Money for Nationals

MaxPower
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Edited Date/Time 1/27/2012 1:10pm
now that sx is over and the Nationals are starting, has the payout for finishes increased any this season or do riders still make more at an arena cross where there are a few hundred fans compared to the outdoors where there are thousands of fans?

Its a riders choice to do what they do, but for the sake of keeping the Nationals alive I hope they pay these guys closer to what they are worth to keep them showing up

.Or at least dont charge them a gate fee
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5/4/2008 4:16pm
It's $200 a race sign up. You don't have a gate fee though with your credentials, that you had to buy upfront. If you make the main, you make up the sign up fee but unless you finish in the points that's about it.
mxdad
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5/4/2008 4:25pm Edited Date/Time 4/16/2016 6:51pm
MaxPower wrote:
[b]now that sx is over and the Nationals are starting, has the payout for finishes increased any this season or do riders still make more at...
now that sx is over and the Nationals are starting, has the payout for finishes increased any this season or do riders still make more at an arena cross where there are a few hundred fans compared to the outdoors where there are thousands of fans?

Its a riders choice to do what they do, but for the sake of keeping the Nationals alive I hope they pay these guys closer to what they are worth to keep them showing up

.Or at least dont charge them a gate fee
This post is a joke I hope. There is no money to pay the riders. Do the math.


The National tracks draw an average of 20,000 fans. Many (60%) pay to camp (in a field) to race amature day $60, and watch on Sunday. Camping $60. and $60. for admittance and $60. to practice and race one class.


Camping income =$720,000.

1000 @ 60 ea amature racer fees= $60,000

Amature racer spectator fees = $720,000


The other 40% (8,000) who come to watch on Sunday only pay $20 ea = $160,000. (parking is always free).


Add to this the never ending 4’ banners around the track the advertising income must be at least 10 bucks total.


Then they charge a % of vending income for the $5 bottles of warm water they sell. This must add up to another 10 bucks or so.


All said and done the income at most of these events is 2 million dollars cash (most never reported to the IRS). This explains the Brinks trucks pulling in/out ever 6 hours.


How could they ever afford to pay the pro racers?


First place should pay at least the same as a top womans bowler makes for a event win........$10,000. They make the majority of income from sponsors also but at least they have an incentive to at least try and win unlike this sport.


Maybe DMG will turn things around. The sport needs it.
KAWboy14
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5/4/2008 4:28pm
they spend all that money to get the show on tv.....so it only leaves $35,000 per event for payouts.

plus the riders dont really need the prize money...they get tons of marketing from the event and the tv show.
mxdad
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5/4/2008 5:56pm Edited Date/Time 4/16/2016 6:51pm
KAWboy14 wrote:
they spend all that money to get the show on tv.....so it only leaves $35,000 per event for payouts. plus the riders dont really need the...
they spend all that money to get the show on tv.....so it only leaves $35,000 per event for payouts.

plus the riders dont really need the prize money...they get tons of marketing from the event and the tv show.
You are very disillusioned. Speed tv PAYS for the television rights.

The reason there are only 2-3 guys trying to win is there is ZERO purse money. This is what makes this sport unworthy of LIVE tv coverage.

Have you ever had a friend over who does not race motocross and watch a race? After the first corner the look on their face is utter boredom. That alone speaks volumes of our sport.

People would rather watch 3-4 hours of cars going in circles (close to each other) than 1-2 guys riding a murdercycle on dirt by themselves.




The Shop

Slow ~ Pro
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5/4/2008 8:36pm Edited Date/Time 4/16/2016 6:51pm
MaxPower wrote:
[b]now that sx is over and the Nationals are starting, has the payout for finishes increased any this season or do riders still make more at...
now that sx is over and the Nationals are starting, has the payout for finishes increased any this season or do riders still make more at an arena cross where there are a few hundred fans compared to the outdoors where there are thousands of fans?

Its a riders choice to do what they do, but for the sake of keeping the Nationals alive I hope they pay these guys closer to what they are worth to keep them showing up

.Or at least dont charge them a gate fee
I have a little knowledge of how it works at Glen Helen.


The Pros are on a free pass all year long at Glen Helen. Over 100 top names on that list.


As for pay out (Purse) it has never been a reason to hang it out. The money earned through monetary sponsorship has always been what makes them work hard.


As for the purse money they do win...It usually goes to the race Mechanic, as a jester of gratitude.


And for what it's worth...you have to be a millionaire these days to promote a National Motocross. It cost a lot more than you think.


For one, the land is not just sitting there...it is owned and operated. New track crews come in. 100s of port o cans...fencing, Hiring local police for a week, 24 hours a day. Heavy equipment rentals, Tents, Permits etc., etc., I mean it goes on, and on.


