Team orders

Andy_Greenney 4/30/2017 11:12am
4/30/2017 11:12am
Katoomey wrote:
circus might be too harsh, but if AMA is going to allow this, then you are right, it is not a competition, it is an exhibition.

If the AMA are going to allow MM to make a mistake on the last lap and get away with it? That is all we 'know', anything else is speculation.
Reality is there is NO WAY to stop a rider from riding below their max to manipulate a result.
Andy_Greenney 4/30/2017 11:13am
4/30/2017 11:13am
MXisLIFE wrote:
When does a sport based individual performance become a team sport?

When someone else is paying you a wage, bikes, parts, rigs and practice facilities....it's no longer a personal endeavour.
Brownstone322 4/30/2017 11:20am
4/30/2017 11:20am Edited Date/Time 4/30/2017 11:35am
Andy_Greenney wrote:
If the AMA are going to allow MM to make a mistake on the last lap and get away with it? That is all we 'know'...
If the AMA are going to allow MM to make a mistake on the last lap and get away with it? That is all we 'know', anything else is speculation.
Reality is there is NO WAY to stop a rider from riding below their max to manipulate a result.
What is so hard for people to understand about this? It's ALWAYS some kinda "mistake" or "mechanical issue" that allows the trailing teammate to pass. So, yeah, any rule against it is meaningless.

Question for you, Andy. Your profile says you're from Britain. Are MXGP fans in Europe this ignorant of race craft? I've always thought AMA motocross (particularly Supercross) pandered to a low-end demographic. How do you think people would react if Coldenhoff let Cairoli through just the same? (Which he would, of course; I have a hard time picturing Coldenhoff actually holding a lead in the late laps, but hypothetically speaking.)
William
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William 4/30/2017 11:25am
4/30/2017 11:25am Edited Date/Time 4/30/2017 11:31am
Monte122 wrote:
Any other Team or Team mate would have done the exact same thing if they were in that situation. If you don't believe that, well... you...
Any other Team or Team mate would have done the exact same thing if they were in that situation.

If you don't believe that, well... you don't know much about team sports.

It has been done many times before, and yes not only in other sports but also in sx and mx.

No one has been cheated out of anything. I'm a Tomac fan and feel bad for him, he just had a bad night, it happens.
William wrote:
How would you feel if Tomac had recovered to finish 5th ? or 4th ? How would....Marvin entering that right hander very slow and then braking...
How would you feel if Tomac had recovered to finish 5th ? or 4th ? How would....Marvin entering that right hander very slow and then braking hard (no reason) and turning left so blatantly make you feel about things ?
Monte122 wrote:
Your comment is irrelevant, because that didn't happen. I'm just pointing out the fact that Team tactics have been used before. To answer your question, I...
Your comment is irrelevant, because that didn't happen. I'm just pointing out the fact that Team tactics have been used before.

To answer your question, I would feel the same way, good racing either way. Vegas is going to be good.
Ahh,..but scenarios or possibilities ARE relevant when it comes to deeming tactics nefarious, illegal or forbidden...That is how rules are made.. by looking at all real possibilites as it relates to a certain action and weighing it.....
I will give another...You are "cool" with what happened and believe it is just part of it....Well if that is the case then..... If two riders are in a heated championship battle, 2 points separated, going in to Vegas..Is it okay for the rider's teammates or any other rider to blatantly impede the progress, take the contender out entering the corner, pull over and give spots up intentionally...where it is an obvious manipulation of the championship outcome ??
Yes scenarios matter and are relevant to track antics and tactics...Simply put...what Musquin did, could have decided the Championship if Tomac would have finished fourth in Rutherford...And it still could if Dungey has a bad Vegas and ends up winning the Championship by 3 points or less.

The Shop

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Andy_Greenney 4/30/2017 11:33am
4/30/2017 11:33am
Brownstone322 wrote:
What is so hard for people to understand about this? It's ALWAYS some kinda "mistake" or "mechanical issue" that allows the trailing teammate to pass. So...
What is so hard for people to understand about this? It's ALWAYS some kinda "mistake" or "mechanical issue" that allows the trailing teammate to pass. So, yeah, any rule against it is meaningless.

