when does the B.S. stop?...

jamma10 wrote:

Just for the record...genius, Jimmy Albertson finished 10th the AMA Outdoor champs last season. He currently stands 16th in the World Championship. Another thing, the number...

Just for the record...genius, Jimmy Albertson finished 10th the AMA Outdoor champs last season. He currently stands 16th in the World Championship.

Another thing, the number of MXdN moto wins since 2005 currently stands at.

USA 8
Rest of the World 7

Not really a comprehensive ass whooping when you look at it sensibly is it?

pilotdude wrote:

Hey Jamma, I've been waiting for a GP fan to try to make this claim again. It is nonsense and here's why: First of all, on...

Hey Jamma, I've been waiting for a GP fan to try to make this claim again. It is nonsense and here's why:

First of all, on a team basis, the U.S. is 5-0 with a five year winning streak.

On moto wins, you say it is the USA VS. the Rest of the World. But the U.S.A only gets to enter one team. How many does the rest of the world get to enter again?

Oh right, I remember 19. So it's 19 "rest of the world" teams against one U.S. team and the U.S. has "only" managed 8 moto wins vs 7 for the side with 19 teams in the game.

Get real. If it were 10 United States teams agains 10 "rest of the world" teams, then your claim might be valid. As things stand now, it is NOT a valid one.

There are 2 possibilities: 1) You were not aware of this rather glaring fact or 2) you are being disingenuous. I've give you the benefit of the doubt and say this it is the former.

Masonry wrote:

Then again the US gets to choose from a lot more riders than each individual European country so... I think the MXDN is a little bit...

Then again the US gets to choose from a lot more riders than each individual European country so...

I think the MXDN is a little bit faulty in the GPs vs. Nationals debate because us sending our three best would be like them sending Cairoli, Desalle, and Musquin.

Hank_Thrill wrote:

All humans are piratically the same, with no race or nationality being superior over another. Scientific studies support this.The reason USA dominates the Des Nations has...

All humans are piratically the same, with no race or nationality being superior over another. Scientific studies support this.



The reason USA dominates the Des Nations has less to do with us simply "being American" and more to do with the economic prosperity of the country, population density, square miles of the country, and progression of the sport in this region of the world (which is correlated to those factors). You're never going to see a 3rd world country win the Des Nations, as you're never going to see an over-populated country lacking motocross facilities winning one either. Does it even occur to people that America is just a melting pot of people anyways? Unless a Native American stacked team USA wins the Des Nations, no American team is technically winning it. Take James Stewart for instant. If he is on Team America, and we win, that's nothing more than a victory for South America. And look at Roger Decoster, who heads up team USA nearly every year. The dude is not even from this country!



I actually began a study on this. I may finish it and post it for the '10 Des Nations, when all this nationality bullshit starts to surface again. American's are a very prideful nation. We are also very ignorant in the eyes of other countries around the world.

pilotdude wrote:

Hey Jamma, I've been waiting for a GP fan to try to make this claim again. It is nonsense and here's why: First of all, on...

Hey Jamma, I've been waiting for a GP fan to try to make this claim again. It is nonsense and here's why:

First of all, on a team basis, the U.S. is 5-0 with a five year winning streak.

On moto wins, you say it is the USA VS. the Rest of the World. But the U.S.A only gets to enter one team. How many does the rest of the world get to enter again?

Oh right, I remember 19. So it's 19 "rest of the world" teams against one U.S. team and the U.S. has "only" managed 8 moto wins vs 7 for the side with 19 teams in the game.

Get real. If it were 10 United States teams agains 10 "rest of the world" teams, then your claim might be valid. As things stand now, it is NOT a valid one.

There are 2 possibilities: 1) You were not aware of this rather glaring fact or 2) you are being disingenuous. I've give you the benefit of the doubt and say this it is the former.

Masonry wrote:

Then again the US gets to choose from a lot more riders than each individual European country so... I think the MXDN is a little bit...

Then again the US gets to choose from a lot more riders than each individual European country so...

