NASCAR says you can't "let Broc bye"

krooner33
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krooner33
Edited Date/Time 8/23/2015 7:39am
Has anyone else ever heard of a team being fined for "team tactics"? I can't say I agree with teams doing this, but I can completely understand why they do it. With all the financial incentive to finishing high in the points why wouldn't they do it? But I also don't agree with them being fined for it.

Thoughts anyone?

(P.S. I despise NASCAR, this story just got me thinking about that famous "let Broc bye" picture)

Also here's the link to the full story NASCAR fines Waltrip racing $300,000
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shortcourse
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shortcourse 9/9/2013 9:18pm
9/9/2013 9:18pm
Have we seen a let Brock Bye pit board since that one.............Maybe if Newman waited to make the pass on the last lap it would've have mattered.
lostboy819 9/9/2013 9:23pm
9/9/2013 9:23pm
Woohoo Great headline
Tim507
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Tim507 9/9/2013 9:24pm
9/9/2013 9:24pm
Ya I read that today - pretty interesting. Seems kind of odd that this might have affected Gordon, but I guess since he was not in a wild card position.......no affect
KennyT
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KennyT 9/9/2013 9:47pm
9/9/2013 9:47pm
Proper move by Nascar. It would be similar to having the Geico team pull off the track into the mechanics area to let their teammate by. Blatant cheating that affected the outcome of a race

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BAMX
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BAMX 9/9/2013 9:49pm
9/9/2013 9:49pm
I am not surprised other than that they did it over the radio. NA$CAR monitors all radio transmission so I don't know what they were thinking. In fact, you have to give them your frequency so that they can monitor it. As for what they did, I totally get where they are coming from. They race for a ton of money. This isn't chump change like motocross. That championship would be worth tens of millions to the team.
The Rock
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The Rock 9/10/2013 1:39am
9/10/2013 1:39am
F1 has had some shenigans with the last occurrence just two or three years ago.
Aaryn234
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Aaryn234 9/10/2013 2:13am
9/10/2013 2:13am
The Rock wrote:
F1 has had some shenigans with the last occurrence just two or three years ago.
The last occurrence just two years ago?

More like earlier this year, not letting drivers pass for position or at least try is as bad as letting someone by.

The Vettle / Webber incident was the one that went public this year, but was not the only team that gave orders to drivers to stay put.

Though you have to question why they are called teams, if Team riders / drivers can't help each other out?
Crisp BRAAAP! 9/10/2013 2:54am
9/10/2013 2:54am
You can use team tactics to let someone by. They do it all the time to let a team mate lead a lap and get a point. You can't intentionally spin out and cause a caution, creating a dangerous situation for everyone else. Two different things.
144273
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144273 9/10/2013 3:01am
9/10/2013 3:01am Edited Date/Time 9/10/2013 3:04am
From a fans point of view I don't like team orders. However the teams are racing for a lot of money, the drivers/riders are employees of the team, so if it's in the best interest of the team it makes total sense that they would swap the position of their drivers/riders. No rider/driver is as big as the team (unless its their own team...).

But I do have more of a problem with team orders if they are supposed to be illegal, although F1 legalised team orders again when they realised that it was not an enforceable rule.

Although crashing intentionally is a different thing, a similar situation happened in F1 in 2008 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Renault_Formula_One_crash_controversy
crackalack 9/10/2013 3:39am
9/10/2013 3:39am
its an absolute bullshit call. the fine and flip flop is all about a car being told to pit over the radio to help with points, no different then allowing a driver to pass to gain lap leading bonus points or whatever in hell they do. If multi driver teams are legal, then drivers working together is legal. Nascar manipulated the results and rules when a golden child didn't get the outcome they were hoping for......not like that has never happened in this sport
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Shawn142 9/10/2013 4:26am
9/10/2013 4:26am Edited Date/Time 9/10/2013 4:27am
The Rock wrote:
F1 has had some shenigans with the last occurrence just two or three years ago.
Aaryn234 wrote:
The last occurrence just two years ago? More like earlier this year, not letting drivers pass for position or at least try is as bad as...
The last occurrence just two years ago?

