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Yep twice……..that’s what is frightening.
Don't see that happening at all. No nukes.
But then again, I don't see how this ends in our favor without an invasion, al la Iraq.
It's possible that Iran comes to their senses and agrees to the previous MOU. I still wonder what the fuck they were thinking when they broke that agreement. That was just fucking stupid.
I don't see Trump declaring victory and walking away either. He will be blamed for the economic mess as Iran takes complete control of the Straight. Maybe he finds some other way to weasel out of this. I cant imagine what it would be though.
Maybe this goes on beyond Trumps term. The question of how does this end applies to whoever is the next President. The problems do not change.
One other possibility, China and some of the other Asian countries make some kind of deal with Iran. They need that oil more than we do. We can retool refineries to run the stuff we produce in Bakken and Permian. Just cost's money. Asia has no alternatives. They need that shit.
That's all I got. I wish somebody else would come up with something.
……and “JAPAN SURRENDERS”. The Japanese were responsible for 10+ million deaths during WWII.
The United States stopped Hitler and Imperial Japan, yet you’re trying to recreate history to make the U.S. the bad guys? Am I getting it right?
I don't see this ending in the US's favor, most like outcome is a stalemate or another forever war.
One other possibility is Iran getting nukes, followed shortly by Saudi Arabia, UAE, and Turkey.
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Not to mention Japan attacked our country killing 2403 Americans and injuring another 1178. Japan is fortunate America showed mercy on them.
Saudi Arabia should be thankful that they’re not a sheet of glass.
Doesn’t change the fact that atomic weapons have only been used in combat twice, for one reason: the enemy did not have nukes of their own. Once the USSR detonated their own weapon in ‘49, the global balance of power shifted. Just as it would shift if Iran acquired a nuke. Hence the reason they, and many other nations, would find nuclear weapons to be the ultimate defensive weapon.
And why Israel will destroy any nuclear development. By any means necessary.
The US narrative is the atomic bombs ended the war, but the Soviet Union entering the war at the same time, Japan was starved of resources (oil, rubber, steel) and could not sustain it's war industries, all of these factors contributed to their surrender.
Stalemate and forever war are pretty much the same thing but I don't see any of those countries nuking up any time soon. But that does raise an issue: Since the general global agreement of post WWII has been broken, by this administration I might add, many countries are looking at nuking up. Namely, Poland and Scandinavian countries. With us backing away from NATO to a certain degree, these countries are looking for ways to defend themselves from Russia. They cant depend on us anymore. Which, I am all for, but it probably means nuclear proliferation. Trade offs. There are no win wins.
By that logic, the US and Israel attacked Iran killing their leaders and +3,500 Iranians, should Iran show the US and Israel any mercy?
Japan and South Korea are also openly discussing going nuclear.
Japan surrendered three days after Hiroshima and one day after Nagasaki.
They surrendered the day after the Soviet Union declared war and invaded Manchuria.
It’s funny, the Russians chose to invade after the first bomb and 11 hours before the second. They were definitely more afraid of nuclear annihilation than they were of Russia.
The Soviet Union invaded 90 days after the surrender of Germany, as they agreed to at the Yalta Conference.
Mercy is a good thing , wouldn’t you agree?
Not trying to recreate history . But history has a tendency to repeat it self , and that’s what’s frightening.you’ve got two leaders of these 2 countries who don’t give 2 fucks about any outcome since they both know their tenure is a short time remaining or not at all .
Take pride out of the equation and walk away from it might be the smartest thing to happen. When a very oil rich country can’t export their very expensive product what do you think happens then ?
Pit Row
Would the US show mercy if a foreign country killed it's leaders?
I doubt that's how it will end.
Oh, it most definitely is. Somebody’s getting spanked. Who? Yet to be determined
*The United States and their allies...
That is true, but my statement is also true. Weapons of mass destruction can be (successfully) used offensively only when the enemy cannot respond in kind. And the “enemy” includes any nation allied with our foes. Since 1949 there’s been a detente of varying stability. Would Iran upset that balance and proactively deploy a nuke? Highly unlikely, but not impossible. Just like any other nation similarly armed.
