Posts
13
Joined
3/9/2014
Location
Derby, KS, USA
Edited Date/Time
5/19/2014 4:51pm
Just wanted to see what everyone thought of this theory on the whole GP's vs. AMA debate.
How much of a role do you think having to compete in both SX and MX for the AMA guys affects their overall ability in outdoors. The GP's start in March and they compete in 17 rounds for the entire year and end in September. The stateside series competes in 17 supercross races from January to May, and then straight into 12 outdoors rounds that last from May till August.
For the AMA guys, you have to perfect your supercross skills, followed directly by working on motocross. I've been racing my entire life, and even though the two types of racing are similar, it still takes a lot of time to get everything dialed in and comfortable between the two. The GP guys only have one job, and that is to concentrate on their motocross skills. They have almost 6 months between each season, while the AMA guys get practically no break if they race the Monster Cup.
I just feel like only having to participate in only one aspect of competition benefits the GP guys when it comes to motocross speed.
On that note, AC222 has always been one of my favorites since we watched him at the Des Nations in Colorado in 2010. He's so smooth and makes everything seem effortless. He almost looks slow when he's going around the track, but still setting lap times no one else could really touch. Really wish something would motivate him to come over for at least one outdoor motocross series so we could see how the AMA boys compare to him, and how he would do on American soil.
Just food for thought
How much of a role do you think having to compete in both SX and MX for the AMA guys affects their overall ability in outdoors. The GP's start in March and they compete in 17 rounds for the entire year and end in September. The stateside series competes in 17 supercross races from January to May, and then straight into 12 outdoors rounds that last from May till August.
For the AMA guys, you have to perfect your supercross skills, followed directly by working on motocross. I've been racing my entire life, and even though the two types of racing are similar, it still takes a lot of time to get everything dialed in and comfortable between the two. The GP guys only have one job, and that is to concentrate on their motocross skills. They have almost 6 months between each season, while the AMA guys get practically no break if they race the Monster Cup.
I just feel like only having to participate in only one aspect of competition benefits the GP guys when it comes to motocross speed.
On that note, AC222 has always been one of my favorites since we watched him at the Des Nations in Colorado in 2010. He's so smooth and makes everything seem effortless. He almost looks slow when he's going around the track, but still setting lap times no one else could really touch. Really wish something would motivate him to come over for at least one outdoor motocross series so we could see how the AMA boys compare to him, and how he would do on American soil.
Just food for thought
There is no real motocross series in the US anymore IMO, even if the name leads you to believe otherwise.
The Shop
DeCal Works Huge Plastic Inventory of UFO and Polisport kits.
Luxon 4-Post Bar Mounts
$189.95 - $239.95
Free shipping: VITALMX
Its no easy ride , the schedule is just as hard , Ben Watson who is doing EMX 250 and the Odd GP , did Bulgaria, back to the UK , for a british champs that got cancelled , so they went to do a Dutch national instead, the valkenswaard for the GP , in Holland, back home , then off to spain for tallavera, back here for round 4 of the UK series this week, and then the british GP at Matterley.. add to that his brother Nathan did a french international the friday before valkenswaard, and a big uk meeting on the sunday.
The myth that the GP boys only ride 6 months a year is just that , a myth, GP's are 2 days , tougher than a 1 day AMA meeting , and pretty much every other weekend is filled with a race that they must do to satisfy the team's home country sponsors. Its a brutal schedule, that you dont get to see the full implications of until you are involved.
SX for 18 weeks isnt easy , but once you have SX dialled , how much do the tracks vary, really ?? And the AMA outdoors is getting more like outdoor SX every year.... which doesnt help guys ride proper outdoors
Sunhouse, you are entitled to your opinion but AMA nationals are every bit motocross as gp's. You ever ridden RedBud? It's what mx is like in heaven.
I say give us both and then you'll see who the top rider is....
I understand the GP guys race other series, and their local national series and some one off winter SX races, but the difference in level of intensity and pressure of a local national or one off sx races makes them have a smaller influence on the riders on a whole in my opinion. Think about all the pressure the AMA guys have, to be competitive in SX, and MX. The GP guys don't rely on their one off SX races for contracts, where the majority of the AMA riders will only land a contract if they are great indoors. Those native country nationals and other mx races they do only benefit them because it is more seat time for mx when you think about it.
My only wonder is if our top guys only raced MX all year, would they benefit speed wise strictly speaking for motocross?
The 2013 MXoN track was insane. I don't think I could have even dog paddled through some of those ruts.