I agree the riders deserve more, but so do a lot of professions, like Police, Firemen, Armed forces, I'd like a few more bucks myself.


As far as being reported to the IRS...The IRS (an Agent) is present all week end.
andymoto
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5/4/2008 9:50pm Edited Date/Time 4/16/2016 6:51pm
While I've been around the sport a very long time, the purse money paid out to the "privateers" has been pretty stagnant for a very long time.

If it takes a millionaire to promote a Outdoor National, why after some that have had Nationals for at least 35 years still continue to have them?




WORCSRacer
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5/4/2008 10:10pm Edited Date/Time 5/4/2008 10:11pm
mxdad wrote:
You are very disillusioned. Speed tv PAYS for the television rights. The reason there are only 2-3 guys trying to win is there is ZERO purse...
You are very disillusioned. Speed tv PAYS for the television rights.

The reason there are only 2-3 guys trying to win is there is ZERO purse money. This is what makes this sport unworthy of LIVE tv coverage.

Have you ever had a friend over who does not race motocross and watch a race? After the first corner the look on their face is utter boredom. That alone speaks volumes of our sport.

People would rather watch 3-4 hours of cars going in circles (close to each other) than 1-2 guys riding a murdercycle on dirt by themselves.




Speed does not pay for the television rights. It is a huge expense for the AMA and LiveNation. TV coverage doesn't even break even at this point.
BobbyM
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5/4/2008 10:18pm
you pay to have it on tv
the advertisers pay you if anybody is watching.
somebody better start gettin em to watch.
everybody wins.
purses are huge.
sport goes large!
2nd only to football
chicks pull you over and want to shag you just because you have an fmf sticker on yer pickup



WORCSRacer
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5/4/2008 10:21pm Edited Date/Time 4/16/2016 6:51pm
BobbyM wrote:
you pay to have it on tv the advertisers pay you if anybody is watching. somebody better start gettin em to watch. everybody wins. purses are...
you pay to have it on tv
the advertisers pay you if anybody is watching.
somebody better start gettin em to watch.
everybody wins.
purses are huge.
sport goes large!
2nd only to football
chicks pull you over and want to shag you just because you have an fmf sticker on yer pickup



"BobbyM wrote:

everybody wins.

purses are huge.

sport goes large!

2nd only to football

chicks pull you over and want to shag you just because you have an fmf sticker on yer pickup"


Well this how it "WORCS" for us...
Racetime
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5/5/2008 2:16am Edited Date/Time 4/16/2016 6:51pm
WORCS is right.

The requirement to pay to put the series on TV was a huge liability for AMA Pro and a key reason for them wanting to get out of pro racing entirely and farm it out. They ended up selling everything. The tracks didn't pay for TV. It's also partly the reason the NPG's proposal to keep running the series stayed at the bottom of the pile-no TV power.

The nats are lucky this summer because they get a ride on the current Speed TV deal. Next year, its DMG's baby.

Little known fun fact- There is no finished DMG/NPG contract right now. They are going into this summer on a handshake.

I think some of you are over estimating the number of Brinks trucks a little! But, then again, the series has been run by some very secretive people and still is. Make your own conclusions and stop talking about my family! whaaaah Smile


JPT
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5/5/2008 2:56am
Just an interesting piece of information along these lines. I've got a '73 program from Daytona and it lists the payoffs. They were still calling it Motocross back then and they ran 3 - 20 minute motos in the 250 and Open classes. First place paid $300 per moto and $400 over all for the potential of $1300 for a win. 20th paid $10 per moto and $20 over all. This was a $10,000 purse.

As I recall it cost me $10 to get into the races and the program was $2.00 for a little reference as to how much $10,000 would have been back then.
KAWboy14
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5/5/2008 6:15am
JPT wrote:
Just an interesting piece of information along these lines. I've got a '73 program from Daytona and it lists the payoffs. They were still calling it...
Just an interesting piece of information along these lines. I've got a '73 program from Daytona and it lists the payoffs. They were still calling it Motocross back then and they ran 3 - 20 minute motos in the 250 and Open classes. First place paid $300 per moto and $400 over all for the potential of $1300 for a win. 20th paid $10 per moto and $20 over all. This was a $10,000 purse.

As I recall it cost me $10 to get into the races and the program was $2.00 for a little reference as to how much $10,000 would have been back then.
gas costs a lot more now.


ps: much of what i wrote and this one is sarcasm!

5/5/2008 7:05am
MaxPower wrote:
[b]now that sx is over and the Nationals are starting, has the payout for finishes increased any this season or do riders still make more at...
now that sx is over and the Nationals are starting, has the payout for finishes increased any this season or do riders still make more at an arena cross where there are a few hundred fans compared to the outdoors where there are thousands of fans?

