Shorty

hartebreak
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hartebreak
Edited Date/Time 1/27/2012 12:41pm
Just listened to the Pulpcast. Seems like Short has finally said to hell with the 350. When Matthes asked him about next year, Shorty said as long as he is on a 450 it doesnt really matter. He said he would love to stay at KTM but he will ride a 450 if he stays. I think there is no more reading between the lines here.
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Stoop 8/13/2011 10:36pm
8/13/2011 10:36pm
If he had of read vital he would have known the 350 was a bad idea right from the start
hartebreak
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hartebreak 8/13/2011 10:38pm
8/13/2011 10:38pm
I know Mike and Andrew are both professionals and handle themselves as such, but I wonder how the conversations about the 350 will be when and if they arent being paid by KTM any longer. Right now they both have said the bike is great and blah blah blah but they are paid to say that. Just sayin
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bvm111 8/14/2011 12:09am
8/14/2011 12:09am
Just listened to it as well... more interesting was his comment about there being some other programs out there... I am sure he is refering to the Brooks/MC effort. I guess he has sung the company line about about the 350 long enough and It will be interesting how this all plays out!
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ATKpilot99 8/14/2011 12:11am
8/14/2011 12:11am
A 350 only works in Europe where the riders aren't as good. Wink

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HatersSuck
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HatersSuck 8/14/2011 4:12am
8/14/2011 4:12am
At this point Short needs to be happy he is getting paid to ride. He has rode the best equipment for most of his career. 250,350 and 450. If Short is riding it it is not going to win a title.With all the talent moving up soon he really just needs to ride whatever he can get and be happy. he is not a player.

As far as the 350 goes, you put RV or Dungey on that bike and its a winner. Period end of story. This sport is all about the talent not the bike you ride
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`ol Ger 8/14/2011 5:41am
8/14/2011 5:41am
ATKpilot99 wrote:
A 350 only works in Europe where the riders aren't as good. Wink
Smile Smile
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carlosmacho 8/14/2011 6:29am
8/14/2011 6:29am Edited Date/Time 8/14/2011 6:31am
ATKpilot99 wrote:
A 350 only works in Europe where the riders aren't as good. Wink
I think that is absolutely a true, the faster riders who have a 350 (Say Carol) are riding against riders that are slower so it is easier for him to win, even on a bike of a lesser god. But when they have to face fast riders like a Dungey in the MXON in Lakewood, they just can't hang.

If you have a rider that is 2 seconds a lap faster than everyone else, then he rides a 350 that slows him to only being 1 second a lap faster, he is still a winner and can say how good the bike is, but when he races someone his same speed and he has a 100cc disadvantage, then it makes it a lot more difficult to win. That to me is what is happening in Europe and why they are having success.

For me. Shorty was hole shot king on the Honda, now he is hole shot not on the KTM. That's just the way it is. There may be some situations on the track that give the 350 an edge but overall from observation the KTM is a wash out. Time for KTM to move on from this ill conceived idea.
The Universe
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The Universe 8/14/2011 6:38am
8/14/2011 6:38am
carlosmacho wrote:
I think that is absolutely a true, the faster riders who have a 350 (Say Carol) are riding against riders that are slower so it is...
I think that is absolutely a true, the faster riders who have a 350 (Say Carol) are riding against riders that are slower so it is easier for him to win, even on a bike of a lesser god. But when they have to face fast riders like a Dungey in the MXON in Lakewood, they just can't hang.

If you have a rider that is 2 seconds a lap faster than everyone else, then he rides a 350 that slows him to only being 1 second a lap faster, he is still a winner and can say how good the bike is, but when he races someone his same speed and he has a 100cc disadvantage, then it makes it a lot more difficult to win. That to me is what is happening in Europe and why they are having success.

For me. Shorty was hole shot king on the Honda, now he is hole shot not on the KTM. That's just the way it is. There may be some situations on the track that give the 350 an edge but overall from observation the KTM is a wash out. Time for KTM to move on from this ill conceived idea.
Yeah, that Desalle is a complete pud. Good thing he's not fast. Unsure
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WhKnuckle 8/14/2011 6:40am
8/14/2011 6:40am
ATKpilot99 wrote:
A 350 only works in Europe where the riders aren't as good. Wink
carlosmacho wrote:
I think that is absolutely a true, the faster riders who have a 350 (Say Carol) are riding against riders that are slower so it is...
I think that is absolutely a true, the faster riders who have a 350 (Say Carol) are riding against riders that are slower so it is easier for him to win, even on a bike of a lesser god. But when they have to face fast riders like a Dungey in the MXON in Lakewood, they just can't hang.

