What's Fair????

Slow ~ Pro
Posts
3834
Joined
3/27/2008
Location
Capistrano Beach, CA US
8/21/2008 7:09pm
motoman0 wrote:
This is going to open up a can of worms. So what do you feel is fair for a dealer to make on a bike when...
This is going to open up a can of worms. So what do you feel is fair for a dealer to make on a bike when they sell it?
Desperation, will make you do stupid things...But hey...he got a new bike, and regardless, of the money loss, I bet he was feeling like he still got the best end of the deal !

New bikes are golden, no matter how you acquire them.

Do you know how many "Left Nuts" are missing, in lieu of new bikes ?
8/21/2008 7:26pm
motoman0 wrote:
This is going to open up a can of worms. So what do you feel is fair for a dealer to make on a bike when...
This is going to open up a can of worms. So what do you feel is fair for a dealer to make on a bike when they sell it?
As much as the buyer is willing to pay.
nomad15
Posts
89
Joined
4/26/2007
Location
TX US
8/21/2008 7:58pm
I dont understand how shops can last. Whenever ive bought a bike they say youre paying just above dealer price. If thats true they are losing...
I dont understand how shops can last. Whenever ive bought a bike they say youre paying just above dealer price. If thats true they are losing money on bikes, because the salesmen gets commision, correct?

I do know as far as parts go they make a killing, not necessarily on clothing, I think they do decent on that, but on bike parts that break. Plano Honda had a good 200% markup on many parts.
How is it you know Plano Honda had a 200% markup on many parts?
Yet you have no idea about dealer cost or what a salesman gets paid.
whats your name zookrider, and why would you buy parts from a honda dealer
if you're a zookrider?
8/21/2008 8:56pm
motoman0 wrote:
This is going to open up a can of worms. So what do you feel is fair for a dealer to make on a bike when...
This is going to open up a can of worms. So what do you feel is fair for a dealer to make on a bike when they sell it?
Slow ~ Pro wrote:
Desperation, will make you do stupid things...But hey...he got a new bike, and regardless, of the money loss, I bet he was feeling like he still...
Desperation, will make you do stupid things...But hey...he got a new bike, and regardless, of the money loss, I bet he was feeling like he still got the best end of the deal !

New bikes are golden, no matter how you acquire them.

Do you know how many "Left Nuts" are missing, in lieu of new bikes ?
lol that is so true.

The Shop

motodude72g
Posts
50
Joined
4/16/2008
Location
Los Angeles, CA US
8/21/2008 9:11pm
none of you know what your're talking about.

a good profit is 10% on bikes and maybe 20% on parts but that is all different when it comes to the real world.

some bikes get more and most WAY LESS DUE to supply constraints or overages. mainly its overages unless its Suzuki who seem to have a better knowledge of supply and demand.

parts get about 23% for most brands but are way less depending on price. say a spring get 28% markup a piston might get around 12%. think of it. a piston with a retail of even as high as $50 will only provide the dealer with a gross margin of, well, it pretty bad. doesnt even pay the salary of a parts guy to look it up and ring up the item with the slow pace of customers appearing at dealers these day.

just remember; you local dealer needs to survive with a little extra income in order to provide you with knowledgeable employees, update service staff and maybe, JUST MAYBE, a decent supply of parts on hand so you dont have to wait for you online parts order to arrive from some cut house price whore online store like you know who...

support your local dealer. go into them and lay it all out on the line a make a deal- tell them you want to have them as 'your dealer' but you expect a fair two way deal and that as long as they will try to have what you need when you need it they will get a fair negotiated deal on the bikes.

whats wrong with that?!

