Mammoth doesn't allow 250 two strokes

peelout wrote:

yeah that's retarded. oops, i mean gay.

Falcon wrote:

I'm not going to get involved in the 2-stroke discussion, except to note that the 250F riders are right to not want to race against a...

I'm not going to get involved in the 2-stroke discussion, except to note that the 250F riders are right to not want to race against a 250 2-stroke. People seem to have forgotten that 250 2-strokes are to 250Fs what a 250F is to a 125; an unfair advantage, and a pretty ridiculous one at that.

There will never be parity between the configurations as long as the cc regulations are what they are, and who cares, anyway? Run the fastest thing you are allowed to run, and be done with it.

Seth, you can race in the 450 class. You'll be more a match for the 450s than the 250Fs would have been for you.

BAMX wrote:

Are you saying that they have an advantage at sea level? If so how does altitude negate that? The both use the same oxygen. If its...

Are you saying that they have an advantage at sea level? If so how does altitude negate that? The both use the same oxygen. If its 25% less for a 4 stroke it is 25% less for a 2 stroke.

blusmbl wrote:

Pumping losses go down at altitude (doesn't make up for the 30% oxygen hit at 5k feet) but it would mean the 4 stroke would be...

Pumping losses go down at altitude (doesn't make up for the 30% oxygen hit at 5k feet) but it would mean the 4 stroke would be slightly less effected, since a 4t has inherently more pumping hp loss normally. I don't know enough to give a definitive answer but I'd be shocked if if a 250 2t dyno'd the same as a 250 4t at the wheel at higher elevation unless the jetting was drastically wrong.

Torco1 wrote:

I'm guessing it has more to do with the fuel injection that the 4-strokes are using.

WORCSRacer wrote:

Why don't you worry about yourself big boy.

BTW it's "Mammoth".

jordanmendes127@gmail.com wrote:

quit crying im riding my CR250 in the open class this year. the thing you should worry about at mammoth is sand baggers the Jr. class...

quit crying im riding my CR250 in the open class this year. the thing you should worry about at mammoth is sand baggers the Jr. class last year was a joke

WORCSRacer wrote:

I don't ride the junior class but I have to agree, from what I've seen, it is full of sand baggers. I'd like to know how...

I don't ride the junior class but I have to agree, from what I've seen, it is full of sand baggers. I'd like to know how come if you're less than 30 you have to have separate displacement classes anyway. If it's good enough for the vets and seniors to race with open displacement why isn't it good enough for the under 30 set?

jordanmendes127@gmail.com wrote:

quit crying im riding my CR250 in the open class this year. the thing you should worry about at mammoth is sand baggers the Jr. class...

quit crying im riding my CR250 in the open class this year. the thing you should worry about at mammoth is sand baggers the Jr. class last year was a joke

WORCSRacer wrote:

I don't ride the junior class but I have to agree, from what I've seen, it is full of sand baggers. I'd like to know how...

I don't ride the junior class but I have to agree, from what I've seen, it is full of sand baggers. I'd like to know how come if you're less than 30 you have to have separate displacement classes anyway. If it's good enough for the vets and seniors to race with open displacement why isn't it good enough for the under 30 set?

Sherwood wrote:

Is this a real question because I'll answer it for you if it is, but really you just sound like a bitter old man.

SEEMEFIRST wrote:

Can we ride 500's in the fooper class?
I is from Texas, we ain't got rules.

WORCSRacer wrote:

No, only in the open class.

blusmbl wrote:

Pumping losses go down at altitude (doesn't make up for the 30% oxygen hit at 5k feet) but it would mean the 4 stroke would be...

Pumping losses go down at altitude (doesn't make up for the 30% oxygen hit at 5k feet) but it would mean the 4 stroke would be slightly less effected, since a 4t has inherently more pumping hp loss normally. I don't know enough to give a definitive answer but I'd be shocked if if a 250 2t dyno'd the same as a 250 4t at the wheel at higher elevation unless the jetting was drastically wrong.

Torco1 wrote:

I'm guessing it has more to do with the fuel injection that the 4-strokes are using.

TeamGreen wrote:

Actually it has to do with HOW the motors operate and their actual Combustion Rates & Ratios which comes down to some fundamentals based on efficiency...

Actually it has to do with HOW the motors operate and their actual Combustion Rates & Ratios which comes down to some fundamentals based on efficiency: Power loss on my 450 is sooooooo minimal to what I lost back in my 2t days.

BobbyM wrote:

old worcsracer is never pleasant or in a good mood since he's been coming here...probably before that too.

in a constant state of constipation...poor guy

WORCSRacer wrote:

Oh Bobby I guess I could follow your path to happiness as a cumguzzling spermbeard hoping to one day actually get to swing from mikey's nut...

Oh Bobby I guess I could follow your path to happiness as a cumguzzling spermbeard hoping to one day actually get to swing from mikey's nut sack....

Sherwood wrote:

The same can be said for yourself guy. Worry about yourself and not how someone decides to run their race. With that said you can contact...

The same can be said for yourself guy.

Worry about yourself and not how someone decides to run their race.

With that said you can contact FMF and see if they still do the Two Stroke Challenge because that was an open class with two strokes that was first come first serve deal and that would be fun.

If you do decide to go guy I think you'd be DQ'd for the first rule they have on that page.

WORCSRacer wrote:

Do you do much beyond sit at a keyboard and pontificate? I seriously doubt it. However i do race. I do support the industry and would...

