Should Bell have been allowed to race?

WhKnuckle
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WhKnuckle 2/16/2013 8:35pm
2/16/2013 8:35pm
JustMX wrote:
um...it is possible to get knocked out and not suffer a concussion...right?
No, if you lose consciousness due to a blow to the head, you have a concussion. But he obviously wasn't unconscious because doctors were standing right there and they would never allow him to race if he had been out. Yeah, it's incredible from watching the crash, but we can't diagnose injuries from the TV.
pilotdude
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pilotdude 2/16/2013 8:35pm
2/16/2013 8:35pm
Regis wrote:
He guarantee's that is what happened, just like you guys guarantee he was knocked out. The truth of the matter is, he was attended to by...
He guarantee's that is what happened, just like you guys guarantee he was knocked out.

The truth of the matter is, he was attended to by professionals who deal with it week in and week out and was obviously cleared to line back up.

I am sure the medics, Mike Larocco (his team manager) and everybody around him made the decision to let him go.
pilotdude wrote:
Right, because none of those people have any pressure on them at all. They are all completely removed from the situation and don't have to answer...
Right, because none of those people have any pressure on them at all. They are all completely removed from the situation and don't have to answer to companies who spend millions of dollars to see their team's racers out there.

Please.
Regis wrote:
You truly don't know Bodnar or any on that crew, They aren;t doing it for the money but mostly for the love of the sport and...
You truly don't know Bodnar or any on that crew, They aren;t doing it for the money but mostly for the love of the sport and are VERY good at what they do.

nobody, is going to turn a blind eye. They absolutely have the power to sit someone if need be.

TO EVEN THINK they makes decisions based on pressure or having to answer to companies is comical at best.
Wrong. To think that they are immune to that pressure is what is comical. Actually, it's not comical, it's just sad.
Matt Wozney
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Matt Wozney 2/16/2013 8:37pm
2/16/2013 8:37pm
I questioned the decision too but hey, if Bodnar and the Asterisk crew gave him the OK, they would know more about it than me farting on the couch watching and pointing at the flat screen.
Slow
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Slow 2/16/2013 8:38pm
2/16/2013 8:38pm
JustMX wrote:
um...it is possible to get knocked out and not suffer a concussion...right?
WhKnuckle wrote:
No, if you lose consciousness due to a blow to the head, you have a concussion. But he obviously wasn't unconscious because doctors were standing right...
No, if you lose consciousness due to a blow to the head, you have a concussion. But he obviously wasn't unconscious because doctors were standing right there and they would never allow him to race if he had been out. Yeah, it's incredible from watching the crash, but we can't diagnose injuries from the TV.
How did the kid ride after the crash?

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vanillaice782 2/16/2013 8:39pm
2/16/2013 8:39pm
Regis wrote:
I respect everybody's concern here and I too believe if you have a concussion you should be sat. That being said, how do any of us...
I respect everybody's concern here and I too believe if you have a concussion you should be sat.


That being said, how do any of us KNOW he was out? because on TV he didn't move right away? I just have the utmost respect for Bodnar and crew. I have been attended to by them and watched them with many a rider.

I don't think they would miss anything or let him line up without absolutely feeling he was ok to do so.

I know I am in the minority, but since he was on the line, I feel he was fine. Especially after seeing him crash in the main, hitting his head again. If he was concussed before, no way does he get up and walk off again.
vanillaice782 wrote:
All the replays were in slow mo so it exaggerated the amount of time that he wasn't moving. I guarantee he got the wind knocked out...
All the replays were in slow mo so it exaggerated the amount of time that he wasn't moving. I guarantee he got the wind knocked out of him and his first priority was breathing before moving.
pilotdude wrote:
Oh really? You guarantee it huh? What the hell ever.
Oh really to you too. "What the hell ever?" Are you a teenage girl? If he would have had a concussion he would have been spacey and not able to put sentences together. His lcq interview was an even better way to assess his mental capacity because it had been a half hour since the crash. It's usually pretty hard to assess for a concussion immediately after it happens but after a half hour everyone else in the room knows someone had a concussion. You're smarter than me though. You know how to google stuff and I've been working in emergency departments for years...
Hut
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Hut 2/16/2013 8:39pm
2/16/2013 8:39pm
JustMX wrote:
um...it is possible to get knocked out and not suffer a concussion...right?
WhKnuckle wrote:
No, if you lose consciousness due to a blow to the head, you have a concussion. But he obviously wasn't unconscious because doctors were standing right...
No, if you lose consciousness due to a blow to the head, you have a concussion. But he obviously wasn't unconscious because doctors were standing right there and they would never allow him to race if he had been out. Yeah, it's incredible from watching the crash, but we can't diagnose injuries from the TV.
Your reasoning doesn't make sense. He easily could have been knocked out before the medics got to him.
I hope he is alright after getting slammed twice in one night.
WhKnuckle
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WhKnuckle 2/16/2013 8:42pm
2/16/2013 8:42pm
pilotdude wrote:
Right, because none of those people have any pressure on them at all. They are all completely removed from the situation and don't have to answer...
Right, because none of those people have any pressure on them at all. They are all completely removed from the situation and don't have to answer to companies who spend millions of dollars to see their team's racers out there.

