Cianciarulo and Baker are no more?

BobPA
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BobPA 1/6/2016 11:46pm
1/6/2016 11:46pm
ReedyMX wrote:
AC is probably still with Baker. It is all under the table stuff. AC is going to get big and strong very quick and baker does...
AC is probably still with Baker. It is all under the table stuff. AC is going to get big and strong very quick and baker does not want his name tarnished any more than what it is. Sometimes too much success can damage a trainers reputation. ie Michele Ferrari.
How is his name tarnished? The only rumors I hear of PED's, or any kind of nonsense, are folding new tinfoil hats while typing on here....
68
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68 1/7/2016 12:27am
1/7/2016 12:27am
mmmm i dont know AC, look how kenny has done since he has left the program..
dirtworldmx 1/7/2016 12:36am
1/7/2016 12:36am
Makes sense for AC to go in a different direction now and he definitely needs to focus on bulking up and injury prevention. Baker would just lean him out even more and that combined with over-training makes another injury a greater possibility, IMO.

But it's a little weird this news coming out just before the season opener. It's almost like breaking up with your chick right before Christmas.
Motofinne
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Motofinne 1/7/2016 12:37am
1/7/2016 12:37am Edited Date/Time 1/7/2016 12:38am
68 wrote:
mmmm i dont know AC, look how kenny has done since he has left the program..
But there is a huge difference between those 2 cases. Roczen won a championship with Aldon/KTM and left both. ACs pro career hasn't gone like it was planned. I think change could be a good thing for him. Roczen? I still to this day think it was stupid to part ways with Aldon and KTM.

But it will definitely be interesting to see what AC does in the next 2 years.

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philG
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philG 1/7/2016 12:41am
1/7/2016 12:41am
UpTiTe wrote:
Aldon Baker, turning champions into champions.
Nothing more to it than that.

Maybe AC has been talking to Kenny.
Sully
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Sully 1/7/2016 4:33am
1/7/2016 4:33am
hammertime wrote:
I don't give a shit who he trains with, just want to see a good kid with so much talent be happy and healthy in 2016!
The rest of you guys may want to reevaluate your thought processes when Hammertime is the only guy in this thread who makes any sense. I'm pretty sure this is the final sign of the apocalypse.
51xc
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51xc 1/7/2016 5:22am
1/7/2016 5:22am
hammertime wrote:
I don't give a shit who he trains with, just want to see a good kid with so much talent be happy and healthy in 2016!
Sully wrote:
The rest of you guys may want to reevaluate your thought processes when Hammertime is the only guy in this thread who makes any sense. I'm...
The rest of you guys may want to reevaluate your thought processes when Hammertime is the only guy in this thread who makes any sense. I'm pretty sure this is the final sign of the apocalypse.
well actually it doesn't make any sense what he said. ac got to where he is with good support, training and mentoring. pure talent and luck is not enough.
but there is more than just aldon ou there, obviously.
Olson
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Olson 1/7/2016 5:33am
1/7/2016 5:33am
What exactly is the difference in Kennys career since he left Aldon? A lot of you people make it seem like he went straight downhill from there. Did he? He still rides at the very top. Did he case the triple, hit a wall and had back surgery all because he left Aldon? Get a grip.
wreckitrandy
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wreckitrandy 1/7/2016 6:00am
1/7/2016 6:00am
Toneconsultant wrote:
Adam left the Baker's factory? It's about time! It's time to get back to enjoying to racel. I'm talking about 80's SX or better yet, the...
Adam left the Baker's factory? It's about time!

It's time to get back to enjoying to racel. I'm talking about 80's SX or better yet, the McGrath era.

I'm tired of this RC era of trainers and groups of blood suckers tagging on for the ride. Let's get back to a day when racers enjoyed racing. What do I mean? I mean this. Is there one rider within the top 40 that would ride on an off weekend, just because they thought it might be fun? Of course not. Over Training ruined the sport.

Even at the top level, moto should be fun. RC quit at 26. RV cut out early too.

It's the Baker factory that's ruining the sport.

P.S. If someone says you have to be fit to win, does that mean our racers will be couch potatoes? Probably not.