Youre talking about rational thinking individuals.. The main variable in all this stuff is that radical muslims do not think and behave rationally. They are religious wackjobs that cannot be reasoned with. Cutting off heads and putting it on Youtube is acceptable practice to these kooks. What they 'might' do is difficult to quantify because they are not rational and are, at its simplest, 6th century murderous barbarians hell bent on smiting the kafirs.
If we had a asylum chock fulla people with schizophrenia, it wouldnt be a good decision to give them the ability to launch nukes, even small dirty ones. These religious fanatics with a pedo bent should not be trusted anymore than the mentally deranged kept in Forensic Psychiatric Hospitals.
100%
Thinking these nuts wouldn’t use one offensively is a mistake.
It would only be once, but are we prepared for that?
Kenny has the reasoning and critical thinking skills of a troglodyte.
Exactly this. Can't apply western and largely Christian based moral code and reasoning to the decisions they might make. They're running a completely different operating system. They don't fear death. The highest aspiration for far too many of them is the brutality and martyrdom. They don't lack the willingness, they lack the means. Give them the means and it's go time. Mutually assured destruction isn't a deterrent for them, it's a positive outcome. Westerners need to accept this reality before it's too late. Plenty of their own people might be more reasonable than this and not support it, but the moderates have shown zero ability to stand up and run the show. We spent a generation in Afghanistan trying to facilitate it and it accomplished nothing.
Have posted this a few times before but for those who may have missed it....
No I am not a big fan of the source. The arguments he makes in this case are solid.
https://www.samharris.org/blog/the-bright-line-between-good-and-evil
"....Most people in the West still don’t understand the problem of jihadism. We often speak about “terrorism” and “violent extremism” generically. And we are told that any linkage between these evils and the doctrine of Islam is spurious, and nothing more than an expression “Islamophobia.” Incidentally, the term “Islamophobia” was invented in the 1970s by Iranian theocrats, to do just this: prevent any criticism of Islam and to cast secularism itself as a form of bigotry. Islam is a system of ideas, subscribed to by people of every race and ethnicity. It’s just like Christianity in that regard. Unlike Judaism, Christianity and Islam are both aggressively missionary faiths, and they win converts from everywhere. People criticize the doctrines of the Christianity all the time and worry about their political and social influences—but no one confuses this for bigotry against Christians as people, much less racism. There’s no such thing as “Christophobia.” As someone once said (it was not Christopher Hitchens, but it sure sounds like him): “Islamophobia is a term created by fascists, and used by cowards, to manipulate morons.”
In any case, fundamentalist Christians and Orthodox Jews don’t tend to be confused about the problem of jihadism because they understand the power of religious beliefs, however secular people generally are. We imagine that people everywhere, at bottom, want the same things: They want to live safe and prosperous lives. They want clean drinking water and good schools for their kids. And we imagine that if whole groups of people start behaving in extraordinarily destructive ways—practicing suicidal terrorism against noncombatants, for instance—they must have been pushed into extremis by others. What could turn ordinary human beings into suicide bombers, and what could get vast numbers of their neighbors to celebrate them as martyrs, other than their entire society being oppressed and humiliated to the point of madness by some malign power? So, in the case of Israel, many people imagine that the ghoulish history Palestinian terrorism simply indicates how profound the injustice has been on the Israeli side.
Now, there are many things to be said in criticism of Israel, in particular its expansion of settlements on contested land. But Israel’s behavior is not what explains the suicidal and genocidal inclinations of a group like Hamas. The Islamic doctrines of martyrdom and jihad do.
These are religious beliefs, sincerely held. They are beliefs about the moral structure of the universe. And they explain how normal people—even good ones—can commit horrific acts of violence against innocent civilians—on purpose, not as collateral damage—and still consider themselves good. When you believe that life in this world has no value, apart from deciding who goes to hell and who goes to Paradise, it becomes possible to feel perfectly at ease killing noncombatants, or even using your own women and children as human shields, because you know that any Muslims who get killed will go to Paradise for eternity.
If you don’t understand that jihadists sincerely believe these things, you don’t understand the problem Israel faces. The problem isn’t merely Palestinian nationalism, or resource competition, or any other normal terrestrial grievance. In fact, the problem isn’t even hatred, though there is enough of that to go around. The problem is religious certainty....."
I would think not. Do you think Australia would want the US involved if they were attacked by Iran?
Post a reply to: How does this thing in Iran end?