New Bike Feeling

mingham97
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mingham97
Hey guys,

So gonna ditch the trails to get into a bit of racing next year. My current motorcycle is a 2013 KX250f. 100 hours on it all up. 25 hours on the piston, cam and SS valves. Has been ridden well. Over it's life time.

I need opinions on the following and I know vital has lots of them.

1.) Compared to a brand new 2015 RMZ250f I got to ride the other day, my bike has next to no resistance when I kick it over (compression? or are kxs just easier to kick?)
2.) RMZ also has far more power better acceleration. This is weird since KX comes with 2-3 more horsepower new. I dunno if this is a torque or hp problem since I am 85kg. How can I get this pull out of my bike? It already has a PC full system
3.) Suspension is set up for 65kgs. What must I do to set it up for my weight?
4.) Bike doesn't idle. Have played with idle screw and couplers with no luck. Only kicks when its top dead centre. Steps to fix this?

I'm going to check and fix the clearances in the next week or so but these have also been done 10 hours ago. If they are out of spec, than I think I will have even more problems as clearances really shouldn't be out after 10 hours.

I want it to feel new again! I don't mind pouring money into it if I can get a decent return. Or does this bike have more problems than it is worth? I can buy a brand new bike from the suzuki dealership I work at for $3000 aud change over
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JackLHyde
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JackLHyde 6/16/2016 4:44am
6/16/2016 4:44am
1.) Probably low on compression, they shouldn't feel that different when your engine is in good condition. Get a leak test made on your bike to find out what needs to be serviced.
2.) You're probably talking about the low-end. I assume you didn't do yourself a favor with an aftermarket pipe, almost all gain on top, but lose low-end. See also point 1, get your engine checked.
3.) Go to your local suspension shop, get your suspension serviced with fresh oil and bushings and tell them to install the right springs for you.
4.) See point 1. Something is going on.

MB109
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MB109 6/16/2016 9:59am
6/16/2016 9:59am
For $3000 AUD..I'd get the brand new RMZ.
mingham97
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mingham97 6/16/2016 5:24pm
6/16/2016 5:24pm
mingham97 wrote:
Hey guys, So gonna ditch the trails to get into a bit of racing next year. My current motorcycle is a 2013 KX250f. 100 hours on...
Hey guys,

So gonna ditch the trails to get into a bit of racing next year. My current motorcycle is a 2013 KX250f. 100 hours on it all up. 25 hours on the piston, cam and SS valves. Has been ridden well. Over it's life time.

I need opinions on the following and I know vital has lots of them.

1.) Compared to a brand new 2015 RMZ250f I got to ride the other day, my bike has next to no resistance when I kick it over (compression? or are kxs just easier to kick?)
2.) RMZ also has far more power better acceleration. This is weird since KX comes with 2-3 more horsepower new. I dunno if this is a torque or hp problem since I am 85kg. How can I get this pull out of my bike? It already has a PC full system
3.) Suspension is set up for 65kgs. What must I do to set it up for my weight?
4.) Bike doesn't idle. Have played with idle screw and couplers with no luck. Only kicks when its top dead centre. Steps to fix this?

I'm going to check and fix the clearances in the next week or so but these have also been done 10 hours ago. If they are out of spec, than I think I will have even more problems as clearances really shouldn't be out after 10 hours.

I want it to feel new again! I don't mind pouring money into it if I can get a decent return. Or does this bike have more problems than it is worth? I can buy a brand new bike from the suzuki dealership I work at for $3000 aud change over
Thats what I'm thinking at this stage
mingham97
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mingham97 6/16/2016 5:34pm
6/16/2016 5:34pm
mingham97 wrote:
Hey guys, So gonna ditch the trails to get into a bit of racing next year. My current motorcycle is a 2013 KX250f. 100 hours on...
Hey guys,

So gonna ditch the trails to get into a bit of racing next year. My current motorcycle is a 2013 KX250f. 100 hours on it all up. 25 hours on the piston, cam and SS valves. Has been ridden well. Over it's life time.

I need opinions on the following and I know vital has lots of them.

1.) Compared to a brand new 2015 RMZ250f I got to ride the other day, my bike has next to no resistance when I kick it over (compression? or are kxs just easier to kick?)
2.) RMZ also has far more power better acceleration. This is weird since KX comes with 2-3 more horsepower new. I dunno if this is a torque or hp problem since I am 85kg. How can I get this pull out of my bike? It already has a PC full system
3.) Suspension is set up for 65kgs. What must I do to set it up for my weight?
4.) Bike doesn't idle. Have played with idle screw and couplers with no luck. Only kicks when its top dead centre. Steps to fix this?