Question for you, Andy. Your profile says you're from Britain. Are MXGP fans in Europe this ignorant of race craft? I've always thought AMA motocross (particularly Supercross) pandered to a low-end demographic. How do you think people would react if Coldenhoff let Cairoli through just the same? (Which he would, of course; I have a hard time picturing Coldenhoff actually holding a lead in the late laps, but hypothetically speaking.)
I wouldn't call it ignorance of race craft, I would call it courtesy to a team mate. Sure if it was the start of the serious I would call BS, if MM had physically hindered or interfered with Tomacs race I would also call BS.
If MM had just stayed behind Dungey this would obviously be a non issue. I wouldn't ever want to see a number 1 and 2 rider ala F1, but that's not the situation here.
Mini Elsinore
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Mini Elsinore 4/30/2017 11:36am
4/30/2017 11:36am
I understand.
I also know who I am now rooting for.
Monte122
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Monte122 4/30/2017 11:47am
4/30/2017 11:47am
William wrote:
How would you feel if Tomac had recovered to finish 5th ? or 4th ? How would....Marvin entering that right hander very slow and then braking...
How would you feel if Tomac had recovered to finish 5th ? or 4th ? How would....Marvin entering that right hander very slow and then braking hard (no reason) and turning left so blatantly make you feel about things ?
Monte122 wrote:
Your comment is irrelevant, because that didn't happen. I'm just pointing out the fact that Team tactics have been used before. To answer your question, I...
Your comment is irrelevant, because that didn't happen. I'm just pointing out the fact that Team tactics have been used before.

To answer your question, I would feel the same way, good racing either way. Vegas is going to be good.
William wrote:
Ahh,..but scenarios or possibilities ARE relevant when it comes to deeming tactics nefarious, illegal or forbidden...That is how rules are made.. by looking at all real...
Ahh,..but scenarios or possibilities ARE relevant when it comes to deeming tactics nefarious, illegal or forbidden...That is how rules are made.. by looking at all real possibilites as it relates to a certain action and weighing it.....
I will give another...You are "cool" with what happened and believe it is just part of it....Well if that is the case then..... If two riders are in a heated championship battle, 2 points separated, going in to Vegas..Is it okay for the rider's teammates or any other rider to blatantly impede the progress, take the contender out entering the corner, pull over and give spots up intentionally...where it is an obvious manipulation of the championship outcome ??
Yes scenarios matter and are relevant to track antics and tactics...Simply put...what Musquin did, could have decided the Championship if Tomac would have finished fourth in Rutherford...And it still could if Dungey has a bad Vegas and ends up winning the Championship by 3 points or less.
Honestly Will, I'm not agreeing or disagreeing with you, we just have different opinions about it and I respect your point of view. Too many If's and but's won't change what went down last night.

Again, I think any Team would have done the same thing, even Kawasaki.
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kakarot 4/30/2017 11:50am
4/30/2017 11:50am
MB109 wrote:
I don't remember people this fired up when Coop "stalled" his bike and let J-mart by during the 2015 nationals..
People have selective memories on the internet.
Sparky_27
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Sparky_27 4/30/2017 11:56am
4/30/2017 11:56am
Andy_Greenney wrote:
If the AMA are going to allow MM to make a mistake on the last lap and get away with it? That is all we 'know'...
If the AMA are going to allow MM to make a mistake on the last lap and get away with it? That is all we 'know', anything else is speculation.
Reality is there is NO WAY to stop a rider from riding below their max to manipulate a result.
Brownstone322 wrote:
What is so hard for people to understand about this? It's ALWAYS some kinda "mistake" or "mechanical issue" that allows the trailing teammate to pass. So...
What is so hard for people to understand about this? It's ALWAYS some kinda "mistake" or "mechanical issue" that allows the trailing teammate to pass. So, yeah, any rule against it is meaningless.

