Is everyone blind???

Edited Date/Time 1/25/2012 12:31am
This is a serious question.

I am neither a CR or JS hater. I am a fan of the sport and I dont subscribe to listening to BS when it is BS. I watch and develop my own opinion from what I believe has happened.

Everyone here is hating on JS for the heat race thing. I think you people are blind. If you watch the video like I did in frame by frame mode JS did not hit the triple any different than usual. However, if you notice Kyle would not have even landed on the downside of the triple. He would have flat landed the well past the downside of the jump. He did not suddenly in the air get more speed. My take is he got a little screwed up on the approach to the triple which probably happened in the rythem section just prior to the take off. Watch the video agin and I am sure you will see what I am talking about. No real blame on either side just a racing incident that tends to happen in the back of the pack, a place JS is not normally near.

I get everyone is a fan of one guy or the other but man, put your BS aside and look at the facts.

The incident in the main was just an incident. Bad timing and position with both guys, but Chad had been following for 4+ laps and had already seen the line JS was taking through the woops (JS on the left and CR on the right) and they were getting close in that corner each lap.

Now it looks like Chad is hurt which isnt good for the series. We need all of the champs out there. James is still the favorite for the title and I am sure even Dungey sees that as real. This will make for an interesting championship just like last year, and with the arrivals of some new threats this should be an even better season than last. With A2 predicted to be a jet ski race anything with the points is possible.

Just my observations.
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Cody24
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1/17/2010 11:02pm
So are you thinking that if Kyle would not have over shot the triple then everything would have been okay?
IoNXe C4P0N3
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1/17/2010 11:06pm
KP should know his speed when hitting a triple that fast stewart had his line and KP over shot that triple to far
Cody24
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1/17/2010 11:08pm
KP overshooting the landing or not, James still cross jumped. Period. If you cant see that I dont know what to tell you.
1/17/2010 11:09pm Edited Date/Time 1/17/2010 11:11pm
What I am saying is that it is not just a clear black and white, this guy is wrong that guy did nothing wrong type of thing. Stuff like this happens when a guy much much faster than the riders around him are in the air together on the first lap of an SX race. I have some real experience here, and I am just wanting to speak some reality for people to consider.

Cody24, what I am saying is that the whole thing is not clear cut. I was at the race and I watched the video again. I am sure if Kyle was not so high and overjumping the triple like he was the results "MIGHT" have been different.

The Shop

MX690
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1/17/2010 11:10pm
I'll take Kyle's view of the situation as he posted on here last night. He had a better view than anyone.
VEGAS711
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1/17/2010 11:16pm
What I am saying is that it is not just a clear black and white, this guy is wrong that guy did nothing wrong type of...
What I am saying is that it is not just a clear black and white, this guy is wrong that guy did nothing wrong type of thing. Stuff like this happens when a guy much much faster than the riders around him are in the air together on the first lap of an SX race. I have some real experience here, and I am just wanting to speak some reality for people to consider.

Cody24, what I am saying is that the whole thing is not clear cut. I was at the race and I watched the video again. I am sure if Kyle was not so high and overjumping the triple like he was the results "MIGHT" have been different.
You need to see the video from the front. I saw it at the stadium and it was very clear Stewart moved over quite a bit. Now all of a sudden that angle is not being shown. It will surface and you will change your opinion.
wfo75080
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1/17/2010 11:18pm
if you try to jump across the track at that angle in that much traffic you better be ready for problems, and that's what he got. just because you might over jump something doesn't give another rider the right to your line. bottom line it was a poor choice by a very talented rider.
race
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1/17/2010 11:20pm
"Is everyone blind???"

No, apparently only you are.

Friday
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1/17/2010 11:24pm
If two riders jump the triple side by side and stay parallel to each other,they will not hit. Even if one rider over or under jumps it. If one rider moves over into another riders line,in the air causing their lines to intersect........then James will cause them to crash.Cool

But to me,the spin factor and then not manning up and apologizing to Kyle,then blaming a crash on Reed ,followed by childish bike tipping tantrum shows a low class, spoiled racer that expects others to bow down before him......It also is my opinion that Dungey was gonna win anyway and was as much in James' head as JLaw was ever in RD's. JMO of course. Whistling
jeffro503
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1/17/2010 11:24pm Edited Date/Time 1/17/2010 11:32pm
I think you need to re-watch that video my friend. You are seeing it differently than 98% of the other people on this board. I am speaking of the JS and Kyle P triple jump wreck here. Js crossed over a good 6-8 feet from the take off to where he landed...........while going right underneath Kyle at the same time. It was 100% James fault! Re-watch it again and get back to us.
Cody24
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1/17/2010 11:25pm
What I am saying is that it is not just a clear black and white, this guy is wrong that guy did nothing wrong type of...
What I am saying is that it is not just a clear black and white, this guy is wrong that guy did nothing wrong type of thing. Stuff like this happens when a guy much much faster than the riders around him are in the air together on the first lap of an SX race. I have some real experience here, and I am just wanting to speak some reality for people to consider.