Dude, you're gonna be like, famous. If you can get some t-shirts made up with a cool logo or something, everybody will be training at your compound. It'll be epic!
Zycki11
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Zycki11 1/7/2016 6:01am
1/7/2016 6:01am
I think it is funny that everyone believes Aldons program is gold. The guy does a very good job at what he is supposed to do. When you look at riders throughout there career, you can really tell when they were serious and when they did it half assed. Adam is a bright kid, he knows what he is after, and he knows what he needs to achieve it. At some point, you wake up and look in the mirror with a epiphany. Aldons program does not work for everyone and for those who are capable of looking on the other side, it has to be scary for their career. I hope Adam finds what he is looking for, Kenny will be fine.
mattmatt300
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mattmatt300 1/7/2016 6:08am
1/7/2016 6:08am
Lots of people talking about overtraining. I remember Dungey saying something along the lines of when he first got with Aldon that he was actually training less than before. The only people calling it overtraining are the guys who's favorite rider couldn't handle it.
IWreckALot
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IWreckALot 1/7/2016 6:31am
1/7/2016 6:31am
machine wrote:
Maybe Baker has finally priced himself too high. Maybe AC learned what he needed to learn from him and maybe wants to freshen things up a...
Maybe Baker has finally priced himself too high. Maybe AC learned what he needed to learn from him and maybe wants to freshen things up a bit. It does seem like weird timing right before the season is starting. Something probably happened between them i'm guessing.
h&m_cycle wrote:
Thank you... learn it... then just do it...
Does Omara and Rattray test blood and know enough about it to alter a training program in a scientific and productive way? Or do they just know training programs? Sincerely asking if anyone knows?

I'd argue that RV would have a much more difficult time without a trainer. RV didn't really "dominate" all of his championships. He won a few of them by a very small margin. He was pudgy before contracting with Baker and pudgy just doesn't get the job done against a guy like RD. Maybe any other trainer could have kept RV in line, but guess who DID do it. . . You can argue your hypothetical bullshit all day but you'll never be able to produce concrete evidence like what is already out there. AB has the most amount of wins, and therefore, he is the best trainer. . .
Motofinne
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Motofinne 1/7/2016 6:46am
1/7/2016 6:46am
I understand to 100% that people can be a bit skeptical when it comes to different trainers, and that's a good thing. Critical thinking is very important when it comes to almost all subjects in the world. But i think that Aldon has the credentials and the results to back up the price for his services and knowledge.
Reefer Sutherland 1/7/2016 6:56am
1/7/2016 6:56am
machine wrote:
Maybe Baker has finally priced himself too high. Maybe AC learned what he needed to learn from him and maybe wants to freshen things up a...
Maybe Baker has finally priced himself too high. Maybe AC learned what he needed to learn from him and maybe wants to freshen things up a bit. It does seem like weird timing right before the season is starting. Something probably happened between them i'm guessing.
h&m_cycle wrote:
Thank you... learn it... then just do it...
IWreckALot wrote:
Does Omara and Rattray test blood and know enough about it to alter a training program in a scientific and productive way? Or do they just...
Does Omara and Rattray test blood and know enough about it to alter a training program in a scientific and productive way? Or do they just know training programs? Sincerely asking if anyone knows?

I'd argue that RV would have a much more difficult time without a trainer. RV didn't really "dominate" all of his championships. He won a few of them by a very small margin. He was pudgy before contracting with Baker and pudgy just doesn't get the job done against a guy like RD. Maybe any other trainer could have kept RV in line, but guess who DID do it. . . You can argue your hypothetical bullshit all day but you'll never be able to produce concrete evidence like what is already out there. AB has the most amount of wins, and therefore, he is the best trainer. . .
So if I pick up AC and train him, and Aldon starts training TYLER FORM TEXIS, and AC beats Tyler, I'm a better trainer than Aldon Baker.

Solid Vitard logic.


