250 SX or 450 CRF. 2013 ??

E.Falla
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E.Falla
Edited Date/Time 12/24/2012 9:37am
Bying a new 2013 Mx bike. Have big problems desiding . Give me some innputt here folks. The KTM are a little bit less dollar.
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Derpin' DJ
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Derpin' DJ 11/10/2012 12:10am
11/10/2012 12:10am
I can see this turning into a 2-stroke circle jerk thread
neverwasfastenuf 11/10/2012 12:34am
11/10/2012 12:34am
E.Falla wrote:
Bying a new 2013 Mx bike. Have big problems desiding . Give me some innputt here folks. The KTM are a little bit less dollar.
Pick whichever one best fits your needs, preferences, and budget. They both have their distinct advantages.

The 250 SX is the best 250 smoker ever. I don't think the 450 CRF will probably end up being the 450 shootout class winner, but who knows. And that may not even matter in your decision making.

If you decide you want the smokey one, you better get one as soon as you can, as they will be sold out of them if you delay your decision too long.

Wink
jtiger12
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jtiger12 11/10/2012 12:38am
11/10/2012 12:38am Edited Date/Time 11/10/2012 12:42am
Derpin' DJ wrote:
I can see this turning into a 2-stroke circle jerk thread
Agreed. Since it is 330 am on the east coast, you should have a little while to go before the wingnuts start to spray their premix everywhere. Imo, it comes down to your age, weight, riding type, and budget. Since you are talking big bikes, I would suggest staying away from the new honda or kx. The air forks are already starting to fail in the field, and you don't want your day to be ruined by a 15 dollar seal. I always stay away from first year models. The ktm 450 would be the bike I got this year, if I was going to buy, and I am a die hard honda guy. Most of the components on the new ktm are second year or more, and i didnt hear about any factory edition ktms breaking. Im a 36 year old vet b rider, 6'2" 225 lbs, mx only. Next choice would be ktm 250sx with the factory big bore cylinder kit.
E.Falla
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E.Falla 11/10/2012 1:15am
11/10/2012 1:15am
Hawe been driving a 2010 Honda 500 AF for two years now,, lowe how the bike handles, but its a bit physical in a 20-30 min race. and the vibration is also a isue. Thinking a 250 Sx would be the optimal two stroke. I am also a big Honda fan, and realy like the look of the new 450, (excuse my bad english)

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E.Falla
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E.Falla 11/10/2012 1:24am
11/10/2012 1:24am
I am 41 years. 105 kg. 1.90 m. B+ driver. Running about 100 houers a year. Not realy a agressive riding style, more comfortable in the higher gears, this is my biggest consern with the 250 sx, gues it neds to be rewd.
onthepipe
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onthepipe 11/10/2012 2:10am
11/10/2012 2:10am Edited Date/Time 11/10/2012 2:11am
E.Falla wrote:
I am 41 years. 105 kg. 1.90 m. B+ driver. Running about 100 houers a year. Not realy a agressive riding style, more comfortable in the...
I am 41 years. 105 kg. 1.90 m. B+ driver. Running about 100 houers a year. Not realy a agressive riding style, more comfortable in the higher gears, this is my biggest consern with the 250 sx, gues it neds to be rewd.
Well is this is true, 105kg and not agressive, liking high gears. Then my advice would be the new sxf450 (or any other 450 or maybe the 350).

the SX250 likes(needs) to be revved.
Fearo
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Fearo 11/10/2012 2:18am
11/10/2012 2:18am Edited Date/Time 11/10/2012 2:18am
I disagree. Although in stock form you will need to be aggressive on the SX250, you can massage it in a way that it can perfectly be lugged: gearing, PV springs, 300 kit, flywheel,... you could turn that thing in a scooter if you wanted to.
onthepipe
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onthepipe 11/10/2012 3:46am
11/10/2012 3:46am Edited Date/Time 11/10/2012 3:47am
Fearo wrote:
I disagree. Although in stock form you will need to be aggressive on the SX250, you can massage it in a way that it can perfectly...
I disagree. Although in stock form you will need to be aggressive on the SX250, you can massage it in a way that it can perfectly be lugged: gearing, PV springs, 300 kit, flywheel,... you could turn that thing in a scooter if you wanted to.
Thats true, however it will never have the bottom end of a 450. But it will have a massive weight advantage.
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Fearo 11/10/2012 4:28am
11/10/2012 4:28am
Yep, what you say is also true.
resetjet
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resetjet 11/10/2012 4:36am
11/10/2012 4:36am
My question is what are you going to do with it???? race???? woods ride??? and if so what type of racing??? mx, hare scramble, enduro?????? Both bikes have distinct advantages depending on what you want to do with it.

