1980 CanAm Mx6-125 rebuild

Garand1
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3/3/2017 6:20pm Edited Date/Time 3/3/2017 6:21pm
I also got in my new rear tire.....Going with a Sedona 907HP in 110/100-18...Its a hard terrain tire that I'm pretty curious to get it out on the dirt. I love the knob pattern and it seems to be fairly soft. We'll see if it performs like I hope it does. It looks very aggressive for a 125.

3/5/2017 8:18am
450exc115 wrote:
Who did you use to line your shoes? I'm about to put the MX3 on the lift and start the tear down and know for sure...
Who did you use to line your shoes? I'm about to put the MX3 on the lift and start the tear down and know for sure it will need shoes. I'm planning to build a 76 GP 250 replica like this one. Smile

The only thing different on my build is I plan to use the aluminum swingarm that Can Am had in 1980 that was a replica of the Thor arms.



Hey 450exc115,
Phoenix Friction out of Woodbridge Ontario did the relining.
Matt
Hi Can-Am #131

did you send Phoenix Friction your shoes and hub, or just shoes, or buy material and reline yourself or what?

DO you know the material they used?

TIA for the info - I would LOVE to get some of my vintage bikes stopping better

Steve
Garand1
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3/6/2017 5:46pm
Well, finally got around to actually doing some engine assembly. It actually went together really nice with the aid of some on-line resources that I found in a few different spots. All new seals & transmission bearings with OEM BRP bearings and seals except for the kickshaft seal which I ordered through NAPA an SKF seal because I could get from SeaDoo, SkiDoo or CanAm(engine bearings only have maybe 4 or 5 hours of light/trial riding so I didnt replace them).







3/6/2017 6:25pm
sclark309d wrote:
Hi Can-Am #131 did you send Phoenix Friction your shoes and hub, or just shoes, or buy material and reline yourself or what? DO you know...
Hi Can-Am #131

did you send Phoenix Friction your shoes and hub, or just shoes, or buy material and reline yourself or what?

DO you know the material they used?

TIA for the info - I would LOVE to get some of my vintage bikes stopping better

Steve
Hi Steve,
I just sent in the shoes and told them what they were off of and they did the rest.
I've had 12 or 13 pairs relined for the mx1-6 era bikes with not issues.
Matt

The Shop

Garand1
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3/10/2017 4:45pm
Things have been a little slow at work so rather then sit around doing nothing, I've been do a little here and a little there. Rewired the stator that I just got as the insulation was starting to get brittle and was cracked in a few spots. Got the engine set back in the frame & doing some more cleanup & re-painting some odd pieces like the pegs, brake stays & etc.

MaxPower
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3/10/2017 5:44pm Edited Date/Time 3/10/2017 5:46pm
Nice work. The finished project comes out so nice when you complete every stage without rushing and finished to 100%
This is going to be a racer isnr it?
Garand1
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central, NY, USA
3/10/2017 7:24pm
MaxPower wrote:
Nice work. The finished project comes out so nice when you complete every stage without rushing and finished to 100% This is going to be a...
Nice work. The finished project comes out so nice when you complete every stage without rushing and finished to 100%
This is going to be a racer isnr it?
I may run it at Unadilla Rewind, I guess I'll have to see which of the support classes I want to run this year. I ran 2 last year, 3 classes may be a little to intense for me, though, It would give me more time on the track!! I probably wont decide until early May which bikes I'll run & what classes . Looking forward to it though!!
riv187
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3/10/2017 7:48pm
Looking good!
You wrote your rewired stator. Who'd you have do it? Will you be using the stock 125 ignition with timing box?
riv187
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3/10/2017 7:51pm
I saw a friends MX6 250b he'd just acquired and the clutch pull was stiff. He showed me another that he had there that was smoother..some ball bearing modification in cover and a hydraulic clutch adapted to cover. Maybe your familiar with it. It was news to me,,but 100% better than stock.
Garand1
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3/11/2017 7:51am
riv187 wrote:
Looking good!
You wrote your rewired stator. Who'd you have do it? Will you be using the stock 125 ignition with timing box?
I just bought a stator coil assembly off ebay(i usually dont like ebay but occasionally have no choice as there are few other choices),and when I got recieved the part, the trigger coil showed open circuit. (I got in touch with the seller and said he would work with me) I had an the original stator but one of the steel magnet plates detached and of course destroyed the trigger coil....it couldn't have hit the lighting coils, they're like 10 times the sizeof the trigger. So, I only needed a trigger coil. Found a unit on ebay, had been pulled from a running 175Qualifier. So as soon as I opened the box....the trigger was dead. Lucky for me, it was a break in the white wire to the trigger. The insulation was also cracking on that white and on the red charge coil wire. So, I cut all of them off and soldered & heat shrinked them as close as I could to the coils and then taped the whole harness, and then ran that through protective sleeve.
Its off a 175 so it doesnt use the timing box. I used to take the whole cover/stator off my 400 and put it on this 125 & it ran pretty good for riding around the house. The timing was a little retarded but better a little late then too far advanced for the type of riding i was doing at the time. Not sure where I'm going to time this. I have to do a little more research. I measured the Squish with no base gasket, I dont know if I can even call it a squish band measurement. The head is a open dome design. There was about 1 1/2 to 2mm wide notch in my measuring solder that was right at 1mm between the head and the piston. I made a base gasket that's .24mm and .0095" thick. The head gasket, I have to see what I can make, something thin. I guess I'll have to see what kind of compression its got to determine the timing and fuel I use.
cable
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3/16/2017 8:09pm
i have a nos orange can am fender still in the wrapper. its not oem. i think its a preston petty.
Garand1
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3/21/2017 4:57pm
Well I finally got my used/new to me stator all re-wired and installed on to the bike. Though the harness was a little longer than I originally wanted, but the length was ok with a little change in routing. Re mounted the rear brakes & wheel assembly. Still have a little widening to do to the chain guide, and then I'll be able to mount the rear brake stay. I also remounted the original sprocket(which has near zero wear) with some new flanged bolts and did away with the lock tabs for the bolts. Its taking shape, slowly. Working on the exhaust soon, gotta get the rear shocks.