More like earlier this year, not letting drivers pass for position or at least try is as bad as letting someone by.

The Vettle / Webber incident was the one that went public this year, but was not the only team that gave orders to drivers to stay put.

Though you have to question why they are called teams, if Team riders / drivers can't help each other out?
That kind of thing happens every time teammates hook up during the race. Some of it goes over the airwaves and some doesn't. If one isn't obviously faster the team makes both of them hold station so no one repeats this BS:



Although it nearly happened again between the same two guys like you mentioned in China.
Crisp BRAAAP! 9/10/2013 5:26am
9/10/2013 5:26am
crackalack wrote:
its an absolute bullshit call. the fine and flip flop is all about a car being told to pit over the radio to help with points...
its an absolute bullshit call. the fine and flip flop is all about a car being told to pit over the radio to help with points, no different then allowing a driver to pass to gain lap leading bonus points or whatever in hell they do. If multi driver teams are legal, then drivers working together is legal. Nascar manipulated the results and rules when a golden child didn't get the outcome they were hoping for......not like that has never happened in this sport
Which "golden child" are you referring to? I assume you mean Gordon but he still didn't get in. You can't mean Newman as the golden child. It is NASCAR but I am pretty sure they can at least pay someone to do the math before making the call to figure that much out.
Mxdnusa
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Mxdnusa 9/10/2013 5:28am
9/10/2013 5:28am
I like how the crew chief told the driver "reach over and itch your arm"
$300,000 fine,got to love NASCAR money!

Helmet comms in MX would lead to same sort of tactics IMO.
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Beast666 9/10/2013 5:57am
9/10/2013 5:57am
The fact of the matter team tactics can happen in any motorsport with out the use of radio or pit boards. The teams can tell the drivers prior to the start that if they are running close Jim Bob is told to let Freddy Joe pass and then protect his position.

An other way they can pull team tactics is to radio the driver and tell them to "back it down a few laps our calculations show you dont have enough fuel to make it to the finish"

Some times the drivers will even pull team tactics without the team knowing. Micheal Schumacher slowed down at the Indy F1 race in 2002 trying to get a dead heat finish and his teammate beat him by 0.011 seconds.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2002_United_States_Grand_Prix
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ocscottie 9/10/2013 6:40am
9/10/2013 6:40am
I have been reading all this and my biggest question....WHERE DOES ALL THAT $$$ GO!!

AMA fines go to help the Astrisk medic crew, are these NASCAR fines just lining the pockets of the already buttrich?
Sully22
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Sully22 9/10/2013 7:09am
9/10/2013 7:09am Edited Date/Time 9/10/2013 7:10am
You guys are missing quite a few pieces to the puzzle....it wasn't just a couple of teammates slowing down or pulling over to help out. Clint bowyer intentionally spun after being coached by his crew chief over and over, saying "39's going to win," "are your arms getting tired," and "we need one more point"....heck, you could even sense some hesitancy in Clint's voice on the radio, not to mention dale Earnhardt jr was behind bowyer the entire time and said he watched bowyer jerk the wheel and hit the breaks over and over trying to make his car spin. MWR did these punk moves to cause a caution so Newman would lose his lead with only a few laps to go. Newman HAD to win to get in the chase, there were no other options for him and he drove his ass off to get to the lead with a few laps remaining, and if newman won the race it would cause truex to miss the chase. so when the race restarted and newman was now in 5th with only a few laps left, Brian vickers was being told to pit on green, to which he replied in a stunned manner over and over, "you want me to pit now?"....the guy was literally dumbfounded (it was originally this communication that made NASCAR believe something wasn't right). So now that Clint intentionally spun causing the caution to come out and Newman loses his lead, both vickers and him pulled off with just enough laps remaining to cause joey lagano to gain enough positions to clinch 10th place in the chase, which caused jeff Gordon to miss the chase because truex would then sew up the last wild card spot based on a win earlier in the year. Like i said, there were many many moving parts to the shenanigans that mwr pulled in the last 8 laps to get their guy in, and it was so blatant it was pathetic, even in nascar terms of helping a teammate...and it was rightly punished. It wasn't really a 'let broc by moment.'
BAMX
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BAMX 9/10/2013 7:09am
9/10/2013 7:09am
ocscottie wrote:
I have been reading all this and my biggest question....WHERE DOES ALL THAT $$$ GO!! AMA fines go to help the Astrisk medic crew, are these...
I have been reading all this and my biggest question....WHERE DOES ALL THAT $$$ GO!!

