How Much Is Baggett's Success is..

GuyB
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GuyB 7/15/2012 2:49pm
7/15/2012 2:49pm
dehner47 wrote:
not any specific "drug" but when you can recover faster after a long moto, practice, injury, or can find ways to alter the bodies energy levels...
not any specific "drug" but when you can recover faster after a long moto, practice, injury, or can find ways to alter the bodies energy levels, yes it can make you ride a dirtbike faster. allows more training, faster recovery, longer time for the oxygen levels in the blood to stay flowing before lactic acids take over.. arm pump. the list can go on and on. but i think i already said to much.
Said too much? You haven't said anything...except dancing around making an allegation.

If you have evidence, bring it. Otherwise, STFU.
DrSweden
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DrSweden 7/15/2012 3:07pm
7/15/2012 3:07pm
Madmax31 wrote:
Baggett won't beat herlings in his dreams ;) I still crack up every race when I think of that euro guy saying barcia couldn't beat roczen...
Baggett won't beat herlings in his dreams Wink

I still crack up every race when I think of that euro guy saying barcia couldn't beat roczen in his dreams. Not only is barcia faster but so is, Baggett and Eli. Don't get me wrong I like roczen and want to see him win but he is honestly a 3-4 place guy right now.
NateDawg122 wrote:
Euros tend to do that a lot, then they get real quiet. Barcia and Tomac are a level above Roczen, and Baggett is a level above...
Euros tend to do that a lot, then they get real quiet. Barcia and Tomac are a level above Roczen, and Baggett is a level above Barcia and Tomac. I love the Euros that posted how Roczen was gonna dominate outdoors. He just better be glad Wilson isn't healthy or he would be fighting for top 5.
Eh? Please re-post any of those euro-postS you mention? One euro felt the urge to refer to A race where Rozcen beat Barcia, and maybe he though that would translate to the outdoors, but I don't think I remember anyone saying Rozcen would DOMINATE? Please refreshen my memory, should be easy since it was "SO MANY"...
ML512
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ML512 7/15/2012 3:21pm
7/15/2012 3:21pm
machine wrote:
Due to his speed and how much is due to his small size and PC using the new SSF air forks while Factory connection is still...
Due to his speed and how much is due to his small size and PC using the new SSF air forks while Factory connection is still using the standard forks. The motors seem pretty equal, but I think the PC bike is clearly better, they have even eluded to the fact that FC has been trying to improve the bike's handling and suspension. FC doesn't use A kit stuff like PC, they "think" they can do it just as good with stock stuff, but I wonder if they really can.

I'm just throwing it out there for discussion, so try and withhold the insults...Smile
I'll clarify a few things about the bikes, ONLY tickle is using the SSF Air forks (they are not legal for the 250 class until they are available for sale for under $7500) the 250's are using the SFF A-kit (still has a main spring). FC went to production for awhile but now its up the the riders, last time i looked at the bikes Tomac and barcia are running standard A-kits (some riders don't like the feel on SFF's actually. Personally i have heard a lil feed back that on the honda's it doesnt work as well as say a suzuki or kawasaki with SFF., Bogle's bike i saw earlier this year had the production 48's with coatings and so did wil hahn. They leave a few options up to the riders personal preference now, brakes, suspension ect. My personal opinion is the FC and PC bikes are pretty even now. What allot of people have pointed out is watch Bagget's lines. He has mentioned a few times while he was hurt in 2010 he watched pourcel allot and picked up allot about line selection. (in SX its pretty one lined not noticeable) outdoors though it shines as the races get going. He doesnt usually qualify as well in practice till the track breaks in and he can sweep his line's and carry momentum.
mxjeff575
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mxjeff575 7/15/2012 3:55pm
7/15/2012 3:55pm
Blake definitely uses different lines than the other 3 speedsters. Blake seems to carry tons of momentum and ride some pretty wide outside lines. He sure makes them work.

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dehner47
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dehner47 7/15/2012 3:57pm
7/15/2012 3:57pm
GuyB wrote:
Said too much? You haven't said anything...except dancing around making an allegation.

