Does KTM bike still have more trouble ?

835
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835 9/7/2011 6:34am
9/7/2011 6:34am
It is my understanding that the new Ethanol Fuel is allot of the problem. The ethanol gas seperates and gums up much quicker. So if your not riding everyday it starts to be and issue. My local shop sells stabilizer to combate the issue. Allot of guys I know just started running straight race fuel and have had no more issues. The problem is more ponounced on street bikes as they sit around more. Then shop said they've cleaned more fuel systems than ever before.

Is Europe doing the Ethanol thing? I saw in an earlier post you were having similar issues.
500guy
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500guy 9/7/2011 6:58am
9/7/2011 6:58am
835 wrote:
It is my understanding that the new Ethanol Fuel is allot of the problem. The ethanol gas seperates and gums up much quicker. So if your...
It is my understanding that the new Ethanol Fuel is allot of the problem. The ethanol gas seperates and gums up much quicker. So if your not riding everyday it starts to be and issue. My local shop sells stabilizer to combate the issue. Allot of guys I know just started running straight race fuel and have had no more issues. The problem is more ponounced on street bikes as they sit around more. Then shop said they've cleaned more fuel systems than ever before.

Is Europe doing the Ethanol thing? I saw in an earlier post you were having similar issues.
if that were true Fuel injectors in Cars would be plugging up after a week, We are talking about failures on bikes that sit less than a few days.

This is not a fuel issue as much as a design or material flaw.
Wetterstrand 9/7/2011 12:50pm
9/7/2011 12:50pm
835 wrote:
It is my understanding that the new Ethanol Fuel is allot of the problem. The ethanol gas seperates and gums up much quicker. So if your...
It is my understanding that the new Ethanol Fuel is allot of the problem. The ethanol gas seperates and gums up much quicker. So if your not riding everyday it starts to be and issue. My local shop sells stabilizer to combate the issue. Allot of guys I know just started running straight race fuel and have had no more issues. The problem is more ponounced on street bikes as they sit around more. Then shop said they've cleaned more fuel systems than ever before.

Is Europe doing the Ethanol thing? I saw in an earlier post you were having similar issues.
500guy wrote:
if that were true Fuel injectors in Cars would be plugging up after a week, We are talking about failures on bikes that sit less than...
if that were true Fuel injectors in Cars would be plugging up after a week, We are talking about failures on bikes that sit less than a few days.

This is not a fuel issue as much as a design or material flaw.
Yes we have the same thing with ethanol in our fuel.

And there are theories that the fuel has been reacting with KTMs plastictanks wich have clogged the injectors.
EastFlorida
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EastFlorida 9/7/2011 1:04pm
9/7/2011 1:04pm Edited Date/Time 9/7/2011 1:04pm
ethanol is a joke! It causes all kinds of problems and jacks our food prices higher. This was a bill of goods sold to the public without proper disclosure. Nothing good comes from ethanol...except for padding some SIG pockets

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Two Stroke
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Two Stroke 9/7/2011 2:10pm
9/7/2011 2:10pm
KTM will pay all of any recall costs as will any manufacturer. The dealer may not get what he thinks he deserves but it is his problem if he can't fix it in the amount of time allocated. If they don't want to do it at no cost to you call KTM first and explain. If that doesn't work call the feds. There should be a phone number on your recall notice. A recall is very serious and if a dealer or manufacturer fails to perform the work at no charge to the customer they will be in serious trouble.
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FastEddy 9/7/2011 2:20pm
9/7/2011 2:20pm
835 wrote:
It is my understanding that the new Ethanol Fuel is allot of the problem. The ethanol gas seperates and gums up much quicker. So if your...
It is my understanding that the new Ethanol Fuel is allot of the problem. The ethanol gas seperates and gums up much quicker. So if your not riding everyday it starts to be and issue. My local shop sells stabilizer to combate the issue. Allot of guys I know just started running straight race fuel and have had no more issues. The problem is more ponounced on street bikes as they sit around more. Then shop said they've cleaned more fuel systems than ever before.

Is Europe doing the Ethanol thing? I saw in an earlier post you were having similar issues.
500guy wrote:
if that were true Fuel injectors in Cars would be plugging up after a week, We are talking about failures on bikes that sit less than...
if that were true Fuel injectors in Cars would be plugging up after a week, We are talking about failures on bikes that sit less than a few days.