AMA fines go to help the Astrisk medic crew, are these NASCAR fines just lining the pockets of the already buttrich?
I don't have an up to date rule book but, the fines use to go to the drivers points fund. I think though that they changed this and are donating it to charities. My bitch about that is that NA$CAR charities tend to be top heavy types. I tend to like my charities more on the giving and less on the chartered jets.
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BAMX 9/10/2013 7:14am
9/10/2013 7:14am
Sully22 wrote:
You guys are missing quite a few pieces to the puzzle....it wasn't just a couple of teammates slowing down or pulling over to help out. Clint...
You guys are missing quite a few pieces to the puzzle....it wasn't just a couple of teammates slowing down or pulling over to help out. Clint bowyer intentionally spun after being coached by his crew chief over and over, saying "39's going to win," "are your arms getting tired," and "we need one more point"....heck, you could even sense some hesitancy in Clint's voice on the radio, not to mention dale Earnhardt jr was behind bowyer the entire time and said he watched bowyer jerk the wheel and hit the breaks over and over trying to make his car spin. MWR did these punk moves to cause a caution so Newman would lose his lead with only a few laps to go. Newman HAD to win to get in the chase, there were no other options for him and he drove his ass off to get to the lead with a few laps remaining, and if newman won the race it would cause truex to miss the chase. so when the race restarted and newman was now in 5th with only a few laps left, Brian vickers was being told to pit on green, to which he replied in a stunned manner over and over, "you want me to pit now?"....the guy was literally dumbfounded (it was originally this communication that made NASCAR believe something wasn't right). So now that Clint intentionally spun causing the caution to come out and Newman loses his lead, both vickers and him pulled off with just enough laps remaining to cause joey lagano to gain enough positions to clinch 10th place in the chase, which caused jeff Gordon to miss the chase because truex would then sew up the last wild card spot based on a win earlier in the year. Like i said, there were many many moving parts to the shenanigans that mwr pulled in the last 8 laps to get their guy in, and it was so blatant it was pathetic, even in nascar terms of helping a teammate...and it was rightly punished. It wasn't really a 'let broc by moment.'
Car racing is a team sport and always will be. Other than the spin which could have been dangerous, this is nothing new. Back in the day, they would have reached over and pulled the chip out of the MSD and over revved the motor.