If you have evidence, bring it. Otherwise, STFU.
Not trying to accuse anyone, cause no i obv dont have proof. nor do we have proof about any rider out there. but some people have their opinions on why he is so much "stronger' as in above the rest of the field, and i have mine.

just speculating on what i think is helping him. thats all. but as is abortion, religion, politics, Jlaw and PED's in mx.. its a forbidden topic. i understand now.
Crashinskinoff
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Crashinskinoff 7/15/2012 5:38pm
7/15/2012 5:38pm
dehner47 wrote:
its called fitness. or blood doping. whatever floats your boat!! or wins motos!!!
Wow man, Baggett is riding like a 2012 version of Bob Hannah, just now watching the first part of moto 2 but he is on it. Everyone's fitness isn't the same, just like a fighter or a runner. Like machine said pro circuit bikes have some awesome suspension, that would keep you from being as tired at the end. Give him some credit unless you have proof.
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Crashinskinoff 7/15/2012 5:42pm
7/15/2012 5:42pm
LOL just saw Baggetts crash, that was the lowest scrub I ever seen and he still gets 4th, that dude is a Monster!
machine
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machine 7/15/2012 5:47pm
7/15/2012 5:47pm
ML512 wrote:
I'll clarify a few things about the bikes, ONLY tickle is using the SSF Air forks (they are not legal for the 250 class until they...
I'll clarify a few things about the bikes, ONLY tickle is using the SSF Air forks (they are not legal for the 250 class until they are available for sale for under $7500) the 250's are using the SFF A-kit (still has a main spring). FC went to production for awhile but now its up the the riders, last time i looked at the bikes Tomac and barcia are running standard A-kits (some riders don't like the feel on SFF's actually. Personally i have heard a lil feed back that on the honda's it doesnt work as well as say a suzuki or kawasaki with SFF., Bogle's bike i saw earlier this year had the production 48's with coatings and so did wil hahn. They leave a few options up to the riders personal preference now, brakes, suspension ect. My personal opinion is the FC and PC bikes are pretty even now. What allot of people have pointed out is watch Bagget's lines. He has mentioned a few times while he was hurt in 2010 he watched pourcel allot and picked up allot about line selection. (in SX its pretty one lined not noticeable) outdoors though it shines as the races get going. He doesnt usually qualify as well in practice till the track breaks in and he can sweep his line's and carry momentum.
That's good info, thanks...
Crashinskinoff
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Crashinskinoff 7/15/2012 6:14pm
7/15/2012 6:14pm
ML512 wrote:
I'll clarify a few things about the bikes, ONLY tickle is using the SSF Air forks (they are not legal for the 250 class until they...
I'll clarify a few things about the bikes, ONLY tickle is using the SSF Air forks (they are not legal for the 250 class until they are available for sale for under $7500) the 250's are using the SFF A-kit (still has a main spring). FC went to production for awhile but now its up the the riders, last time i looked at the bikes Tomac and barcia are running standard A-kits (some riders don't like the feel on SFF's actually. Personally i have heard a lil feed back that on the honda's it doesnt work as well as say a suzuki or kawasaki with SFF., Bogle's bike i saw earlier this year had the production 48's with coatings and so did wil hahn. They leave a few options up to the riders personal preference now, brakes, suspension ect. My personal opinion is the FC and PC bikes are pretty even now. What allot of people have pointed out is watch Bagget's lines. He has mentioned a few times while he was hurt in 2010 he watched pourcel allot and picked up allot about line selection. (in SX its pretty one lined not noticeable) outdoors though it shines as the races get going. He doesnt usually qualify as well in practice till the track breaks in and he can sweep his line's and carry momentum.
machine wrote:
That's good info, thanks...
Great post thanks for that, Baggett's. rear tire was staying connected better than Barcia or Tomacs bikes, at least it looked like it. Maybe your right maybe he is picking smoother lines. Great info either way.
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jeffro503 7/15/2012 6:25pm
7/15/2012 6:25pm
GuyB wrote:
Said too much? You haven't said anything...except dancing around making an allegation.

If you have evidence, bring it. Otherwise, STFU.
dehner47 wrote:
Not trying to accuse anyone, cause no i obv dont have proof. nor do we have proof about any rider out there. but some people have...
Not trying to accuse anyone, cause no i obv dont have proof. nor do we have proof about any rider out there. but some people have their opinions on why he is so much "stronger' as in above the rest of the field, and i have mine.

just speculating on what i think is helping him. thats all. but as is abortion, religion, politics, Jlaw and PED's in mx.. its a forbidden topic. i understand now.
Dehner........listen to what you just typed there. You think little Blake Bagget has more strength on a bike that Barcia and Tomac , or Roczen? Those guys not only out weigh him , but look like ( physically wise ) in better shape. Blake is also sweating more and looks more exhausted than Tomac and especially Barcia. Sooo.....so far , I haven't seen one thing physically more impressive about Blake. I just see a kid that is totally dialed and on his "A" game........and completely hammering!