Garand1
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3/23/2017 11:03am
Hi Guys, Just wanted to ask a quik question to you guys with some rebuild experience with the CA125 engines. Seems like every time I see a picture of a 125 head, it is a squish-band type of head. My head does not have the squish-band. Its a simple open dome chamber. Was there a running change in the design of the heads? or possibly a Rotax "Race" head. I know on the sleds, there are performance parts that were made available through BRP/Bombardier's Race Department. So whats the story????



riv187
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3/24/2017 8:15am
My MX6125 is still together,,but I'll bet yours and mine are same. Like the RM125 that era the factory design was full hemi. Aftermarket companies like DG where experimenting with squish bands for improved torque & midrange. I have a collection of various DG& LOP heads and there are numerous combustion chamber and squish bands for 76-80 RM100/125s. I recommend getting it as tight as .020 as measured at outside edge. Depending upon your piston/wall clearance you can go more or less because of the rocking amount closing this. If your piston is loose you'll need more squish. Don't assume the piston fit is equal front and back if your cutting it real close..Check it front and back with clay or playdow. You may also lathe the outside crown down at a angle to closer match chamber ceiling, then mill cylinder top or head where gasket rest or thinner gasket. This would insert the piston deeper into combustion chamber and raise compression. I have experimented with stuff like this. As well as opposite and lowering compression. Raising compression will give improve midrange power but flatten top. Eric gore told me that 160psi was a good number on my 78 RM125,,,above killed rpm power. I'd love to hear a engine builder with can am experience chime in for this motor specifically.
Garand1
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central, NY, USA
3/24/2017 10:32am
Thanks For the Input riv187......I made a base gasket that is .009" thick and with no headgasket/shim my squish is at 1mm/.039". My piston is a .080" over Wiseco, & now I'm wondering if its a little flatter than an OEM Rotax/Elko piston. There is a Tech guy at BRP who was there from the early 70's & still is, who has given me some info, so I probably will reach out to him again and see what he has to say.
riv187
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3/24/2017 11:04am
I would shoot for .030" max with gasket at edge. If you where porting this,,,they would turn the base on a lathe, then correct port roofs to desired heights. Another option is taking studs out of head and surfacing top of cylinder,,,even by hand on a flat surface with wet/dry paper.
Do a compression check to start. If I remember right,,,for each .001" I took off my RM125 it was about 1psi. I had a .010 thinner head gasket and it bumped compression 10psi.
Shoot for 160 and you'll be close to ideal. I have 180psi in one 78 RM125 and that's high,,race gas only and short lived main bearings and rod from stress.
Bigger bore equal more compression and lower port heights.
MaxPower
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3/24/2017 12:07pm
MaxPower wrote:
Nice work. The finished project comes out so nice when you complete every stage without rushing and finished to 100% This is going to be a...
Nice work. The finished project comes out so nice when you complete every stage without rushing and finished to 100%
This is going to be a racer isnr it?
Garand1 wrote:
I may run it at Unadilla Rewind, I guess I'll have to see which of the support classes I want to run this year. I ran...
I may run it at Unadilla Rewind, I guess I'll have to see which of the support classes I want to run this year. I ran 2 last year, 3 classes may be a little to intense for me, though, It would give me more time on the track!! I probably wont decide until early May which bikes I'll run & what classes . Looking forward to it though!!
I ran 3 classes last year. They even had to hold the gate for me to come off from one class directly to the line. For me I felt as it was an advantage being warmed up and knowing the track. We are only out there for a few laps, its not like a 45 min GP moto. Your fresh can am will get lots of attention
Garand1
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central, NY, USA
3/24/2017 5:35pm
MaxPower wrote:
Nice work. The finished project comes out so nice when you complete every stage without rushing and finished to 100% This is going to be a...
Nice work. The finished project comes out so nice when you complete every stage without rushing and finished to 100%
This is going to be a racer isnr it?
Garand1 wrote:
I may run it at Unadilla Rewind, I guess I'll have to see which of the support classes I want to run this year. I ran...