Cody24, what I am saying is that the whole thing is not clear cut. I was at the race and I watched the video again. I am sure if Kyle was not so high and overjumping the triple like he was the results "MIGHT" have been different.
I understand what your saying. And the results might have been different. But from seeing it from 3 or 4 different angles I cannot see the result being any different with the way stewart jumped from the middle-left side of the face all the way to almost landing on the bales.
jeffro503
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1/17/2010 11:29pm
What I am saying is that it is not just a clear black and white, this guy is wrong that guy did nothing wrong type of...
What I am saying is that it is not just a clear black and white, this guy is wrong that guy did nothing wrong type of thing. Stuff like this happens when a guy much much faster than the riders around him are in the air together on the first lap of an SX race. I have some real experience here, and I am just wanting to speak some reality for people to consider.

Cody24, what I am saying is that the whole thing is not clear cut. I was at the race and I watched the video again. I am sure if Kyle was not so high and overjumping the triple like he was the results "MIGHT" have been different.
Listen.....i explained this in another thread as well. Kyle would NOT of flat landed that jump if james wouldn't of veered over and under him like he did. Kyle saw James move under him , and his first instinct is to pull up on the front of the bike to avoiding making contact with James. I have had that exact same thing happen to me , and being in Kyles spot.....there is NOTHING you can do but just pray!

kyle would have landed nice and smooth if it weren't for James coming over on him like that. It really is that "black and white" ( not a racial thing here BTW) as you put it. that wreck was 100% James fault.
IoNXe C4P0N3
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1/17/2010 11:31pm
What I am saying is that it is not just a clear black and white, this guy is wrong that guy did nothing wrong type of...
What I am saying is that it is not just a clear black and white, this guy is wrong that guy did nothing wrong type of thing. Stuff like this happens when a guy much much faster than the riders around him are in the air together on the first lap of an SX race. I have some real experience here, and I am just wanting to speak some reality for people to consider.

Cody24, what I am saying is that the whole thing is not clear cut. I was at the race and I watched the video again. I am sure if Kyle was not so high and overjumping the triple like he was the results "MIGHT" have been different.
jeffro503 wrote:
Listen.....i explained this in another thread as well. Kyle would NOT of flat landed that jump if james wouldn't of veered over and under him like...
Listen.....i explained this in another thread as well. Kyle would NOT of flat landed that jump if james wouldn't of veered over and under him like he did. Kyle saw James move under him , and his first instinct is to pull up on the front of the bike to avoiding making contact with James. I have had that exact same thing happen to me , and being in Kyles spot.....there is NOTHING you can do but just pray!

kyle would have landed nice and smooth if it weren't for James coming over on him like that. It really is that "black and white" ( not a racial thing here BTW) as you put it. that wreck was 100% James fault.
KP still shouldnt have over shot that triple like that 90% stewarts fault
1/17/2010 11:34pm
I still believe that if Kyle had not been overjumping it by so much and so high things would have been different. Kyle lands on the back of JS bike on the flat of the straight and not on the downside of the jump or in mid air. JS was already landed on the ground when Kyle landed on him.
jeffro503
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1/17/2010 11:35pm Edited Date/Time 4/17/2016 8:07pm
That's what i'm saying though.....he would NOT of over jumped in the first place if Stewart wouldn't have crossed over on him. he pulled up and gained length on the jump from avoiding to hit James. If he would of left the front wheel pointed downward or level , he would of hit the landing ramp perfectly.