I'm going to check and fix the clearances in the next week or so but these have also been done 10 hours ago. If they are out of spec, than I think I will have even more problems as clearances really shouldn't be out after 10 hours.

I want it to feel new again! I don't mind pouring money into it if I can get a decent return. Or does this bike have more problems than it is worth? I can buy a brand new bike from the suzuki dealership I work at for $3000 aud change over
Sorry for the silly question, but can a bike be valved for someone elses weight?
I think that could be the first thing, is to put the stock exhaust on and see if that fixes anything

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JackLHyde
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JackLHyde 6/17/2016 3:32am
6/17/2016 3:32am
mingham97 wrote:
Sorry for the silly question, but can a bike be valved for someone elses weight? I think that could be the first thing, is to put...
Sorry for the silly question, but can a bike be valved for someone elses weight?
I think that could be the first thing, is to put the stock exhaust on and see if that fixes anything
Valving controls the damping, springs carry the weight. Some suspension techs may want to change your valving (and take your money), but please get the right springs first. With these and fresh serviced suspension you'll feel a noticable difference.
Or take the RMZ, it's sprung for heavier riders in stock form.
mingham97
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mingham97 6/18/2016 8:13am
6/18/2016 8:13am
JackLHyde wrote:
Valving controls the damping, springs carry the weight. Some suspension techs may want to change your valving (and take your money), but please get the right...
Valving controls the damping, springs carry the weight. Some suspension techs may want to change your valving (and take your money), but please get the right springs first. With these and fresh serviced suspension you'll feel a noticable difference.
Or take the RMZ, it's sprung for heavier riders in stock form.
What I'm getting at is that, the previous owner, had suspension set up for him including valves so was wondering if I had to change that out but i think that you answered my question anyway! Thanks for your helps guys!
captmoto
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captmoto 6/18/2016 9:23am
6/18/2016 9:23am
Change every bearing in the chassis including the wheels to get a new bike feel. Replace seat foam, controls and cables. Nothing short of a full rebuild of the motor will make it feel new again and that includes all bearings in the motor. The sky is the limit for getting back that new bike feel.
cwtoyota
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cwtoyota 6/18/2016 12:30pm
6/18/2016 12:30pm
JackLHyde wrote:
Valving controls the damping, springs carry the weight. Some suspension techs may want to change your valving (and take your money), but please get the right...
Valving controls the damping, springs carry the weight. Some suspension techs may want to change your valving (and take your money), but please get the right springs first. With these and fresh serviced suspension you'll feel a noticable difference.
Or take the RMZ, it's sprung for heavier riders in stock form.
mingham97 wrote:
What I'm getting at is that, the previous owner, had suspension set up for him including valves so was wondering if I had to change that...
What I'm getting at is that, the previous owner, had suspension set up for him including valves so was wondering if I had to change that out but i think that you answered my question anyway! Thanks for your helps guys!
Suspension settings can be drastically different based on rider weight and rider skill. A stock setting, or something setup for your weight and speed would be the best "mod" for any bike. You'll get way more out of $600 in suspension work than you will out of a $1200 exhaust on every bike made.

If your fork and shock oil are old (more than 20 - 30 hours) they need to be changed. That will make the suspension feel mushy and worn out. What JackLHyde said about springs and fresh oil, etc is 100% true, but the valving and springs work together for your weight and speed.

It sounds to me like your engine/chassis needs to be gone through thoroughly. If you don't know the exact total hours on it, just do the full deal or go for the new bike if you don't want to commit that much money. Rebuilding a 250F is almost economical if you do all of the work yourself and already have the tools, etc.

