WP 4cs Re-valve / re-worked suspension services... What tuner to go to.

Highsider
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Highsider 8/22/2016 6:02am
8/22/2016 6:02am Edited Date/Time 8/24/2016 5:57am
PTshox wrote:
RaceTech has some good parts for that fork too... Serious. I rode some and they were good. Probably all the tuners have a better solution today...
RaceTech has some good parts for that fork too... Serious. I rode some and they were good. Probably all the tuners have a better solution today with more time on them too.
Yes, I was wondering why RaceTech wasn't mentioned.
Right there in Corona, right?
Maybe a couple of miles from Milestone?

...and they are WP specialists, right?

Rocket88
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Rocket88 8/22/2016 6:31am
8/22/2016 6:31am
Call Rick at Too Tech Suspension.

You might like what you hear!
Paul333
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Paul333 8/22/2016 7:26am
8/22/2016 7:26am Edited Date/Time 8/22/2016 7:26am
ENZO did an amazing job with my 4CS forks. After they set them up I have zero complaints and see zero reasons to spend any more money.
Mouse153
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Mouse153 8/22/2016 7:52am
8/22/2016 7:52am
Craig Decker at Enzo has the 4CS's figured out. He did my FC250 and I haven't touched them since! Save a lot of money and frustration and call Enzo.

The Shop

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Panic_Rev
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Panic_Rev 8/22/2016 10:04am
8/22/2016 10:04am
I'm in the exact same situation. I spoke with FC a few weeks ago about improving the forks. They told me now that they have a lot of time on the forks they have designed new internals that are better then their original design when it first came out. Maybe a sales tactic, but they did such a good job on my SSS forks I will be giving them a shot.
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i3oykin 8/22/2016 11:56am
8/22/2016 11:56am
Thelen20 wrote:
My 4cs stuff on a 15' 250sx had been revalved twice by Stillwell and still had the same symptoms you are describing. I sprung for power...
My 4cs stuff on a 15' 250sx had been revalved twice by Stillwell and still had the same symptoms you are describing. I sprung for power band cone valves, sometimes i still can't believe I spent that much on a set of forks, but they are really good. Bottoming resistance is literally insane! Very forgiving! Miles ahead of the 4cs stuff, as they very well should be.

I called Billy at powerband and had a good chat then finalized the deal through email. Sent him a cashier's check and took my place in line. 3 weeks later I had a set of forks at my door.

If I could do it again, considering the way I keep my bikes for a long time, the kyb conversion probably should have been my first choice, but then again I bet they would not have the bottoming resistance of these cone valve forks and that is the thing I love most about my current setup . . .


Duely noted! They look amazing.. I was not even considering Stillwell as they seem off-road oriented. When did you have your re-valved, early 2015 or late? Because I am sure they had to have made som leeway since then?!
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i3oykin 8/22/2016 12:03pm
8/22/2016 12:03pm
Rocket88 wrote:
Call Rick at Too Tech Suspension.

You might like what you hear!
Just read their approach to the 4cs, I like that they just do valving, with minor mods, kind of what I am looking for and at a reasonable price for sure... Under $400 for both forks and a shock. I will be giving him a call shortly.
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i3oykin 8/22/2016 12:06pm
8/22/2016 12:06pm
Panic_Rev wrote:
I'm in the exact same situation. I spoke with FC a few weeks ago about improving the forks. They told me now that they have a...
I'm in the exact same situation. I spoke with FC a few weeks ago about improving the forks. They told me now that they have a lot of time on the forks they have designed new internals that are better then their original design when it first came out. Maybe a sales tactic, but they did such a good job on my SSS forks I will be giving them a shot.
Let me know how it pans out for you!!!
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i3oykin 8/22/2016 12:08pm
8/22/2016 12:08pm
Mouse153 wrote:
Craig Decker at Enzo has the 4CS's figured out. He did my FC250 and I haven't touched them since! Save a lot of money and frustration...
Craig Decker at Enzo has the 4CS's figured out. He did my FC250 and I haven't touched them since! Save a lot of money and frustration and call Enzo.
I thought ENZO only did KYB stuff? On their website that is all they list?? http://www.enzoracing.com/service.html

Unless there is a different Enzo you guys are going to?
Bennett59
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Bennett59 8/22/2016 12:15pm
8/22/2016 12:15pm
SPYGUY wrote:
Anyone tried the WP Cone Valve inserts for 4CS forks? Considering they're 2/3 the price of a set of cone valves, maybe it's not cost efficient...
Anyone tried the WP Cone Valve inserts for 4CS forks?