Kyle has been doing this a long time too , but in this situation , there was nothing he could do. he lifted the front end of that bike because he knew he was going to hit James and/or land on the tuff blocks as well. he wouldn't of had to do any of this if james wouldn't of came over from about 8' from the left......that's some pretty scary shit.
1/17/2010 11:38pm
I watched Kyle grow up racing and I am not saying he did anything wrong. It just appeared to me that had he not been so high the result may have been different. Trust me when I tell you I hate seeing people crash.
jeffro503
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1/17/2010 11:44pm
I watched Kyle grow up racing and I am not saying he did anything wrong. It just appeared to me that had he not been so...
I watched Kyle grow up racing and I am not saying he did anything wrong. It just appeared to me that had he not been so high the result may have been different. Trust me when I tell you I hate seeing people crash.
Me to dude! It sucks when shit like this happens.
IoNXe C4P0N3
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1/17/2010 11:47pm
jeffro503 wrote:
That's what i'm saying though.....he would NOT of over jumped in the first place if Stewart wouldn't have crossed over on him. he pulled up and...
That's what i'm saying though.....he would NOT of over jumped in the first place if Stewart wouldn't have crossed over on him. he pulled up and gained length on the jump from avoiding to hit James. If he would of left the front wheel pointed downward or level , he would of hit the landing ramp perfectly.



Kyle has been doing this a long time too , but in this situation , there was nothing he could do. he lifted the front end of that bike because he knew he was going to hit James and/or land on the tuff blocks as well. he wouldn't of had to do any of this if james wouldn't of came over from about 8' from the left......that's some pretty scary shit.
the pull up didnt do nothing..he had to much speed off the jump
IceMan446
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1/17/2010 11:51pm Edited Date/Time 1/17/2010 11:55pm
jeffro503 wrote:
That's what i'm saying though.....he would NOT of over jumped in the first place if Stewart wouldn't have crossed over on him. he pulled up and...
That's what i'm saying though.....he would NOT of over jumped in the first place if Stewart wouldn't have crossed over on him. he pulled up and gained length on the jump from avoiding to hit James. If he would of left the front wheel pointed downward or level , he would of hit the landing ramp perfectly.



Kyle has been doing this a long time too , but in this situation , there was nothing he could do. he lifted the front end of that bike because he knew he was going to hit James and/or land on the tuff blocks as well. he wouldn't of had to do any of this if james wouldn't of came over from about 8' from the left......that's some pretty scary shit.
You don't gain length by pulling up on the front of your bike mid flight after your speed and distance is set leaving the lip of that triple. James started near the middle of the triple and landed 2 or 3 feet from the bayles. James looked like to me he some what scrubbed the jump and just like most times when you scrub your bike will move over to what ever side you scrubbed on. I think they both were a lot closer to each other then what they thought. Just like ozzy said....racing incident. Does it suck that it happened, yes, they are both lucky they aren't seriously hurt. Has this happened before by a top level guy, yes. Will it happen again by a top level guy, yes. So let's move on and stop with all of the he said she said bs. All the jabbing back and forth doesn't change shit and the only thing we know forsure is there will be a race next Saturday and 14 other saturdays.
bvm111
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1/18/2010 12:13am Edited Date/Time 4/17/2016 8:07pm
I was watching from the stands right above the incident... JS was looking over his right shoulder and knew he F'ed up.... he caused that 100%.... and the fact that he gave that 1 sentence in his "statement" points to the fact he knows he caused it but called it a "racing incident."

Typical stewart "Im the fastest man so get out of my way" attitude
jeffro503
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1/18/2010 12:15am Edited Date/Time 4/17/2016 8:07pm
Wrong............


I think i can speak from experience. watch the video of what speed played on the highlights of the race that OCscottie put up. Kyle was fine on the take off , and midway ( about over the second mound) James had already started to come in and just about make contact! Kyle's right leg comes off the pegs while he's pulling up on the front of the bike! rear wheel would have hit the landing ramp perfect , but front end was high.........making it "look like" he over shot it!


And besides the fact....it wouldn't have mattered even if Kyle did over jump the dam thing.....he was going to land on James no matter what! James was about underneath him!



Go re-watch the video!





Please go re-watch it. Most of the guys who would disagree with you are all in bed now............which is where i'm heading.


One other thing Kyle himself came in here and explained exactly what happened and what he thought. The video itself proves everything , and that he was in no way at fault for this.