Do you do much beyond sit at a keyboard and pontificate? I seriously doubt it. However i do race. I do support the industry and would like it to be a better place. I am all too happy to point out that the OEM's have completely lost sight of who buys their bikes. The factory race teams don't give flying eff about anyone or anything beyond what is good for them. They care about professional racing THAT IS IT. This isn't about selling bikes for them anymore than selling toyotas or yamahas is important to JGR. i on the other hand am interested in seeing the sport SURVIVE. i dont really think you are aware of just how sick this business is. In my opinion it is because of the lack of concern by the factories about Joe q public. This isn't all about the economy, stupid. New mx bike sales are now sitting about 30 percent of the end of the last boom which was 2006. THIRTY PERCENT. Not bad enough for you? Fine because it gets worse. Mx bike sales today are barely even 20% of the sales in 1970's. Race entries in the "growth" classes (minis and c classes) are down as much as 80% from 2007. When you look back when the sport was still new in the mid seventies, there would be a 1000 to 3000 entries for a freaking desert race. Now a HUGE desert race has maybe 350. Just ask yourself why? There are nearly 50% more Americans today vs the seventies and yet there are only 1/5 as many bikes being sold.

So what's this all have to do with Mammoth not allowing 250 two strokes to race the 250 class? No one can argue that a two fifty four stroke is an economical race bike. They aren't. They cost every bit of a $1000 to do a top end and they need them every 40 hours at a bare minimum. Further the secret is out too. No one wants to buy a used 250f. They are a timebomb in the used market. $7000 dollars to buy and literally $2500 at the end of the year and that is assuming you can find a buyer. 250fs are a freaking pox on this industry. Mammoth is just helping with the decline because they are siding with the 5 fucking idiots who think their the next big thing call and threaten to pull out if two strokes are allowed to race.

So frankly Sherlock, I don't really care what you think. It matters far more what the consequences mean to the industry as a whole.

4stroke4DWIN wrote:

Lets see here, 40hr rebuild minimum. Practice 2x a week = about 2 hrs Race 2x a month= 1hr (2-15min motos each race) So every 5...

Lets see here, 40hr rebuild minimum.

Practice 2x a week = about 2 hrs
Race 2x a month= 1hr (2-15min motos each race)

So every 5 months I should do the top end? I have five 5 months on a complete rebuild in December, I put in KW valves, hd springs, Stage 2 Hot cam, had the head worked and Wisco piston for 1500.

I over rev, float the valves and bang off the rev limiter which is set higher than factory (I have an 2 map ignition timing switch)
and generally ride the crap out of it.

I don't buy into the whole 40hr routine, I change my oil every 2 weeks and valves get checked after every race. 4strokes have a bad name because of POOR maintenance from the owner...........

By a thumper and you won't have to complain about you outdated 2t not getting to play with the cool kids.

Oh, and I do like 2t's also, I just know there place.

Sherwood wrote:

Man, you have a stick up your ass for some reason and I'm not sure why? I think you should change your name to SMIRKracer because...

Man, you have a stick up your ass for some reason and I'm not sure why? I think you should change your name to SMIRKracer because that better fits the way you act on this board.

The amature nationals in any shape or form have never been a reflection of what the common man wants so it really makes no fucking diffrence how they want to run their race. The common rider rides in the desert and buys a new bike about every 4 years and the common racer usually only goes to maybe one race a month around here. Quit comparing the boom of racing in the 70's and realize those times won't be coming back. They're gone.

When I'm at the races and see someone that quit racing its usually do to two reasons;

1. Because they lost their job.
2. Because the good people that would do anything to help a fellow racer out are the minority now and all that are left are the "elitists" that think they know everything about racing and only bitch about how things had once been better. People like you SMIRKracer.

The people made the sport and now the people like you are killing it.

I went to Lake Whitney up until it closed, loved Mosier Valley, and Cycle Ranch. All HAD great people all around, but now when we go it's just a bunch of MXA wannabe dicks and the good people seem to be in the minority.

The sports changed and that has nothing to do with 4-strokes, so if you'd like to blaim anyone for ruining the sport it's the people like you who act like this sport should be operated like a country club and we should shit on people in the D class.

Sherwood wrote:

Man, you have a stick up your ass for some reason and I'm not sure why? I think you should change your name to SMIRKracer because...

Man, you have a stick up your ass for some reason and I'm not sure why? I think you should change your name to SMIRKracer because that better fits the way you act on this board.

The amature nationals in any shape or form have never been a reflection of what the common man wants so it really makes no fucking diffrence how they want to run their race. The common rider rides in the desert and buys a new bike about every 4 years and the common racer usually only goes to maybe one race a month around here. Quit comparing the boom of racing in the 70's and realize those times won't be coming back. They're gone.

When I'm at the races and see someone that quit racing its usually do to two reasons;

1. Because they lost their job.
2. Because the good people that would do anything to help a fellow racer out are the minority now and all that are left are the "elitists" that think they know everything about racing and only bitch about how things had once been better. People like you SMIRKracer.

The people made the sport and now the people like you are killing it.

I went to Lake Whitney up until it closed, loved Mosier Valley, and Cycle Ranch. All HAD great people all around, but now when we go it's just a bunch of MXA wannabe dicks and the good people seem to be in the minority.

The sports changed and that has nothing to do with 4-strokes, so if you'd like to blaim anyone for ruining the sport it's the people like you who act like this sport should be operated like a country club and we should shit on people in the D class.

GuyB wrote:

If you want to argue (and I know that you do), how about you skip the name-calling, and maintain a little respect?

Sherwood wrote:

I felt decently respectful before Worcs decided to name call. After that I don't see the point of respecting him. When you start with "big boy"...

I felt decently respectful before Worcs decided to name call. After that I don't see the point of respecting him. When you start with "big boy" and end with "Sherlock" I no longer need to respect you IMO.

Sherwood wrote:

You sure it has nothing to do with the USFS?

Sherwood wrote:

You sure it has nothing to do with the USFS?

MX Sports Medicine wrote:

Are you serious????????????????????