MXER90-SX and MX owes a lot to Freestyle MX for raising public awareness I think, Your last question RE wonder I can't relate to honestly but I like people who think outside the box so right on.
lostboy819-Why go there RE pro GP crowd? No one is saying one is better than the other which is actually nice for a change.
philG-Thanks for the 411 about the riders' schedule. I wasn't that familiar with all that so I appreciate the post.
SX is wat pays the bills in the US at the moment so that's the only option but you'd have to think they'd get faster if MX was their year round focus.
In regards to Supercross aiding MX skills - other than perhaps a touch more intensity (which suits the National tracks anyway) I don't think it makes a huge difference to the Motocross skill set. They're two different things and even more different again in Europe.
The bigger difference to promoting good technique for MX is surely found in riding a variety of terrains; and this is the one area where I think the Nationals could benefit. Not so much roughness (both series can get mad rough) but terrain. Iv'e lost count of the comments on RacerX from people that talk about "rough" and "technical" as if they're absolutely always one and the same, completely interchangeable terms. They're NOT necessarily the same thing. You can have a relatively smooth, blue grooved, off cambers everywhere track; that's just as highly technical in its own way as a whooped out rough and rutted loam surface. I think the Nationals have lost touch with that side of things a little bit.
My point (which is a digression from the original topic - sorry OP) is that IMO American motocross has lost a little bit of touch with what pure motocross used to be (even though it of course will change over time). There are exceptions, and some variables from the what "the rest of the world" defines as mx is also perfectly fine. BUT, the tracks we as fans have been fed the last few years (last year was the worst by far) are IMO a mix of supercross and nascar. Even the classic tracks have been peltered with often meaningless jumps, whoops etc. It`s like they have to jump for the sake of jumping. As a fan I am not liking the way things are going. After 5 months of SX I want to see something different.
Unfortunately I think we have seen the beginning of this happeneing to the GP`s too. Maybe I`m old fashioned, but I would like to see a bigger difference between sx and mx than what we have now.
Back to topic: I agree with OP. Americans race more, have more pressure and a little better technique over pretty much everything except rutted tracks.
Sorry if I brought up a new topic in this thread OP, don`t mean to highjack it!
The beginnning? We went down this route about 8 or 9 years ago, we virtually pioneered the trend with tracks like Donington Park.
The tracks are pretty good this year; Sevlievo, Arco di Trento, Maggiora, Saint Jean d'Angley, Uddevalla, Talavera, Lierop, Teutschenthal etc. Lossail aside (which is a GP desitination for obvious reasons) think YS have actually started to recognise peoples dissatisfaction with manmade circuits and are changing their ways in this respect. They've as much as said so in various interviews.
Im not too fussed about Utah but on the whole I think the US tracks are great, amazing even. The only thing that bugs me is this trend where a modern riders preference for perfect loamy soil seems to dictate the track preperation. We all like to ride on pillowy dirt with nice berms but these guys shouldn't have that luxury, especially at every round. It should be a variety of hardpack, sand, mud, grass even.
If I had my way this what professional Motocross tracks would still be like, not deeply groomed soil which has been plowed flat...
Pit Row
You should go to the US this summer, for exemple to Unadilla....or Washougal, Redbud, and so on...
Compare to several europeans tracks...., I'm afraid you need eye glasses...
My sentiments exactly. Please be advised you're treading on thin ice as this is a sore point to some who want specific examples. If you have time go for it. For me the results of the MXoN the last two years are indicative to be of how much SX has influenced the sport in the US and the resulting impact it has had on our racers MX chops. WARNING LABEL: Please don't anyone turn these words into who's faster or who's better because that is NOT what I am saying.
EDIT: SX influence on US tracks has made them less old school and more hybrid SX/MX tracks IMO.. My vote is fewer jumps and more LONG rutted straights like what they have across the pond. Last time I looked that is what MX is about is technical riding skills and not just jump timing.
As a fan of MX I think it is great the gap has closed between the GPs and AMA racers. Great not knowing who will win the MXoN for a change.
Look at Unadilla then and now.... it used to be 1ft long grass in practice .. now its just jumps . And why the track becomes a rut fest, the racing turns into slot cars..
There is a reason why there are a multitude of ice cream flavors. Would be boring if everyone just liked one flavor.
Line choice used to be everything , now its all about jumps. The tougher riders dont get to stand out like they used to , and with the short races , even more so,
Post a reply to: GP's vs. AMA: A Different Perspective