Also, what have you ridden before, 2 stroke or 4????
E.Falla
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E.Falla 11/10/2012 6:36am
11/10/2012 6:36am
Only Mx with the bike. I do some Old Boys races and some lokal races here in Norway. I hawe a CRF 250 X for the woods Smile I used to be a A driver about 20 years ago. Hawe done about 350 races over the past 30 years. Most of the bikes 4 stroke. Realy got a positive suprise with the 500 AF, and thats why i loking at the new SX, althoug the 500 is great funn, its also a litle brutal Smile
bartziokas123 11/10/2012 6:50am
11/10/2012 6:50am
E.Falla wrote:
Only Mx with the bike. I do some Old Boys races and some lokal races here in Norway. I hawe a CRF 250 X for the...
Only Mx with the bike. I do some Old Boys races and some lokal races here in Norway. I hawe a CRF 250 X for the woods Smile I used to be a A driver about 20 years ago. Hawe done about 350 races over the past 30 years. Most of the bikes 4 stroke. Realy got a positive suprise with the 500 AF, and thats why i loking at the new SX, althoug the 500 is great funn, its also a litle brutal Smile
I'm a 2 stroke freak. Hate 4 strokes and ill never buy one again but I will tell you that if I was only riding mx, I would buy the 450.
scooter5002
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scooter5002 11/10/2012 9:59am
11/10/2012 9:59am
E.Falla wrote:
Hawe been driving a 2010 Honda 500 AF for two years now,, lowe how the bike handles, but its a bit physical in a 20-30 min...
Hawe been driving a 2010 Honda 500 AF for two years now,, lowe how the bike handles, but its a bit physical in a 20-30 min race. and the vibration is also a isue. Thinking a 250 Sx would be the optimal two stroke. I am also a big Honda fan, and realy like the look of the new 450, (excuse my bad english)
Break your front and lower motor mount bolts loose, but leave your swingarm pivot bolt torqued to spec. Look to see if there is any noticeable gap between the mounts and the engine cases. It there is, build shims to take up the slack, so they are snug when you slide them in. Torque bolts back to spec again, and take it for a rip. You will probably notice a big difference. I have an AF500 too, and did that to mine. It vibrates less than the steel frame bike that I got the motor out of. Well worth your time.
E.Falla
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E.Falla 11/10/2012 10:29am
11/10/2012 10:29am
E.Falla wrote:
Hawe been driving a 2010 Honda 500 AF for two years now,, lowe how the bike handles, but its a bit physical in a 20-30 min...
Hawe been driving a 2010 Honda 500 AF for two years now,, lowe how the bike handles, but its a bit physical in a 20-30 min race. and the vibration is also a isue. Thinking a 250 Sx would be the optimal two stroke. I am also a big Honda fan, and realy like the look of the new 450, (excuse my bad english)
scooter5002 wrote:
Break your front and lower motor mount bolts loose, but leave your swingarm pivot bolt torqued to spec. Look to see if there is any noticeable...
Break your front and lower motor mount bolts loose, but leave your swingarm pivot bolt torqued to spec. Look to see if there is any noticeable gap between the mounts and the engine cases. It there is, build shims to take up the slack, so they are snug when you slide them in. Torque bolts back to spec again, and take it for a rip. You will probably notice a big difference. I have an AF500 too, and did that to mine. It vibrates less than the steel frame bike that I got the motor out of. Well worth your time.
Tanx for the tips scooter, i wil do a big service on it this winter, so i wil lok at that Smile
jtiger12
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jtiger12 11/10/2012 11:35am
11/10/2012 11:35am
scooter5002 wrote:
Break your front and lower motor mount bolts loose, but leave your swingarm pivot bolt torqued to spec. Look to see if there is any noticeable...
Break your front and lower motor mount bolts loose, but leave your swingarm pivot bolt torqued to spec. Look to see if there is any noticeable gap between the mounts and the engine cases. It there is, build shims to take up the slack, so they are snug when you slide them in. Torque bolts back to spec again, and take it for a rip. You will probably notice a big difference. I have an AF500 too, and did that to mine. It vibrates less than the steel frame bike that I got the motor out of. Well worth your time.
you've peaked my interest. How, and why does this make any difference in transferring the vibration of the motor into the frame? I can see how that would keep the cradle from being stressed inward towards the center of the bike.
Rooster
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Rooster 11/10/2012 12:24pm
11/10/2012 12:24pm
jtiger12 wrote:
you've peaked my interest. How, and why does this make any difference in transferring the vibration of the motor into the frame? I can see how...
you've peaked my interest. How, and why does this make any difference in transferring the vibration of the motor into the frame? I can see how that would keep the cradle from being stressed inward towards the center of the bike.
If you have to flex the frame to get the mounts tight you're removing some of the inherent flex built into the frame design. Less flex equals stiffer frame, stiffer frame equals more transfer of vibration from engine to frame.
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Whip 11/10/2012 12:26pm
11/10/2012 12:26pm
What about a 350SXF? It's got an additional 6 horsepower over the '12 model....
DrSweden
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DrSweden 11/10/2012 1:15pm
11/10/2012 1:15pm Edited Date/Time 11/10/2012 1:57pm
Impossible question to answer. No way on earth the 250 sx will beat the 450, but I notice lately, it's more important having fun, and to the cost that maybe go a bit slower, I would take the 250SX. The resale value in Sweden are crazy on 250 smokers, while people throw out barley used 450 for pocket money.