I may run it at Unadilla Rewind, I guess I'll have to see which of the support classes I want to run this year. I ran 2 last year, 3 classes may be a little to intense for me, though, It would give me more time on the track!! I probably wont decide until early May which bikes I'll run & what classes . Looking forward to it though!!
MaxPower wrote:
I ran 3 classes last year. They even had to hold the gate for me to come off from one class directly to the line. For...
I ran 3 classes last year. They even had to hold the gate for me to come off from one class directly to the line. For me I felt as it was an advantage being warmed up and knowing the track. We are only out there for a few laps, its not like a 45 min GP moto. Your fresh can am will get lots of attention
Thanks MaxPower......I ran 2 support classes last year...Open Age Novice on my CA 400 & Pre-Millenium novice on my Kx250......Had a blast.......First time id been on a track since about 2003 & it was Unadilla......What a rush that was!!!! Saturdays downpours made the track, ummmmm, interesting for me :o)
Garand1
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3/24/2017 5:48pm
Heres a short vid of me at Unadilla at Rewind 2016. 1980 CanAm Qual/Mx6-400 hybird. Sunday Open Age moto2.....I wasnt fast, but I wasnt last :o) I love my old 400!!!!
wolfy0067
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Wernersville, PA, USA
3/25/2017 4:58am




If you truly want the engine tuned to perfection, you should invest in these gadgets, rotary timming degree wheel along with a burrett to properly CC the head, calculate intake and intake close duration, then using simple math you will then be able to establish the compression ration you wish to run your engine at. Time consuming but fun, the work pays off in top performance.

wolfy0067
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3/25/2017 5:04am

Almost forgot these to establish true TDC don't rely on the factory stamps, simple to make using a spark plug hollowed out and tap in some threads, I have 10, 12 and 14mm more fun stuff to make in the shop
Garand1
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central, NY, USA
3/25/2017 6:11am
Hey Wolfy, I have most of those tools, but not the burrett, I use a syringe instead, I would also suggest a TDC dial indicator, you can get them through a SkiDoo, SeaDoo or CanAm dealership, part# 295000143, though they are fairly pricey at slightly over $300.00 at retail. But, they are awesome to use to set timings with custom/not stock ignition systems. Sometimes, If the degree wheel doesnt fit whatever engine I'm doing, I'll just take actual measurements from TDC or BDC to the ports opening or closing to do a porting map. I did map out this engine, but am not doing any mods to it. I usually just clean up airways & set durations & clearances where I want them with base gaskets & very occasionally set squish if its way out of whack. I learned long ago, If you need more power.......go up in displacement. Your wallet will thank you, :o)
wolfy0067
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3/25/2017 8:36am
No replacement for displacement
Garand1
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central, NY, USA
3/30/2017 6:18pm
A day of ups & downs & back up again Cool I filled the transmission with oil last night, and thought I'd go into work early to see If I could fire it up. I added a little premix to the carb and kicked it twice and it sputtered and fired and stalled. Kicked it again with the throttle open and the choke off and it fired up again, and I let it run for probably 30 seconds & man....was it loud with out the original Supertrapp silence assembled. So...that was a high point. So the day went on and I noticed a few drips on the floor underneath the bike. I thought, I must have spilled some fuel on the bike stand it it took a while to drip off. I moved the bike, wiped off the stand and finished the day of work. At the end of the day, I noticed more of what I knew to be oil on the floor.....Low point, thinking i had a case or new seal leaking and thinking Id have to pull & split the engine again....was not a happy camper. Started wiping of the cases trying to figure where the leak was from and it was just under the clutch cover.......then I realized that I had not fully tightened the plastic plug at the clutch cable access point, tightened that and leak was fixed....High point!!!!! Spent some time working on the fuel tank, was pretty badly oxidized. Trying the restoration method where you scrape it with a razor blade, & seems to be working. Also disassembled the seat to have a cover made, the pan is pretty good but needs some repair to the fiberglass in the rear, I will probably do some extra reinforcement to it. I'm going to take the seat assembly to a local upholstery shop for a new cover and maybe they can cut some new higher density foam for it.