If you hire a shop to make it feel new again, you're going to be better off (financially) just buying new and selling the old bike.


mingham97
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mingham97 6/19/2016 6:28am
6/19/2016 6:28am
JackLHyde wrote:
Valving controls the damping, springs carry the weight. Some suspension techs may want to change your valving (and take your money), but please get the right...
Valving controls the damping, springs carry the weight. Some suspension techs may want to change your valving (and take your money), but please get the right springs first. With these and fresh serviced suspension you'll feel a noticable difference.
Or take the RMZ, it's sprung for heavier riders in stock form.
mingham97 wrote:
What I'm getting at is that, the previous owner, had suspension set up for him including valves so was wondering if I had to change that...
What I'm getting at is that, the previous owner, had suspension set up for him including valves so was wondering if I had to change that out but i think that you answered my question anyway! Thanks for your helps guys!
cwtoyota wrote:
Suspension settings can be drastically different based on rider weight and rider skill. A stock setting, or something setup for your weight and speed would be...
Suspension settings can be drastically different based on rider weight and rider skill. A stock setting, or something setup for your weight and speed would be the best "mod" for any bike. You'll get way more out of $600 in suspension work than you will out of a $1200 exhaust on every bike made.

If your fork and shock oil are old (more than 20 - 30 hours) they need to be changed. That will make the suspension feel mushy and worn out. What JackLHyde said about springs and fresh oil, etc is 100% true, but the valving and springs work together for your weight and speed.

It sounds to me like your engine/chassis needs to be gone through thoroughly. If you don't know the exact total hours on it, just do the full deal or go for the new bike if you don't want to commit that much money. Rebuilding a 250F is almost economical if you do all of the work yourself and already have the tools, etc.

If you hire a shop to make it feel new again, you're going to be better off (financially) just buying new and selling the old bike.


For a woods bike, it is very good tbh. I wouldn't change a thing if I was going to keep riding local trails and what not. So selling it, I would be selling it to someone who rides 3 times a year. A lot of local woods riders who think they are fast can not push these bikes too hard. That's where four strokes go to die haha.

I think i will just got with something new. I live in Australia BTW, anything that comes from the US has shipping and import tax incorporated into the price. So everything here is expensive, there fore not completely economical to fully fix up. Different story in America
BobPA
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BobPA 6/20/2016 5:08am
6/20/2016 5:08am
Sounds like you engine is tired

SS valves make them feel lazy

SS valves can beat up valve seats hurting compression

Tear that engine apart
CrGuy2T
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CrGuy2T 6/23/2016 5:23pm
6/23/2016 5:23pm Edited Date/Time 6/23/2016 5:25pm
I have done ground up restores and I personally do not think it's possible to have an actual new bike feeling. This is replacing all the bearing and everything. You can make it feel better but it'll never have that new bike feeling again. You will spend a small fortune trying to get that back. The new bike feeling goes away after about 30 hours. It comes down to everything frame, motor, spokes, hubs, suspension bushings, and springs.
mingham97
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mingham97 6/23/2016 6:46pm
6/23/2016 6:46pm Edited Date/Time 6/23/2016 6:49pm
mingham97 wrote:
Hey guys, So gonna ditch the trails to get into a bit of racing next year. My current motorcycle is a 2013 KX250f. 100 hours on...
Hey guys,

So gonna ditch the trails to get into a bit of racing next year. My current motorcycle is a 2013 KX250f. 100 hours on it all up. 25 hours on the piston, cam and SS valves. Has been ridden well. Over it's life time.

I need opinions on the following and I know vital has lots of them.

1.) Compared to a brand new 2015 RMZ250f I got to ride the other day, my bike has next to no resistance when I kick it over (compression? or are kxs just easier to kick?)
2.) RMZ also has far more power better acceleration. This is weird since KX comes with 2-3 more horsepower new. I dunno if this is a torque or hp problem since I am 85kg. How can I get this pull out of my bike? It already has a PC full system
3.) Suspension is set up for 65kgs. What must I do to set it up for my weight?
4.) Bike doesn't idle. Have played with idle screw and couplers with no luck. Only kicks when its top dead centre. Steps to fix this?

I'm going to check and fix the clearances in the next week or so but these have also been done 10 hours ago. If they are out of spec, than I think I will have even more problems as clearances really shouldn't be out after 10 hours.

I want it to feel new again! I don't mind pouring money into it if I can get a decent return. Or does this bike have more problems than it is worth? I can buy a brand new bike from the suzuki dealership I work at for $3000 aud change over
Yeah for sure! Just pulled the bike apart and pressure washed it and put the valves in spec. New wheel bearings and sprockets. Will repack exhaust. Everything else is lubed and adjusted and I can already get an element of the new feeling after $100. I think spending any more I will he pissing in the wind. Everything in the engine is still relatively fresh and after pulling it apart, I can definitely believe that the previous owner did spend some money to keep the engine well looked after at 100 hours. But as stated, it is just tired and approaching it's first crank and it's 2nd piston

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