School me on the KTM 200 engine

Aceofspades
Edited Date/Time 10/15/2021 6:36am
It's very possible I'm buying a new bike. probably an xc or xcw model ktm either a 200, 250,or 300. Is the 200 still the old engine design? since the ktm 125 is pushing 40 hp, what's the hp for the 200? Is the engine torquey enough for a 200 pound old man like myself? I'm researching daily but I can't find a thorough source of buyer info.
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KTMsc
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KTMsc 5/11/2016 10:14pm
5/11/2016 10:14pm
I raced a 200SX and had no problem against the bigger bikes.
The 200 engine is amazingly torquey and can be lugged around on the trails if that is your thing.
KTM only sells the XC-W now which has the wide ratio tranny.
The engine has not had any significant updates except for e-start.
Very fun bikes to ride.
Aceofspades 5/12/2016 4:12am
5/12/2016 4:12am Edited Date/Time 5/12/2016 4:13am
is first gear pretty low on the xc models? If not, are the top gears wide enough that a few teeth can be added without totally making the top gears way too short? Forgot to ask Smile I just sold my old kx250 because first gear was way too tall, so I'm not going to go through that nonsense again.
EEE299
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EEE299 5/12/2016 4:24am
5/12/2016 4:24am
I had a 09 200xc, first gear was pretty low but still usable. I think I read that they were making 46 hp stock in 09? The xc-w first gear is even lower from what I've heard, and that is the only new 200 available right now I think. The xc was a not a wide ratio trans like the xc-w is but it was wider than any 125 mx bike. I would think it would have enough torque for you down low, however I have heard people say the gearing is a little too wide for the power and it struggles at pulling in high gears.
tobz
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tobz 5/12/2016 5:19am
5/12/2016 5:19am
Funnest bike I've ever owned. Seriously underrated super fun power.

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EEE299
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EEE299 5/12/2016 5:46am
5/12/2016 5:46am
tobz wrote:
Funnest bike I've ever owned. Seriously underrated super fun power.
I'll never buy a bike without linkage again, but it sure was fun while it lasted!
Aceofspades 5/12/2016 9:55am
5/12/2016 9:55am
my nephew has a 2014 250 xcw 4 stroke model without linkage, and it's a fun, fun bike. The link less rear feels great to me, but I'm thinking that IF I spend the cash on a new bike, I'm getting the xc since it's basically the mx bike with a wide ratio tranny. if I'm not mistaken. I know I'll regret it I'd I get the xcw model, even though I KNOW that the xcw is actually the better bike for my usage. One other contingency is the yz250x, which I'm really leaning toward since it's much cheaper in my area plus it's got all those years of aftermarket support. If all else fails, I may also buy a used YZ and add the yz250x gears, powervalve and cylinder as well as a full rebuild. By the time my money rolls in I will have made my decision lol.
EEE299
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EEE299 5/12/2016 10:03am
5/12/2016 10:03am
If you're looking into the 250xc wait for the 2017 release then compare to the yz250x. I know the 250sx is suppose to get big changes for 17 and I would see if the xc gets some too. Usually the offroad bikes are a year or two behind but its worth checking. If its the same as the 2016 I'd probably get the yz250x instead. I have a woods built 2011 yz250 and the aftermarket/cheap parts is really nice...
Hcallz5
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Hcallz5 5/12/2016 3:15pm
5/12/2016 3:15pm
It's got a rack and pinion style powervalve so the power transition is really smooth. Super torquey down low, I have no problem getting the front tire up on mine plus it does pretty well with the wide ratio gear box too. On a track its not going to run away from 450 obviously but if things start to get tight and technical at all there is no bike I'd rather be on. I just got got my head recut for proper squish clearance and it runs great.
Aceofspades 5/12/2016 3:23pm
5/12/2016 3:23pm
Hcallz5 wrote:
It's got a rack and pinion style powervalve so the power transition is really smooth. Super torquey down low, I have no problem getting the front...
It's got a rack and pinion style powervalve so the power transition is really smooth. Super torquey down low, I have no problem getting the front tire up on mine plus it does pretty well with the wide ratio gear box too. On a track its not going to run away from 450 obviously but if things start to get tight and technical at all there is no bike I'd rather be on. I just got got my head recut for proper squish clearance and it runs great.
are you talking ktm200? Weird as it sounds, a low first gear is the most important thing to me besides general torque. If funds allow I'm leaning Husqvarna so I'll have to get the 300, but man those 200 are slick!
colintrax
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colintrax 5/12/2016 3:32pm
5/12/2016 3:32pm
Since nobody's answered it yet, the 200 is the old engine design. The new 125 cases can't fit a crankshaft that large. That why no 200 for 2017, it's getting replaced by the 150XC.
OldYZRider1
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OldYZRider1 5/12/2016 3:35pm
5/12/2016 3:35pm
My 2008 200XC pulls my 200 lbs around fine. I did change gearing from the 14/48 stock to 14/44 as I just ride MX with mine. The 200 XC-W is the only model currently available still and I think this is the final year for them. The XC's stopped in 2009.