The tank before scraping


after its first round of scraping - I did this 3 times with wipe/scrubbing with Scotchbrite between


The Semi-assembled bike. How do you guys like the Supertrapp megaphone???? wicked loud!!! The tank needs alot more work but you can see how the difference where the old Can-Am decals was is much faded.


Garand1
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146
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central, NY, USA
3/31/2017 6:31pm
Hey you CanAm guys.....heres a little info I learned and am using. If your looking for a clutch cable, The cable for a CanAm DS450 ATV works awesomely!!!, only 1 slight modification. On the engine side of the cable housing The ATV cable has a threaded end. Take a piece of thin wall rubber tubing(example thin wall 3/16 fuel line)cut the line 2/3 to 3/4 of the length of the threads, and screw the hose all the way up to the top of the threads, Now install and adjust the cable. The hose on the threads should fit tightly in the hole in the clutch cover. Oh yeah the best part.....a Motion Pro cable Retails for less than $12!!!!


4/1/2017 11:58am
Loving this thread thank-you al for such great info !
There are some alu. swingarms on ebay that come up once in a while.
I do know that a QIV '82 model arm will fit the earlier models with some modification.
Garand1
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central, NY, USA
4/4/2017 4:28pm
Well, its once again progressing. Have the fenders on, and am pretty happy with them. I guess the only thing about them is the front fender is a little short in the rear. I'll have to see how it is and if necessary modify it or find something different. The tank I'm fairly happy with.......at least its a whole lot better than it was. Now that it mounted, I'll be able to buff/polish it a lot harder with my DA sander/buffer. Major items yet to do........rear shocks, chain & seat. The rest is just small details.




Garand1
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central, NY, USA
4/6/2017 12:24pm Edited Date/Time 4/6/2017 5:20pm
I read somewhere on-line that for the air-box to carb adapter you could use a CV boot. I went to our stock room and grabbed a aftermarket cv boot repair kit for a CanAm Outlander ATV and started to look at it to see if it would work. It was smaller on the large end then what I thought it should be, but, it was very stretchy and with a little coaxing it slipped right on the air-box. then I looked and measured the pleated section and cut the boot to what I thought to be the right size. I was 1 pleat off but it fit, it was tight but fit. So, now the air box and air filter is all in stalled. On a side note......The air filter cleaned up and looks like new......Ive seen several of these K&N stock filters and they tend to collapse & twist in the center if they been removed, cleaned and installed. Another thing that leads me to believe this was a low bike. I'll post some pictures of this stuff soon.
Garand1
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central, NY, USA
4/6/2017 4:43pm
Here are a few pictures of the cv/carb boot and the air filters. The first air filter picture shows the filter that was in the 125 which I believe didnt have a lot of use its nice and straight and when I cleaned it, it was in really good shape. The second picture shows a filter that came out of a parts bike that I bought, you can see how it partially collapsed and twisted.







Garand1
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central, NY, USA
4/8/2017 9:00am
Getting there, things are going slow again. I was going to have a custom seat cover made based on a moden KTM aftermarket color design, but, time & cost didnt let that happen. So, I'm going to order a new cover from RTRMoto.com. Cant beat $52 for a new cover. They have ones that have an orange MX6 logo, or a white CanAm logo. Think I'm going to go with the MX6 logo. Its turning out pretty good, and I'm getting very anxious to ride.

This is the color design that i wanted for a custom seat



The bike nearing completion, I spent more time buffing the tank with NOVUS2, It was easier to use pressure once the tank was mounted to the frame


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