I mean if you change your mind, I think it's easier to sell the smoker and buy a equal mint 450, while the other way around might be harder...

I have been hovering sites for used SX250s, an 11, with tons of hours after two years is still costing 6k here.

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DrSweden
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DrSweden 11/10/2012 1:59pm
11/10/2012 1:59pm
jtiger12 wrote:
Dr sweden. http://pages.ebay.com/motors/link/?nav=item.view&id=330825043220

Thanks for the frame tip rooster. Guessing this would never be an issue on a oem frame and motor combo.
Well you guys in the US are lucky bastards, doesn't matter what you buy, your prices are always like 30%-50% less compared to what we pay, on the other hand you people in average make more money than us as well... Hey wait? WTF!!! Grinning

There are some benefits in Sweden though, I guess there's no major injustice in the end...Cool
Big
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Big 11/10/2012 2:07pm
11/10/2012 2:07pm
DrSweden wrote:
Impossible question to answer. No way on earth the 250 sx will beat the 450, but I notice lately, it's more important having fun, and to...
Impossible question to answer. No way on earth the 250 sx will beat the 450, but I notice lately, it's more important having fun, and to the cost that maybe go a bit slower, I would take the 250SX. The resale value in Sweden are crazy on 250 smokers, while people throw out barley used 450 for pocket money.

I mean if you change your mind, I think it's easier to sell the smoker and buy a equal mint 450, while the other way around might be harder...