Slow ~ Pro
Posts
3834
Joined
3/27/2008
Location
Capistrano Beach, CA US
8/21/2008 11:00pm Edited Date/Time 4/16/2016 8:08pm
none of you know what your're talking about. a good profit is 10% on bikes and maybe 20% on parts but that is all different when...
none of you know what your're talking about.

a good profit is 10% on bikes and maybe 20% on parts but that is all different when it comes to the real world.

some bikes get more and most WAY LESS DUE to supply constraints or overages. mainly its overages unless its Suzuki who seem to have a better knowledge of supply and demand.

parts get about 23% for most brands but are way less depending on price. say a spring get 28% markup a piston might get around 12%. think of it. a piston with a retail of even as high as $50 will only provide the dealer with a gross margin of, well, it pretty bad. doesnt even pay the salary of a parts guy to look it up and ring up the item with the slow pace of customers appearing at dealers these day.

just remember; you local dealer needs to survive with a little extra income in order to provide you with knowledgeable employees, update service staff and maybe, JUST MAYBE, a decent supply of parts on hand so you dont have to wait for you online parts order to arrive from some cut house price whore online store like you know who...

support your local dealer. go into them and lay it all out on the line a make a deal- tell them you want to have them as 'your dealer' but you expect a fair two way deal and that as long as they will try to have what you need when you need it they will get a fair negotiated deal on the bikes.

whats wrong with that?!

Being one that actually ran dealers...I think. I pretty much know first hand, what I'm talking about.


Hard parts, are around 30% mark up on the average, but as low as 10%, some accessories are as much as 100% mark up.


I know, because I was the guy buying, receiving, labeling, selling, as well as paying the bills.

However, the question is what's fair on the bike sales...I say suggested retail price, tax, and license. Every dealer should do so.


8/21/2008 11:48pm Edited Date/Time 4/16/2016 8:08pm
none of you know what your're talking about. a good profit is 10% on bikes and maybe 20% on parts but that is all different when...
none of you know what your're talking about.

a good profit is 10% on bikes and maybe 20% on parts but that is all different when it comes to the real world.

some bikes get more and most WAY LESS DUE to supply constraints or overages. mainly its overages unless its Suzuki who seem to have a better knowledge of supply and demand.

parts get about 23% for most brands but are way less depending on price. say a spring get 28% markup a piston might get around 12%. think of it. a piston with a retail of even as high as $50 will only provide the dealer with a gross margin of, well, it pretty bad. doesnt even pay the salary of a parts guy to look it up and ring up the item with the slow pace of customers appearing at dealers these day.

just remember; you local dealer needs to survive with a little extra income in order to provide you with knowledgeable employees, update service staff and maybe, JUST MAYBE, a decent supply of parts on hand so you dont have to wait for you online parts order to arrive from some cut house price whore online store like you know who...

support your local dealer. go into them and lay it all out on the line a make a deal- tell them you want to have them as 'your dealer' but you expect a fair two way deal and that as long as they will try to have what you need when you need it they will get a fair negotiated deal on the bikes.

whats wrong with that?!

Lets see.... My dad had a Honda Yamaha shop that I started working at in the 70s when I was 12 after he sold that I worked for a Kaw,Suzuki, Harley {yes Harley} shop .
I then went to a Honda,Kaw dealer and was a service mgr for several years and then went to the parts counter of one of the largest Yamaha dealers in the country.

Even now I will go work for them a few hours a week during the summer hours just to stay involved with them so I do believe I I have a pretty good understanding of how it all works . You say 20% average mark up on parts but the average MSRP book price on parts is 30% to 40%.

Low dollar items can be marked up from 100% to 1000% and the high dollar parts may only be marked up 1%-2% and that runs pretty standard with the big four.

Some dealers do straight dealer retail book pricing other may do retail book + 10% or 15% or what ever they think they can sell it. It is up to the market and they are free to sell at what ever they choose.

One thing I have seen working at shops for over 30 years is that very few stay in business or have the same owner for long periods of time and the ones that have been in business the longest all have the same thing in common. The people at the shops all ride and treat their customers fairly.

I agree with Slow pro on what he thinks pricing should be on bikes, Look at how Harley dealers stuck it to everyone with massive markup OVER MSRP and built these multi million dollar buildings and now with the cooling economy and slowing market they will feel it.