Question for you, Andy. Your profile says you're from Britain. Are MXGP fans in Europe this ignorant of race craft? I've always thought AMA motocross (particularly Supercross) pandered to a low-end demographic. How do you think people would react if Coldenhoff let Cairoli through just the same? (Which he would, of course; I have a hard time picturing Coldenhoff actually holding a lead in the late laps, but hypothetically speaking.)
In the world championship back in the 80's Dave Thorpe was instructed to let his team mate pass, I think it was at the Swiss round. He stopped on the last bend to let Andre past!

There was a big up roar at the time and to my knowledge it never happened again in that team!
William
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William 4/30/2017 11:57am
4/30/2017 11:57am
patrickadizzle wrote:
I don't really care that marv pulled over, and I get why he did it.. but I also understand why some people are upset about it...
I don't really care that marv pulled over, and I get why he did it.. but I also understand why some people are upset about it.

Here is my question... If it's not as big of a deal as people are saying, and that 'it's the norm in motorsports' then why try to make it look like a mistake?

Why not just pull over, put your hand on your hip and give Dungey a cheerful wave by and then on the podium say that you were doing it to help your teammate win a championship because that is what teammates do.

Why lie about making a mistake when everyone knows it wasn't one? I believe that is why people are upset, saying it was a mistake is just beyond disingenuous, its disrespectful to the fans. Just be honest with it, say you let your teammate by.
William wrote:
Absolutely spot on comment ! And it reveals the legitimacy of the idea that it is "just a part of racing and no big deal" Of...
Absolutely spot on comment !
And it reveals the legitimacy of the idea that it is "just a part of racing and no big deal"
Of course it isnt okay and it isnt perceived as okay and it is not healthy for the sport.
That is EXACTLY why Marvin didnt admit to doing it intentionally in his interview..As you pointed out already.
TXDirt wrote:
Sometimes we do things we don't like to do, but do them anyways. Ever had a meal you didn't like but told whoever made it that...
Sometimes we do things we don't like to do, but do them anyways. Ever had a meal you didn't like but told whoever made it that it tastes great?

Using your idea, you should have thrown the plate across the room and then punched the chef in the face.

It goes both ways.
NO,.. in my scenario you would tell the waiter or the chef the truth because there is nothing to hide...Not throw a plate !!! That is a strawman argument your making.
I am merely asking....If there is nothing WRONG with pulling over (so painfully obvious) then why lie about it ??
Brownstone322 4/30/2017 11:58am
4/30/2017 11:58am
MB109 wrote:
I don't remember people this fired up when Coop "stalled" his bike and let J-mart by during the 2015 nationals..
kakarot wrote:
People have selective memories on the internet.
You know what else? That was more personal. Webb was in an open feud with Musquin at the time, and it was pretty clear that he WANTED to stick it to Marvin.

Yesterday was just good business.
Andy_Greenney 4/30/2017 12:00pm
4/30/2017 12:00pm
Brownstone322 wrote:
You know what else? That was more personal. Webb was in an open feud with Musquin at the time, and it was pretty clear that he...
You know what else? That was more personal. Webb was in an open feud with Musquin at the time, and it was pretty clear that he WANTED to stick it to Marvin.

Yesterday was just good business.
Whether it's for a team mate or against an opponent, motive makes no difference to 'throwing a race'
PFitzG38
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PFitzG38 4/30/2017 12:42pm
4/30/2017 12:42pm
Ryan598 wrote:
[img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2017/04/29/191468/s1200_IMG_1847.jpg[/img]


THATS the pic i wanted to see!!

They could've at least had a code word like. "I love crepes'"

Might as well put "Let Rian Buy"

I love how he kept going on and on about how everyone must think he did it on purpose and it was just a mistake. lol
Doth Protest Too Much!?

I feel bad for Marvin, it was so obvious but I understand why he can't just come clean with AMA rules and all but WTF no big deal - its' sports strategy. TDF anyone? Marv was just being a good domestique.