Please.
Regis wrote:
You truly don't know Bodnar or any on that crew, They aren;t doing it for the money but mostly for the love of the sport and...
You truly don't know Bodnar or any on that crew, They aren;t doing it for the money but mostly for the love of the sport and are VERY good at what they do.

nobody, is going to turn a blind eye. They absolutely have the power to sit someone if need be.

TO EVEN THINK they makes decisions based on pressure or having to answer to companies is comical at best.
pilotdude wrote:
Wrong. To think that they are immune to that pressure is what is comical. Actually, it's not comical, it's just sad.
If you think Doc Bodner cares about sponsors or teams or anything in the world except the safety of those riders, you're out of your mind. And they don't just hold out riders with head injuries for their own sake, they also hold them out to prevent them from injuring someone else.

Doc Bodner would NEVER - EVER - LET A RIDER GO BACK OUT ON THE TRACK AFTER HE'D BEEN KNOCKED UNCONSCIOUS. EVER. The fact that Bell was out on the track is simple proof that he was NOT unconscious.
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pilotdude 2/16/2013 8:43pm
2/16/2013 8:43pm
vanillaice782 wrote:
All the replays were in slow mo so it exaggerated the amount of time that he wasn't moving. I guarantee he got the wind knocked out...
All the replays were in slow mo so it exaggerated the amount of time that he wasn't moving. I guarantee he got the wind knocked out of him and his first priority was breathing before moving.
pilotdude wrote:
Oh really? You guarantee it huh? What the hell ever.
vanillaice782 wrote:
Oh really to you too. "What the hell ever?" Are you a teenage girl? If he would have had a concussion he would have been spacey...
Oh really to you too. "What the hell ever?" Are you a teenage girl? If he would have had a concussion he would have been spacey and not able to put sentences together. His lcq interview was an even better way to assess his mental capacity because it had been a half hour since the crash. It's usually pretty hard to assess for a concussion immediately after it happens but after a half hour everyone else in the room knows someone had a concussion. You're smarter than me though. You know how to google stuff and I've been working in emergency departments for years...
You don't know what the FUCK you you are talking about. I had a 30 year ER doc sitting right beside me watching the race and saw the crash multiple times. That was his opinion but hey, you've "been working in emergency departments for years."
Slow
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Slow 2/16/2013 8:47pm
2/16/2013 8:47pm
The kid started and rode like shit after the crash. He probably has a 90% holeshot ratio in the pros. After the crash 2 shit starts and he rode like shit. If you think he was 100% you are shit. lol
WhKnuckle
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WhKnuckle 2/16/2013 8:49pm
2/16/2013 8:49pm
pilotdude wrote:
Oh really? You guarantee it huh? What the hell ever.
vanillaice782 wrote:
Oh really to you too. "What the hell ever?" Are you a teenage girl? If he would have had a concussion he would have been spacey...
Oh really to you too. "What the hell ever?" Are you a teenage girl? If he would have had a concussion he would have been spacey and not able to put sentences together. His lcq interview was an even better way to assess his mental capacity because it had been a half hour since the crash. It's usually pretty hard to assess for a concussion immediately after it happens but after a half hour everyone else in the room knows someone had a concussion. You're smarter than me though. You know how to google stuff and I've been working in emergency departments for years...
pilotdude wrote:
You don't know what the FUCK you you are talking about. I had a 30 year ER doc sitting right beside me watching the race and...
You don't know what the FUCK you you are talking about. I had a 30 year ER doc sitting right beside me watching the race and saw the crash multiple times. That was his opinion but hey, you've "been working in emergency departments for years."
If that ER doc had been standing next to that rider 15 seconds after the crash and examined him after they red flagged the race, then his opinion would have value. But as it is, he watched on TV and Doc Bodner looked into Bell's eyes within one minute of the wreck and obviously saw that he was OK. Sure, it's amazing, but I've seen some very benign looking wrecks that resulted in very bad injuries - even one guy back in the 70s who finished a race right in front of me, started riding back to his truck in first gear, turned his head to yell at a buddy, hit a rock, fell down on his head and died right there on the spot.
ando
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ando 2/16/2013 8:51pm
2/16/2013 8:51pm
Regis wrote:
You truly don't know Bodnar or any on that crew, They aren;t doing it for the money but mostly for the love of the sport and...
You truly don't know Bodnar or any on that crew, They aren;t doing it for the money but mostly for the love of the sport and are VERY good at what they do.