This is not a fuel issue as much as a design or material flaw.
Here is my experience with using Ethanol fuel...
I have ran both Non-Ethanol Fuel & regular pump fuel in my boats (outboards) over the past few years or so.
What I found is with regular cheap pump fuel that contains Ethanol is that the bowl on my water & fuel separators tends
to collect quite a bit more water in a short period of time then with the Non-Ethanol more spendy fuels I buy at marinas.
This on both 4stroke outboards & 2smokers.
However,I have never had any problems on my carb motors or any on my EFI motors over the years with injectors & carbs becoming gummed.
And no I was never sold on the stabiliser....always thought it was bullshit.
I just throw a couple bottles of 109 in the tank and I'm good to go.
500guy
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500guy 9/7/2011 2:21pm
9/7/2011 2:21pm
Two Stroke wrote:
KTM will pay all of any recall costs as will any manufacturer. The dealer may not get what he thinks he deserves but it is his...
KTM will pay all of any recall costs as will any manufacturer. The dealer may not get what he thinks he deserves but it is his problem if he can't fix it in the amount of time allocated. If they don't want to do it at no cost to you call KTM first and explain. If that doesn't work call the feds. There should be a phone number on your recall notice. A recall is very serious and if a dealer or manufacturer fails to perform the work at no charge to the customer they will be in serious trouble.
That is good info right here folks


You are welcome for this thread!
Faceaz
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Faceaz 9/7/2011 5:15pm
9/7/2011 5:15pm Edited Date/Time 9/7/2011 5:25pm
CamP wrote:
That's all fine and dandy until you enter your local race and there are only three people on the line with you because the bikes have...
That's all fine and dandy until you enter your local race and there are only three people on the line with you because the bikes have gotten stupid expensive. What's really sad is that our local vintage club gets better turnouts than the regular races.
Mod Killer wrote:
agreed. but it doesnt make EFI overrated or steel frames better than aluminum when talking performance. we all know, whats best for a participant driven sport...
agreed.


but it doesnt make EFI overrated or steel frames better than aluminum when talking performance. we all know, whats best for a participant driven sport aint necessarily good for performance of bikes and vice-versa.

i think that is maybe the big disconnect in the whole efi/carb/steel/aluminum/2stroke/thumper debate. some are arguing practicality while the others are arguing performance. its two totally different discussions but since the same parties are involved, people confuse the two and the debate rages on.


Faceaz, you have mail.
Where do you go to see it? I've been searching all over my profile & can't find a Private Message area. I think I have a few in there too.

Thanks,

PS. Nevermind, finally figured it out.
machine
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machine 9/7/2011 5:49pm
9/7/2011 5:49pm
835 wrote:
It is my understanding that the new Ethanol Fuel is allot of the problem. The ethanol gas seperates and gums up much quicker. So if your...
It is my understanding that the new Ethanol Fuel is allot of the problem. The ethanol gas seperates and gums up much quicker. So if your not riding everyday it starts to be and issue. My local shop sells stabilizer to combate the issue. Allot of guys I know just started running straight race fuel and have had no more issues. The problem is more ponounced on street bikes as they sit around more. Then shop said they've cleaned more fuel systems than ever before.

Is Europe doing the Ethanol thing? I saw in an earlier post you were having similar issues.
500guy wrote:
if that were true Fuel injectors in Cars would be plugging up after a week, We are talking about failures on bikes that sit less than...
if that were true Fuel injectors in Cars would be plugging up after a week, We are talking about failures on bikes that sit less than a few days.

This is not a fuel issue as much as a design or material flaw.
FastEddy wrote:
Here is my experience with using Ethanol fuel... I have ran both Non-Ethanol Fuel & regular pump fuel in my boats (outboards) over the past few...
Here is my experience with using Ethanol fuel...
I have ran both Non-Ethanol Fuel & regular pump fuel in my boats (outboards) over the past few years or so.
What I found is with regular cheap pump fuel that contains Ethanol is that the bowl on my water & fuel separators tends
to collect quite a bit more water in a short period of time then with the Non-Ethanol more spendy fuels I buy at marinas.
This on both 4stroke outboards & 2smokers.
However,I have never had any problems on my carb motors or any on my EFI motors over the years with injectors & carbs becoming gummed.
And no I was never sold on the stabiliser....always thought it was bullshit.
I just throw a couple bottles of 109 in the tank and I'm good to go.
Eddy, be careful using ethanol fuel in your boat. My buddy who owns a boat repair shop replaces fuel pumps all the time that fail due to ethanol fuel. I have seen this first hand.
Suns_PSD
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Suns_PSD 9/8/2011 9:57am
9/8/2011 9:57am
Mod Killer wrote:
different day.....same ignorant argument. EFI at the pro level, is better. the pro's hated it at first, because it smoothed out the "hit". but there are...
different day.....same ignorant argument.