All those top guys can go full out , non stop all the way to the flag.......fitness isn't what is getting Bagget to the flag faster. And yes , I do know about how PED's work.....and there is not one PED on this planet which would make a guy actually " Go faster" on a dirt bike. You can think what you want......but if you look back in history....we have always had riders that "Stand out" above the rest.....not all of them were Aldon Bakers riders either.......so go figure.

It's kind of a shitty thing to insinuate that with no proof what so ever. When it comes to this kind of stuff.....the other riders know way more than what we do about what happens behind the scenes......you don't think that if one rider was doing it........they all wouldn't be? Give me a break.
neverwasfastenuf 7/15/2012 6:45pm
7/15/2012 6:45pm
No doping or PED's, he's just a clone of Hannah and Barnett! Baggett has some serious determination and the smarts to ride his own race knowing he can get it done.
neverwasfastenuf 7/15/2012 6:46pm
7/15/2012 6:46pm
GuyB wrote:
Said too much? You haven't said anything...except dancing around making an allegation.

If you have evidence, bring it. Otherwise, STFU.
That's a rarity, don't think I've ever seen that on here from you. Don't sugarcoat it.Wink
Hando
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Hando 7/15/2012 7:01pm
7/15/2012 7:01pm
baggets only winning cause he's on a PC bike

wat a cheater!!11
GuyB
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GuyB 7/15/2012 7:27pm
7/15/2012 7:27pm
dehner47 wrote:
Not trying to accuse anyone, cause no i obv dont have proof. nor do we have proof about any rider out there. but some people have...
Not trying to accuse anyone, cause no i obv dont have proof. nor do we have proof about any rider out there. but some people have their opinions on why he is so much "stronger' as in above the rest of the field, and i have mine.

just speculating on what i think is helping him. thats all. but as is abortion, religion, politics, Jlaw and PED's in mx.. its a forbidden topic. i understand now.
Forbidden topic? Not really. The first three are all common in Non-Moto, which is where they belong. J-Law threads? They're like bigfoot sightings.

But yeah, you are making accusations, and it wouldn't be all that different from anyone here saying, "Well with your posting style, it's apparent you're heavily into meth."

Get the point? Smile
TripleFive 7/15/2012 8:28pm
7/15/2012 8:28pm
jeffro503 wrote:
Dehner........listen to what you just typed there. You think little Blake Bagget has more strength on a bike that Barcia and Tomac , or Roczen? Those...
Dehner........listen to what you just typed there. You think little Blake Bagget has more strength on a bike that Barcia and Tomac , or Roczen? Those guys not only out weigh him , but look like ( physically wise ) in better shape. Blake is also sweating more and looks more exhausted than Tomac and especially Barcia. Sooo.....so far , I haven't seen one thing physically more impressive about Blake. I just see a kid that is totally dialed and on his "A" game........and completely hammering!

All those top guys can go full out , non stop all the way to the flag.......fitness isn't what is getting Bagget to the flag faster. And yes , I do know about how PED's work.....and there is not one PED on this planet which would make a guy actually " Go faster" on a dirt bike. You can think what you want......but if you look back in history....we have always had riders that "Stand out" above the rest.....not all of them were Aldon Bakers riders either.......so go figure.

It's kind of a shitty thing to insinuate that with no proof what so ever. When it comes to this kind of stuff.....the other riders know way more than what we do about what happens behind the scenes......you don't think that if one rider was doing it........they all wouldn't be? Give me a break.
But it is the same with cycling - there isn't a drug to make a person "go faster" on a bicycle but what they end up doing is going faster..
Old School Racer 7/15/2012 9:22pm
7/15/2012 9:22pm
TripleFive: You are incorrect about cycling. The drugs do not make the guys go faster. In cycling the advantage is for recovery. So that you can recover both on trining rides and long tours. It allows you to train harder and recover faster.