nobody, is going to turn a blind eye. They absolutely have the power to sit someone if need be.

TO EVEN THINK they makes decisions based on pressure or having to answer to companies is comical at best.
pilotdude wrote:
Wrong. To think that they are immune to that pressure is what is comical. Actually, it's not comical, it's just sad.
WhKnuckle wrote:
If you think Doc Bodner cares about sponsors or teams or anything in the world except the safety of those riders, you're out of your mind...
If you think Doc Bodner cares about sponsors or teams or anything in the world except the safety of those riders, you're out of your mind. And they don't just hold out riders with head injuries for their own sake, they also hold them out to prevent them from injuring someone else.

Doc Bodner would NEVER - EVER - LET A RIDER GO BACK OUT ON THE TRACK AFTER HE'D BEEN KNOCKED UNCONSCIOUS. EVER. The fact that Bell was out on the track is simple proof that he was NOT unconscious.
I don't know the processes and protocols they follow, but if I try to reconcile the number of crashes I've seen with the number of times a rider has involuntarily been removed from competing, it doesn't add up.

For loss of consciousness yes, but what about other concussions that don't involve loss of consciousness?
WhKnuckle
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WhKnuckle 2/16/2013 8:52pm
2/16/2013 8:52pm
Slow wrote:
The kid started and rode like shit after the crash. He probably has a 90% holeshot ratio in the pros. After the crash 2 shit starts...
The kid started and rode like shit after the crash. He probably has a 90% holeshot ratio in the pros. After the crash 2 shit starts and he rode like shit. If you think he was 100% you are shit. lol
Did you ever stop to think that this kid was aware how lucky he was to be alive? And you don't think that might have a little negative effect on his performance?

DOCTORS EXAMINED THE KID WITHIN ONE MINUTE OF THE WRECK AND HE WAS OK. These aren't couch doctors, these are real, honest to goodness trained trauma doctors. They know what they're doing.
Black Diesel Bomber 2/16/2013 8:54pm
2/16/2013 8:54pm
Anyone who doubts the kid was CLEARLY knocked out fucking COLD needs to look in the mirror and tell themselves it's time to make drastic changes in their life.....because something is really wrong.

I started this thread right after the LCQ and I could not believe my eyes when he was lined up for the Main. Dumbest move I have ever seen by a professional organization. Could have killed the kid.

Yeah, Caleb Moore walked away from his crash too....dumb fucks.
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Derpin' DJ 2/16/2013 8:54pm
2/16/2013 8:54pm
RacerX said he was never unconcious
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ocscottie 2/16/2013 8:55pm
2/16/2013 8:55pm
I posted this in the other thread, but:

@racerxonline Talked to Zach Bell, never knocked out, remembers everything. Foot came off in corner before triple, couldn't get it back on.
Slow
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Slow 2/16/2013 8:55pm
2/16/2013 8:55pm
Slow wrote:
The kid started and rode like shit after the crash. He probably has a 90% holeshot ratio in the pros. After the crash 2 shit starts...
The kid started and rode like shit after the crash. He probably has a 90% holeshot ratio in the pros. After the crash 2 shit starts and he rode like shit. If you think he was 100% you are shit. lol
WhKnuckle wrote:
Did you ever stop to think that this kid was aware how lucky he was to be alive? And you don't think that might have a...
Did you ever stop to think that this kid was aware how lucky he was to be alive? And you don't think that might have a little negative effect on his performance?

