What PED's are recommended for improved performance/recovery and healing?

Kenny Lingus wrote:

Drink massive amounts of bull semen. That's the word on the street.

plowboy wrote:

Yeah, but it must be ingested straight from the source to have any effect. It's a risky procedure but worth it they say.

yamaharider471 wrote:

I dont know but Frank Thomas keeps trying to get me to buy Nugenix

oldblood wrote:

what do the race horses get

yamaharider471 wrote:

I dont know but Frank Thomas keeps trying to get me to buy Nugenix

DoctorJD wrote:

Frank Thomas? Don't you mean, "The Big Hunk"?

Kenny Lingus wrote:

Drink massive amounts of bull semen. That's the word on the street.

plowboy wrote:

Yeah, but it must be ingested straight from the source to have any effect. It's a risky procedure but worth it they say.

Kenny Lingus wrote:

Straight out of the tap, you say?

gjbruny wrote:

disclaimer.... this is going to be long winded. having said that, if you are in your late 30s or older this may be worth reading if...

disclaimer.... this is going to be long winded. having said that, if you are in your late 30s or older this may be worth reading if you have heard of or thought about hormone replacement.

another disclaimer... i have never smoked a cigarette, smoked weed, put a chew in my mouth or done any sort of drugs in my life..... except for the fact that i have taken PEDs (or steroids as we used to call it back in the day).

one last disclaimer.... i am not going to spell check anything so sorry if my spelling or punctuation pisses anyone off.... i know that really gets a few guys spooled up around here.

it started off from bodybuilding. right after high school i got into bodybuilding. i was always heavily into athletics but not gifted enough to take sports past high school. i was strong as an ox as a kid and some of my lifting records still stand at my high school some 26 years later. as i got into college i just focused on weights and about half way through my freshmen year i met a kid that was starting to compete as a bodybuilder. i was hooked. i loved the building of the body as well as the nutrition side of it. i competed 100% naturally for 2 years. however, within the first year i realized that most anyone that was competitive at any weight class was using something. there are very very very few people genetically gifted enough to compete and actually be competitive that are not using something. the heavier the weight class, the more they are using and the longer they have been using.

long story short, i was scared to death to use any "drug" and i therefore researched for over a year before i took anything. now back then, there weren't nearly the laws nor the stigma attached to steroids and i actually had a doc and a pharmacist (both were friends an NO.... they absolutely did not provide me with anything other than guidance as to what was "safe" and what was not as safe). i competed for another 3 years while using the drugs. in that time i went from a lean 165lbs (lean as in 6-8% fat.... not lean as in ready to step on stage) to 216lbs with roughly the same body fat. the largest i competed at was just under 193lbs which may not sound like much but i am 5'8" on a good day and the skin folds on my belly were as thin as the skin folds on my penis.... ripped was an understatement.

i stayed away from all oral drugs with the exception of fairly small doses of anavar. everything else was injectable (which is real fun for a guy that hates needles). the base drug for all bodybuilders is testosterone cypianate with the ananthate version being a close second only because the ananthate is painful. testosterone is 1:1 androgenic to anabolic. androgenic meaning it gives us men our manly attributes (thicker skin, facial/body hair deeper voices etc) and anabolic meaning constructive or building. the stronger anabolic drugs are 3:1 anabolic to androgenic. this is why they have the ability to put so much muscle on a person in a relatively short amount of time.

there was a ton to learn and i am glad i had the guidance of both a physician and a pharmacist. there is such a multitude of drugs out there and some can have some serious side effects. most of the guys in the gyms rely on "bro science" and came out with a lot of unwanted side effects. also, some drugs work differently and are used for different times during the bodybuilding season. for instance some drugs aromatize (or convert) to estrogen more than others. these are the drugs that are never used shortly before a competition because they cause subcutaneous water retention and make a person "smooth" or soft looking. others like trenbolone (mentioned above) have very little aromatase factors and are actually used pre-contest to give the person a much harder look.