Considering they're 2/3 the price of a set of cone valves, maybe it's not cost efficient but until a few days ago I wasn't even aware that WP even made such a kit.

http://www.wp-group.com/suspension/forks/mxma-4800-cone-valve-kit/
I tried that route first and I was told we was not importing the cone valve inserts do to low sales on the inserts not sure if that changed though
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i3oykin 8/22/2016 12:36pm
8/22/2016 12:36pm
Just talked to Corey at ProTune, he seems very knowledgeable. Ugh this is such a frustrating decision.
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Digger29 8/22/2016 2:47pm
8/22/2016 2:47pm
Send them to Billy at Powerband. He's done a bunch of 4CS for me and my buddy's who race MX and off-road and everyone has been very pleased with his 4CS set up and his prices are very very good.
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JWACK 8/22/2016 4:24pm
8/22/2016 4:24pm
Digger29 wrote:
Send them to Billy at Powerband. He's done a bunch of 4CS for me and my buddy's who race MX and off-road and everyone has been...
Send them to Billy at Powerband. He's done a bunch of 4CS for me and my buddy's who race MX and off-road and everyone has been very pleased with his 4CS set up and his prices are very very good.
You have been so pleased with your billy 4cs that you promptly bought cone valves.??
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i3oykin 8/22/2016 5:24pm
8/22/2016 5:24pm
After talking with many many suspension guys, local and distant. I have decided to try out Corey at ProTune. His rates are fair for what he does. I called to have the SSS cartridges installed into my tubes and he gave me three other options in terms of performance and finances. Offers to pay half of shipping if I need a re-valve in the future, etc. He was straight forward and very knowledgeable and I am going to try his 4cs setup at this point. He also informed me that the 2015 mx bikes that came with the 4cs are the worst in terms of harshness. So it can only get better, right? Not to mention his rave reviews on KTMtalk. He was one of the few that kept popping up with great results, between him and Kreft.

Thanks everyone for your input, after I get the work done and a few rides on it I will update.

Osaka627
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Osaka627 8/22/2016 7:05pm
8/22/2016 7:05pm
i3oykin wrote:
After talking with many many suspension guys, local and distant. I have decided to try out Corey at ProTune. His rates are fair for what he...
After talking with many many suspension guys, local and distant. I have decided to try out Corey at ProTune. His rates are fair for what he does. I called to have the SSS cartridges installed into my tubes and he gave me three other options in terms of performance and finances. Offers to pay half of shipping if I need a re-valve in the future, etc. He was straight forward and very knowledgeable and I am going to try his 4cs setup at this point. He also informed me that the 2015 mx bikes that came with the 4cs are the worst in terms of harshness. So it can only get better, right? Not to mention his rave reviews on KTMtalk. He was one of the few that kept popping up with great results, between him and Kreft.

Thanks everyone for your input, after I get the work done and a few rides on it I will update.

Price range??
i3oykin
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i3oykin 8/22/2016 7:13pm
8/22/2016 7:13pm
i3oykin wrote:
After talking with many many suspension guys, local and distant. I have decided to try out Corey at ProTune. His rates are fair for what he...
After talking with many many suspension guys, local and distant. I have decided to try out Corey at ProTune. His rates are fair for what he does. I called to have the SSS cartridges installed into my tubes and he gave me three other options in terms of performance and finances. Offers to pay half of shipping if I need a re-valve in the future, etc. He was straight forward and very knowledgeable and I am going to try his 4cs setup at this point. He also informed me that the 2015 mx bikes that came with the 4cs are the worst in terms of harshness. So it can only get better, right? Not to mention his rave reviews on KTMtalk. He was one of the few that kept popping up with great results, between him and Kreft.

Thanks everyone for your input, after I get the work done and a few rides on it I will update.

Osaka627 wrote:
Price range??
Depends on which year 4cs you have, but he said $450 for the forks, that includes the mods, high and low speed comp, so similar to MX-Tech and Kreft setup from what I understood. That also includes re-valve, etc. And then I think he said $130 for the shock re-valve. Plus shipping. He does re-valves until it is right and he pays for shipping back after the re-valve if it wasn't perfect the first time.
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Thelen20 8/22/2016 7:44pm
8/22/2016 7:44pm Edited Date/Time 8/22/2016 7:45pm
i3oykin wrote:
Duely noted! They look amazing.. I was not even considering Stillwell as they seem off-road oriented. When did you have your re-valved, early 2015 or late...
Duely noted! They look amazing.. I was not even considering Stillwell as they seem off-road oriented. When did you have your re-valved, early 2015 or late? Because I am sure they had to have made som leeway since then?!
It was early 2015.