Its a riders choice to do what they do, but for the sake of keeping the Nationals alive I hope they pay these guys closer to what they are worth to keep them showing up

.Or at least dont charge them a gate fee
Slow ~ Pro wrote:
I have a little knowledge of how it works at Glen Helen. The Pros are on a free pass all year long at Glen Helen. Over...
I have a little knowledge of how it works at Glen Helen.


The Pros are on a free pass all year long at Glen Helen. Over 100 top names on that list.


As for pay out (Purse) it has never been a reason to hang it out. The money earned through monetary sponsorship has always been what makes them work hard.


As for the purse money they do win...It usually goes to the race Mechanic, as a jester of gratitude.


And for what it's worth...you have to be a millionaire these days to promote a National Motocross. It cost a lot more than you think.


For one, the land is not just sitting there...it is owned and operated. New track crews come in. 100s of port o cans...fencing, Hiring local police for a week, 24 hours a day. Heavy equipment rentals, Tents, Permits etc., etc., I mean it goes on, and on.


I agree the riders deserve more, but so do a lot of professions, like Police, Firemen, Armed forces, I'd like a few more bucks myself.


As far as being reported to the IRS...The IRS (an Agent) is present all week end.
Hey I only got bonus money from Steve Rhyan. When Gary Ogden got a 3rd Over-all at Hangtown he did pay for dinner at Dennys. But never did it for the money just for the fun.
Racetime
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5/5/2008 1:47pm
The truth is no one likes paying prize money on either side of the ocean.

When there is talk of a rider's union in the US, the promoters get purple-faced with rage.

I have seen it.

The top riders make a lot of money and the promoters actually resent paying them.

At least SX tries harder and pays more, even though they hate it.
KAWboy14
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5/5/2008 4:10pm Edited Date/Time 4/16/2016 6:51pm
Racetime wrote:
The truth is no one likes paying prize money on either side of the ocean. When there is talk of a rider's union in the US...
The truth is no one likes paying prize money on either side of the ocean.

When there is talk of a rider's union in the US, the promoters get purple-faced with rage.

I have seen it.

The top riders make a lot of money and the promoters actually resent paying them.

At least SX tries harder and pays more, even though they hate it.
"they hate it"

any good partner has no problem paying his partner his fair share! If they "hate it" its obvious they dont consider the riders their partners or even necessary for their existance.

if thats true the riders should form a union to push their employer to pay the fair share. they are in an employer employee relationship whether anyone wants to admit it or not.
Racetime
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5/5/2008 4:48pm
I hope Edmondson can get the sport on sound financial footing, and get the riders money like he says.

But, promoters haven't changed.

Right now, teams (and even media) are too often treated as competitors and not partners. That requires a significant and real culture change. If DMG can pull that off, it would be huge, but I wouldn't count on it. Sounds like all talk to me.
KAWboy14
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5/5/2008 4:52pm
Racetime wrote:
I hope Edmondson can get the sport on sound financial footing, and get the riders money like he says. But, promoters haven't changed. Right now, teams...
I hope Edmondson can get the sport on sound financial footing, and get the riders money like he says.

But, promoters haven't changed.

Right now, teams (and even media) are too often treated as competitors and not partners. That requires a significant and real culture change. If DMG can pull that off, it would be huge, but I wouldn't count on it. Sounds like all talk to me.
yep!
ProMed
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5/5/2008 4:58pm
After being allowed to short-change the talent for such a long time, the promoters have had almost no incentive to change. Hopefully DMG will do the right thing by watching what NPG does right this year, then further improve on that while doing it themselves in 09.

It would certainly be interesting to watch the guys who have been doing the screwing have to bend over for a change. They all certainly were squirming like crazy this summer... lmao.
GuyB
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5/5/2008 5:07pm Edited Date/Time 5/5/2008 5:07pm
Are you ready for the National season? I can't wait to see how it's going to pan out.
Racetime
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5/5/2008 5:35pm
Promed-

And it got worse after Budds, until DMG threw them a bone, they were purpled-faced paranoid.
Slow ~ Pro
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5/5/2008 5:54pm
GuyB wrote:
Are you ready for the National season? I can't wait to see how it's going to pan out.
Ready ?

Always...
5/5/2008 9:49pm
The whole thing is a joke.......the only "magazine" that even mentions a privateer is Racer X and they only do it online!

Gotta love the supporters of MX and the privateer. Guess who they've featured......DV12 and Heath Voss.

Puuhleese.......those fools got permanent numbers and you got them in privateer profile!

Sorry folks.........get prepared for 32 guy's showing up for Unadilla this year.....unless they change the rules and let local B class guy's take a crack at it like they did with SX this year for the Lites guys (who have money and access to 450's and transportation and a semi)

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