I have been hovering sites for used SX250s, an 11, with tons of hours after two years is still costing 6k here.
No way on earth the 250 sx will beat the 450,......? A 250SX KTM just won the Stuttgart SX. It was a 80cc piece of shit track but that crapbike won anyway even thou i hate to admit it. Grinning
Big
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Big 11/10/2012 2:19pm
11/10/2012 2:19pm
Pssst. If someone giving you the bike choose whatever. But hell will froze before i buy a 2nd quality KTM instead of a Honda. Probably the best bike made with some small modifications? Just buy another fork and exhaust system. Whistling Buy a Japanese brand. KTMs will cause you more trouble than you deserves. POS bike even thou some fanatic KTM fans going to try to tell you how good they are.BS all way. They must have Austrian relatives or working in a KTM shop. Wink
DrSweden
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DrSweden 11/10/2012 2:34pm
11/10/2012 2:34pm
Big wrote:
Pssst. If someone giving you the bike choose whatever. But hell will froze before i buy a 2nd quality KTM instead of a Honda. Probably the...
Pssst. If someone giving you the bike choose whatever. But hell will froze before i buy a 2nd quality KTM instead of a Honda. Probably the best bike made with some small modifications? Just buy another fork and exhaust system. Whistling Buy a Japanese brand. KTMs will cause you more trouble than you deserves. POS bike even thou some fanatic KTM fans going to try to tell you how good they are.BS all way. They must have Austrian relatives or working in a KTM shop. Wink
Can you bee a bit more specific in what way the SX250 is 2nd quality bike? I'm not tuned at all to their four strokes, and if issues, I don't care, I'm done with that type of bike for the moment. All I heard was the SX125, SX144 had issues with rods breaking pre 2010, maybe the ads I read about used KTMs has more "new crank, and rod" in them then the same ads for YZs? But other than that thin speculation, I haven't heard complaints?
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part-timer 11/10/2012 3:37pm
11/10/2012 3:37pm
Big wrote:
Pssst. If someone giving you the bike choose whatever. But hell will froze before i buy a 2nd quality KTM instead of a Honda. Probably the...
Pssst. If someone giving you the bike choose whatever. But hell will froze before i buy a 2nd quality KTM instead of a Honda. Probably the best bike made with some small modifications? Just buy another fork and exhaust system. Whistling Buy a Japanese brand. KTMs will cause you more trouble than you deserves. POS bike even thou some fanatic KTM fans going to try to tell you how good they are.BS all way. They must have Austrian relatives or working in a KTM shop. Wink
Can you elaborate on the 2nd quality comment? I'm not trying to break balls, but I am really curious - I plan to buy my 1st ever KTM this week after decades of riding Honda,Yamaha, and Kawasaki.
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ATKpilot99 11/10/2012 3:55pm
11/10/2012 3:55pm
Big wrote:
Pssst. If someone giving you the bike choose whatever. But hell will froze before i buy a 2nd quality KTM instead of a Honda. Probably the...
Pssst. If someone giving you the bike choose whatever. But hell will froze before i buy a 2nd quality KTM instead of a Honda. Probably the best bike made with some small modifications? Just buy another fork and exhaust system. Whistling Buy a Japanese brand. KTMs will cause you more trouble than you deserves. POS bike even thou some fanatic KTM fans going to try to tell you how good they are.BS all way. They must have Austrian relatives or working in a KTM shop. Wink
part-timer wrote:
Can you elaborate on the 2nd quality comment? I'm not trying to break balls, but I am really curious - I plan to buy my 1st...
Can you elaborate on the 2nd quality comment? I'm not trying to break balls, but I am really curious - I plan to buy my 1st ever KTM this week after decades of riding Honda,Yamaha, and Kawasaki.
He always criticizes the Euro brands. Just me but I wouldn't put too much stock into his opinion, they're all good bikes.
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DrSweden 11/10/2012 4:12pm
11/10/2012 4:12pm
Big wrote:
Pssst. If someone giving you the bike choose whatever. But hell will froze before i buy a 2nd quality KTM instead of a Honda. Probably the...
Pssst. If someone giving you the bike choose whatever. But hell will froze before i buy a 2nd quality KTM instead of a Honda. Probably the best bike made with some small modifications? Just buy another fork and exhaust system. Whistling Buy a Japanese brand. KTMs will cause you more trouble than you deserves. POS bike even thou some fanatic KTM fans going to try to tell you how good they are.BS all way. They must have Austrian relatives or working in a KTM shop. Wink
part-timer wrote:
Can you elaborate on the 2nd quality comment? I'm not trying to break balls, but I am really curious - I plan to buy my 1st...
Can you elaborate on the 2nd quality comment? I'm not trying to break balls, but I am really curious - I plan to buy my 1st ever KTM this week after decades of riding Honda,Yamaha, and Kawasaki.
ATKpilot99 wrote:
He always criticizes the Euro brands. Just me but I wouldn't put too much stock into his opinion, they're all good bikes.
Could be so, but I would like to hear his case before I dismiss it as a feeling only.
keeptwostrokesalive 11/10/2012 5:04pm
11/10/2012 5:04pm
Big wrote:
Pssst. If someone giving you the bike choose whatever. But hell will froze before i buy a 2nd quality KTM instead of a Honda. Probably the...
Pssst. If someone giving you the bike choose whatever. But hell will froze before i buy a 2nd quality KTM instead of a Honda. Probably the best bike made with some small modifications? Just buy another fork and exhaust system. Whistling Buy a Japanese brand. KTMs will cause you more trouble than you deserves. POS bike even thou some fanatic KTM fans going to try to tell you how good they are.BS all way. They must have Austrian relatives or working in a KTM shop. Wink
part-timer wrote:
Can you elaborate on the 2nd quality comment? I'm not trying to break balls, but I am really curious - I plan to buy my 1st...
Can you elaborate on the 2nd quality comment? I'm not trying to break balls, but I am really curious - I plan to buy my 1st ever KTM this week after decades of riding Honda,Yamaha, and Kawasaki.
He owned some of the later model KTMs and they didint treat him to well. But the bikes have vastly improved since he owned one so dont listen to what he has to say. KTMs are awesome bikes now and the 250sx is my dream bike.
mynewcr250 11/10/2012 8:21pm
11/10/2012 8:21pm Edited Date/Time 11/10/2012 8:22pm
DrSweden wrote:
Impossible question to answer. No way on earth the 250 sx will beat the 450, but I notice lately, it's more important having fun, and to...
Impossible question to answer. No way on earth the 250 sx will beat the 450, but I notice lately, it's more important having fun, and to the cost that maybe go a bit slower, I would take the 250SX. The resale value in Sweden are crazy on 250 smokers, while people throw out barley used 450 for pocket money.