But dang he could've at least been a little less obvious and just slow up a bit till RD went by, but then again it's dangerous to ride a slower pace at that levet. Look at what almost happened to Tomac when he almost ran into the back of Grant through the Rythem section when grant was going slower than Tomac expected.



kiwifan
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kiwifan 4/30/2017 12:54pm
4/30/2017 12:54pm
Katoomey wrote:
circus might be too harsh, but if AMA is going to allow this, then you are right, it is not a competition, it is an exhibition.

Andy_Greenney wrote:
If the AMA are going to allow MM to make a mistake on the last lap and get away with it? That is all we 'know'...
If the AMA are going to allow MM to make a mistake on the last lap and get away with it? That is all we 'know', anything else is speculation.
Reality is there is NO WAY to stop a rider from riding below their max to manipulate a result.
so what if Marvin did get all screwed up when he hit the rut on the entrance to that turn (i.e. he didnt let Ryan past on purpose).... you see that kind of thing happen often....fact is the AMA cannot say he did it on purpose or not
superflyguy 4/30/2017 1:05pm
4/30/2017 1:05pm
feelit2morrow wrote:
Marv checked up earlier in the year also and gave RD 2pts also. Could be a 4pt battle to the last round. Amazing it's even this...
Marv checked up earlier in the year also and gave RD 2pts also. Could be a 4pt battle to the last round. Amazing it's even this close with Tomac's issues.
Which races did he check up on? I want to watch those again.
William
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William 4/30/2017 1:13pm
4/30/2017 1:13pm
Katoomey wrote:
circus might be too harsh, but if AMA is going to allow this, then you are right, it is not a competition, it is an exhibition.

Andy_Greenney wrote:
If the AMA are going to allow MM to make a mistake on the last lap and get away with it? That is all we 'know'...
If the AMA are going to allow MM to make a mistake on the last lap and get away with it? That is all we 'know', anything else is speculation.
Reality is there is NO WAY to stop a rider from riding below their max to manipulate a result.
kiwifan wrote:
so what if Marvin did get all screwed up when he hit the rut on the entrance to that turn (i.e. he didnt let Ryan past...
so what if Marvin did get all screwed up when he hit the rut on the entrance to that turn (i.e. he didnt let Ryan past on purpose).... you see that kind of thing happen often....fact is the AMA cannot say he did it on purpose or not
Man,....Marvin parked it in the corner even when his entry speed was super slow....And he took the high line intentionally in the last several corners leading up to that...(IE,...it was glaringly intentional)
William
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William 4/30/2017 1:17pm
4/30/2017 1:17pm
Katoomey wrote:
circus might be too harsh, but if AMA is going to allow this, then you are right, it is not a competition, it is an exhibition.

Andy_Greenney wrote:
If the AMA are going to allow MM to make a mistake on the last lap and get away with it? That is all we 'know'...
If the AMA are going to allow MM to make a mistake on the last lap and get away with it? That is all we 'know', anything else is speculation.
Reality is there is NO WAY to stop a rider from riding below their max to manipulate a result.
kiwifan wrote:
so what if Marvin did get all screwed up when he hit the rut on the entrance to that turn (i.e. he didnt let Ryan past...
so what if Marvin did get all screwed up when he hit the rut on the entrance to that turn (i.e. he didnt let Ryan past on purpose).... you see that kind of thing happen often....fact is the AMA cannot say he did it on purpose or not
https://youtu.be/RzoHKcFFb6I
This is soooo obvious that is laughable !
Dougie-D-768 4/30/2017 5:00pm
4/30/2017 5:00pm
Ryan598 wrote:
[img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2017/04/29/191468/s1200_IMG_1847.jpg[/img]


PFitzG38 wrote:
THATS the pic i wanted to see!! They could've at least had a code word like. "I love crepes'" Might as well put "Let Rian Buy"...
THATS the pic i wanted to see!!

They could've at least had a code word like. "I love crepes'"

Might as well put "Let Rian Buy"

I love how he kept going on and on about how everyone must think he did it on purpose and it was just a mistake. lol
Doth Protest Too Much!?