Good luck with your new setup! Can't wait the hear the review!

Pit Row

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i3oykin
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i3oykin 8/22/2016 7:56pm
8/22/2016 7:56pm
i3oykin wrote:
Duely noted! They look amazing.. I was not even considering Stillwell as they seem off-road oriented. When did you have your re-valved, early 2015 or late...
Duely noted! They look amazing.. I was not even considering Stillwell as they seem off-road oriented. When did you have your re-valved, early 2015 or late? Because I am sure they had to have made som leeway since then?!
Thelen20 wrote:
It was early 2015.

Good luck with your new setup! Can't wait the hear the review!
Oh I will post up a very lengthy and informative review, hoping to have them sent out this week. I am going to try and ride Pala tomorrow to get a little more feel for them before I send them out.
Digger29
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Digger29 8/22/2016 8:40pm
8/22/2016 8:40pm
Digger29 wrote:
Send them to Billy at Powerband. He's done a bunch of 4CS for me and my buddy's who race MX and off-road and everyone has been...
Send them to Billy at Powerband. He's done a bunch of 4CS for me and my buddy's who race MX and off-road and everyone has been very pleased with his 4CS set up and his prices are very very good.
JWACK wrote:
You have been so pleased with your billy 4cs that you promptly bought cone valves.??
I had the cone valves well before I got the bike smartass :-) I did test my 4CS that Billy did for me at the end of last season and they were great. I put about 3hrs on them right before I sold my bike. Were they as good as the cone valves F no but they were better than other 4CS that I tried in the last yr and half and they were very race-able. He did 7-8 sets for some racing buddy's and they all loved them and few had already had them done here locally and they hated them and a cpl of the guys were just about ready to sell their bikes until Powerband did their forks. Would you like their names and phone numbers and their skill levels :-) I'm not trying to drum up business for Billy because he doesn't need my help.
CarlinoJoeVideo
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CarlinoJoeVideo 8/22/2016 9:24pm
8/22/2016 9:24pm
Speaking of upgrading suspension... I just saw Ohlins fork and shock for 2016 KTM on eBay for $3,000ish. Maybe lowball them for a better deal? if you can afford the money up front, because revalve front and rear will be $1,000+ and go with the bike.
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i3oykin 8/22/2016 11:28pm
8/22/2016 11:28pm
CarlinoJoeVideo wrote:
Speaking of upgrading suspension... I just saw Ohlins fork and shock for 2016 KTM on eBay for $3,000ish. Maybe lowball them for a better deal? if...
Speaking of upgrading suspension... I just saw Ohlins fork and shock for 2016 KTM on eBay for $3,000ish. Maybe lowball them for a better deal? if you can afford the money up front, because revalve front and rear will be $1,000+ and go with the bike.
Yeah I saw them, they were like 3200 I think.

I found a guy selling A-kit PC forks/shock. 3 sets of Cone valve forks, and 2 Traxx shocks locally to me. I asked how much for one set of forks and a traxx shock... No reply. Guess he does not want to sell them separate? Looked like he was asking 7k for everything... Which is insanely good but I only want a set of forks and shock lol.
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Madmax31 8/23/2016 5:19am
8/23/2016 5:19am
Just save your money and ride the damn bike.
CarlinoJoeVideo
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CarlinoJoeVideo 8/23/2016 7:11am
8/23/2016 7:11am
CarlinoJoeVideo wrote:
Speaking of upgrading suspension... I just saw Ohlins fork and shock for 2016 KTM on eBay for $3,000ish. Maybe lowball them for a better deal? if...
Speaking of upgrading suspension... I just saw Ohlins fork and shock for 2016 KTM on eBay for $3,000ish. Maybe lowball them for a better deal? if you can afford the money up front, because revalve front and rear will be $1,000+ and go with the bike.
i3oykin wrote:
Yeah I saw them, they were like 3200 I think. I found a guy selling A-kit PC forks/shock. 3 sets of Cone valve forks, and 2...
Yeah I saw them, they were like 3200 I think.

I found a guy selling A-kit PC forks/shock. 3 sets of Cone valve forks, and 2 Traxx shocks locally to me. I asked how much for one set of forks and a traxx shock... No reply. Guess he does not want to sell them separate? Looked like he was asking 7k for everything... Which is insanely good but I only want a set of forks and shock lol.
Are they for the new 16 or older bike?