I mean if you change your mind, I think it's easier to sell the smoker and buy a equal mint 450, while the other way around might be harder...

I have been hovering sites for used SX250s, an 11, with tons of hours after two years is still costing 6k here.
bullshit dude. you can beat the current 450s on an old ass 250 2 stroke, its been proven to my own eyes. the issue isnt the bike, its the rider. period.

to the original poster: do you have a current bike? if i already had a bike, id end up buying which ever kind i didnt already have. its nice to have 1 of each.
DrSweden
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DrSweden 11/11/2012 2:36am
11/11/2012 2:36am
DrSweden wrote:
Impossible question to answer. No way on earth the 250 sx will beat the 450, but I notice lately, it's more important having fun, and to...
Impossible question to answer. No way on earth the 250 sx will beat the 450, but I notice lately, it's more important having fun, and to the cost that maybe go a bit slower, I would take the 250SX. The resale value in Sweden are crazy on 250 smokers, while people throw out barley used 450 for pocket money.

I mean if you change your mind, I think it's easier to sell the smoker and buy a equal mint 450, while the other way around might be harder...

I have been hovering sites for used SX250s, an 11, with tons of hours after two years is still costing 6k here.
mynewcr250 wrote:
bullshit dude. you can beat the current 450s on an old ass 250 2 stroke, its been proven to my own eyes. the issue isnt the...
bullshit dude. you can beat the current 450s on an old ass 250 2 stroke, its been proven to my own eyes. the issue isnt the bike, its the rider. period.

to the original poster: do you have a current bike? if i already had a bike, id end up buying which ever kind i didnt already have. its nice to have 1 of each.
Eh? U mean RC on a clapped out two-stroke would beat an C-rider on a new KX450F?
Big
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Big 11/11/2012 5:49am
11/11/2012 5:49am
If you still have a cheap steelframe like a -73 honda a la Gary Jones with woodscrews in plastick and same piece of shit crankshaft company delivers....still. And they trying to tell you their early 90 style bikes should cost as much as a high-tech japanese? yeah right? The 2 stroke is not as bad as their 4 strokes because they are a disaster and some guys on this forum say thats false? Everybody in the buissiness knows for a fact since many years, if you race a KTM team you'd better have factory back-up or you get ruined. Your mechanics will abandon you. Famous Danish rider tried KTM. After a month his mechanic gave up. Barragan got fired for smacktalking KTM when riding for them. He told his friends and relatives who asked him about them. don't f...g buy this shit..ATK you know me now a little?Smile I'm in for the me like not your wrong discussion for pure fun.Wink But you must be the slowest rider on heart or never rode a KTM. Because you still try to convince peopla that Huskys, Ktm etc are solid bikes? I'm pretty sure you own some pos Eurobike shop or own some pos eurobikes you trying to sell...MonkeybrainGrinning .

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