I feel bad for Marvin, it was so obvious but I understand why he can't just come clean with AMA rules and all but WTF no big deal - its' sports strategy. TDF anyone? Marv was just being a good domestique.

But dang he could've at least been a little less obvious and just slow up a bit till RD went by, but then again it's dangerous to ride a slower pace at that levet. Look at what almost happened to Tomac when he almost ran into the back of Grant through the Rythem section when grant was going slower than Tomac expected.



What is the big deal? The pit board says , "1 lap," on top and, "Ryan" on the bottom. This is the smoking gun? Holy hell, really? That is standard info given to every rider, every lap. Especially with the white flag coming up the mechanic would put either one lap or white flag and who was in 2nd! Someone tell me why this is evidence of KTM telling Marv to let Ryan by, because I'm having a hard time seeing that evidence. By the way, Dungey didn't do anything wrong but do his best all day, and everyone is attacking his character for stealing the title fro Tomac. Freaking unbelievable!!!!!!

Pit Row

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Dougie-D-768 4/30/2017 5:07pm
4/30/2017 5:07pm
Ryan598 wrote:
[img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2017/04/29/191468/s1200_IMG_1847.jpg[/img]


PFitzG38 wrote:
THATS the pic i wanted to see!! They could've at least had a code word like. "I love crepes'" Might as well put "Let Rian Buy"...
THATS the pic i wanted to see!!

They could've at least had a code word like. "I love crepes'"

Might as well put "Let Rian Buy"

I love how he kept going on and on about how everyone must think he did it on purpose and it was just a mistake. lol
Doth Protest Too Much!?

I feel bad for Marvin, it was so obvious but I understand why he can't just come clean with AMA rules and all but WTF no big deal - its' sports strategy. TDF anyone? Marv was just being a good domestique.

But dang he could've at least been a little less obvious and just slow up a bit till RD went by, but then again it's dangerous to ride a slower pace at that levet. Look at what almost happened to Tomac when he almost ran into the back of Grant through the Rythem section when grant was going slower than Tomac expected.