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Sully22
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Sully22 9/10/2013 7:27am
9/10/2013 7:27am Edited Date/Time 9/10/2013 7:45am
Sully22 wrote:
You guys are missing quite a few pieces to the puzzle....it wasn't just a couple of teammates slowing down or pulling over to help out. Clint...
You guys are missing quite a few pieces to the puzzle....it wasn't just a couple of teammates slowing down or pulling over to help out. Clint bowyer intentionally spun after being coached by his crew chief over and over, saying "39's going to win," "are your arms getting tired," and "we need one more point"....heck, you could even sense some hesitancy in Clint's voice on the radio, not to mention dale Earnhardt jr was behind bowyer the entire time and said he watched bowyer jerk the wheel and hit the breaks over and over trying to make his car spin. MWR did these punk moves to cause a caution so Newman would lose his lead with only a few laps to go. Newman HAD to win to get in the chase, there were no other options for him and he drove his ass off to get to the lead with a few laps remaining, and if newman won the race it would cause truex to miss the chase. so when the race restarted and newman was now in 5th with only a few laps left, Brian vickers was being told to pit on green, to which he replied in a stunned manner over and over, "you want me to pit now?"....the guy was literally dumbfounded (it was originally this communication that made NASCAR believe something wasn't right). So now that Clint intentionally spun causing the caution to come out and Newman loses his lead, both vickers and him pulled off with just enough laps remaining to cause joey lagano to gain enough positions to clinch 10th place in the chase, which caused jeff Gordon to miss the chase because truex would then sew up the last wild card spot based on a win earlier in the year. Like i said, there were many many moving parts to the shenanigans that mwr pulled in the last 8 laps to get their guy in, and it was so blatant it was pathetic, even in nascar terms of helping a teammate...and it was rightly punished. It wasn't really a 'let broc by moment.'
BAMX wrote:
Car racing is a team sport and always will be. Other than the spin which could have been dangerous, this is nothing new. Back in the...
Car racing is a team sport and always will be. Other than the spin which could have been dangerous, this is nothing new. Back in the day, they would have reached over and pulled the chip out of the MSD and over revved the motor.
I get that, I've been a fan of NASCAR and watched from back around 89/90. You would have thought these guys would have had a better strategy for all this worked out well before the race...but not what these guys were doing. What mwr was doing was flat out dumb. Also, if we're talking about teams and team tactics, why didn't Penske have brad pull off a couple laps early, just in case lagano might have needed the position and one point?
krooner33
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krooner33 9/10/2013 7:39am
9/10/2013 7:39am
I understand that team tactics are nothing new, but is this the first time anyone has been reprimanded for it?
Could this set a precedent for other forms of racing?
40Plus_922mx
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40Plus_922mx 9/10/2013 9:28am
9/10/2013 9:28am
Sure these type of tactics may always exist. But that's not an excuse to not discipline teams when they do it blatantly. If they do nothing then the inmates will run the asylum and the integrity of the racing itself will plunge into wwf type of drama one day. Props to NASCAR for having the balls to slam the hammer down. Wish the AMA had this type of vision and fortitude.
mt798
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mt798 9/10/2013 11:20am
9/10/2013 11:20am
Sully22 wrote:
You guys are missing quite a few pieces to the puzzle....it wasn't just a couple of teammates slowing down or pulling over to help out. Clint...
You guys are missing quite a few pieces to the puzzle....it wasn't just a couple of teammates slowing down or pulling over to help out. Clint bowyer intentionally spun after being coached by his crew chief over and over, saying "39's going to win," "are your arms getting tired," and "we need one more point"....heck, you could even sense some hesitancy in Clint's voice on the radio, not to mention dale Earnhardt jr was behind bowyer the entire time and said he watched bowyer jerk the wheel and hit the breaks over and over trying to make his car spin. MWR did these punk moves to cause a caution so Newman would lose his lead with only a few laps to go. Newman HAD to win to get in the chase, there were no other options for him and he drove his ass off to get to the lead with a few laps remaining, and if newman won the race it would cause truex to miss the chase. so when the race restarted and newman was now in 5th with only a few laps left, Brian vickers was being told to pit on green, to which he replied in a stunned manner over and over, "you want me to pit now?"....the guy was literally dumbfounded (it was originally this communication that made NASCAR believe something wasn't right). So now that Clint intentionally spun causing the caution to come out and Newman loses his lead, both vickers and him pulled off with just enough laps remaining to cause joey lagano to gain enough positions to clinch 10th place in the chase, which caused jeff Gordon to miss the chase because truex would then sew up the last wild card spot based on a win earlier in the year. Like i said, there were many many moving parts to the shenanigans that mwr pulled in the last 8 laps to get their guy in, and it was so blatant it was pathetic, even in nascar terms of helping a teammate...and it was rightly punished. It wasn't really a 'let broc by moment.'
Sully22, do they actually show NASCAR in Thailand or do you watch it on line? Just wondering what kind of sports they show there?
smezmx
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smezmx 8/23/2015 7:39am
8/23/2015 7:39am


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