The transmission ratios on the XC-W's are different from the XC, first and second are 3% lower, third and fourth are the same, fifth is 6% higher and sixth is 15% higher. I went to 14/44 final gearing on mine (came with 14/48) and thats very close to what the 200SX's had (14/45). Even with that my taller gearing the XC-W's top gear is still 5% higher yet, so its a pretty tall gear.

I've never ridden an XC-W but didn't feel I wanted to try it when I bought mine as I don't do any trail riding with one. The XC-W's also had open cartridge forks in 2008 whereas the XC had closed chambers which I preferred also. I think the newest XC-W's have had a change in the fork rake and front axle size but I really don't know what all has changed on them. Of course the XC-W's are still PDS rear suspension which I really prefer, after all at 57 yo I'm not racing supercross! The frame and shock changes made in 2007 and 2008 really improved the PDS bikes performance in my opinion. I also own a 2004 200SX and even with a MX-Tech re-valved shock and progressive spring its still not as good as my '08 is.

Basically it sucks where the KTM 200 is at in my opinion. I really wish KTM or Husky would put one out in SX trim again but it looks like the new 125/150 motor may be at its limit so there may be no upgrade path to 200 as they did to make the original 200. Maybe TM or GasGas can come in and offer something unique just like KTM did?
Aceofspades 5/12/2016 4:00pm
5/12/2016 4:00pm
OldYZRider1 wrote:
My 2008 200XC pulls my 200 lbs around fine. I did change gearing from the 14/48 stock to 14/44 as I just ride MX with mine...
My 2008 200XC pulls my 200 lbs around fine. I did change gearing from the 14/48 stock to 14/44 as I just ride MX with mine. The 200 XC-W is the only model currently available still and I think this is the final year for them. The XC's stopped in 2009.

The transmission ratios on the XC-W's are different from the XC, first and second are 3% lower, third and fourth are the same, fifth is 6% higher and sixth is 15% higher. I went to 14/44 final gearing on mine (came with 14/48) and thats very close to what the 200SX's had (14/45). Even with that my taller gearing the XC-W's top gear is still 5% higher yet, so its a pretty tall gear.

I've never ridden an XC-W but didn't feel I wanted to try it when I bought mine as I don't do any trail riding with one. The XC-W's also had open cartridge forks in 2008 whereas the XC had closed chambers which I preferred also. I think the newest XC-W's have had a change in the fork rake and front axle size but I really don't know what all has changed on them. Of course the XC-W's are still PDS rear suspension which I really prefer, after all at 57 yo I'm not racing supercross! The frame and shock changes made in 2007 and 2008 really improved the PDS bikes performance in my opinion. I also own a 2004 200SX and even with a MX-Tech re-valved shock and progressive spring its still not as good as my '08 is.

