Why does everyone hate 4ts?

Cygnus
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Cygnus 8/1/2010 7:39pm
8/1/2010 7:39pm
Cygnus wrote:
Do I need to keep going?
Void Main wrote:
Yes, can you find one in Klotz? Also the sites that those images came from are Romanian and Australian.
No but I did find a Golden Spectro one.

If you want to get technical the term 2 Cycle would be the proper english use.
Void Main
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Void Main 8/1/2010 7:43pm
8/1/2010 7:43pm Edited Date/Time 8/1/2010 7:51pm
Cygnus wrote:
Do I need to keep going?
Void Main wrote:
Yes, can you find one in Klotz? Also the sites that those images came from are Romanian and Australian.
Cygnus wrote:
No but I did find a Golden Spectro one. [img]https://www.heeters.com/images/2TSCOOTER.jpg[/img] If you want to get technical the term 2 Cycle would be the proper english use.
No but I did find a Golden Spectro one.

If you want to get technical the term 2 Cycle would be the proper english use.
I am fine with cycle or stroke but not a big fan of 2T and 4T, unless of course you are from a country that uses that notation. Maybe everyone should start calling them "motorbikes". That would be cool too. I much prefer the 2T motorbike over the 4T motorbike.
jmar
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jmar 8/1/2010 7:48pm
8/1/2010 7:48pm
nadeauracing229 wrote:
I like both
You are correct, other than time, and the existing rules, have allowed for the 250f class to become the same ole, same ole, when it comes to deep pocket teams have the advantage.

The 450 though is the best thing to hit the sport. No one is out motored in the 450 class.


Take the displacement down 100 ccs and that will not be the case.
scotttydog 8/1/2010 7:50pm
8/1/2010 7:50pm
scotttydog wrote:
Well ask your self what is there to like about 4 strokes? i bet it'd be a pretty short list! If you're really objective about it...
Well ask your self what is there to like about 4 strokes? i bet it'd be a pretty short list!

If you're really objective about it and weigh up all the pros and cons of 2 vs 4, 2 strokes wins hand down.

The market has now changed/feed up and the big manufacturers/ race promoters are now left behind the eight ball, but they will at some point get with the program



jmar wrote:
You have obviously never maintained a two stroke under the hands of a pro level rider.

Yes your correct, The only maintenance I've done is on my own 2 and 4 strokes and would much prefer to work on and pay for a 2 stroke

I guess you have? If so whats the difference between a 4 and 2 strokes for a pro? I'm just curious as the FIM brings in a new 125cc class as a way to keep costs down for young upcoming riders?

Anyway this is more about recreational riders like my self than the pros.

The Shop

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DrSweden
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DrSweden 8/1/2010 7:52pm
8/1/2010 7:52pm Edited Date/Time 8/1/2010 7:55pm
queen of spodes wrote:
In french the word "stroke" means "trait" - that's where the T's are coming from. Unless someone is speaking french the correct abbreviation should be "s"...
In french the word "stroke" means "trait" - that's where the T's are coming from. Unless someone is speaking french the correct abbreviation should be "s" not "t".
No. T stands for temps. I'm not sure what that exactly means, but I think it's similar to time, stroke or beat in your language...

We in Sweden also use T which means takt and translates to beat.
dietzl41
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dietzl41 8/1/2010 8:06pm
8/1/2010 8:06pm
Im building a 3T 6 speed. its gunna SHRED
ThePipe
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ThePipe 8/1/2010 8:08pm
8/1/2010 8:08pm
I hate them because they are killing our sport and now the sport is dying a slow death.
I know I couldn't afford MX, If those Piles of Shit took over in the 80s
I would've stopped spending $ on MX 25yrs ago
Cygnus
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Cygnus 8/1/2010 8:08pm
8/1/2010 8:08pm
dietzl41 wrote:
Im building a 3T 6 speed. its gunna SHRED
Old technology.

ThePipe
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ThePipe 8/1/2010 8:10pm
8/1/2010 8:10pm
I hate them because they are Satans Spawn
and 2strokes are a gift from God
TerryK
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TerryK 8/1/2010 8:11pm
8/1/2010 8:11pm
Wtf is a 4t?
jmar
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jmar 8/1/2010 8:11pm
8/1/2010 8:11pm
scotttydog wrote:
Well ask your self what is there to like about 4 strokes? i bet it'd be a pretty short list! If you're really objective about it...
Well ask your self what is there to like about 4 strokes? i bet it'd be a pretty short list!