Also, just as an FYI folks, the MX/SX races are sprints. 15-18 min SX mins, and 35 min MX races. Give me a break, its not like being in the saddle in the TDF for 4-6hrs a day and then do it all again for the next 20 days.

Here is what makes a good rider in MX/SX: Train hard but correctly for "YOUR" body, not somebody elses, and rest correctly, with a good diet. Dirtbike racing is not rocket science. It is truly a simple equation when it come to training. Now, the execution part of it is totally different.

By the way, i would bet any dollar amount that you test RV, BB, Tyla, and Jake's blood, not urine (which is all the AMA does) and all 4 would be clean. These guys are not cheating. They train correctly. I have seen it with Aldon time and time again. You have to work hard but work correctly and that is what he is very good at doing. Evaluating each riders specific needs and then tailoring the program to them.
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chrisbuehler 7/15/2012 9:26pm
7/15/2012 9:26pm
kongols wrote:
It`s like watching smaller version of Pourcel. Straight back, not much moving on a bike.
Yes! Thank you Kongols, been saying that for that past 2 seasons. Neutral on the bike, straight back. Pourcel clone
NateDawg122 7/15/2012 9:26pm
7/15/2012 9:26pm
Old School Racer wrote:
TripleFive: You are incorrect about cycling. The drugs do not make the guys go faster. In cycling the advantage is for recovery. So that you can...
TripleFive: You are incorrect about cycling. The drugs do not make the guys go faster. In cycling the advantage is for recovery. So that you can recover both on trining rides and long tours. It allows you to train harder and recover faster.

Also, just as an FYI folks, the MX/SX races are sprints. 15-18 min SX mins, and 35 min MX races. Give me a break, its not like being in the saddle in the TDF for 4-6hrs a day and then do it all again for the next 20 days.

Here is what makes a good rider in MX/SX: Train hard but correctly for "YOUR" body, not somebody elses, and rest correctly, with a good diet. Dirtbike racing is not rocket science. It is truly a simple equation when it come to training. Now, the execution part of it is totally different.

By the way, i would bet any dollar amount that you test RV, BB, Tyla, and Jake's blood, not urine (which is all the AMA does) and all 4 would be clean. These guys are not cheating. They train correctly. I have seen it with Aldon time and time again. You have to work hard but work correctly and that is what he is very good at doing. Evaluating each riders specific needs and then tailoring the program to them.
Yes the training is so simple..that is why people like Aldon make a living off of specializing in it. Oh and by the way I agreed with most of what you said, just busting your balls.

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chrisbuehler
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chrisbuehler 7/15/2012 9:37pm
7/15/2012 9:37pm
I can pretty much guarantee that ANY steroid would have these guys forearms pumped up so bad, the recovery aspect of them would cancel out. I don't know how EPO works but steroids produce crazy pumps
jeffro503
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jeffro503 7/15/2012 9:41pm
7/15/2012 9:41pm
There are people who are born athletic as well......and in sports that they excel....that is why you never hear the names of the guys who "weren't" athletic.....because they never made it. MX.....just like any sport , has a group of "creme' of the crop" racers.....that is why they win and race the way they do.

I am not saying that I totally don't believe some racers use PED's........some guys swear they do. But when a person can go flat out ( as Emig would say ...."Maximum heart rate )......in two 35 min motos........what the hell would you need PED's for? I know fast Vet riders that can damn near max out their heart rate for an entire 20-25 min motos.....and they aint using PEDS! And now.....take some 16-25yr old dude , make it his job to race and train.....AND hire a trainer?? A 30 min moto is what they are trained to do.

