out of touch?
You need to hear what is being said and set aside your own personal biases.
That is what a "reporter" does - He listens to both side foregoing his own personal opinions and reports them.
Have you done so with all the post regarding 2 strokes?
No, you've only pushed back..
Thus, your credibility is in question.
Is your job to report what the factories want or to give the fans what they want to see/hear?
Based on your replies, it seems you are not listening to a significant percentage of the fan base/market.
The OEM's have basically said, here's your 4-strokes, weather you like them or not. Don't want one?.......too bad.
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Consumers had a choice and have a choice. Consumers bought four strokes while both were being made. Consumers can buy two strokes now. That's a fact.
But if some or all of the OEM's concluded that they were bound and determined to switch over away from two strokes, and the dynamics of what people spend their money on won't change that, nothing else will force them to make bikes they aren't making now.
Now, 5-6 years later with a dying economy we are wanting to go back to the 2 stroke but there aren't any left except the old Yamaha and the KTM.
4 strokes can survive with 2 strokes. 2 strokes need equal footing on the track.
Too many have said over and over agiain that the cost to participate is a significant factor.
The general public needs options to consider participation and that opyion is a fairly matched 2 stroke.
This also applied to the local Pro that wins everything in site and attempts the closest AMA National. He can make an attempt without blowing his budget for the remainder of his local efforts.
Too many are forgetting that local racing/riding supports the pro efforts... Without them. our sport is doomed...
Eric Gorr's 2 stroke business is blowing up...
Why?
The local trail rider doesn't go to Gorr for a big bore kit, a re-sleeve, or port job, etc... It is the local racer...
Also, you are correct, comsumers did go out and buy 4-strokes in droves after being told that 4-strokes were the best thing since sliced bread by all the mags. Then they see all their favorite riders racing them, so again, they thought to themselves, self I gotta get me one of them there 4-strokes.
It's all marketing and the OEM's know the MX community are sheep and tend to be copy cat followers. The plan has worked so far. Are 4-strokes easier to ride and race, yes they are. Are they the best bike for everyone, absolutely not. Low cost maintenance and being simple to maintain are big factors when it comes to the average joe.
BUT, until the MX media is willing to report on the fan base/privateer opinion, nothing will happen.
Why are they scared to have an interview with the OEMs about all the activity about 2 strokes?
This has been beaten to death recently and not one has broached the subject with an OEM.
This is the "off season" and the perfect time to get some answers and positions.
Why hasn't DC, Swap, Matthes, Nerd and others had an interview asking the OEMs about all the message boards and the discussions about 2 strokes?
Because it will ruffle feathers.
Which one will "man up" first to broach the subject? Let's see...
Then, we'll see who the tag alongs are who will then start asking the same questions...
Anyone willing to bet who will address the topic with the OEMs first?
I think the mags need to step up like they did when they touted the 4-strokes as the end all be all. OEM's tend to listen to mags, at least they used too. I commend MXA for doing so, even if they once were on the bandwagon helping to sway our opinions the opposite direction.
I road raced for a year and the biggest difference for me was tires, $400 set of slicks sucks. It sucks even more if you are racing a 600cc bike or up and need sets of tires every race weekend...ouch.
Do people really believe that instituting a rule that purportedly is going to benefit maybe 50 guys who want to be pro but are not good enough to get support is going to the change the OEM production decision? And do it when some of those companies have already looked at the far larger, unrestricted non-pro market and stopped making that particular type of bike? Even though, as some contend, people were clamoring for two strokes throughout the entire period?
I love two strokes. I have owned them and will own them. Hope they keep making them and the others who stopped start making them again
Some of you are falling into the trap of thinking that if you like something or it matters a lot to you, most people feel the same way. Some of your assumptions about the prevailing mood of the fan base are pure speculation.
Like Matthes said, why does this have to be about right/wrong? See them for what they are, and move on.
You guys want a sticker that says "2-strokes are awesome" or something? Will that settle all of this?
Hmmm, You state you're a 2 stroke fan. But EVERY reply by you to a 2 stroke post has been to shoot down the respective argument. As smart as you are, I don't get where you are coming from.
If your position is indeed true, help guide the misguided efforts by myself and many others rather than shoot holes into the current efforts.
Thanks!
Pit Row
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Matthes, Nerd, Swap, DC... What do you think?
Anyone media?
Pros depend on amatures....
1. the mags need to step up and give equal time and space to the 2-strokes
2. the AMA needs to change the rules to equal the playing field.
Then and only then, will there be choice and parity between the bikes. Those two entities created this mess, they can reverse it as well.
Choice and an even playing field is all anyone is asking for here.
I'm rational. I know what it costs businesses to make significant production changes, in any economy let alone this one. If people can't come to grips with that dynamic, and stick to resorting to some of the crazy ideas that get vetted in these and the sheer lack of focus on what solution people actually want, then you are the biggest part of the problem whether you like two strokes or not.
I am in a business that brought back a product demanded by the public.
We were and are responsive to VOC.
My point is why are so many convinced that the Jap OEMsare unwilling to resond to current VOC?
I believe it is because the replies are based on speculation rather than real world VOC.
I don't think I ever said or implied that you "Liking two strokes means I have to believe there's a conspiracy and deny that most consumers willingly and joyfully bought four strokes and abandoned two strokes when all companies were still making them? "
I deal in a business that daily determines what production levels are required to meet demand.
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