If you're really objective about it and weigh up all the pros and cons of 2 vs 4, 2 strokes wins hand down.

The market has now changed/feed up and the big manufacturers/ race promoters are now left behind the eight ball, but they will at some point get with the program



jmar wrote:
You have obviously never maintained a two stroke under the hands of a pro level rider.

scotttydog wrote:
Yes your correct, The only maintenance I've done is on my own 2 and 4 strokes and would much prefer to work on and pay for...
Yes your correct, The only maintenance I've done is on my own 2 and 4 strokes and would much prefer to work on and pay for a 2 stroke

I guess you have? If so whats the difference between a 4 and 2 strokes for a pro? I'm just curious as the FIM brings in a new 125cc class as a way to keep costs down for young upcoming riders?

Anyway this is more about recreational riders like my self than the pros.

Pro level riders ride the two stroke bikes past their intended limits. Lot's of rings, pistons, clutch plates, reeds and rods.

On a 125 race bike?

It's constant work after every ride.
Void Main
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Void Main 8/1/2010 8:13pm
8/1/2010 8:13pm
TerryK wrote:
Wtf is a 4t?
That's an age you passed long long ago.

dietzl41
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dietzl41 8/1/2010 8:17pm
8/1/2010 8:17pm
dietzl41 wrote:
Im building a 3T 6 speed. its gunna SHRED
Cygnus wrote:
Old technology. [img]https://www.suzukicycles.org/photos/suzuki-history/1976/1976_re5_rotary_570.jpg[/img]
Old technology.

well played sir.
Cygnus
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Cygnus 8/1/2010 8:17pm
8/1/2010 8:17pm
TerryK wrote:
Wtf is a 4t?
Void Main wrote:
That's an age you passed long long ago. [img]http://accessories.yamaha-motor-europe.com/files/images/EU/YMD67021XXXX_HR.jpg[/img]
That's an age you passed long long ago.

I wouldn't use that crap in my weed wacker.
TerryK
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TerryK 8/1/2010 8:17pm
8/1/2010 8:17pm
TerryK wrote:
Wtf is a 4t?
Void Main wrote:
That's an age you passed long long ago. [img]http://accessories.yamaha-motor-europe.com/files/images/EU/YMD67021XXXX_HR.jpg[/img]
That's an age you passed long long ago.

lmao, it took me a second to get it.

Touche' motherfucker, touche'.
Void Main
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Void Main 8/2/2010 8:33am
8/2/2010 8:33am Edited Date/Time 8/2/2010 8:34am
TerryK wrote:
Wtf is a 4t?
Void Main wrote:
That's an age you passed long long ago. [img]http://accessories.yamaha-motor-europe.com/files/images/EU/YMD67021XXXX_HR.jpg[/img]
That's an age you passed long long ago.

Cygnus wrote:
I wouldn't use that crap in my weed wacker.
Man, I looked all over the Yamaha, Kawasaki, and KTM web sites and nowhere do they refer to any of their motorcycles as 2T or 4T. They all say 2-stroke and 4-stroke for some reason.
Outsider
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Outsider 8/2/2010 9:24am
8/2/2010 9:24am
TerryK wrote:
Wtf is a 4t?
Void Main wrote:
That's an age you passed long long ago. [img]http://accessories.yamaha-motor-europe.com/files/images/EU/YMD67021XXXX_HR.jpg[/img]
That's an age you passed long long ago.

LOL!
sbarrington314 8/2/2010 9:40am
8/2/2010 9:40am
how about if you like 2-s your ride a 2-s. if you like 4-s, then ride a 4-s. pretty simple really.

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Void Main
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Void Main 8/2/2010 9:43am
8/2/2010 9:43am
sbarrington314 wrote:
how about if you like 2-s your ride a 2-s. if you like 4-s, then ride a 4-s. pretty simple really.
It sounds pretty simple but I haven't seen a new 2-stroke in my local Yamaha shop in a good 3 years. My old one is going to be worn out and sooner or later I'll need a new one but it's getting harder to do. At least Yamaha and KTM are still making them, even if they aren't getting any R&D (from Yamaha that is).
SteveS
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SteveS 8/2/2010 9:51am
8/2/2010 9:51am
sbarrington314 wrote:
how about if you like 2-s your ride a 2-s. if you like 4-s, then ride a 4-s. pretty simple really.
If you race it isn't very competitive that they allow the 4-s a double displacement advantage. If they made it competitive and the manufacturers would put them in the showroom, then your argument would be valid.
peelout719
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peelout719 8/2/2010 9:56am
8/2/2010 9:56am
fat. heavy. ugly. loud. and as reliable as a chinese lawn mower.