I think the MXDN is a little bit faulty in the GPs vs. Nationals debate because us sending our three best would be like them sending Cairoli, Desalle, and Musquin.

pilotdude wrote:

They do get to send them. And all the rest of their best. Then they compare those results with our sending a single team of 3...

They do get to send them. And all the rest of their best. Then they compare those results with our sending a single team of 3 (who may or may NOT be our best). If the U.S. got to send ALL of our very best riders, top 20 450 guys and top 10 250 guys:

1. The U.S. would have even more moto wins
2. Several teams in the top 10 would be U.S. teams.

I don't begrudge any rider from any country who is excellent or the fans who support him. I do not appreciate any fan who refuses to compare apples to apples, or refuses to acknowledge the excellence, past or present, of a team whose success and dare I say domination, has been won through blood, sweat, and tears for decades. Don't like that? Think that's not PC? Boo effin hoo.

sharkey wrote:

so really the MXON race is just a gp where 3 americans get to enter just like this weekend. because the way i see it, all...

so really the MXON race is just a gp where 3 americans get to enter just like this weekend. because the way i see it, all the top guys were at GH and just a few us guys, actually that would be harder race than the mxon because the top talent would be there and not a bunch of riders that would be even on the same plain.can someone breakdown the riders on the gp circuit and what country they are from because thus might be pretty interesting. its always pretty intersting how its always the us versus werstern europe and the population between the two is about the same, ones just divided by states and the other countries

sharkey wrote:

us population 309,395,000- germany,81 mil, france 65 mil,uk 62mil,italy 60 mil,australia 22 mil and belgium 10 mil=302 million people. i only included countries i knew had...

us population 309,395,000- germany,81 mil, france 65 mil,uk 62mil,italy 60 mil,australia 22 mil and belgium 10 mil=302 million people. i only included countries i knew had riders in the gps and probably missed some and didnt count alot of countries.im just comparing the series, not individual countries to each other. they are really pretty close in that aspect

sharkey wrote:

us population 309,395,000- germany,81 mil, france 65 mil,uk 62mil,italy 60 mil,australia 22 mil and belgium 10 mil=302 million people. i only included countries i knew had...

us population 309,395,000- germany,81 mil, france 65 mil,uk 62mil,italy 60 mil,australia 22 mil and belgium 10 mil=302 million people. i only included countries i knew had riders in the gps and probably missed some and didnt count alot of countries.im just comparing the series, not individual countries to each other. they are really pretty close in that aspect

hartebreak wrote:

toss out all the illegals and our population would be a hell of alot smaller, and we probably wouldnt lose too many pro motocrossers.

hartebreak wrote:

toss out all the illegals and our population would be a hell of alot smaller, and we probably wouldnt lose too many pro motocrossers.

broman64 wrote:

you are a dreamer. deal with r-e-a-l-i-t-y m-a-n. The over alls... are what m-a-t-t-e-r...
you must be french or german...
BMan-

Masonry wrote:

You aren't really bringing anything to this discussion. In fact, you are making Americans look bad.

broman64 wrote:

this is my discussion, smart guy... get your facts straight or get out...

BMan-

Hank_Thrill wrote:

All humans are piratically the same, with no race or nationality being superior over another. Scientific studies support this.The reason USA dominates the Des Nations has...

All humans are piratically the same, with no race or nationality being superior over another. Scientific studies support this.



The reason USA dominates the Des Nations has less to do with us simply "being American" and more to do with the economic prosperity of the country, population density, square miles of the country, and progression of the sport in this region of the world (which is correlated to those factors). You're never going to see a 3rd world country win the Des Nations, as you're never going to see an over-populated country lacking motocross facilities winning one either. Does it even occur to people that America is just a melting pot of people anyways? Unless a Native American stacked team USA wins the Des Nations, no American team is technically winning it. Take James Stewart for instant. If he is on Team America, and we win, that's nothing more than a victory for South America. And look at Roger Decoster, who heads up team USA nearly every year. The dude is not even from this country!