Here is the thread with the video. >>>> http://www.vitalmx.com/...re-is-the-vid,780740



watch it about 10 times over between the 6 and 10 second mark.....and then tell me what you think.
1/18/2010 12:56am
Okay heres the deal... I appreciate everyones comments and concernes on whether or not im okay.. When you have someone who is 4 seconds a lap faster than you,as james was over me in times in practice, who am I kidding making up 4 seconds a lap to me seems impossible hince the reason in every single post ive done ive told everyone i have the up most respect for James Stewart and the whole team. I know it may seem to you guys that it looked like i was going to over jump the triple but when someone is literally scrubbing from one side of the track to the other and goes underneath you then you lift the front wheel up... If you see one of the videos as someone else stated i tried all i could by taking my foot off and lifting as hard as possible... James is so good at staying low and carrying so much speed up the face off a triple and landing it perfectly it blows my mind how he does it... If you watch the lites class on TV you will notice a lot of guys coming up short on the second triple.. The reason this was happening is because the faces on the triples were a lot steeper than usual.. The length is the same week in and week out... While i was coming down before both of us hit the ground i was already on his back.. So he kind of drug me an extra 5 or 10 feet before we both hit the ground.. neither one of us rolled very far we hit the ground and stopped... I dont know what the confusion is here but like i said and this is getting a little out of hand I dont feel as if i was at fault at all... He came over on me in the air and we hit before either one of us landed so if i was over shooting the jump or not we both would have still crashed
IceMan446
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1/18/2010 1:09am
Kyle...from your perspective what do you think should be done? Not trying to stir the pot but as a rider involved what do you think the AMA should do as a recourse? Hope you are alright and can make the next race.
MX690
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1/18/2010 1:14am
No confusion kyle. Like has been said, you had the best view, you were there, you know exactly what happened. Some people just don't want to admit that James screwed up. Pure and simple....... and you don't have to justify what happened either.........Take it easy.
1/18/2010 1:14am
I dont think that the AMA should do anything... I agree it was a racing incident and it is what it is but, at the same time it was a racing incident that could have been prevented if james was a little more patient... I mean he had the heat race in the bag without a doubt i mean stroupe led the whole race
DCL36
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1/18/2010 1:15am
If you jumped any less the only thing that wouldve changed is you would've hit a little bit sooner. If you over jumped it, it wouldve actually helped cause of the trajectory the jumps were shooting most of the riders like you said equaling more hang time, he wouldve possibly had more time to get on the ground and power away just enough to escape.
Quickdraw
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1/18/2010 1:17am
MX690 wrote:
No confusion kyle. Like has been said, you had the best view, you were there, you know exactly what happened. Some people just don't want to...
No confusion kyle. Like has been said, you had the best view, you were there, you know exactly what happened. Some people just don't want to admit that James screwed up. Pure and simple....... and you don't have to justify what happened either.........Take it easy.
Agreed, good luck Kyle
akmx17
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1/18/2010 1:19am
This is a serious question. I am neither a CR or JS hater. I am a fan of the sport and I dont subscribe to listening...
This is a serious question.

I am neither a CR or JS hater. I am a fan of the sport and I dont subscribe to listening to BS when it is BS. I watch and develop my own opinion from what I believe has happened.

Everyone here is hating on JS for the heat race thing. I think you people are blind. If you watch the video like I did in frame by frame mode JS did not hit the triple any different than usual. However, if you notice Kyle would not have even landed on the downside of the triple. He would have flat landed the well past the downside of the jump. He did not suddenly in the air get more speed. My take is he got a little screwed up on the approach to the triple which probably happened in the rythem section just prior to the take off. Watch the video agin and I am sure you will see what I am talking about. No real blame on either side just a racing incident that tends to happen in the back of the pack, a place JS is not normally near.

I get everyone is a fan of one guy or the other but man, put your BS aside and look at the facts.

The incident in the main was just an incident. Bad timing and position with both guys, but Chad had been following for 4+ laps and had already seen the line JS was taking through the woops (JS on the left and CR on the right) and they were getting close in that corner each lap.

Now it looks like Chad is hurt which isnt good for the series. We need all of the champs out there. James is still the favorite for the title and I am sure even Dungey sees that as real. This will make for an interesting championship just like last year, and with the arrivals of some new threats this should be an even better season than last. With A2 predicted to be a jet ski race anything with the points is possible.

Just my observations.
It doesnt matter if he hit it any different he still jumped across which hit kyle.
Gardner37
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1/18/2010 1:32am Edited Date/Time 1/18/2010 1:35am
The only thing that needs to be done now that JS has has put out that garbage press release, is to man up and acknowledge the fact that he took KP out in the heat race with a move that was in bad judgement .

Slicing through the pack is fine but doing it over the tripe on the first lap of a race in traffic is foolhardy at best.

Sure its forgivable, but to go to the length to put up an accusatory post on your website and not mention any regret to the fellow rider YOU scrubbed into is shallow and snobbish.

Leave the AMA out of this thing.
Let men be men. One man child has some people skills to work on. Maybe spend some of that cash of his and get a real PR agent in there.

Maybe borrow one from that shoe company.

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