"Good fit".
kkawboy14
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kkawboy14 1/7/2016 7:01am
1/7/2016 7:01am
1-forty-8 wrote:
Maybe deep down Baker stopped believing the hype.. If it was a dollar thing but you really believed this kid was the next RC (and who...
Maybe deep down Baker stopped believing the hype.. If it was a dollar thing but you really believed this kid was the next RC (and who better than Aldon to know something like that) you'd give him a little discount knowing that a couple years time he would be raking in the dollars..
GuyB wrote:
So what you're saying is, what's in your post is 100 percent speculation.
This place is a place to come to for factual industry news now?
Zycki11
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Zycki11 1/7/2016 7:04am
1/7/2016 7:04am
Those credentials come in handy when you get riders like RC, Stewart, RD, Musquin, Roczen, AC, RV, and Anderson. You need to be in shape to go fast, and you need to be fast to win races. Speed comes first, conditioning to sustain the pace comes second. I don't think Aldon will turn a Alex Martin into a champion, do any of you? Nothing against Alex, the guy is a fantastic racer.
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kaptkaos 1/7/2016 7:07am
1/7/2016 7:07am
Guys, seriously give this some thought...

AC has been training and paying Aldon a ton of money over the last few years. He is a smart kid, you dont think he could have learned how to train himself at this point and pocket a ton of cash? His results havent exactly been indicative of securing a future contract, and every penny counts with these short careers. He is probably making a prudent business decision. Based on past history, of which AC is an astute historian of MX, he can figure out that one can only endure so long on the Baker regimen before burning out mentally and physically. He doesnt need that elite fitness right now in his career. He needs to ride, say healthy, and secure another contract. The 250 class isnt exactly full of Bakers athletes so he can win there without him, especially with what he already knows about training. Hes a smart kid, with smarter family and I trust he is doing what is best for him.
IWreckALot
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IWreckALot 1/7/2016 7:07am
1/7/2016 7:07am
h&m_cycle wrote:
Thank you... learn it... then just do it...
IWreckALot wrote:
Does Omara and Rattray test blood and know enough about it to alter a training program in a scientific and productive way? Or do they just...
Does Omara and Rattray test blood and know enough about it to alter a training program in a scientific and productive way? Or do they just know training programs? Sincerely asking if anyone knows?

I'd argue that RV would have a much more difficult time without a trainer. RV didn't really "dominate" all of his championships. He won a few of them by a very small margin. He was pudgy before contracting with Baker and pudgy just doesn't get the job done against a guy like RD. Maybe any other trainer could have kept RV in line, but guess who DID do it. . . You can argue your hypothetical bullshit all day but you'll never be able to produce concrete evidence like what is already out there. AB has the most amount of wins, and therefore, he is the best trainer. . .
Reefer Sutherland wrote:
So if I pick up AC and train him, and Aldon starts training TYLER FORM TEXIS, and AC beats Tyler, I'm a better trainer than Aldon...
So if I pick up AC and train him, and Aldon starts training TYLER FORM TEXIS, and AC beats Tyler, I'm a better trainer than Aldon Baker.

Solid Vitard logic.


"Good fit".
Blah blah blah. . . hypothetical hypothetical hypothetical. . . Stats don't lie.

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Olson
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Olson 1/7/2016 7:07am
1/7/2016 7:07am
IWreckALot wrote:
Does Omara and Rattray test blood and know enough about it to alter a training program in a scientific and productive way? Or do they just...
Does Omara and Rattray test blood and know enough about it to alter a training program in a scientific and productive way? Or do they just know training programs? Sincerely asking if anyone knows?

I'd argue that RV would have a much more difficult time without a trainer. RV didn't really "dominate" all of his championships. He won a few of them by a very small margin. He was pudgy before contracting with Baker and pudgy just doesn't get the job done against a guy like RD. Maybe any other trainer could have kept RV in line, but guess who DID do it. . . You can argue your hypothetical bullshit all day but you'll never be able to produce concrete evidence like what is already out there. AB has the most amount of wins, and therefore, he is the best trainer. . .
Anyone can go to any sports clinic and get the exact same tests done. I doubt Aldon tests his riders in his garage. If he does I can see where the PED rumour comes from.
IWreckALot
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IWreckALot 1/7/2016 7:10am
1/7/2016 7:10am
kaptkaos wrote:
Guys, seriously give this some thought... AC has been training and paying Aldon a ton of money over the last few years. He is a smart...
Guys, seriously give this some thought...