they all have side effects... some almost not detectable and others are much more so. a steroid that most people have heard of is Decadurobolin or just "deca." super common in all sports. what you don't hear about that much is "deca dick" or the inability to have an erection. it happens with a number of the anabolics. one of the scariest has to do with red blood cell production. more specifically the increased red blood cell production. the more informed athletes that used PEDs get their blood tested at least every 6 months to ensure that their red blood cell counts are not to high. as your red blood cells increase, the viscosity of your blood increases. too high and you are primed for a stroke or heart attack as your blood gets too thick. i remember an interview with Lance Armstrong where he said his trainer used to say in a thick accent "all you need are the red cells." endurance athletes want the extra red cells for their oxygen carrying capacity. its a wonder that more endurance athletes haven't dropped dead from the levels that i have heard them having.

so here is my take on my experience with them. i took them in cycles for 3 years. i stopped after i had gotten engaged, was about to start a career (a real career) and new laws had come into play that made having them a serious crime. i never once had "roid rage." in fact, i was never in a better mood. i never got acne (though i would say i had a few extra zits than normal). when on the sauce my nuts were in fact 1/3 their normal size (makes sense... they werent needed so they atrophied). once i made the decision to stop using them, my strength and physical size were back to my 100% natural size within 1 year no matter how hard i trained and i would say back to within 80% within 6-8 months.

how did i feel while on it.... in all honesty.... AMAZING! i was always in a great mood. i had the ability to study in school much more intensely and for longer durations. i was full of energy (not spastic, just always ready for anything and never tired until it was time to call it a day). never wanted to be caught in sweat pants because woodies had to have happened 50 times/day (your sex drive is largely controlled by your testosterone and i was injecting 100 times the amount naturally found in my body... if memory serves, about 600mg/ week). i was bigger, stronger and faster than i had ever been. i could recover from workouts insanely fast (which is a big part of the reason the drugs work so well). i just generally had an amazing sense of wellbeing.

having said that, these are not the drugs that someone would want to use for an endurance sport like motocross or GNCC racing. at least not at the levels bodybuilders use. some steroids yes (testosterone for sure) but just to recover faster, not to look like the hulk. more mass requires more oxygen, thus the reason marathon runners don't look like Arnold Schwarzenegger.

fast forward to my late 30s... i started noticing some things that i just attributed to getting older i felt as though i were getting moodier, had less energy, had troubles recovering from workouts, riding, working hard around my ranch etc. i also felt as though it took longer to recover from injuries. a good friend of mine who is 10 years older than i am suggested that i go see a doc here in town that specializes in mens health and hormone replacement therapy. turns out that back then he had already been seeing him for a couple years and he said what i was explaining to him were his exact symptoms. turns out his testosterone levels were really low and that his life had changed dramatically for the better since being on TRT (testosterone replacement therapy). years went by and i never gave it much thought but every so often, we would be talking and i would be complaining about something and he would say.... "you need to go see dr #$%^@" and get your levels tested and he would remind me how great he felt. in 2017 i was diagnosed with an intradural extramedulary tumor at the C2 nerve root. the short version is that its a small benign pea size tumor inside my spinal cord. the docs think that theres a good chance that it could have been caused from one of my 2 neck injuries i had as a kid and believe it could have been in me for decades. its not growing (at least appreciably at the moment) but has caused some weird neurological issues that i had noticed for years but came to a head in 2017. most of it is just sensory stuff mixed with bouts of feeling motion sick for no reason. at first i thought this was the reason i had the mood issues etc mentioned above but my buddy still insisted to go get my testosterone levels checked. a year ago this month i decided what could it hurt so i got tested (i was 43 at the time). "normal" range (depending on who is testing you) is somewhere between 340 and 900 for men 18 to as old as they come... its a massive range. i was 206. the doc joked with me saying i was ready to buy feminine hygene products.

before he had told me what my results were, he asked what brought me in. i told him that i just didn't feel like i used to. i felt like i had half the energy i used to. my drive to work as hard as i used to was way down (both personal and professional). and the biggest thing.... i didn't feel like i dreamed anymore. not that i didn't dream when i slept but i didn't look forward to things in the future like used to... especially the little things in life. now don't get me wrong, i didn't want to go jump off the nearest bridge but my general enthusiasm for life just wasn't what it was.