If you have a rider that is 2 seconds a lap faster than everyone else, then he rides a 350 that slows him to only being 1 second a lap faster, he is still a winner and can say how good the bike is, but when he races someone his same speed and he has a 100cc disadvantage, then it makes it a lot more difficult to win. That to me is what is happening in Europe and why they are having success.

For me. Shorty was hole shot king on the Honda, now he is hole shot not on the KTM. That's just the way it is. There may be some situations on the track that give the 350 an edge but overall from observation the KTM is a wash out. Time for KTM to move on from this ill conceived idea.
I think the only thing ill-conceived about it is the notion that it's a better bike for pros. For the average racer/rider, it's probably a great choice, particularly for riders moving up from 250s to the 450 class. I'm happy they're making it, and I'm stoked that KTM keeps the passion for the sport and makes so many unusual bikes for niche markets. But the notion that a pro is going to do better with less displacement than everyone else is just fundamentally flawed logic.

Their engineering department made a fantastic product and the promotion group took the wrong tactic to sell it.
BWRAAP
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BWRAAP 8/14/2011 6:42am
8/14/2011 6:42am
You need to ride the 350-bike more like a 250 then a 450.. Shorty is a smooth rider, he's is agressive, but not to the bike.. (not enough)

My opinion ofcourse!
The Universe
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The Universe 8/14/2011 6:50am
8/14/2011 6:50am
BWRAAP wrote:
You need to ride the 350-bike more like a 250 then a 450.. Shorty is a smooth rider, he's is agressive, but not to the bike...
You need to ride the 350-bike more like a 250 then a 450.. Shorty is a smooth rider, he's is agressive, but not to the bike.. (not enough)

My opinion ofcourse!
The only chance the 350 has is taking a guy that rips from the 250 and putting him on the 350. The question would still be "why?". The 350 is an amazing bike for amateurs; I have a YZ290F and it's the perfect bike for guy like me. I'd love to get my hands on a 350.
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kongols 8/14/2011 6:52am
8/14/2011 6:52am
carlosmacho wrote:
I think that is absolutely a true, the faster riders who have a 350 (Say Carol) are riding against riders that are slower so it is...
I think that is absolutely a true, the faster riders who have a 350 (Say Carol) are riding against riders that are slower so it is easier for him to win, even on a bike of a lesser god. But when they have to face fast riders like a Dungey in the MXON in Lakewood, they just can't hang.

If you have a rider that is 2 seconds a lap faster than everyone else, then he rides a 350 that slows him to only being 1 second a lap faster, he is still a winner and can say how good the bike is, but when he races someone his same speed and he has a 100cc disadvantage, then it makes it a lot more difficult to win. That to me is what is happening in Europe and why they are having success.

For me. Shorty was hole shot king on the Honda, now he is hole shot not on the KTM. That's just the way it is. There may be some situations on the track that give the 350 an edge but overall from observation the KTM is a wash out. Time for KTM to move on from this ill conceived idea.
You just beat that other guy for a dumbest fucking post of the week. Congratulations.
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jamma10 8/14/2011 6:55am
8/14/2011 6:55am
Compare Short and Alessi's current championship positions to last years overall championship standings... then consider the fact that both Villopoto & Reed were missing last year.

That should tell you everything you need to know.
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jmar 8/14/2011 7:09am
8/14/2011 7:09am
ATKpilot99 wrote:
A 350 only works in Europe where the riders aren't as good. Wink
carlosmacho wrote:
I think that is absolutely a true, the faster riders who have a 350 (Say Carol) are riding against riders that are slower so it is...
I think that is absolutely a true, the faster riders who have a 350 (Say Carol) are riding against riders that are slower so it is easier for him to win, even on a bike of a lesser god. But when they have to face fast riders like a Dungey in the MXON in Lakewood, they just can't hang.

If you have a rider that is 2 seconds a lap faster than everyone else, then he rides a 350 that slows him to only being 1 second a lap faster, he is still a winner and can say how good the bike is, but when he races someone his same speed and he has a 100cc disadvantage, then it makes it a lot more difficult to win. That to me is what is happening in Europe and why they are having success.

For me. Shorty was hole shot king on the Honda, now he is hole shot not on the KTM. That's just the way it is. There may be some situations on the track that give the 350 an edge but overall from observation the KTM is a wash out. Time for KTM to move on from this ill conceived idea.
WhKnuckle wrote:
I think the only thing ill-conceived about it is the notion that it's a better bike for pros. For the average racer/rider, it's probably a great...
I think the only thing ill-conceived about it is the notion that it's a better bike for pros. For the average racer/rider, it's probably a great choice, particularly for riders moving up from 250s to the 450 class. I'm happy they're making it, and I'm stoked that KTM keeps the passion for the sport and makes so many unusual bikes for niche markets. But the notion that a pro is going to do better with less displacement than everyone else is just fundamentally flawed logic.