Christ....in my mid 20's to mid 30's I could go flat out for 25 min's.....and do more if I had to. If I was 1/2 that age I could of gone 30-40 mins easy with the correct diet and training. I did that shit on my own with advice from nutritionists and sports trainers.
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Travis_Hudson 7/15/2012 11:46pm
7/15/2012 11:46pm
dehner47 wrote:
its called fitness. or blood doping. whatever floats your boat!! or wins motos!!!
Outsider wrote:
It's called being fucking fast.
Yes......thank you. Now lets move on.....and watch the rest of them. Plenty things happen in racing......even when one guy is faster, it is never dull....really.
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Ghost of Jabroni 7/16/2012 12:05am
7/16/2012 12:05am Edited Date/Time 7/16/2012 7:07am
Big wrote:
Everyone Aldon trains become superhumans. He smells strange for sure.And the Amerikan superhero and closest athlete to "man above" Mr Armstrong NEVER used steroids either? (friend...
Everyone Aldon trains become superhumans. He smells strange for sure.And the Amerikan superhero and closest athlete to "man above" Mr Armstrong NEVER used steroids either? (friend to Aldon)Watch his imperium falling now.....I always feel ill when someone beats all other too easy. Ben Johnson, Carl Lewis, Tyson etcetc. Some of the Us riders as well even thou i prefer Nationals. Euroriders are no different at all it's only so much more difficult to survive a full seasons tests.In the Us there is still no real testingprogram offseason and not much during season either i heard? Only Aldons guys can make a comeback after injury faster and more fit quicker than anyone else. Maybe every other riders are morans? Don't think so. This is my reflections after many years in the sport. I also think Bagget is more talented than most but Aldons presence make him smells too?
You are right, the Euro riders are no different. Cairoli has failed tests before, that is a FACT. And it was swept under the rug.

And I dont care. I appreciate any athlete that is willing to go the extra mile.

PEDs are no more dangerous than whoop sections or triples. This is MX/SX, get over the whole "safety bullshit" (not directed at you Big, but people in this thread in general).



I dont know if Bagget is using, one way or the other. But to me it just doesnt matter. The fact is, the kid doesnt cut corners. He is a machine at the practice track and to me that is the difference.

The guys getting beat by him brag about how much Red Bull they drink and they wonder why he blows past them late in the moto. When they put down the Red Bull and In-N-Out burger and start making as many sacrifices as Bagget does, then we can discuss the PED topic and you will still all lose that argument. It doesnt matter whether Bagget uses or not.



MX/SX needs to start doing some "official test" days like they do in F1 and MotoGP so fans can show up and see just who really puts in the laps and who just sits on the truck and bitches because they dont have a brand new tire to ride with.
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jamma10 7/16/2012 2:37am
7/16/2012 2:37am
Whether Baggett uses PEDs, his PC bike puts out more hp than the others or what, I would put money on him beating Dungey and even Villopoto right now.

Baggett went wide on the first corner of the first race on saturday and ran around the outside of the banners. Barcia, Roczen and Tomac were gone, off into the lead and riding as fast as anyone probably has gone in that class. Yet Baggett manages to haul them in from about 10th place, pass and gap them by a quite a significant margin. At one stage Im sure Weege said he was lapping 3 seconds faster than the other three!

I don't think anyone wants to believe that there is anything unethical going on but when shit like that happens its hard not to be a little skeptical.
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BR_HERO 7/16/2012 2:47am
7/16/2012 2:47am
GuyB wrote:
Said too much? You haven't said anything...except dancing around making an allegation.

If you have evidence, bring it. Otherwise, STFU.
dehner47 wrote:
Not trying to accuse anyone, cause no i obv dont have proof. nor do we have proof about any rider out there. but some people have...
Not trying to accuse anyone, cause no i obv dont have proof. nor do we have proof about any rider out there. but some people have their opinions on why he is so much "stronger' as in above the rest of the field, and i have mine.

just speculating on what i think is helping him. thats all. but as is abortion, religion, politics, Jlaw and PED's in mx.. its a forbidden topic. i understand now.
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Crush 7/16/2012 3:10am
7/16/2012 3:10am
jamma10 wrote:
Whether Baggett uses PEDs, his PC bike puts out more hp than the others or what, I would put money on him beating Dungey and even...
Whether Baggett uses PEDs, his PC bike puts out more hp than the others or what, I would put money on him beating Dungey and even Villopoto right now.

Baggett went wide on the first corner of the first race on saturday and ran around the outside of the banners. Barcia, Roczen and Tomac were gone, off into the lead and riding as fast as anyone probably has gone in that class. Yet Baggett manages to haul them in from about 10th place, pass and gap them by a quite a significant margin. At one stage Im sure Weege said he was lapping 3 seconds faster than the other three!

I don't think anyone wants to believe that there is anything unethical going on but when shit like that happens its hard not to be a little skeptical.
Ok...

Put the crack pipe down and step away from the keyboard...