8/22/2008 5:46am
none of you know what your're talking about. a good profit is 10% on bikes and maybe 20% on parts but that is all different when...
none of you know what your're talking about.

a good profit is 10% on bikes and maybe 20% on parts but that is all different when it comes to the real world.

some bikes get more and most WAY LESS DUE to supply constraints or overages. mainly its overages unless its Suzuki who seem to have a better knowledge of supply and demand.

parts get about 23% for most brands but are way less depending on price. say a spring get 28% markup a piston might get around 12%. think of it. a piston with a retail of even as high as $50 will only provide the dealer with a gross margin of, well, it pretty bad. doesnt even pay the salary of a parts guy to look it up and ring up the item with the slow pace of customers appearing at dealers these day.

just remember; you local dealer needs to survive with a little extra income in order to provide you with knowledgeable employees, update service staff and maybe, JUST MAYBE, a decent supply of parts on hand so you dont have to wait for you online parts order to arrive from some cut house price whore online store like you know who...

support your local dealer. go into them and lay it all out on the line a make a deal- tell them you want to have them as 'your dealer' but you expect a fair two way deal and that as long as they will try to have what you need when you need it they will get a fair negotiated deal on the bikes.

whats wrong with that?!

lostboy819 wrote:
Lets see.... My dad had a Honda Yamaha shop that I started working at in the 70s when I was 12 after he sold that I...
Lets see.... My dad had a Honda Yamaha shop that I started working at in the 70s when I was 12 after he sold that I worked for a Kaw,Suzuki, Harley {yes Harley} shop .
I then went to a Honda,Kaw dealer and was a service mgr for several years and then went to the parts counter of one of the largest Yamaha dealers in the country.

Even now I will go work for them a few hours a week during the summer hours just to stay involved with them so I do believe I I have a pretty good understanding of how it all works . You say 20% average mark up on parts but the average MSRP book price on parts is 30% to 40%.

Low dollar items can be marked up from 100% to 1000% and the high dollar parts may only be marked up 1%-2% and that runs pretty standard with the big four.

Some dealers do straight dealer retail book pricing other may do retail book + 10% or 15% or what ever they think they can sell it. It is up to the market and they are free to sell at what ever they choose.

One thing I have seen working at shops for over 30 years is that very few stay in business or have the same owner for long periods of time and the ones that have been in business the longest all have the same thing in common. The people at the shops all ride and treat their customers fairly.

I agree with Slow pro on what he thinks pricing should be on bikes, Look at how Harley dealers stuck it to everyone with massive markup OVER MSRP and built these multi million dollar buildings and now with the cooling economy and slowing market they will feel it.


I think you two guys are talking about 2 diff things. 1 being markup and 1 being profit margin. They are not the same. It is impossible to have a 100% margin unless you got said part for FREE. You can however have a 100% markup. Example said part's dealer cost was $5.00 and you sell it for $10.00. Is that what you are considering a 100% markup? I believe that is a 50% margin but correct me if I am wrong.
Starter Bob
Posts
109
Joined
4/1/2008
Location
Brigham City, UT US
8/22/2008 6:28am
First, let me qualify my opinion with the fact that I live in a medium sized town in Nothern Utah. My opinion may not apply to someone who lives in a big city. We only have one bike shop and have to drive 30 miles to get to another.

Anyway, I believe that this thread is missing the correct focus. You can always look around for better prices (other shops, big internet shops, ebay, etc.).

If you want to get the best prices, develop a relationship with the shop of your choice. Our local shop has taken care of my family for more than 12 years and through two owners (first one retired). It has been a good relationship for both of us. They treat me quite well with pricing on bikes, ATV's, and parts. For my part, I do my best to present the shop to everyone I know as the place to do business with. When I hear that someone has had a problem with the shop, I go and talk with the owner so he can address the problem. He has gone out of his way to listen and address any problems. When I want to purchase a new bike or ATV, I go see the owner so that I'm not hurting any of the salesmen with a lower commission than they might otherwise get.

If you develop this kind of a relationship, there is no need to worry about how much who is making. In my opinion, this is the way to go.
8/22/2008 7:39am
First, let me qualify my opinion with the fact that I live in a medium sized town in Nothern Utah. My opinion may not apply to...
First, let me qualify my opinion with the fact that I live in a medium sized town in Nothern Utah. My opinion may not apply to someone who lives in a big city. We only have one bike shop and have to drive 30 miles to get to another.

Anyway, I believe that this thread is missing the correct focus. You can always look around for better prices (other shops, big internet shops, ebay, etc.).