Their engineering department made a fantastic product and the promotion group took the wrong tactic to sell it.
I agree with this. The bike is fine for supercross, but giving up 100cc outdoors at this level isn't a good thing.

BTW: The GPs are a whole different ball game. Different set of rules when it comes to the equipment and I wouldn't be surprised if what they were riding were not true 350s.
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zippy895 8/14/2011 7:20am
8/14/2011 7:20am
350 is a good concept. the problem is, in order for it to get advertised, you have to see it in action. and the pro rank racing seems to be the place for that.
a lighter than 450 /big bike for the vets,etc. is a great concept.
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WORCSRacer 8/14/2011 7:30am
8/14/2011 7:30am
zippy895 wrote:
350 is a good concept. the problem is, in order for it to get advertised, you have to see it in action. and the pro rank...
350 is a good concept. the problem is, in order for it to get advertised, you have to see it in action. and the pro rank racing seems to be the place for that.
a lighter than 450 /big bike for the vets,etc. is a great concept.
Since when has KTM needed a successful motocross team to sell bikes?
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zippy895 8/14/2011 7:44am
8/14/2011 7:44am
zippy895 wrote:
350 is a good concept. the problem is, in order for it to get advertised, you have to see it in action. and the pro rank...
350 is a good concept. the problem is, in order for it to get advertised, you have to see it in action. and the pro rank racing seems to be the place for that.
a lighter than 450 /big bike for the vets,etc. is a great concept.
WORCSRacer wrote:
Since when has KTM needed a successful motocross team to sell bikes?
you know whats funny,honda and ktm seem to be doing something right.
reed,dungey, rc can win championships on suzuki and people...the majority seem to be on hondas mx/superx and ktms on off road events.
maybe it has to do with privateer contigencies,etc.
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jmar 8/14/2011 7:45am
8/14/2011 7:45am
zippy895 wrote:
350 is a good concept. the problem is, in order for it to get advertised, you have to see it in action. and the pro rank...
350 is a good concept. the problem is, in order for it to get advertised, you have to see it in action. and the pro rank racing seems to be the place for that.
a lighter than 450 /big bike for the vets,etc. is a great concept.
WORCSRacer wrote:
Since when has KTM needed a successful motocross team to sell bikes?
That's a good point.

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HatersSuck
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HatersSuck 8/14/2011 7:52am
8/14/2011 7:52am
I think honda has a great bike even though Canard has snapped 2 femurs on it and Grant is chilling at home. Add in zero titles in the big bike class since 02 and it still does not change my mind that the bike is not a problem.

KTM will have Dungey in 4 or 5 weeks. Come SX everyone will see that its not the bike.
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WhKnuckle 8/14/2011 7:53am
8/14/2011 7:53am
HatersSuck wrote:
I think honda has a great bike even though Canard has snapped 2 femurs on it and Grant is chilling at home. Add in zero titles...
I think honda has a great bike even though Canard has snapped 2 femurs on it and Grant is chilling at home. Add in zero titles in the big bike class since 02 and it still does not change my mind that the bike is not a problem.

KTM will have Dungey in 4 or 5 weeks. Come SX everyone will see that its not the bike.
Uh, zero titles since '04...
machine
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machine 8/14/2011 8:55am
8/14/2011 8:55am
There definitely has to be something to the European tracks vs US tracks thing. Maybe it's the fact that the US tracks are tilled deeper. I also think that it is a 250f type guys bike, i'm sure RV would do okay on it because of his riding style.


This is all opinion of course.
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jamma10 8/14/2011 9:04am
8/14/2011 9:04am
machine wrote:
There definitely has to be something to the European tracks vs US tracks thing. Maybe it's the fact that the US tracks are tilled deeper. I...
There definitely has to be something to the European tracks vs US tracks thing. Maybe it's the fact that the US tracks are tilled deeper. I also think that it is a 250f type guys bike, i'm sure RV would do okay on it because of his riding style.


This is all opinion of course.
This.
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jmar 8/14/2011 9:09am
8/14/2011 9:09am
The fact that Short is talking like this pretty much tells you that he is done at KTM. With that said, this is a little out of character for Short and it's not going to make it any easier when it comes to finding another ride for next year.
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carlosmacho 8/14/2011 9:11am
8/14/2011 9:11am Edited Date/Time 8/14/2011 9:13am
WhKnuckle wrote:
I think the only thing ill-conceived about it is the notion that it's a better bike for pros. For the average racer/rider, it's probably a great...
I think the only thing ill-conceived about it is the notion that it's a better bike for pros. For the average racer/rider, it's probably a great choice, particularly for riders moving up from 250s to the 450 class. I'm happy they're making it, and I'm stoked that KTM keeps the passion for the sport and makes so many unusual bikes for niche markets. But the notion that a pro is going to do better with less displacement than everyone else is just fundamentally flawed logic.

