Posts
953
Joined
2/28/2007
Location
St. Petersburg , FL
US
Edited Date/Time
1/26/2012 10:01pm
After reading this board for a few years and listening to you guys bitch. I think I've figured out a few things. You guys want it both ways. Well, it doesn't work that way. You guys say you want the sport to grow and purses to grow. But you still want Jonnyo Moto to show up with his dad in their pick up truck with the bike they bought with their hard earned money at the local shop. Well, things don't grow and stay the same. Some of you say you want growth, but we still need the privateers. Well, the deal is, if this sport is to grow, things HAVE TO CHANGE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Its that simple. And that involves a more professional image to attract more outside sponsors. That means that Jonnyo and his daddy riding out of their pickup truck has to go. I know you guys don't like nascar, but you know what? Jeff Gordon made more money last year then probably every factory rider and privateer that raced a SX last year combined. If SX/MX is to grow, things will change. It is that simple. Part of the big attraction to nascar for sponsors? A very professional image. Yes, most of the spectators are toothless rednecks, but have you guys been to a SX or outdoor lately? Thats what makes up a large percentage of the fans. You guys DO NOT REPRESENT THE MAJORITY! Did you hear that? You don't! Its that simple. You guys think that you represent the fan base. Well, you don't. The majority of the fan base at SX anymore is either flatbillers from the 909 or rednecks in Atlanta. There are 50,000 people at an SX, and most of them don't ride. They are there to watch someone crash their brains out. Not to watch some title chase, not to watch jonnyo moto and his dad try to get that big break. They don't even know the difference between a privateer and a factory rider. They do not care.
People on hear think that they think they know how things work inside the industry, and most couldn't be farther from the truth. Any time any one comes on here that works inside the industry, you guys shoe them away. If they don't kiss your ass and suck your balls, everyone gets all pissy. People ran off Larry Brooks, and everyone said fine. You think it was just him that was pissed off? He left, and so did others. Paul comes on here and you guys bag on him. Paul has probably been to more pro sx/mx race's then damn near everyone on here combined. He has a better idea of how this shit works then damn near any of you ever will. Forrest tells you guys how it is, and people bitch at him? What the hell? Just because this isn't your fantasy world that you thought it was, that makes him wrong?
The biggest thing I think that cause's issues with all of this. Most of you on here fail to see one big difference. This is a business. Very simple. It is a business to the factory's the privateer teams and the guys out there trying to make it. Yes, they enjoy what they do. But its how they make their house payments. Its how they pay their grocery bill. The big issue, is you guys let your emotions get in the way, and it clouds your judgement and view points. To most of you, this is something you do on the weekends, because you like it. For the guys at the races every week, its their job. Yes, its something they enjoyed when they started, but most of you had that when you started your career, now its how you pay the bills.
I am sure everyone is gonna bag on me and tell me that I am a dick or a dork and I don't know shit about anything. But, hey what the hell do I know? Nothing I guess.
People on hear think that they think they know how things work inside the industry, and most couldn't be farther from the truth. Any time any one comes on here that works inside the industry, you guys shoe them away. If they don't kiss your ass and suck your balls, everyone gets all pissy. People ran off Larry Brooks, and everyone said fine. You think it was just him that was pissed off? He left, and so did others. Paul comes on here and you guys bag on him. Paul has probably been to more pro sx/mx race's then damn near everyone on here combined. He has a better idea of how this shit works then damn near any of you ever will. Forrest tells you guys how it is, and people bitch at him? What the hell? Just because this isn't your fantasy world that you thought it was, that makes him wrong?
The biggest thing I think that cause's issues with all of this. Most of you on here fail to see one big difference. This is a business. Very simple. It is a business to the factory's the privateer teams and the guys out there trying to make it. Yes, they enjoy what they do. But its how they make their house payments. Its how they pay their grocery bill. The big issue, is you guys let your emotions get in the way, and it clouds your judgement and view points. To most of you, this is something you do on the weekends, because you like it. For the guys at the races every week, its their job. Yes, its something they enjoyed when they started, but most of you had that when you started your career, now its how you pay the bills.
I am sure everyone is gonna bag on me and tell me that I am a dick or a dork and I don't know shit about anything. But, hey what the hell do I know? Nothing I guess.
People on hear think that they think they know how things work inside the industry, and most couldn't be farther from the truth. Any time any one comes on here that works inside the industry, you guys shoe them away. If they don't kiss your ass and suck your balls, everyone gets all pissy. People ran off Larry Brooks, and everyone said fine. You think it was just him that was pissed off? He left, and so did others. Paul comes on here and you guys bag on him. Paul has probably been to more pro sx/mx race's then damn near everyone on here combined. He has a better idea of how this shit works then damn near any of you ever will. Forrest tells you guys how it is, and people bitch at him? What the hell? Just because this isn't your fantasy world that you thought it was, that makes him wrong?
[/quote:1617oce9]
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I don't believe motocross will ever be near as big as Nascar.
Nascar has the fan base because the typical 'Johnny Redneck' can relate to driving fast in a circle in a fast car.
