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Edited Date/Time
3/5/2023 2:02pm
Yeah I know there are probably plenty of threads like this and it's an unpopular opinion but they really should make it one national class . They are talking about RJ Hampshire learning the 450 class ? He's 27 years old . He either should be a few years in to a 450 career already if the 250s are truly a developmental class or just put it on the national level like outdoors . How much better would it be with all the fast guys in one class . Flame away .
See my post in the other thread. It needs an entirely different format. 250 = division 2, 450 = division 1 with some kind of qualification system. Maybe top 3 (or some amount) from previous 250 season automatically qualify and move to 450. Losers in 450 get demoted back to 250. Right now the talent gap between the top riders and rest of the field is massive. Putting all the top riders in 450 and the rest in 250 would result in the best, most competitive racing in both classes. It's not like we are talking about racing go karts vs F1, these are dirt bikes that have a 200cc engine size difference (which itself is probably irrelevant with the amazing bikes they are putting out). The 250s have better lap times sometimes. There is no need to split the top riders into two classes resulting in a handful of riders dominating every week.
So I take it all the down voters like having maybe 5 guys that have a chance of winning each week, the rest a lap or two down?
One 250 class, open to all. Some guys are just better on smaller bikes, some do great on big bores even when they’re young. Let the rider/sponsor decide. Keep the 15 minute races as the dividing line between 450s and 250s, that makes it clear that the 450s are the premier races.
Watching the Lawrence brothers run away from a half of a class every week is getting old. Let ‘‘em race each other!
Would make for way better racing and probably faster and more developed riders. Elite 250 guys spend half the year not really riding against much competition the way it is now. 3-4 guys on each coast, and 1-2 who have a real chance at the title. Combine them, and the entertainment value goes way up.
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Half the number of races that are shorter to begin with, on bikes that are easier to ride. And we wonder why riders struggle so much when they move to 450s..
1 coast under 21, 1 championship graduates you out of it, 1 coast unlimited. Alot of the younger guys could use more development both from a supercross perspective and a marketing perspective. A half season unlimited 250 class could keep some guys racing longer after they have put in time in the 450 class they could drop back down Seely, Bogle, etc
450 class doesn’t even have 5 guys that can realistically win each weekend
I still like the idea of 250s being like a minor league, where you have to earn a 450 spot. But having it open is also preferable to the current setup. I just think it won't fix the problem of splitting the best competitors up. If you have the 250 open, rather than combine it with 450 or have the minor/major league setup, some of the better riders may choose one class over the other for whatever reason. There just are not enough elite supercross riders to stack both classes.
I don't understand how the powers that be do not understand this. Maybe they do and it's all just politics with Feld, the AMA, the manufacturers, etc.
Yep, ridiculous Jett makes a million dollars racing half a series. If they are going to pay these guys full time salaries have them race a full series. If they want to keep it a regional development class it needs a salary cap.
"I still like the idea of 250s being like a minor league, where you have to earn a 450 spot."
Most guys that have a 450 ride have a 250 championship to their name. I say the current system of earning a 450 ride works just fine.
It's not a true system of earning it though when it depends on finding a team that will hire you, or when some riders can choose which class to race. It's like some half ass hybrid system right now that leaves a lot of good riders out of jobs. Admittedly, to do something like I am proposing is a major shakeup with a lot of logistical, contractual changes that would need to be made. It will likely never happen without a new series opening up. But it is a proven system in other sports that results in the best competition, the most opportunity (based on merit) for riders, and the best experience for fans.
This is an option that has been talked about and it's a great one. This was it doesn't cut jobs out and has all the young guns in the class together.
Development is for amateur racing. And there is not enough elite talent to keep splitting the riders up. I also think the current setup is already overly complicated and needs to be simplified.
Elite talent belongs in the 450 class. This would allow development and the 250 class gets the same coverage and many times offers better racing anyway.
So are you saying the guys that currently have 450 factory rides didn't earn them?