This is not the first time we've seen a lites or 125 rider go faster than the big class and it NEVER translates...
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jamma10 7/16/2012 3:40am
7/16/2012 3:40am
jamma10 wrote:
Whether Baggett uses PEDs, his PC bike puts out more hp than the others or what, I would put money on him beating Dungey and even...
Whether Baggett uses PEDs, his PC bike puts out more hp than the others or what, I would put money on him beating Dungey and even Villopoto right now.

Baggett went wide on the first corner of the first race on saturday and ran around the outside of the banners. Barcia, Roczen and Tomac were gone, off into the lead and riding as fast as anyone probably has gone in that class. Yet Baggett manages to haul them in from about 10th place, pass and gap them by a quite a significant margin. At one stage Im sure Weege said he was lapping 3 seconds faster than the other three!

I don't think anyone wants to believe that there is anything unethical going on but when shit like that happens its hard not to be a little skeptical.
Crush wrote:
Ok... Put the crack pipe down and step away from the keyboard... This is not the first time we've seen a lites or 125 rider go...
Ok...

Put the crack pipe down and step away from the keyboard...

This is not the first time we've seen a lites or 125 rider go faster than the big class and it NEVER translates...
Im being deadly serious.

Right now I think Baggett on his 250 would be a match for Dungey on his 450.
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Crush 7/16/2012 4:35am
7/16/2012 4:35am
jamma10 wrote:
Im being deadly serious.

Right now I think Baggett on his 250 would be a match for Dungey on his 450.
Look at the lap times... Dunge is like 2 seconds faster at best, way more consistent with those laps and starts at the front every time...

There is almost ALWAYS a lites rider who can utilise a light bike with 45 HP to go faster than a fire breathing 450... but the Big 4 or 5 are serious
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jamma10 7/16/2012 5:36am
7/16/2012 5:36am Edited Date/Time 7/16/2012 5:52am
jamma10 wrote:
Im being deadly serious.

Right now I think Baggett on his 250 would be a match for Dungey on his 450.
Crush wrote:
Look at the lap times... Dunge is like 2 seconds faster at best, way more consistent with those laps and starts at the front every time...
Look at the lap times... Dunge is like 2 seconds faster at best, way more consistent with those laps and starts at the front every time...

There is almost ALWAYS a lites rider who can utilise a light bike with 45 HP to go faster than a fire breathing 450... but the Big 4 or 5 are serious
Dungey is a much more consistent starter thats for sure, but Baggett bettered Dungeys lap times in their respective first moto's and his fastest lap time in the second moto wasn't far off Dungey's time and Dungey had a clear track;

Millville 2012

Moto 1 Dungey
Min: 2.08.358
Av: 2.10.629

Moto 1 Baggett
Min: 2.07.561
Av: 2.09.807

Moto 2 Dungey
Min: 2.07.306
Av: 2.11.017

Moto 2 Baggett
Min: 2.08.235
Av: 2.15.401 (inflated due to his crash)

------------------------------------------------------------------

Compare Baggetts lap times to Alessi's!

Moto 1 Alessi
Min: 2.08.681
Av: 2.13.193

Moto 2 Alessi
Min: 2.08.593
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Crush
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Crush 7/16/2012 5:39am
7/16/2012 5:39am
Stand corrected for Millville, I heard something for Red Bud tho that Dunge did a 2:05 and everyone else was 2:07s or 2:08s...

As I said tho, there are always lites riders who have gone faster... RV being the last... Then Bubba, RC, Lammy, Henry, Fro, O-Show...

He ain't the first.
jamma10
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jamma10 7/16/2012 5:48am
7/16/2012 5:48am
Crush wrote:
Stand corrected for Millville, I heard something for Red Bud tho that Dunge did a 2:05 and everyone else was 2:07s or 2:08s... As I said...
Stand corrected for Millville, I heard something for Red Bud tho that Dunge did a 2:05 and everyone else was 2:07s or 2:08s...

As I said tho, there are always lites riders who have gone faster... RV being the last... Then Bubba, RC, Lammy, Henry, Fro, O-Show...

He ain't the first.
No I appreciate what you're saying and I would tend to agree with you - most of the time.

Baggett just seems so strong its ridiculous, his confidence must be sky high right now. As Huckster says in that other thread about Baggett's pass, all that stands between him and the title is one almighty crash.

Post a reply to: How Much Is Baggett's Success is..