he told me that what i was telling him were classic signs of low testosterone and that i had 3 options... the first was do nothing. the second was to try an oral drug called clomaphine (it is a drug that works with the HPA axis to help us produce more testosterone... we as body builders used to take it while coming off a cycle to kick our own endogenous testosterone back into production). they have mixed results with this method but some do really well on it. number 3 was to get on a weekly injection of testosterone. this is what my friend has been doing for 10+ years. he said that he would happily help me with any method i wanted. in the long run we decided the weekly injections would be the route i would go. i give myself the shot every thursday morning right when my alarm goes off. not a fun way to wake up but in all honesty, it absolutely is painless. still not the way to wake up for a guy that has always feared needles. lol

now this is not a doc that just prescribes this because he can make a ton of money doing this. he is one of our leading ER docs in town who had gone through a head injury that messed with his pituitary gland pretty well shutting off his own production of testosterone. after years of not knowing what was wrong and feeling really lousy, a colleague of his suggested getting his own testosterone tested. he was extremely low and after a very short time on the replacement therapy it had made such an impact on his life that he decided to go back and get more training on the subject. he has said that he has actually thought about leaving the ER to work with men on this subject full time because he feels like he has more of a positive impact on peoples lives than he does in the ER. needless to say i trust the guy and he is now my doc and prescribes TRT to me.

so how do i feel now right at 1 year after starting? AMAZING! now don't get me wrong, i am not taking super human levels of testosterone like i did back in my bodybuilding days. i inject 120mg once a week and at my last blood test i was floating around 1100. yes that is slightly higher than what is considered normal but there are people who are naturally much higher than that. 200mg is kind of the gold standard dose that most docs start people off at. i feel that my energy is back, my drive to work and work hard is back. i'm not tired until its time to go to bed. and though i felt like my wife and i had a very good sex life, it is insanely good now (thank god my wife has a libido like an 18 year old man lol). physically, i havent felt this good or looked like this since i was in my 20s. in fact, i didn't realize the drastic physical change until this past winter when we got back from kauai. we were looking through pictures and i about shit myself when i saw a pic of the two of us with our surfboards. i mean i knew i was getting bigger stronger, and losing fat but i didn't realize as to what extent. that inspired me to set some goals for my 44th bday. now mind you i have never lost the urge to workout and workout hard. i even have a pretty extensive gym in my house so i have maintained a level of strength. but i decided i wanted to bench press twice my bodyweight (i got that), 44 wide grip pullups (im stuck at 36), 475lb ass to calf squat (stuck at 460) and 100 dips (got that easily) by my 44th bday. in all honesty i physically look about 90% of what i did when i was in my early 20s prior to taking any PEDs. now granted all the aches and pains are still there but even then my mental outlook is such that they don't bother me as much.

most importantly, i have that zest for life again.... i dream.... i look forward to things in the future big or small. i just feel like me again.

now along with the testosterone i also have to take an aromatase inhibitor. we have enzymes in our body that break testosterone down into estrogen. this is something i took as a bodybuilder as well to keep estrogen under control. this is very important not only because we don't want all the unwanted side effects of estrogen like gynocomastia (aka bitch tits), water retention etc.... it is also known that increased estrogen levels can "wake up" the prostate cancer gene that we as all men carry. as we age, our bodies start to decrease test production but increase estrogen production. the beauty of monitoring and controlling my estrogen is that it is thought to decrease the likelihood of prostate cancer.

when i first started TRT, i was embarrassed to tell anyone. now it has such a positive impact on my life i tell everyone which is the reason i felt the need to mention it here.... i know "Jonny Depp" isn't a "spring chicken" and while he may have been joking with this thread... he may have had a little curiosity about PEDS. and on the subject of PEDs.... unless you are dealing with a doc directly in guiding you, DO NOT DO IT. there is so much science behind it that a guy or gal could really damage their body if they just randomly start trying different performance enhancing drugs.

but if you are a guy in your mid 30s or older and just noticing that you arent yourself anymore, think about getting your test levels tested. it might be the best PED you ever took that made you feel like you again.

sorry for the novel, just thought maybe it might be of help to someone

Asselstine wrote:

Will you continue with these injections for life or will you reach an age where you'll come off of it? This is a big reason while...

Will you continue with these injections for life or will you reach an age where you'll come off of it? This is a big reason while I never went down that road when I was big into lifting. It turns into a life long thing. I'm sure I'll eventually get on HRT but I just think of how many years I'd be injecting.

Asselstine wrote:

Will you continue with these injections for life or will you reach an age where you'll come off of it? This is a big reason while...