I actually began a study on this. I may finish it and post it for the '10 Des Nations, when all this nationality bullshit starts to surface again. American's are a very prideful nation. We are also very ignorant in the eyes of other countries around the world.

Masonry wrote:

How would we have more moto wins? We send the best riders available. We have James and that obviously counts for a lot. Villopoto was able...

How would we have more moto wins? We send the best riders available. We have James and that obviously counts for a lot. Villopoto was able to put up results comparable with the European best MX2 rider (except at Budds where he obviously excels). and our MX3 rider usually doesn't set the world on fire. The advantage we have is that among a large American population we can field three riders on one team while nations in Europe are split up so each of their countries can only field at the most two good riders and one who holds them back.

Hank_Thrill wrote:

All humans are piratically the same, with no race or nationality being superior over another. Scientific studies support this.The reason USA dominates the Des Nations has...

All humans are piratically the same, with no race or nationality being superior over another. Scientific studies support this.



The reason USA dominates the Des Nations has less to do with us simply "being American" and more to do with the economic prosperity of the country, population density, square miles of the country, and progression of the sport in this region of the world (which is correlated to those factors). You're never going to see a 3rd world country win the Des Nations, as you're never going to see an over-populated country lacking motocross facilities winning one either. Does it even occur to people that America is just a melting pot of people anyways? Unless a Native American stacked team USA wins the Des Nations, no American team is technically winning it. Take James Stewart for instant. If he is on Team America, and we win, that's nothing more than a victory for South America. And look at Roger Decoster, who heads up team USA nearly every year. The dude is not even from this country!



I actually began a study on this. I may finish it and post it for the '10 Des Nations, when all this nationality bullshit starts to surface again. American's are a very prideful nation. We are also very ignorant in the eyes of other countries around the world.

pilotdude wrote:

"How would we have more moto wins?" You're saying that increasing our presence from 1 team to 10 teams and from 3 riders to 30 would...

"How would we have more moto wins?"

You're saying that increasing our presence from 1 team to 10 teams and from 3 riders to 30 would not increase our number of moto and team wins.

Right.

You are just as thick as you were under your old screen name.

answerthis229 wrote:

We don't even need to send our BEST to Europe in order to win. If we sent a mid-pack AMA Supercross or Moto-X rider, we'd still...

We don't even need to send our BEST to Europe in order to win.
If we sent a mid-pack AMA Supercross or Moto-X rider,
we'd still whoop Europes a$$.

And I know of a few teams that are sending riders
to Europe after this MX season to ride over there.

It's gunna be sic.

jamma10 wrote:

Just for the record...genius, Jimmy Albertson finished 10th the AMA Outdoor champs last season. He currently stands 16th in the World Championship. Another thing, the number...

Just for the record...genius, Jimmy Albertson finished 10th the AMA Outdoor champs last season. He currently stands 16th in the World Championship.

Another thing, the number of MXdN moto wins since 2005 currently stands at.

USA 8
Rest of the World 7

Not really a comprehensive ass whooping when you look at it sensibly is it?

pilotdude wrote:

Hey Jamma, I've been waiting for a GP fan to try to make this claim again. It is nonsense and here's why: First of all, on...

Hey Jamma, I've been waiting for a GP fan to try to make this claim again. It is nonsense and here's why:

First of all, on a team basis, the U.S. is 5-0 with a five year winning streak.

On moto wins, you say it is the USA VS. the Rest of the World. But the U.S.A only gets to enter one team. How many does the rest of the world get to enter again?

Oh right, I remember 19. So it's 19 "rest of the world" teams against one U.S. team and the U.S. has "only" managed 8 moto wins vs 7 for the side with 19 teams in the game.

Get real. If it were 10 United States teams agains 10 "rest of the world" teams, then your claim might be valid. As things stand now, it is NOT a valid one.

There are 2 possibilities: 1) You were not aware of this rather glaring fact or 2) you are being disingenuous. I've give you the benefit of the doubt and say this it is the former.

pilotdude wrote:

"How would we have more moto wins?" You're saying that increasing our presence from 1 team to 10 teams and from 3 riders to 30 would...