Dougie-D-768 wrote:
What is the big deal? The pit board says , "1 lap," on top and, "Ryan" on the bottom. This is the smoking gun? Holy hell...
What is the big deal? The pit board says , "1 lap," on top and, "Ryan" on the bottom. This is the smoking gun? Holy hell, really? That is standard info given to every rider, every lap. Especially with the white flag coming up the mechanic would put either one lap or white flag and who was in 2nd! Someone tell me why this is evidence of KTM telling Marv to let Ryan by, because I'm having a hard time seeing that evidence. By the way, Dungey didn't do anything wrong but do his best all day, and everyone is attacking his character for stealing the title fro Tomac. Freaking unbelievable!!!!!!
Oh and in the photo, look to the left, and the leaderboard. Dungey 0.7 seconds behind. Tomac 48.0 seconds behind! Dungey was coming to try and pass Marv so its a little unfair to Dungey if Marv "let him by" because Ryan was going for a legit pass. It was almost a copout on Marv's part.
kiwifan
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kiwifan 4/30/2017 5:41pm
4/30/2017 5:41pm
Andy_Greenney wrote:
If the AMA are going to allow MM to make a mistake on the last lap and get away with it? That is all we 'know'...
If the AMA are going to allow MM to make a mistake on the last lap and get away with it? That is all we 'know', anything else is speculation.
Reality is there is NO WAY to stop a rider from riding below their max to manipulate a result.
kiwifan wrote:
so what if Marvin did get all screwed up when he hit the rut on the entrance to that turn (i.e. he didnt let Ryan past...
so what if Marvin did get all screwed up when he hit the rut on the entrance to that turn (i.e. he didnt let Ryan past on purpose).... you see that kind of thing happen often....fact is the AMA cannot say he did it on purpose or not
William wrote:
https://youtu.be/RzoHKcFFb6I
This is soooo obvious that is laughable !
you see what you want to see maybe? I am just saying it is possible it was all innocent....for all we know...
Jarid332
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Jarid332 4/30/2017 5:55pm
4/30/2017 5:55pm
Mini Elsinore wrote:
I understand.
I also know who I am now rooting for.
Mini Elsinore
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Mini Elsinore 4/30/2017 5:57pm
4/30/2017 5:57pm
Mini Elsinore wrote:
I understand.
I also know who I am now rooting for.
Jarid332 wrote:
[img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/users/13480/photos/78894/s780_3K2A1518.jpg?1416079648[/img]
Laughing
Brownstone322 4/30/2017 6:22pm
4/30/2017 6:22pm
William wrote:
https://youtu.be/RzoHKcFFb6I
This is soooo obvious that is laughable !
Couldn't have been more obvious. I think he waited too long to do what we knew he was gonna do, so by that point he really had make a dramatic move to get out of the way. Basically parked it.
cool_hand
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cool_hand 4/30/2017 6:29pm
4/30/2017 6:29pm
Marvin, Clearly Dropped that One....
mjr119 4/30/2017 6:38pm
4/30/2017 6:38pm
kiwifan wrote:
so what if Marvin did get all screwed up when he hit the rut on the entrance to that turn (i.e. he didnt let Ryan past...
so what if Marvin did get all screwed up when he hit the rut on the entrance to that turn (i.e. he didnt let Ryan past on purpose).... you see that kind of thing happen often....fact is the AMA cannot say he did it on purpose or not
Dude you sound like an attorney. We aren't in court. Let's be real here. He took all outside lines on the last lap. Doubled thru the long rhythm section. It was painfully obvious. I was there.
Yamaknockers
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Yamaknockers 4/30/2017 7:02pm
4/30/2017 7:02pm
eric513anderson wrote:
[img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2017/04/30/191749/s1200_IMG_0883.jpg[/img]


Good one lol
MXisLIFE
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MXisLIFE 4/30/2017 7:12pm
4/30/2017 7:12pm
PFitzG38 wrote:
THATS the pic i wanted to see!! They could've at least had a code word like. "I love crepes'" Might as well put "Let Rian Buy"...
THATS the pic i wanted to see!!

They could've at least had a code word like. "I love crepes'"

Might as well put "Let Rian Buy"

I love how he kept going on and on about how everyone must think he did it on purpose and it was just a mistake. lol
Doth Protest Too Much!?

I feel bad for Marvin, it was so obvious but I understand why he can't just come clean with AMA rules and all but WTF no big deal - its' sports strategy. TDF anyone? Marv was just being a good domestique.

But dang he could've at least been a little less obvious and just slow up a bit till RD went by, but then again it's dangerous to ride a slower pace at that levet. Look at what almost happened to Tomac when he almost ran into the back of Grant through the Rythem section when grant was going slower than Tomac expected.



Dougie-D-768 wrote:
What is the big deal? The pit board says , "1 lap," on top and, "Ryan" on the bottom. This is the smoking gun? Holy hell...
What is the big deal? The pit board says , "1 lap," on top and, "Ryan" on the bottom. This is the smoking gun? Holy hell, really? That is standard info given to every rider, every lap. Especially with the white flag coming up the mechanic would put either one lap or white flag and who was in 2nd! Someone tell me why this is evidence of KTM telling Marv to let Ryan by, because I'm having a hard time seeing that evidence. By the way, Dungey didn't do anything wrong but do his best all day, and everyone is attacking his character for stealing the title fro Tomac. Freaking unbelievable!!!!!!
Dougie-D-768 wrote:
Oh and in the photo, look to the left, and the leaderboard. Dungey 0.7 seconds behind. Tomac 48.0 seconds behind! Dungey was coming to try and...
Oh and in the photo, look to the left, and the leaderboard. Dungey 0.7 seconds behind. Tomac 48.0 seconds behind! Dungey was coming to try and pass Marv so its a little unfair to Dungey if Marv "let him by" because Ryan was going for a legit pass. It was almost a copout on Marv's part.
If you watched the race you would have seen musquin setting this up before hand he was slowing in like every corner prior to his "mistake"
PFitzG38
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PFitzG38 4/30/2017 9:14pm
4/30/2017 9:14pm Edited Date/Time 4/30/2017 9:25pm
Dougie-D-768 wrote:
Oh and in the photo, look to the left, and the leaderboard. Dungey 0.7 seconds behind. Tomac 48.0 seconds behind! Dungey was coming to try and...
Oh and in the photo, look to the left, and the leaderboard. Dungey 0.7 seconds behind. Tomac 48.0 seconds behind! Dungey was coming to try and pass Marv so its a little unfair to Dungey if Marv "let him by" because Ryan was going for a legit pass. It was almost a copout on Marv's part.
um OK. You don't know what "1 Lap Ryan" means It means "Let Brock Bye 1 Lap". It's freeking spelled out for you! It looked like Marvin wasn't too sure what it was either with the double take when he went by it but he figured it out.