DOCTORS EXAMINED THE KID WITHIN ONE MINUTE OF THE WRECK AND HE WAS OK. These aren't couch doctors, these are real, honest to goodness trained trauma doctors. They know what they're doing.
cool so your kid would be riding after that kind of crash?
Regis
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Regis 2/16/2013 8:55pm
2/16/2013 8:55pm Edited Date/Time 2/16/2013 8:57pm
pilotdude wrote:
Right, because none of those people have any pressure on them at all. They are all completely removed from the situation and don't have to answer...
Right, because none of those people have any pressure on them at all. They are all completely removed from the situation and don't have to answer to companies who spend millions of dollars to see their team's racers out there.

Please.
Regis wrote:
You truly don't know Bodnar or any on that crew, They aren;t doing it for the money but mostly for the love of the sport and...
You truly don't know Bodnar or any on that crew, They aren;t doing it for the money but mostly for the love of the sport and are VERY good at what they do.

nobody, is going to turn a blind eye. They absolutely have the power to sit someone if need be.

TO EVEN THINK they makes decisions based on pressure or having to answer to companies is comical at best.
pilotdude wrote:
Wrong. To think that they are immune to that pressure is what is comical. Actually, it's not comical, it's just sad.
Do you know them personally?

Have you ever been treated by Bodnar? Have you spent any period of time with that medical crew? Have you ever been transported to the hospital from a SX to only have Bodnar come by after the races to make sure you are OK?

To say that they would risk a riders safety on orders of higher ups or pressure is complete and udder bullshit.
Black Diesel Bomber 2/16/2013 8:55pm
2/16/2013 8:55pm
Slow wrote:
The kid started and rode like shit after the crash. He probably has a 90% holeshot ratio in the pros. After the crash 2 shit starts...
The kid started and rode like shit after the crash. He probably has a 90% holeshot ratio in the pros. After the crash 2 shit starts and he rode like shit. If you think he was 100% you are shit. lol
WhKnuckle wrote:
Did you ever stop to think that this kid was aware how lucky he was to be alive? And you don't think that might have a...
Did you ever stop to think that this kid was aware how lucky he was to be alive? And you don't think that might have a little negative effect on his performance?

DOCTORS EXAMINED THE KID WITHIN ONE MINUTE OF THE WRECK AND HE WAS OK. These aren't couch doctors, these are real, honest to goodness trained trauma doctors. They know what they're doing.
are you the dumbest person on this planet or what? obviously.

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knoxville747 2/16/2013 8:55pm
2/16/2013 8:55pm
Black Diesel Bomber wrote:
Anyone who doubts the kid was CLEARLY knocked out fucking COLD needs to look in the mirror and tell themselves it's time to make drastic changes...
Anyone who doubts the kid was CLEARLY knocked out fucking COLD needs to look in the mirror and tell themselves it's time to make drastic changes in their life.....because something is really wrong.

I started this thread right after the LCQ and I could not believe my eyes when he was lined up for the Main. Dumbest move I have ever seen by a professional organization. Could have killed the kid.

Yeah, Caleb Moore walked away from his crash too....dumb fucks.
in fuckin deed!
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Hank_Thrill 2/16/2013 8:56pm
2/16/2013 8:56pm Edited Date/Time 2/16/2013 8:59pm
Derpin' DJ wrote:
RacerX said he was never unconcious
Bell knew he was headed to the LCQ so it is more likely he was just resting.
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purpleNurple 2/16/2013 8:57pm
2/16/2013 8:57pm
WhKnuckle wrote:
Did you ever stop to think that this kid was aware how lucky he was to be alive? And you don't think that might have a...
Did you ever stop to think that this kid was aware how lucky he was to be alive? And you don't think that might have a little negative effect on his performance?

DOCTORS EXAMINED THE KID WITHIN ONE MINUTE OF THE WRECK AND HE WAS OK. These aren't couch doctors, these are real, honest to goodness trained trauma doctors. They know what they're doing.
Have to make this point, when are people going to start being thankful the series has the medics on scene they way they do, and stop thinking they know better? It could have been way way worse and fortunately for the riders and the series they have a quality medical team on hand at all the races.
vanillaice782 2/16/2013 8:59pm
2/16/2013 8:59pm
pilotdude wrote:
You don't know what the FUCK you you are talking about. I had a 30 year ER doc sitting right beside me watching the race and...
You don't know what the FUCK you you are talking about. I had a 30 year ER doc sitting right beside me watching the race and saw the crash multiple times. That was his opinion but hey, you've "been working in emergency departments for years."
I thought the exact same thing when I first saw it but then I realized that they have an adequate medical staff there to assess him. They did exactly what any emergency room doctor would have done. Why go to an ER if you already have four emergency room doctors assessing you within seconds of the crash?
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wacker 2/16/2013 8:59pm
2/16/2013 8:59pm
I feel like 90% of the people that have responded to this thread may or may not have hit their heads and possibly could have been knocked out or even suffered concussions as a result. But then again, from reading this, I also question my own brain capacity and effects of prior concussions because I do feel pretty dumb, maybe even dumber than I did before reading it. Or was that the concussion I my or may not have. Wait, what are we talking about?
WhKnuckle
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WhKnuckle 2/16/2013 8:59pm
2/16/2013 8:59pm
Black Diesel Bomber wrote:
Anyone who doubts the kid was CLEARLY knocked out fucking COLD needs to look in the mirror and tell themselves it's time to make drastic changes...
Anyone who doubts the kid was CLEARLY knocked out fucking COLD needs to look in the mirror and tell themselves it's time to make drastic changes in their life.....because something is really wrong.