It would certainly help the younger rider get ready for the big leagues, but most importantly us fans would absolutely love it.
Winning it will carry more weight too even for the older riders.
MotoGP has the perfect format.
There isn't really amateur supercross aside from a handful of events. Splitting the 250 class maintains the 450 class premier status. This arrangement would create 3 distinct classes unlike the current confusing structure.
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I've said it for years. Then you always get the counter argument that there will be less rides and jobs around, which is a ridiculous take. Nobody is pushing for a regional 450 class to create more jobs, the current 250 class has lots of old riders in it (you can't call it a development class anymore) and the depth isn't great. Combine it and add more 250 future races.
Keep the east/west as a privateer/rookie series, scrap futures. if you finish top 3 in either series you've gotta go up.
Then have a pro 250 series that does all 17 rounds.
The top 250 teams are at every round anyway.
If you combine the two coasts. You expect the 250 guys to run a full schedule like the 450s? Or have 450s only at half of the rounds? The separate coasts also benefits the smaller teams that don’t have a budget to run the full series. Just be happy we get the east west shoot-out.
250s at every round with all the heavy hitters . I don't understand where you're coming from with 450s at half the rounds
Two strokes didn’t have this problem because most grown men were too big for a 125cc machine
the 250 four stroke is plenty for a lot of different sized guys so it’s easier for older guys, taller guys, heavier guys to stick around the 250 class.
Privateers will be impacted by a new structure. Maybe they need their own main event…idk
Keep the futures and make 250 one class .
How could it not affect the amount of rides? Less rides, less mechanics? Do you think Mitch would take 6 guys out for one series? Well, that's a bad example. He might have to if he wants one of them to finish...
The split 250 East / West class adds excitement value to the shows entertainment value.
2 kickoff shows. More East/West shows. Final round East/West showdown.
Not at all. But think how much better the competition and the will to win would get when the riders only choice to race 450, and remain in the class, is to continue winning and/or doing well. There are guys in 450 right now that do not belong there, and other guys in 250 that are too good and should be in 450. A promotion/demotion system would solve this almost immediately and we would have incredible racing in each division, where a much larger number of riders are capable of winning each week. Lots of people here want to talk about "sandbagging", old guys in 250, etc. Forget about all this and put the most closely matched racers by speed together in the same class!
This intrigued me but I see a few potential problems that seem rather significant, such as where do you draw the line to what is considered "factory"? Yes I know what a factory team is, but what if a privateer has an unlimited budget and engine/suspension machine shops, etc.? And what is to stop sandbagging in this arrangement? The biggest problem would probably be that there are only so many factory teams and there just wouldn't be enough riders. They are not going to go out and double their payroll.
Probably not, he would settle for 3-4 guys (+ fill-ins). Maybe have 6 riders but two of them would be younger kids racing the actual futures development class.
We have 250 champions and contenders that are close to and even in some cases in their 30s and these guys are making 500k+ in a season. It's ridiculous that the class is still split. As for the less jobs part, sure there would probably be a tiny decrease in factory 250 rides and grips and graphics jobs. But to be honest, i don't really care. And there would be a trickledown effect to the real Futures development class.
The most important thing is to put out a good product. And a full combined 250 class is a much better product than two regional 250 classes.
I agree there needs to be more than one class if we want a good pool of talented riders to keep coming up. A dream configuration for me (but I don't have hopes of it ever happening) would be to see at least two classes, three even better, all OPEN. With each class being a different tier, riders having to qualify and fight to keep their place in each tier. If they don't, they fall to next tier and can try and requalify again for the higher tier. Let the riders ride whatever bike they want. Would love to see a mix of bikes and how they do against each other. We all know it's not all just about raw power and that 450s already have too much power sometimes for the tracks. 250s get the same if not better lap times sometimes. Many many years ago, before comrade GuyB gave me the boot, I said the same thing. I referred to the English football league, the best league in the world, which follows this system for teams.
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