Will you continue with these injections for life or will you reach an age where you'll come off of it? This is a big reason while I never went down that road when I was big into lifting. It turns into a life long thing. I'm sure I'll eventually get on HRT but I just think of how many years I'd be injecting.

MXOHIOGUY wrote:

Here’s the honest truth about TRT …. TRT is awesome and can be great but there’s a lot of pitfalls. TRT is the most over prescribed...

Here’s the honest truth about TRT …. TRT is awesome and can be great but there’s a lot of pitfalls. TRT is the most over prescribed drug right now in America.

When you start TRT you’ll feel like a GOD for maybe a year or so(give or take). After that time period and your body adjusts and the fun turns into a lot of work, frustration and money. The hardest part of TRT for many is finding a doctor that really knows what they are doing. Most guys will bounce from doc to doc and eventually give up or spend an ass load using online labs/doctors. They key with TRT is finding balance and finding that balance is super tough.

Pros
• You’ll feel invincible. You’ll feel 17 but have a mind of a 30 something , which is totally awesome..
• Riding endurance and aggression will go thru the roof
• You’ll crave working out
• Your sex drive will be insane
• Recovery time is zero
• Mind clarity/no fog
• Unreal confidence in yourself
• In most cases insurance cover labs and testosterone
Cons
• Once you start you can’t stop, TRT is for life ..
• 2 injections a week or more depending if you add HCG to your program. Say if you start at 35 and stop at 70, at bare minimum 3,600 injections in a lifetime
• In a lot of guys you’ll start balding sooner than later. It doesn’t cause baldness but jump starts it sooner than later
• You have to adhere to a pretty strict injection schedule no matter what
• Pretty good chance you’ll have to take other drugs to combat issues that pop up from taking testosterone
• Your sex drive will be insane, so insane that there’s a good chance your wife or girlfriend won’t be able to keep up
• Finding a good doctor that really knows TRT is really tough or expensive
• There really hasn’t been any long-term studies on long-term use of TRT
• Infertility
• In a lot of states test is becoming hard to get and is constantly on backorder
• In most cases your balls will shrivel some or a lot. I know a guy that his balls shriveled so much it became painful
• You have to work out regularly and can’t stop or you’ll quickly pack on pounds
• You’ll eat like animal and you really have to eat clean because of this.
• If you do decide to quit, restarting your system can be tough if not impossible.
• ED
• There’s too much bad info online
• There’s zero proof on any health benefits from TRT.

Personally I wouldn’t suggest anyone to start TRT unless they absolutely needed it. The range for men is 200 to 1,100 and one man might feel awesome at 210 and another might feel like shit. A higher number doesn’t necessarily mean better. I would suggest doing cycles throughout the year, it’s easier to restart your system that way. I only started because I was curious one winter. I purchased some from overseas and did one long cycle and felt great. Roughly a year later I heard a stupid commercial on the radio about a Low T center. I dealt with doctor that only cared about money and very easily I got a script for T. For the last few years I’ve bounced around from doc to doc and still haven’t found a knowledgeable one to this day. I really don’t think I needed it to begin with even though I was sitting around a 250 level..

I am on week 4 of quitting after 4 years. I feel like super ran down and like I am walking around with a weighted vest. My mind is foggy and I really have to bite my tongue because my moods right now are a little out of whack.

RCF wrote:

Are you using any nolvadex or Clomid your estrogen levels are probably through the roof.

RCF wrote:

Are you using any nolvadex or Clomid your estrogen levels are probably through the roof.

WCRider wrote:

https://bluecloud.org/post-cycle-therapy/

olds cool wrote:

You guys do realize that this probably means there will be guys with funny accents carrying piss cups roaming around the pits at LL’s next year...

You guys do realize that this probably means there will be guys with funny accents carrying piss cups roaming around the pits at LL’s next year, don’t ya!

RCF wrote:

Are you using any nolvadex or Clomid your estrogen levels are probably through the roof.

WCRider wrote:

https://bluecloud.org/post-cycle-therapy/

RCF wrote:

If you use that over-the-counter stuff you'll be going bra shopping with your wife

RCF wrote:

Are you using any nolvadex or Clomid your estrogen levels are probably through the roof.