AC has been training and paying Aldon a ton of money over the last few years. He is a smart kid, you dont think he could have learned how to train himself at this point and pocket a ton of cash? His results havent exactly been indicative of securing a future contract, and every penny counts with these short careers. He is probably making a prudent business decision. Based on past history, of which AC is an astute historian of MX, he can figure out that one can only endure so long on the Baker regimen before burning out mentally and physically. He doesnt need that elite fitness right now in his career. He needs to ride, say healthy, and secure another contract. The 250 class isnt exactly full of Bakers athletes so he can win there without him, especially with what he already knows about training. Hes a smart kid, with smarter family and I trust he is doing what is best for him.
I don't knock AC's decision at all. I just find it funny that some guys give 0 credit to Baker. . . It's clear he does something different than all the other trainers. RC was clearly going to be a champ with or without Baker, and I can see the argument with JS7 as well. RV though, the dude was WAY less conditioned without Baker and there was a significant change after he went with Baker. . . And the margin that RV won by in some of his championships, I believe training was the exact piece of the puzzle that pushed him to win.
IceMan446
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IceMan446 1/7/2016 9:40am
1/7/2016 9:40am
ReedyMX wrote:
AC is probably still with Baker. It is all under the table stuff. AC is going to get big and strong very quick and baker does...
AC is probably still with Baker. It is all under the table stuff. AC is going to get big and strong very quick and baker does not want his name tarnished any more than what it is. Sometimes too much success can damage a trainers reputation. ie Michele Ferrari.
Yeah Ferrari's rep was totally tarnished from too much success.

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IceMan446 1/7/2016 9:43am
1/7/2016 9:43am
Gukamonster wrote:
This is probably the biggest factor. Adam wasn't exactly raking in huge win and championship bonuses being hurt and Aldon doesn't come cheap. A lot of...
This is probably the biggest factor. Adam wasn't exactly raking in huge win and championship bonuses being hurt and Aldon doesn't come cheap. A lot of contracts dock some pay for a certain amount of races missed also. After training with him since being on 85s, he has probably learned enough to not feel "lost" without him. It's probaby not ideal for his results, but spending 6 figures while being hurt would not be enjoyable either.
Not to mention Mitch doesnt pay that well. Your pay is based on results on his team.

While I think AC is living comfortably, his brand has to be hurting from all of his injuries. And im sure Aldon doesnt give him a break if he is hurt.

I think he sees Roczen training at the Bagget compound out in florida and thinks he can do just the same. While saving a shit ton of money each year. They have two guys with the blue print, now it just comes down to staying injury free.
h&m_cycle
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h&m_cycle 1/7/2016 10:33am
1/7/2016 10:33am
kaptkaos wrote:
Guys, seriously give this some thought... AC has been training and paying Aldon a ton of money over the last few years. He is a smart...
Guys, seriously give this some thought...

AC has been training and paying Aldon a ton of money over the last few years. He is a smart kid, you dont think he could have learned how to train himself at this point and pocket a ton of cash? His results havent exactly been indicative of securing a future contract, and every penny counts with these short careers. He is probably making a prudent business decision. Based on past history, of which AC is an astute historian of MX, he can figure out that one can only endure so long on the Baker regimen before burning out mentally and physically. He doesnt need that elite fitness right now in his career. He needs to ride, say healthy, and secure another contract. The 250 class isnt exactly full of Bakers athletes so he can win there without him, especially with what he already knows about training. Hes a smart kid, with smarter family and I trust he is doing what is best for him.
No... he can't just have "the trainer to the stars" then learn the program in 2 years, Adam needs to give his money to
Baker as long as he's capable of winning because Aldon is the best there is...