EFI at the pro level, is better. the pro's hated it at first, because it smoothed out the "hit". but there are major advantages to EFI. major advantages!

and for the average rider, not having to tune a carb is awesome and is easy to market.


fuck. its the same stupid argument over the steel vs aluminum frames. motogp bikes are aluminum....and they do it for a reason. i understand the advantages to steel, y'all dont need to list them. but do you understand the advantages to aluminum? obviously not.

same goes for EFI. just cause you are unaware of its benefits, doesnt mean there isnt any. its not just about fancy marketing and higher retail sales figures. i understand that plays a factor but if steel frames or carb's were really better, you'd see them in F1 and MGP.


some of you guys need to face the fact that there are people waaay smarter than you, building these bikes.
The chassis loads and feel transmitted into a MotoGP chassis thru sticky as hell racing slicks, ridden by the best riders in the world at the limit are far beyond what is desirable on an MX bike.

To claim that because they use aluminum frames in MotoGP so it must be good for a dirt bike is just silly.

Maybe we should mount up some tubeless 3 spoke magnesium wheels w/ 130mm front tires and dual 220mm carbon fiber discs on our dirt bikes? After all they use it in MotoGP.
seth505
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seth505 9/8/2011 10:14am
9/8/2011 10:14am
CamP wrote:
FI does not produce more power than a carb. In fact, the production bikes lost top end horsepower when they transitioned to FI.
500guy wrote:
What happened and what should happen is not my problem, Stay stuck in the past, I don't give a shit
bahahaa. So which is it, FI makes more power as a fact or FI makes more power in theory (in your head)??

I'm thinking option 2
Madmax31
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Madmax31 9/8/2011 10:22am
9/8/2011 10:22am
I still think FI is stupid! Why would you want to add the headaches? Sure a mechanic may have to adjust a carb slightly from track to track...big deal. Waste of money and just another thing to cause a headache.
CamP
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CamP 9/8/2011 12:19pm
9/8/2011 12:19pm Edited Date/Time 9/8/2011 12:19pm
Madmax31 wrote:
I still think FI is stupid! Why would you want to add the headaches? Sure a mechanic may have to adjust a carb slightly from track...
I still think FI is stupid! Why would you want to add the headaches? Sure a mechanic may have to adjust a carb slightly from track to track...big deal. Waste of money and just another thing to cause a headache.
That reminds me of a quote from a famous Corvette engineer. "Parts left out don't break".
Ing
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Ing 9/8/2011 12:23pm
9/8/2011 12:23pm
Mod Killer wrote:
they arent obsolete...yet. and steel may never be, for the average rider or during a shootout on brand new bikes. Yamaha's aluminum frame takes 8 hours...
they arent obsolete...yet.

and steel may never be, for the average rider or during a shootout on brand new bikes.

Yamaha's aluminum frame takes 8 hours to break in and then begin to handle the way it is intended too. I highly doubt MXA puts 8 hours on their Yamaha 450s before testing them up against the 450sx.

And I highly doubt that any of the MXA test riders are good enough to notice the changes in handling characteristics as the KTM's steel frame begins to wear down and loose its rigidity over time. Meanwhile, the aluminum frame holds its characteristics longer. (of course until it cracks without warning)

Hell, the aluminum chassis of MGP are still a work in progress. And so will it be the case for MX from here on out.