Basically it sucks where the KTM 200 is at in my opinion. I really wish KTM or Husky would put one out in SX trim again but it looks like the new 125/150 motor may be at its limit so there may be no upgrade path to 200 as they did to make the original 200. Maybe TM or GasGas can come in and offer something unique just like KTM did?
good info! 3% first gear difference isn't enough to dissuade me from an xc if I go that way. Thanks!
FreshTopEnd
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FreshTopEnd 5/12/2016 4:09pm
5/12/2016 4:09pm Edited Date/Time 5/12/2016 4:10pm
The 200 may be the perfect engine. I've owned two, an older EXC (wide ratio) and an 08 XC. Fans of this engine go to elaborate lengths to keep it available in new chassis (Haven't looked for a couple years, but the smoker section at KTMTalk had a couple 150XC conversions where the 200 top end was fitted). If and when I am in the market for another bike besides vintage stuff, another 200 will be pretty close to the top of the list of options.
Aceofspades 5/12/2016 6:11pm
5/12/2016 6:11pm
I know a lot of you guys will laugh, but my old 02 kdx200 was a pretty great bike. My wife today said "why not get a used mx bike and another used kdx and rebuild both, and you'll still be spending only about half as much as you would on a new bike. Then you can buy a crf230 used for our youngest son to ride with you?" She's starting to make sense lol. Man, this kind of decision making is hard for me.
colintrax
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colintrax 5/12/2016 6:33pm
5/12/2016 6:33pm
Aceofspades wrote:
I know a lot of you guys will laugh, but my old 02 kdx200 was a pretty great bike. My wife today said "why not get...
I know a lot of you guys will laugh, but my old 02 kdx200 was a pretty great bike. My wife today said "why not get a used mx bike and another used kdx and rebuild both, and you'll still be spending only about half as much as you would on a new bike. Then you can buy a crf230 used for our youngest son to ride with you?" She's starting to make sense lol. Man, this kind of decision making is hard for me.
Who'd laugh? The KDX is a great bike.
And your wife is smart. I'd advise you listen to her more often lol
Adam43
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Adam43 5/12/2016 6:57pm
5/12/2016 6:57pm
Rode a 200XC on a moto track years ago, and it was one of the most fun bikes I've ever rode.
Kx125rider 5/12/2016 6:59pm
5/12/2016 6:59pm
Aceofspades wrote:
I know a lot of you guys will laugh, but my old 02 kdx200 was a pretty great bike. My wife today said "why not get...
I know a lot of you guys will laugh, but my old 02 kdx200 was a pretty great bike. My wife today said "why not get a used mx bike and another used kdx and rebuild both, and you'll still be spending only about half as much as you would on a new bike. Then you can buy a crf230 used for our youngest son to ride with you?" She's starting to make sense lol. Man, this kind of decision making is hard for me.
I'd do this if i were you.
Project 2501 5/12/2016 7:10pm
5/12/2016 7:10pm
it's the old engine, expect a 200 kit to exist for the 150 if you want to go bigger and have the newest cases but I can't say enough good things about the old 200 engine. Gem to ride and work on. I have an orange 200, 250, and 300 and I think the 200 is the best engine of the bunch.

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Aceofspades 5/12/2016 7:31pm
5/12/2016 7:31pm
yep. I'm now actively searching for a 05 and up yz250, and a 99 and up kdx200 to restore. It just makes way more sense in my situation since I'm a seldom riding, very slow trail rider. The yz250 will get the yz250x gears and powervalve/cylinder, 18 inch wheel, skid plate, and lighting capable stator. The Kdx will get usd forks and a skid plate. If a good enough kdx can be foubd, and I can score a kx125 chassis, I'll probably build a hybrid and not even get the yz. a tt230 or crf230 will be bought as a bike for my son and any guests who want to ride. I think even with that plan I'll still save about 5 grand lol.
bodean123 5/12/2016 10:05pm
5/12/2016 10:05pm
Have a 2004 200sx motor in a 2009 125sx chassis. It's a fucking riot.
FWYT
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FWYT 5/13/2016 12:30am
5/13/2016 12:30am
I have an '04 200 EXC and I just love it. That motor is awesome!