I started this thread right after the LCQ and I could not believe my eyes when he was lined up for the Main. Dumbest move I have ever seen by a professional organization. Could have killed the kid.

Yeah, Caleb Moore walked away from his crash too....dumb fucks.
Man, you might have a career there. They can just show you TV video of people in emergency rooms and you can diganose what's wrong with them, never mind what the doctors who are actually examining them think. Probably pays pretty good, you should look into that.
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JBods 2/16/2013 8:59pm
2/16/2013 8:59pm
I dont get how he was okay from that crash.. hes lucky he walked away i think they should of not let him ride this weekend for his safety..
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JJO741 2/16/2013 9:01pm
2/16/2013 9:01pm
ocscottie wrote:
I posted this in the other thread, but: @racerxonline [i]Talked to Zach Bell, never knocked out, remembers everything. Foot came off in corner before triple, couldn't...
I posted this in the other thread, but:

@racerxonline Talked to Zach Bell, never knocked out, remembers everything. Foot came off in corner before triple, couldn't get it back on.
Funny how this is getting ignored...

I'm just glad he is ok and in one piece. That scared the hell out of me and a lot of others.
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Jontow 2/16/2013 9:01pm
2/16/2013 9:01pm
he was OUT, i was wondering if he should be allowed back, but he must have passed whatever test to be allowed back in.

Now, though, what did the second (hard) crash do? Hopefully he'll be ok, dude was haulin
WhKnuckle
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WhKnuckle 2/16/2013 9:02pm
2/16/2013 9:02pm
ocscottie wrote:
I posted this in the other thread, but: @racerxonline [i]Talked to Zach Bell, never knocked out, remembers everything. Foot came off in corner before triple, couldn't...
I posted this in the other thread, but:

@racerxonline Talked to Zach Bell, never knocked out, remembers everything. Foot came off in corner before triple, couldn't get it back on.
JJO741 wrote:
Funny how this is getting ignored... I'm just glad he is ok and in one piece. That scared the hell out of me and a lot...
Funny how this is getting ignored...

I'm just glad he is ok and in one piece. That scared the hell out of me and a lot of others.
Like Paul Simon sang, "A man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest."
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Regis 2/16/2013 9:05pm
2/16/2013 9:05pm Edited Date/Time 2/16/2013 9:08pm
Slow wrote:
The kid started and rode like shit after the crash. He probably has a 90% holeshot ratio in the pros. After the crash 2 shit starts...
The kid started and rode like shit after the crash. He probably has a 90% holeshot ratio in the pros. After the crash 2 shit starts and he rode like shit. If you think he was 100% you are shit. lol
holy crap!

what race were you watching Slow?

He lined up last in the LCQ and got a second place start, slipping back to third for a short time and then finishing behind a previous race winner in second.

Then in the main he had LAST GATE PICK and started inside the top ten from the last gate on the outside. He then made another mistake and crashed again

He had a pretty damn good night, even after the first crash, up until his crash in the main event after a so called concussion.
vanillaice782 2/16/2013 9:06pm
2/16/2013 9:06pm
ocscottie wrote:
I posted this in the other thread, but: @racerxonline [i]Talked to Zach Bell, never knocked out, remembers everything. Foot came off in corner before triple, couldn't...
I posted this in the other thread, but:

@racerxonline Talked to Zach Bell, never knocked out, remembers everything. Foot came off in corner before triple, couldn't get it back on.
I just wanted to repost this in case any of you arm chair doctors missed it.

Post a reply to: Should Bell have been allowed to race?