How is that standard info given to every rider? Your mechanic doesn't tell you ANYTHING about anybody else. That is what your eyes are for your mechanic gives you lap times and splits and maybe a little word of encouragement like U Can!! or the favorite "Breath" or sometimes "Ryan 1 Lap"

What else could that possibly mean and why would Frankie be telling him anything that has to do with Dungey? and then what about his protesteth too much while being interviewed? He hadn't talked to ONE person yet except maybe Frankie

But he starts blathering "everyone is going to think I let him by", then proceeds to talk about it for the majority of the interview. lol Classic human behavior from feeling guilty. If you don't think Marvin took a dive you are either extremely gullible, very naive, don't understand motocross or are blinded by your fan boyisim for Marv or a combination.

It will only be unfair to Dungey if he wins the title by 2 pts or less and has to live with the asterisk Marvin will have given him by diving. Also there IS NO leader board in that photo!?!

Don't get me wrong I love Marvin. He's one of my favorite racers, in fact I hope he wins next week - But It is what it is.

EDIT: I see the leader board in the initial larger photo
Dougie-D-768 5/1/2017 1:21am
5/1/2017 1:21am
Dougie-D-768 wrote:
What is the big deal? The pit board says , "1 lap," on top and, "Ryan" on the bottom. This is the smoking gun? Holy hell...
What is the big deal? The pit board says , "1 lap," on top and, "Ryan" on the bottom. This is the smoking gun? Holy hell, really? That is standard info given to every rider, every lap. Especially with the white flag coming up the mechanic would put either one lap or white flag and who was in 2nd! Someone tell me why this is evidence of KTM telling Marv to let Ryan by, because I'm having a hard time seeing that evidence. By the way, Dungey didn't do anything wrong but do his best all day, and everyone is attacking his character for stealing the title fro Tomac. Freaking unbelievable!!!!!!
Dougie-D-768 wrote:
Oh and in the photo, look to the left, and the leaderboard. Dungey 0.7 seconds behind. Tomac 48.0 seconds behind! Dungey was coming to try and...
Oh and in the photo, look to the left, and the leaderboard. Dungey 0.7 seconds behind. Tomac 48.0 seconds behind! Dungey was coming to try and pass Marv so its a little unfair to Dungey if Marv "let him by" because Ryan was going for a legit pass. It was almost a copout on Marv's part.
MXisLIFE wrote:
If you watched the race you would have seen musquin setting this up before hand he was slowing in like every corner prior to his "mistake"
You know I didn't understand all the anger toward Dungey about this. It was so simple I couldn't see it. The anger has nothing to do with truth or or facts because if one looked at this objectively and not subjectively no one would be criticizing Dungey. It hit me that the hate is coming from avid Tomac fans and\or people that never have liked Dungey. I can guarantee that Dungey-haters would be orgasmic if Grant had let Tomac by on the last lap and would have defended Grant\Kawi to the death for doing it! Just my opinion!

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