If you want to get the best prices, develop a relationship with the shop of your choice. Our local shop has taken care of my family for more than 12 years and through two owners (first one retired). It has been a good relationship for both of us. They treat me quite well with pricing on bikes, ATV's, and parts. For my part, I do my best to present the shop to everyone I know as the place to do business with. When I hear that someone has had a problem with the shop, I go and talk with the owner so he can address the problem. He has gone out of his way to listen and address any problems. When I want to purchase a new bike or ATV, I go see the owner so that I'm not hurting any of the salesmen with a lower commission than they might otherwise get.

If you develop this kind of a relationship, there is no need to worry about how much who is making. In my opinion, this is the way to go.
You are infact hurting the saleman because most would rather make a small amount as opposed to a nothing.
8/22/2008 7:48am
motoman0 wrote:
This is going to open up a can of worms. So what do you feel is fair for a dealer to make on a bike when...
This is going to open up a can of worms. So what do you feel is fair for a dealer to make on a bike when they sell it?
So let me get this straight; He bought a 7500 dollar machine the dealer made maybe 1200 dollars.

They sold his trade in and "supposedly" got 4500 out of it thus making 2400 dollars

So with this one customer they sold 12,000 of goods and made 3600 dollars.

That is a 30% profit margin off the whole transaction. Most major corp. report a 30% margin each quarter, is that fair then? Do you think homebuilders are or were making 30% I would guess pretty damn close. So why can't the place, where you probably love going the most make the same?

What kind of percent do you think Fox Racing makes if you buy it direct from them? Probably more like 55% to 60%..........
NB304
Posts
166
Joined
4/1/2008
Location
Jackson, MI US
8/22/2008 7:59am
i worked for a dealer for about 5 years now i run a welding company. you have to make every penny you possibly can off of everything you sell otherwise you wont be around very long. I the consumer wants that hot new bike they are going to have to pay for it. I know I have a few times. When there are leftovers on the floor and the hot new ones are coming in then its time to deal. Supply and demand, make a killing while you can, dicker and deal when you have too, that is perfectly fair.
8/22/2008 8:07am Edited Date/Time 4/16/2016 8:08pm
I dont understand how shops can last. Whenever ive bought a bike they say youre paying just above dealer price. If thats true they are losing...
I dont understand how shops can last. Whenever ive bought a bike they say youre paying just above dealer price. If thats true they are losing money on bikes, because the salesmen gets commision, correct?

I do know as far as parts go they make a killing, not necessarily on clothing, I think they do decent on that, but on bike parts that break. Plano Honda had a good 200% markup on many parts.
nomad15 wrote:
How is it you know Plano Honda had a 200% markup on many parts? Yet you have no idea about dealer cost or what a salesman...
How is it you know Plano Honda had a 200% markup on many parts?
Yet you have no idea about dealer cost or what a salesman gets paid.
whats your name zookrider, and why would you buy parts from a honda dealer
if you're a zookrider?
Whats up nomad, my name is Kyle, yours? I see youre from Allen, so no doubt you know that Plano Honda was sold and became maxim Honda. My brother worked for parts at Plano Honda, so I learned some things from him. Like I said before this was with Plano Honda, so that was years ago, when I rode Hondas. CR80 and 2 CR125s. And shhhhh dont tell anyone this but I ride a Suzuki and sometimes go into the Yamaha shop because the guys there are all friendly and you can get Suzuki parts from them...

LOL just looking at your profile, you get upset that I was talking about the shop you work at? And were you at River Valley a couple of weeks ago? I saw the 686 JD bike, gave me a quick chuckle wondering what JD thought as he was passing himself.
todder
Posts
1608
Joined
10/20/2006
Location
Sw, WI US
8/22/2008 8:50am
Times are tough especially for small business owners, i know I am one. "If "I could afford to, I would love to go into a small dealership and pay full MSRP for a new bike, knowing they need it more me.
DPW
Posts
1995
Joined
8/16/2006
Location
Dallas, TX US
8/22/2008 10:06am
I had a dealer in southern TX try and sell me an '06 YZ450F when they first came out for $8100 OTD and he made it sound like he was giving me a deal.....I chuckled and walked..

There are good dealers and bad dealers..the trick is trying to find a good one....shop around and go with the dealer and price you are comfortable with..

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