the 4 stroke is the Roseanne Arnold of the world of motocross.
OW38B
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OW38B 8/2/2010 10:51am
8/2/2010 10:51am
OW38B wrote:
I don't hate 4 strokes, I have raced them and they are OK. But I really dislike the double the displacement rule that the AMA goobers...
I don't hate 4 strokes, I have raced them and they are OK. But I really dislike the double the displacement rule that the AMA goobers let the "lawnmowers" have.

If it was equal displacement in ALL forms of racing I would be fine with them.

The double displacement rule was stupid when they passed it, it was stupid when Yamaha came out with the YZ400 four stroke and yes, it is stupid today.
mx317 wrote:
Only in the pros. You can run a 250 2-stroke with 250 4-strokes in all forms of AMA racing except pro sx and mx. So unless...
Only in the pros. You can run a 250 2-stroke with 250 4-strokes in all forms of AMA racing except pro sx and mx. So unless you are a national pro, it doesn't matter.
AMA Pro is what I was talking about.

I keep forgetting that the guys back east all race the AMA stuff. I'm not sure we even have regular AMA non pro MX races here in So Cal?
Ing
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Ing 8/2/2010 11:02am
8/2/2010 11:02am Edited Date/Time 8/2/2010 11:03am
It's the displacement thingy. Always has been alway will be until they level the playing field. Talking about pro level maintenance? How about a 500 2-stroke? Virtually zero maintenance. You can't run them hard enough to hurt them. If the 500 2-stroke had as much development as the 450 4-strokes there wouldn't be any competition. 4-stokes=good 2-stroke=better. JMO. I've owned LOTS of each.
gaines1016
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gaines1016 8/2/2010 1:36pm
8/2/2010 1:36pm
i like 4 strokes. i hate carburetors.
babba boey
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babba boey 8/2/2010 1:47pm
8/2/2010 1:47pm
jmar wrote:
You have obviously never maintained a two stroke under the hands of a pro level rider.

scotttydog wrote:
Yes your correct, The only maintenance I've done is on my own 2 and 4 strokes and would much prefer to work on and pay for...
Yes your correct, The only maintenance I've done is on my own 2 and 4 strokes and would much prefer to work on and pay for a 2 stroke

I guess you have? If so whats the difference between a 4 and 2 strokes for a pro? I'm just curious as the FIM brings in a new 125cc class as a way to keep costs down for young upcoming riders?

Anyway this is more about recreational riders like my self than the pros.

jmar wrote:
Pro level riders ride the two stroke bikes past their intended limits. Lot's of rings, pistons, clutch plates, reeds and rods. On a 125 race bike...
Pro level riders ride the two stroke bikes past their intended limits. Lot's of rings, pistons, clutch plates, reeds and rods.

On a 125 race bike?

It's constant work after every ride.
With the 4 stroke you can add valves, valve springs, cam chain to that list. Mitch Payton stated it cost 4 times the money to race a 250f than a 125.
AMA Mowercross! 8/2/2010 3:12pm
8/2/2010 3:12pm
They're just boring....

Also, I think lots of people were lead into the whole 4 stroke thing by all the half truths and miss information that were being trumpeted for a long time by the magazines and all the other hype-pipes, and now the reality of the 4 stroke experience has left them dissapointed and a little indignant.

It pisses people off to realized they fell for outright lies, or subliminal pro-4 Stroke hype such as the type that's just dripping off this commentary from 04, and now realize they were sold into the motorsports version of oregano in a dimebag.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r4MygtUhJPs

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HL49GkxKiOY
ImTheDude
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ImTheDude 8/2/2010 3:26pm
8/2/2010 3:26pm
4s are expensive after you blow them up and
they sound like shit
Dropbear
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Dropbear 8/2/2010 3:58pm
8/2/2010 3:58pm Edited Date/Time 8/2/2010 4:02pm
Because I am placed at a cube disadvantage if I choose to race a 2 stroke as it is of a superior design and creates more power per CC.

If the 2 stroke had just been invented, everyone would want one - or Honda would have it banned Wink

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