WCRider wrote:

https://bluecloud.org/post-cycle-therapy/

RCF wrote:

If you use that over-the-counter stuff you'll be going bra shopping with your wife

WCRider wrote:

If you don't use a PCT, you will need a bra and you want commit suicide... Clomid + Nolvadex (tamoxifen citrate) : Day 1 : 300mg...

If you don't use a PCT, you will need a bra and you want commit suicide...

Clomid + Nolvadex (tamoxifen citrate) :

Day 1 : 300mg + 40mg Nolva
Day 2/11 : 100mg + 20mg Nolva
Day 12/22 : 50mg + 20mg Nolva

This is the standard protocol for relaunch your balls.

Black Diesel Bomber wrote:

MXOHIOGUY - how long were you doing the TRT? gjbruny - it sounds like you are just getting started and are on cloud 9. I think...

MXOHIOGUY - how long were you doing the TRT?

gjbruny - it sounds like you are just getting started and are on cloud 9. I think you got a lot of guys excited until they read MXOHIOGUY's post.

I would like to hear from more long term TRT patients who've been taking shots for several years.


For now, this is the only options that seems "safe" for boosting T levels:

Here are 8 evidence-based ways to increase testosterone levels naturally:
1. Exercise and Lift Weights.
2. Eat Protein, Fat and Carbs.
3. Minimize Stress and Cortisol Levels.
4. Get Some Sun or Take a Vitamin D Supplement.
5. Take Vitamin and Mineral Supplements.
6. Get Plenty of Restful, High-Quality Sleep.
7. Take Some of These Natural Testosterone Boosters
8. Follow a Healthy Lifestyle and Avoid Estrogen-like Compounds

https://www.healthline.com/nutrition/8-ways-to-boost-testosterone

Black Diesel Bomber wrote:

MXOHIOGUY - how long were you doing the TRT? gjbruny - it sounds like you are just getting started and are on cloud 9. I think...

MXOHIOGUY - how long were you doing the TRT?

gjbruny - it sounds like you are just getting started and are on cloud 9. I think you got a lot of guys excited until they read MXOHIOGUY's post.

I would like to hear from more long term TRT patients who've been taking shots for several years.


For now, this is the only options that seems "safe" for boosting T levels:

Here are 8 evidence-based ways to increase testosterone levels naturally:
1. Exercise and Lift Weights.
2. Eat Protein, Fat and Carbs.
3. Minimize Stress and Cortisol Levels.
4. Get Some Sun or Take a Vitamin D Supplement.
5. Take Vitamin and Mineral Supplements.
6. Get Plenty of Restful, High-Quality Sleep.
7. Take Some of These Natural Testosterone Boosters
8. Follow a Healthy Lifestyle and Avoid Estrogen-like Compounds

https://www.healthline.com/nutrition/8-ways-to-boost-testosterone

49weasel wrote:

4 years.

RCF wrote:

I agree with you, the link that you posted though it's for an over-the-counter product.I understand it's talks about proper PCT but it seemed like it...

I agree with you, the link that you posted though it's for an over-the-counter product.I understand it's talks about proper PCT but it seemed like it was pushing they're useless pills. Also the cycle they list are too Short, you should go at least six weeks.

Black Diesel Bomber wrote:

MXOHIOGUY - how long were you doing the TRT? gjbruny - it sounds like you are just getting started and are on cloud 9. I think...

MXOHIOGUY - how long were you doing the TRT?

gjbruny - it sounds like you are just getting started and are on cloud 9. I think you got a lot of guys excited until they read MXOHIOGUY's post.

I would like to hear from more long term TRT patients who've been taking shots for several years.


For now, this is the only options that seems "safe" for boosting T levels:

Here are 8 evidence-based ways to increase testosterone levels naturally:
1. Exercise and Lift Weights.
2. Eat Protein, Fat and Carbs.
3. Minimize Stress and Cortisol Levels.
4. Get Some Sun or Take a Vitamin D Supplement.
5. Take Vitamin and Mineral Supplements.
6. Get Plenty of Restful, High-Quality Sleep.
7. Take Some of These Natural Testosterone Boosters
8. Follow a Healthy Lifestyle and Avoid Estrogen-like Compounds

https://www.healthline.com/nutrition/8-ways-to-boost-testosterone