"How would we have more moto wins?"

You're saying that increasing our presence from 1 team to 10 teams and from 3 riders to 30 would not increase our number of moto and team wins.

Right.

You are just as thick as you were under your old screen name.

kongols wrote:

No it would not, because there is only 3 moto and 1 team win each year.

broman64 wrote:

I can tell by your avatar that you are a genius...and 2010 will be fine...

BMan-

pilotdude wrote:

"How would we have more moto wins?" You're saying that increasing our presence from 1 team to 10 teams and from 3 riders to 30 would...

"How would we have more moto wins?"

You're saying that increasing our presence from 1 team to 10 teams and from 3 riders to 30 would not increase our number of moto and team wins.

Right.

You are just as thick as you were under your old screen name.

kongols wrote:

No it would not, because there is only 3 moto and 1 team win each year.

pilotdude wrote:

Right. Once again your assertion is: Raising the number of U.S. teams from one to 10 would not increase the number of U.S. team or U.S...

Right. Once again your assertion is: Raising the number of U.S. teams from one to 10 would not increase the number of U.S. team or U.S. moto wins.

Keep talking kongols. You are making my points for me faster than I would have hoped for. More please.



So I guess you are saying that if we increased the number of U.S. teams to 19 and reduced the rest of the world to 1 team, the number of U.S. moto wins and team wins wouldn't increase either. I see.


Tell me, how well can you ride while on those hallucinogens?

pilotdude wrote:

Hey Jamma, I've been waiting for a GP fan to try to make this claim again. It is nonsense and here's why: First of all, on...

Hey Jamma, I've been waiting for a GP fan to try to make this claim again. It is nonsense and here's why:

First of all, on a team basis, the U.S. is 5-0 with a five year winning streak.

On moto wins, you say it is the USA VS. the Rest of the World. But the U.S.A only gets to enter one team. How many does the rest of the world get to enter again?

Oh right, I remember 19. So it's 19 "rest of the world" teams against one U.S. team and the U.S. has "only" managed 8 moto wins vs 7 for the side with 19 teams in the game.

Get real. If it were 10 United States teams agains 10 "rest of the world" teams, then your claim might be valid. As things stand now, it is NOT a valid one.

There are 2 possibilities: 1) You were not aware of this rather glaring fact or 2) you are being disingenuous. I've give you the benefit of the doubt and say this it is the former.

jamma10 wrote:

My mistake was to write Rest of the World instead of Non-US. But you missed the third possibility, which is that I was replying to Answerthis229's...

My mistake was to write Rest of the World instead of Non-US. But you missed the third possibility, which is that I was replying to Answerthis229's specific claim that...


'We don't even need to send our BEST to Europe in order to win. If we sent a mid-pack AMA Supercross or Moto-X rider, we'd still whoop Europes a$$'.


As I said earlier in the thread, I don't have a problem admitting who is the fastest rider/s, or that America is usually able to field the strongest team at the MXdN. But to say American riders whoop ass in Europe every year is just incorrect. An Ass whooping is what Villopoto did, to everyone - including RC in 2007. Thats fair enough. But the MXdN results of recent years don't tell the whole story.


Maybe RC's claim that 'you make your own luck' is true, but many freak incidents have affected the results of the last few MXdN's, and that is what is often ignored. They have not - with the exception of VP in 2007 - been ass whoopings, nor is Jimmy Albertson (who I admire greatly) ass whopping in the GP's.

broman64 wrote:

I can't find where anyone, except you, have mentioned Jimmy Albertson... I have met Jimmy and seen how he responds to fellow riders... He is a...

I can't find where anyone, except you, have mentioned Jimmy Albertson... I have met Jimmy and seen how he responds to fellow riders... He is a kind hearted guy... Was a gifted amatuer and is doing the job in Europe... However you want to spell it out... But, nobody said that Jimmy, flippin', Albertson was whooping anyone's a$$... are you having an understanding episode of some sort?...
BMan-