Not everyone can relate to motocross and supercross. If you take away average 'JonnyO' who shows up to race in his pick up truck, you take away more fan base.
Its the same reason Formula 1 isn't as big as Nascar.... Formula 1 is WAY better IMO, but you'll have a hard time convincing the general public of that.
The general public wants simple things that they can relate to. Football, Baseball, Basketball, Nascar.
I don't believe motocross will ever be near as big as Nascar.
Nascar has the fan base because the typical 'Johnny Redneck' can relate to driving fast in a circle in a fast car.
Not everyone can relate to motocross and supercross. If you take away average 'JonnyO' who shows up to race in his pick up truck, you take away more fan base.
Its the same reason Formula 1 isn't as big as Nascar.... Formula 1 is WAY better IMO, but you'll have a hard time convincing the general public of that.
The general public wants simple things that they can relate to. Football, Baseball, Basketball, Nascar.[/quote:lec2jqfp]
Your right on part of that. I doubt you would take much of the fan base away if the privateers aren't there, but not a huge amount. The one thing, F1 is WAY bigger then nascar will ever dream of being. In the states F1 isn't as big as nascar, but the US isn't the world. The US thinks what's popular here, must be the same everywhere else.
I don't believe motocross will ever be near as big as Nascar.
Nascar has the fan base because the typical 'Johnny Redneck' can relate to driving fast in a circle in a fast car.
Not everyone can relate to motocross and supercross. If you take away average 'JonnyO' who shows up to race in his pick up truck, you take away more fan base.
Its the same reason Formula 1 isn't as big as Nascar.... Formula 1 is WAY better IMO, but you'll have a hard time convincing the general public of that.
The general public wants simple things that they can relate to. Football, Baseball, Basketball, Nascar.[/quote:x8c5fh6q]
The biggest difference between SX and NASCAR is it takes talent and training to ride. Unfortunately it is also our number one problem. There is not enough talented riders to make SX exciting. It's 90 percent rider and 10% bike. NASCAR is about 180 from that and money can fix a lot of short comings. Think I'm wrong explain how a family name and or a "buy a ride" has gotten someone into the night show or on a National gate. At the competitive level MX and SX will never be NASCAR it takes too much talent.
But you are absolutely right, it is a business and to guys in the trenches is a big deal and it's how they pay the way. My complaint isn't that Johnny pick up truck doesn't get his chance.......he does more in this sport then any other type of racing in my opinion. The problem is if these so called professionals (promoters) would spread the wealth a little more, so that Jeff Gordon doesn't make more than all the racers combined that would be a start. But like in another post where someone complained about making money, until riders who take the most risk here get paid what there worth, this sport won't be taken serious. You are absolutely correct Mx/Sx is a friggin minority group.
I don't pretend to know anyone or think that I would have something to offer the pro side of things. One thing I do concern myself with is that "Johnny pickup truck" isn't forgotten at the local level, because with todays main focus on the front row 300.000 dollar motorhomes in the pits, there are 10x more pickups with a tent out back.
Our sport will grow as the economy lets it. MOST ALL spectators relate to round de round nascar. It's simple they own a truck or a car and relate.......win on Sunday sell on Monday wasn't a phrase coined in Mx. Our sport is to new,(comparitively) to unorganized, and to "special" to become a super hit anytime soon. Its come a long way......
LOL Hey this is a friggin post board where the johnny pickup truck dude like myself can voice an opinion, if it gets read cool, if not well at least it freshin's up the long lost typing skills.
One thing is for sure, I don't have any idea who is and who isn't an "insider" around here, but if one of them does come in here then hey it's a jungle.
DV does ok huh? just a thought.
B. As far as growing the sport, the AMA cerainly hasn't helped with their non-stop bungling. LN, I suspect is far more interested in growing their profit, than growing the sport. One has to wonder WHO exactly is looking out for the future of the sport.
C. Although I never flame the few industry types that wander in and always appreciate their input, from what I saw of Brooks's net escapades, he did himself in. Some folks just don't have the personality or net savvy for it. DV has clearly found a comfortable balance in the way he posts and has fun with it all.
D. "Paul Brians, Professor of English at Washington State University, points out that the original and only sensible version of this saying is “You can’t eat your cake and have it too,” meaning that if you eat your cake you won’t have it any more. People get confused because we use the expression “have some cake” to mean “eat some cake,” and they therefore misunderstand what “have” means in this expression.[1] Alternatively, people understand that "have" and "eat" represent a sequence of actions, so one can indeed "have" one's cake and then "eat" it. Consequently, the literal meaning of the reversed idiom doesn't match the metaphorical meaning."
No charge for that last bit.
You win Daves title...
most recently? here it is.
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=50663
it pretty much details everything in matts rant.
I don't agree with half of what you typed. The fastest kid is always the fastest kid. It don't matter what they drive. If someone has the skills they should get a fair chance to race. You know the fastest kids don't always qualify for LLs. It comes down to some luck as well.