Want to connect me? Maybe I could do a deal then sell you a set?

Carlinojoe@yahoo.com
JWACK
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JWACK 8/23/2016 7:54am
8/23/2016 7:54am
Digger29 wrote:
Send them to Billy at Powerband. He's done a bunch of 4CS for me and my buddy's who race MX and off-road and everyone has been...
Send them to Billy at Powerband. He's done a bunch of 4CS for me and my buddy's who race MX and off-road and everyone has been very pleased with his 4CS set up and his prices are very very good.
JWACK wrote:
You have been so pleased with your billy 4cs that you promptly bought cone valves.??
Digger29 wrote:
I had the cone valves well before I got the bike smartass :-) I did test my 4CS that Billy did for me at the end...
I had the cone valves well before I got the bike smartass :-) I did test my 4CS that Billy did for me at the end of last season and they were great. I put about 3hrs on them right before I sold my bike. Were they as good as the cone valves F no but they were better than other 4CS that I tried in the last yr and half and they were very race-able. He did 7-8 sets for some racing buddy's and they all loved them and few had already had them done here locally and they hated them and a cpl of the guys were just about ready to sell their bikes until Powerband did their forks. Would you like their names and phone numbers and their skill levels :-) I'm not trying to drum up business for Billy because he doesn't need my help.
Just razzn you! Grinning
i3oykin
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i3oykin 8/23/2016 9:42am
8/23/2016 9:42am
Madmax31 wrote:
Just save your money and ride the damn bike.
I am, today! Going to do some more testing.
KVDT
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KVDT 8/23/2016 12:24pm
8/23/2016 12:24pm
Are the 4CS really that bad? 10 years ago I could win the C class and not get lapped in B. Now I'm 40 years old and want to get another bike. I'm looking at the 2016 KTM 250F. Just how bad is the suspension? For heavens sake I made due 20+ years ago with stock RM125 and YZ125. Are they worse than the older sticks out there?
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i3oykin 8/23/2016 10:29pm
8/23/2016 10:29pm
KVDT wrote:
Are the 4CS really that bad? 10 years ago I could win the C class and not get lapped in B. Now I'm 40 years old...
Are the 4CS really that bad? 10 years ago I could win the C class and not get lapped in B. Now I'm 40 years old and want to get another bike. I'm looking at the 2016 KTM 250F. Just how bad is the suspension? For heavens sake I made due 20+ years ago with stock RM125 and YZ125. Are they worse than the older sticks out there?
It's not as horrible as people say. It's far from being competitive in stock form, though.
So testing today I thought what the heck. Let's check some stuff. A local pro told me to try to back the rebound out to 18. Stock being 15. Deff helped a lot. But still not forgiving in many situations. I'm going to send .y stuff to ProTune this week. He's confident he can make it do what I want.

Side note. Suspension aside I'm faster on my Husky thab on my yz125. 80 hours on the yz. Barely 2 on the Husky. The TC just tracks better and seems to be overall more planted in corners. Can't wait to see what it's like with suspension revisions.
Madmax31
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Madmax31 8/24/2016 4:59am
8/24/2016 4:59am
Madmax31 wrote:
Just save your money and ride the damn bike.
i3oykin wrote:
I am, today! Going to do some more testing.
Smile
Madmax31
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Madmax31 8/24/2016 5:30am
8/24/2016 5:30am
KVDT wrote:
Are the 4CS really that bad? 10 years ago I could win the C class and not get lapped in B. Now I'm 40 years old...
Are the 4CS really that bad? 10 years ago I could win the C class and not get lapped in B. Now I'm 40 years old and want to get another bike. I'm looking at the 2016 KTM 250F. Just how bad is the suspension? For heavens sake I made due 20+ years ago with stock RM125 and YZ125. Are they worse than the older sticks out there?
I honestly think it's the placebo effect. Couple of guys say they are horrible, and then everyone thinks they have to buy after market forks, or spend a bunch of money re-valving. I have a 13 KTM 450, I'm 50, race vet B, run top 3 or better most of the time. I've been racing since the early 80's, and have owned a lot of bikes.

My bike is 3 years old, and haven't even changed the oil. I think they are good 85% of the time. The only time I even notice them not working good is on slap down high speed hits, and that's really not that bad. I only notice it on one track I ride, on 1 jump. Again it's not that bad, just initial harshness from slap down.

Am I the right weight to make them work right (200 lbs)? Did I get a one-off good setup from the factory...doubt it. Even my friend who absolutely hates KTM's thinks the forks are pretty good.

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