And when showroom bikes start coming equipped with traction control.....well by then even the two strokes will have direct injection. TC is coming. its on showroom sportbikes. and it will one day be on showroom mx bikes. i give it less than 5 years.


then maybe we will start seeing race teams with electronically controlled suspension.
Aluminum frame takes 8hrs. to break-in? Where did you get this bit of info at. Source please. You keep comparing Moto-GP to MX and I really don't see a comparison. You do know moto-gp is run on asphalt right? How do the moto-gp boys break in their frames. LOL. Comical
Mod Killer
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Mod Killer 9/8/2011 12:39pm
9/8/2011 12:39pm Edited Date/Time 9/8/2011 12:51pm
source please? ha!

i dont have to give my source. youre not the gestapo and im not under oath. if you dont find me credible, so be it, it doesnt bother me.

but its a fact...the yamaha takes 8 hrs to break in and begin handling as intended.


i dont know if any of the other OEM frames are this way and if they are, what their break-in period is. i dont know if mgp frames have a break-in period either. but i do know that they are allowed to run what they feel is going to give them an advantage. materials like aluminum and carbon fiber are lighter and stiffer, but more importantly theyre easier to manipulate so as to create flex points that just arent possible with steel. its why mgp uses aluminum, and why i brought them into the discussion. aluminum has performance advantages in mx as well. just cause some here cant see them doesnt mean they dont exist. its not just some marketing gimmick. same goes with EFI....which is the original topic i think.

we are so off topic right now. i know im partially to blame for that. my bad.
Deetsmx
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Deetsmx 9/8/2011 12:50pm
9/8/2011 12:50pm
I always wanted aluminum frames on my 250 2 strokes because my steel frames would feel clapped out after less than a year. Then I bought a yz250, that thing is way too rigid, even after months on it. My brother has a cr250 and I feel it's a much better design and flexes a bit more. He did have a ktm for a while and I must say it did seem to hold up better than the Japanese bikes I used to have as far as the frame rigidity.
Ing
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Ing 9/8/2011 4:20pm
9/8/2011 4:20pm
Deetsmx wrote:
I always wanted aluminum frames on my 250 2 strokes because my steel frames would feel clapped out after less than a year. Then I bought...
I always wanted aluminum frames on my 250 2 strokes because my steel frames would feel clapped out after less than a year. Then I bought a yz250, that thing is way too rigid, even after months on it. My brother has a cr250 and I feel it's a much better design and flexes a bit more. He did have a ktm for a while and I must say it did seem to hold up better than the Japanese bikes I used to have as far as the frame rigidity.
Probably just didn't have your frame "broke in". It takes 8hrs. you know. I heard it from a credible source. Just sayin....
Roscoe33
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Roscoe33 9/8/2011 6:09pm
9/8/2011 6:09pm
How will I know when my aluminuim frame is broken in ?

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tmkiwi
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tmkiwi 9/8/2011 6:40pm
9/8/2011 6:40pm Edited Date/Time 9/8/2011 6:45pm
Roscoe33 wrote:
How will I know when my aluminuim frame is broken in ?

This one's broken in nicely.
500guy
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500guy 9/8/2011 6:57pm
9/8/2011 6:57pm
Roscoe33 wrote:
How will I know when my aluminuim frame is broken in ?
tmkiwi wrote:
[IMG]http://i864.photobucket.com/albums/ab207/tmkiwi/yz250split12je1.jpg[/IMG] This one's broken in nicely.

This one's broken in nicely.
2 strokes vibrate so bad this is a problem.
crusher773
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crusher773 9/8/2011 7:21pm
9/8/2011 7:21pm
KTM is very good at standing behind their bikes and are pretty proactive about doing recalls. My brother had a Yamaha that locked up with 2 hours on it they told him he was on his own. As far as not holding together KTMs hold together by far way better than any of the Jap bikes. I'll never own anything else ever again.
M-M
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M-M 1/14/2012 9:25pm
1/14/2012 9:25pm
Cygnus wrote:
I really hope Dungey goes to KTM so we can see how bad, or good the KTM's really are.
carlosmacho wrote:
I don't know if I would wish that on an enemy. If Dungey goes to KTM, it could be hurt his career if KTMs are as...
I don't know if I would wish that on an enemy. If Dungey goes to KTM, it could be hurt his career if KTMs are as bad as we have seen. The good news is that at least the factory will be behind him and try and fix those problems. In motoGP the Doctor went to Ducati and is reaping the rewards of leaving a good bike like Yamaha and going to something else. I wouldn't wish that on him either. BUT.

I am thinking KTM and Ducati are both paying well so even if neither does well at least they are making money.
Nevermind Carlos , nevermind.......

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