Their engineering department made a fantastic product and the promotion group took the wrong tactic to sell it.
What if the average rider (one who can afford the bike and maintain it) is a vet or senior riders that is not 170lbs but is 250lbs and not only uses the bike for mx but also for a few trips out to the trails or to Moab and or lives at high altitude or rides up in the mountains at 9-12000 feel. Nope, not thinking this is a good bike for this average rides.

If you are saying a pro, at the local pro level I am thinking being down 100cc is still not a good thing. But that is my opinion. The facts are fast American riders have a hard time with being 100ccs down. And to try to get more HP out of the bike, we have seen those bikes blow up more than a couple of times. No thanks for this average rider.
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carlosmacho 8/14/2011 9:15am
8/14/2011 9:15am Edited Date/Time 8/14/2011 9:16am
jmar wrote:
The fact that Short is talking like this pretty much tells you that he is done at KTM. With that said, this is a little out...
The fact that Short is talking like this pretty much tells you that he is done at KTM. With that said, this is a little out of character for Short and it's not going to make it any easier when it comes to finding another ride for next year.
Absolutely. To actual say something negative about a bike KTM is trying to shove down Americans throats says a lot. And it will make it difficult to get the next ride, which shows how strongly he feels about it.
BC261
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BC261 8/14/2011 9:17am
8/14/2011 9:17am
Some of you seem to forget Short is still a top 10 guy, not every team is looking for somebody that is going to sweep the field. K-dub comes to mind for example.
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Sherwood 8/14/2011 9:18am
8/14/2011 9:18am
ATKpilot99 wrote:
A 350 only works in Europe where the riders aren't as good. Wink
Or where they can make the engine whatever they'd like...
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jamma10 8/14/2011 9:19am
8/14/2011 9:19am
WhKnuckle wrote:
I think the only thing ill-conceived about it is the notion that it's a better bike for pros. For the average racer/rider, it's probably a great...
I think the only thing ill-conceived about it is the notion that it's a better bike for pros. For the average racer/rider, it's probably a great choice, particularly for riders moving up from 250s to the 450 class. I'm happy they're making it, and I'm stoked that KTM keeps the passion for the sport and makes so many unusual bikes for niche markets. But the notion that a pro is going to do better with less displacement than everyone else is just fundamentally flawed logic.

Their engineering department made a fantastic product and the promotion group took the wrong tactic to sell it.
carlosmacho wrote:
What if the average rider (one who can afford the bike and maintain it) is a vet or senior riders that is not 170lbs but is...
What if the average rider (one who can afford the bike and maintain it) is a vet or senior riders that is not 170lbs but is 250lbs and not only uses the bike for mx but also for a few trips out to the trails or to Moab and or lives at high altitude or rides up in the mountains at 9-12000 feel. Nope, not thinking this is a good bike for this average rides.

If you are saying a pro, at the local pro level I am thinking being down 100cc is still not a good thing. But that is my opinion. The facts are fast American riders have a hard time with being 100ccs down. And to try to get more HP out of the bike, we have seen those bikes blow up more than a couple of times. No thanks for this average rider.
Then perhaps they should buy a different bike...?

Why do people feel as though KTM are holding a gun to their heads and insisting they buy a 350?
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carlosmacho 8/14/2011 9:19am
8/14/2011 9:19am
HatersSuck wrote:
I think honda has a great bike even though Canard has snapped 2 femurs on it and Grant is chilling at home. Add in zero titles...
I think honda has a great bike even though Canard has snapped 2 femurs on it and Grant is chilling at home. Add in zero titles in the big bike class since 02 and it still does not change my mind that the bike is not a problem.

KTM will have Dungey in 4 or 5 weeks. Come SX everyone will see that its not the bike.
And if he is able to win on it, then it can be said that the bike can work for a very fast rider, till then, I am think not.

I am also thinking RD will not perform very well on the KTM, he might even ride as slow as Caroli and not be able to get another American championship. Smile

But seriously. I hope RD does well regardless but I would bet against him riding against RV on a 450.
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SMITH201 8/14/2011 9:20am
8/14/2011 9:20am
I have read a few times, even tweets from Reed, that Cairoli's 350 is not even close to a real 350.

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