BTW, for moto gearing for me, I went the opposite of what most people do
and went way down. 12/48 is what I think I'm at. Works really, really well.
Gets you up in the higher gears where the ratios are closer together.
And actually works great for trail riding, too.
cwtoyota
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cwtoyota 5/13/2016 12:43am
5/13/2016 12:43am
Aceofspades wrote:
I know a lot of you guys will laugh, but my old 02 kdx200 was a pretty great bike. My wife today said "why not get...
I know a lot of you guys will laugh, but my old 02 kdx200 was a pretty great bike. My wife today said "why not get a used mx bike and another used kdx and rebuild both, and you'll still be spending only about half as much as you would on a new bike. Then you can buy a crf230 used for our youngest son to ride with you?" She's starting to make sense lol. Man, this kind of decision making is hard for me.
colintrax wrote:
Who'd laugh? The KDX is a great bike.
And your wife is smart. I'd advise you listen to her more often lol
I've often thought a KDX200 or 200SX with a little engine work and a modern 250F chassis would make a fun race bike.
tobz
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tobz 5/13/2016 1:13am
5/13/2016 1:13am
tobz wrote:
Funnest bike I've ever owned. Seriously underrated super fun power.
EEE299 wrote:
I'll never buy a bike without linkage again, but it sure was fun while it lasted!
It's certainly a bit of a stigma that riders tend to screw their noses up. I had gold valves and a racetech bladder in the rear, thing was plush with no nasty suprises, handled better than the wr250f I have now.
Underground 5/13/2016 1:25am
5/13/2016 1:25am
Guys who think 125's are fun, haven't ridden a 200. And yes they are torquey off the bottom and with screaming top end. Bit less than a 300 off the bottom but 125 up top. And 200 through the middle which makes it way easier than a 250. Hope that sort of builds a picture, it's a good spread of power. I'm running 13/46 on my EXC to get decent road speed between sections (and I do feel the gear ratios up top on an MX track) with a carb spacer and FMF standard length MX muffler and spent a fair amount of time sorting out the jetting so it's very crisp.
EEE299
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EEE299 5/13/2016 4:05am
5/13/2016 4:05am Edited Date/Time 5/13/2016 4:07am
tobz wrote:
Funnest bike I've ever owned. Seriously underrated super fun power.
EEE299 wrote:
I'll never buy a bike without linkage again, but it sure was fun while it lasted!
tobz wrote:
It's certainly a bit of a stigma that riders tend to screw their noses up. I had gold valves and a racetech bladder in the rear...
It's certainly a bit of a stigma that riders tend to screw their noses up. I had gold valves and a racetech bladder in the rear, thing was plush with no nasty suprises, handled better than the wr250f I have now.
Believe it or not, my complaint was not the handling. Something about the forces exerted from no linkage made my xc eat swingarm bearings. At least I think that's what caused it. I've never had that problem with any other bike. I swear I was doing them every couple months though Dizzy


Edit: I loved that freakin engine though. And I could still race light in my HS series, it was like cheating!
resetjet
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resetjet 5/13/2016 5:21am
5/13/2016 5:21am
The 200 died this year. No 200 for 2017. So if you can find a 16, buy it. Or buy an older one. I have two 03 sx and although the handling isnt as good as a modern bike, its close. I run showa forks. The engine on the other hAnd is the best they built to date. Its also very tuneable to get power wherever you want it. I dont like 250's in the woods as they are two peppy, 300,s are easier to ride so ling as you dont grab a handful. Yz250x is a dog. Almost no pipe. I would also consider a modern 250f ktm or yz.
resetjet
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resetjet 5/13/2016 5:24am
5/13/2016 5:24am
Oh and a 125-200 is a small bore bike. Smaller crank. They just ride different then a big bore......250+
Frodad78
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Frodad78 5/13/2016 5:39am
5/13/2016 5:39am
Aceofspades wrote:
I know a lot of you guys will laugh, but my old 02 kdx200 was a pretty great bike. My wife today said "why not get...
I know a lot of you guys will laugh, but my old 02 kdx200 was a pretty great bike. My wife today said "why not get a used mx bike and another used kdx and rebuild both, and you'll still be spending only about half as much as you would on a new bike. Then you can buy a crf230 used for our youngest son to ride with you?" She's starting to make sense lol. Man, this kind of decision making is hard for me.
I'm rebuilding a 97 KDX200 and I can't wait to get it in the woods!
de883zx
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de883zx 5/13/2016 5:40am
5/13/2016 5:40am
Ktm talk has this topic covered multiple times. Joshua at Jbonemotorworks is very knowledgeable in the 200 engine. Andrew cooskey at cooskey cranks knows the bottom end like nobody else. I rode one and knew it was for me. 165 lb vet intermediate. Just got done with some upgrades.









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Zaugg
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Zaugg 5/13/2016 8:02am
5/13/2016 8:02am
Danny...the bike is looking on-point. Now lets get that shop cleaned up. hahaha

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