I agree you must have had a bad day. Step back and re read your post. It comes across as very negative to us lower class folk dat don't fit in to your salary range.
I am one of the dads whom drag his trailer and family around every weekend, trying to help my boy reach his dreams. ( thats my job as a father) I'm proud my son is " The future privateer".
I'm done ranting now!
# 184 Logan Dagners Dad
Scott Dagner
this would require [b:3t5z0yz3]PROFESSIONALS[/b:3t5z0yz3] running the show!
I don't believe motocross will ever be near as big as Nascar.
Nascar has the fan base because the typical 'Johnny Redneck' can relate to driving fast in a circle in a fast car.
Not everyone can relate to motocross and supercross. If you take away average 'JonnyO' who shows up to race in his pick up truck, you take away more fan base.
Its the same reason Formula 1 isn't as big as Nascar.... Formula 1 is WAY better IMO, but you'll have a hard time convincing the general public of that.
The general public wants simple things that they can relate to. Football, Baseball, Basketball, Nascar.[/quote:3uf7ofit]
[b:3uf7ofit]The biggest difference between SX and NASCAR is it takes talent and training to ride. [/b:3uf7ofit]Unfortunately it is also our number one problem. There is not enough talented riders to make SX exciting. It's 90 percent rider and 10% bike. NASCAR is about 180 from that and money can fix a lot of short comings. Think I'm wrong explain how a family name and or a "buy a ride" has gotten someone into the night show or on a National gate. At the competitive level MX and SX will never be NASCAR it takes too much talent.[/quote:3uf7ofit]Yep, thank god NASCAR doesn't take talent or training. If it did RC wouldn't be able to just walk in and dominate like he is.
Nascar made it possible for the privateer (they were called independents back in the day) to earn a living on the circuit. They needed the privateers to fill the fields. Eventually the sport grew to were the independents could not keep up but they were replaced by well funded teams that kept the fields full.
Based on what Nascar looks like today I am not sure I want our sport modeled after them.
Pit Row
Everyone wants bigger purses, but no one wants the sport to grow.
How can you expect bigger purses without growth?
Some of you need to make up your minds about what you want, because you can't have it both ways.
Either the sport grows, changes and adapts in order to increase revenues to pay the desired higher purses or you stagnate growth and keep the sport status quo
Choose
Yep, you are right. Anyone can jump in a 3400# land-yacht and go 200mph for hours & hours.
He should realize that just like my job, his job/business is an "at will job" and he can quit, or sell out any time he wants. No one is forcing him to do what he is doing. If he can't pay his bills traveling the country like a rockstar, then he needs to find something else to do. Perhaps they should stick to local races and they can go back to the pick up truck scene and take home local purse money instead.....I'd say they would make more that way.
And TFS actually makes a very, very good point above as far as individual team sponsorship goes......
Sponsors spend a lot of money, but teams are forbidden from passing out decals, t-shirts, hats and other promotional items.
The system has made it where teams can do little more for their sponsors than "there's your logo"
I think what people are missing is this - In both SX and MX, teams are grumbling because the promoters are competing with them, but promoters hold the power. So you do you work to get your sponsors, and they either want those sponsors for themselves, or if yours compete with theirs, they want to hide you and not help you. That's your thanks for working so hard to support the sport and participate.
BBMX can't hand out cans of their sponsor's energy drink, because the series sponsor doesn't want to see them in people's hands. Promoters should be figuring out how to make teams happy, instead of pissed off over stupid things.
This goes on so much we are used to it, and people just grumble and forget why. The reason is too much "MY company before the sport" thinking.[/quote:3am3mtds]
x 100. If I owned a company that was going to spend the $$ to sponsor a sport it would be because I love that sport, and if that meant letting my competition be there so be it. It is dumb that MXA, TWMX,Fox, No Fear, etc. can't have a booth at a National. I have heard these guys can not even hand out stickers to kids.
Right now there is more talent than "rides". I happened a couple years ago in the lites division. There are kids that do possess the right "tools" to make it. Here is a perfect example why teams like Butler Brothers are so important to the sport. Last year a kid on Yamaha of Troy had some great finishes in both MX and SX. He ride wasn't renewed for 2008. In 2008 he has already had a top 5 finish in SX lites . It would have been impossible to do this without a team. You need great equipment, practice facilities, travel accomodations, and more to compete at this level. Without teams like Butler brothers, Team Solitaire, Suzuki City, Richardsons RV, Team ECC,{etc.} what chance would a Kyle Cunningham or Robert Kiniry have? We need these privateer teams for "johnny Privateer". These guys are the new privateers, if you haven't figured that out. The factories only have so many positions they can fill.
Sponsors spend a lot of money, but teams are forbidden from passing out decals, t-shirts, hats and other promotional items.
The system has made it where teams can do little more for their sponsors than "there's your logo"[/quote:34l3hr1k]
So it would seem that this is a MUCH bigger problem than having a local guy in the pits, doesn't it?
But which of those two keeps corporate sponsorship away more?
Post a reply to: You can't have your cake and eat it.....