I done learned it on Vital...
twizzler
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twizzler 1/7/2016 11:05am
1/7/2016 11:05am
Has Baker ever turned a non champion into a champion? Don't think so. Every champion Baker has worked with was a previous champion somewhere at some time in their career. AC was a amateur champion with another trainer but with Baker AC has not won any pro championships.
51xc
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51xc 1/7/2016 11:28am
1/7/2016 11:28am
IWreckALot wrote:
Does Omara and Rattray test blood and know enough about it to alter a training program in a scientific and productive way? Or do they just...
Does Omara and Rattray test blood and know enough about it to alter a training program in a scientific and productive way? Or do they just know training programs? Sincerely asking if anyone knows?

I'd argue that RV would have a much more difficult time without a trainer. RV didn't really "dominate" all of his championships. He won a few of them by a very small margin. He was pudgy before contracting with Baker and pudgy just doesn't get the job done against a guy like RD. Maybe any other trainer could have kept RV in line, but guess who DID do it. . . You can argue your hypothetical bullshit all day but you'll never be able to produce concrete evidence like what is already out there. AB has the most amount of wins, and therefore, he is the best trainer. . .
yes they do. they work mainly with heart rate and lactate test to see how they respond to the training (overtraining etc). and they have their guys do vo2 max tests and all that fun.

Dyno testing my bodies motor.

A video posted by Jeremymartin6 (@jeremymartin6) on Dec 9, 2015 at 9:16pm PST






scott_nz 1/7/2016 11:37am
1/7/2016 11:37am
twizzler wrote:
Has Baker ever turned a non champion into a champion? Don't think so. Every champion Baker has worked with was a previous champion somewhere at some...
Has Baker ever turned a non champion into a champion? Don't think so. Every champion Baker has worked with was a previous champion somewhere at some time in their career. AC was a amateur champion with another trainer but with Baker AC has not won any pro championships.
i'll counter that with the question " has anyone ever gone better after leaving Aldon?"

because Stew hasn't, Kenny didn't (although too short of a time to really know) and Weimer/Baggett and the other riders have not gone any better either,
bdub
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bdub 1/7/2016 11:49am
1/7/2016 11:49am
This is interesting, I am a really big fan of AC44, I really hope to see him win his first SX championship this year. He seems to have a good head on him, should be alright without Aldon.
h&m_cycle
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h&m_cycle 1/7/2016 11:52am
1/7/2016 11:52am
68 wrote:
mmmm i dont know AC, look how kenny has done since he has left the program..
Who Kenny? a Tier One Rider who had a couple of crashes and fork problems is my pick to win either the supercross
title or motocross and maybe both...

Baker is good at helping a Tier One Rider get to the next level... Let's see if he can turn Jason Anderson into a Tier One
Rider... I have Anderson & Baggett listed as the Top Tier Two Riders...
Reefer Sutherland 1/7/2016 11:53am
1/7/2016 11:53am
Gukamonster wrote:
This is probably the biggest factor. Adam wasn't exactly raking in huge win and championship bonuses being hurt and Aldon doesn't come cheap. A lot of...
This is probably the biggest factor. Adam wasn't exactly raking in huge win and championship bonuses being hurt and Aldon doesn't come cheap. A lot of contracts dock some pay for a certain amount of races missed also. After training with him since being on 85s, he has probably learned enough to not feel "lost" without him. It's probaby not ideal for his results, but spending 6 figures while being hurt would not be enjoyable either.
IceMan446 wrote:
Not to mention Mitch doesnt pay that well. Your pay is based on results on his team. While I think AC is living comfortably, his brand...
Not to mention Mitch doesnt pay that well. Your pay is based on results on his team.

While I think AC is living comfortably, his brand has to be hurting from all of his injuries. And im sure Aldon doesnt give him a break if he is hurt.

I think he sees Roczen training at the Bagget compound out in florida and thinks he can do just the same. While saving a shit ton of money each year. They have two guys with the blue print, now it just comes down to staying injury free.
he pays well... Forkers whole contract got posted here yesterday. For 18 minutes...
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Tpog496 1/7/2016 11:58am
1/7/2016 11:58am
Reefer Sutherland wrote:
he pays well... Forkers whole contract got posted here yesterday. For 18 minutes...
I missed it by 1 minute. Clue me in.

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