World Champions - Why Don't We Respect Them?

SL91
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SL91 7/15/2011 2:06pm
7/15/2011 2:06pm
You guys are all like a bunch of fucking babies the way you argue over this shit.
Adam43
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Adam43 7/15/2011 2:17pm
7/15/2011 2:17pm
I would say that most fans who have a knowledge of and follow the GPs have a ton of respect for their champions.

You can't really expect a fan who doesn't keep up with them to think GP riders are worth a damn in comparison. The average American motocross fan has no knowledge of the sport outside the US. That's not unique to motocross, either.
Mstock
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Mstock 7/15/2011 2:21pm
7/15/2011 2:21pm
Unfortunately the average US motocross fan lives in the vacuum called the US media. Add to that you don't have to be born in the US to ride the "US National" series. Add to that the US series promoter is also the primary media outlet for the sport in the US. Add to that the GP's have NEVER been on real US tv broadcast. It's not that people don't respect them. They don't even know they exist.

I respect AC222 more than JS7. Results are less than 1% of my respect equation.
426Hemi
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426Hemi 7/15/2011 2:35pm
7/15/2011 2:35pm
Mstock wrote:
Unfortunately the average US motocross fan lives in the vacuum called the US media. Add to that you don't have to be born in the US...
Unfortunately the average US motocross fan lives in the vacuum called the US media. Add to that you don't have to be born in the US to ride the "US National" series. Add to that the US series promoter is also the primary media outlet for the sport in the US. Add to that the GP's have NEVER been on real US tv broadcast. It's not that people don't respect them. They don't even know they exist.

I respect AC222 more than JS7. Results are less than 1% of my respect equation.
Start your own mag and focus on the GPs and sell it.

The "US Media" barely covers mx, it is mostly covered by niche mags that target the MX audience.

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BobbyM
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BobbyM 7/15/2011 2:41pm
7/15/2011 2:41pm Edited Date/Time 7/15/2011 2:41pm
Mstock wrote:
Unfortunately the average US motocross fan lives in the vacuum called the US media. Add to that you don't have to be born in the US...
Unfortunately the average US motocross fan lives in the vacuum called the US media. Add to that you don't have to be born in the US to ride the "US National" series. Add to that the US series promoter is also the primary media outlet for the sport in the US. Add to that the GP's have NEVER been on real US tv broadcast. It's not that people don't respect them. They don't even know they exist.

I respect AC222 more than JS7. Results are less than 1% of my respect equation.
you should be loving james then
pilotdude
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pilotdude 7/15/2011 2:41pm
7/15/2011 2:41pm
希望 wrote:
Aha, Yeah, I laugh when I see that video. Everts rode around Bubs like he was on a fucking trail ride. Feet on the pegs, standing...
Aha, Yeah, I laugh when I see that video. Everts rode around Bubs like he was on a fucking trail ride. Feet on the pegs, standing and smooth as smooooooooooth.

pilotdude wrote:
This MXdN is one that always makes me smile. Do you understand that if Carmichael had been there as leader of that team, and Stewart had...
This MXdN is one that always makes me smile. Do you understand that if Carmichael had been there as leader of that team, and Stewart had been the MX3 rider, the ENTIRE dynamic would have been different? Stewart was not mentally ready to be leader of that team, but was thrown into that role when Carmichael was injured 2 weeks earlier at Glen Helen. It DEFINITELY affected his confidence and his riding. The Stewart everyone saw at the 2006 MXdN was NOT the Stewart who raced Carmichael during the Nationals in 2006. A Carmichael/Stewart/Villopoto Team USA would have had a different vibe altogether then the Stewart/Tedesco/Villopoto team., which had Tedesco just back from injury and horribly out of shape.

But we see hear over and over again how Everts beat Stewart, ad nauseum like it was some sort of miracle.

And then you wonder why we don't respect the "world" champions. I personally do respect the riders hugely. Their over-the-top fans...not so much.
robkinuk wrote:
Pilotdude, Why is it so difficult for Stewart and his fans to just admit he was beat that day by a better rider? All the RC...
Pilotdude,
Why is it so difficult for Stewart and his fans to just admit he was beat that day by a better rider? All the RC crashed, team dynamic bullshit excuses can't re-write history. This was Stefan's last race and he wanted to go out with a bang. Even a fully fit RC would have struggled to beat Everts that day at the MXDN 2006.

They say we all can learn by our mistakes, so if Bubba actually analysed the reasons why he got beat, smoother rider , arcing the corners standing up on pegs to absorb ruts, better choice of lines etc, he would be able to better handle such a challenge next time.
I respect riders from all over the world, AMA riders and GP riders alike, but to try and be-little what Stefan achieved that day is scraping the barrel.
Rob, a few things.

1. I do respect Everts. Dude was awesome

2. If you think the difference between a Carmichael/Stewart/Villopto team and a Stewart/Tedesco/Villopoto team is "bullshit", then you are not being intellectually honest in this debate. One team won the MXdN, the other team would almost certainly have won and put a hurt on everyone for the ages. Just my opinion there.

3. I see GP fans trying to turn Evert's ride in 2006 into something it wasn't far more than I see U.S. fans trying to "belittle" what Everts did. He won. Everyone saw it. Did he dominate the way some people try to hype it? No. Where did Stewart end up in the points in the 2006 Nationals? Fifth. Did DeCoster tell him to ride well within his limits and be smart for the team title? Decoster, Stewart, and everyone else seem to say so.
V
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V 7/15/2011 4:01pm
7/15/2011 4:01pm
希望 wrote:
From Penhall to Roberts to Spencer to Lackey, and a lot of others, we tend to turn a blind eye to these bad asses - unknowns...
From Penhall to Roberts to Spencer to Lackey, and a lot of others, we tend to turn a blind eye to these bad asses - unknowns here at home. These dudes gave it all up to go over to Europe and kick ass. When did being a World Champ lose it's credibility here in the U.S.? In fact, I'll go so far as to ask, why do we dislike World Champions in America?
I think that most Americans do like and respect the World Champs. Not the hillbillies that you see in movies like Deliverance, but most do.
V
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V 7/15/2011 4:04pm
7/15/2011 4:04pm
pilotdude wrote:
This MXdN is one that always makes me smile. Do you understand that if Carmichael had been there as leader of that team, and Stewart had...
This MXdN is one that always makes me smile. Do you understand that if Carmichael had been there as leader of that team, and Stewart had been the MX3 rider, the ENTIRE dynamic would have been different? Stewart was not mentally ready to be leader of that team, but was thrown into that role when Carmichael was injured 2 weeks earlier at Glen Helen. It DEFINITELY affected his confidence and his riding. The Stewart everyone saw at the 2006 MXdN was NOT the Stewart who raced Carmichael during the Nationals in 2006. A Carmichael/Stewart/Villopoto Team USA would have had a different vibe altogether then the Stewart/Tedesco/Villopoto team., which had Tedesco just back from injury and horribly out of shape.

But we see hear over and over again how Everts beat Stewart, ad nauseum like it was some sort of miracle.

And then you wonder why we don't respect the "world" champions. I personally do respect the riders hugely. Their over-the-top fans...not so much.
robkinuk wrote:
Pilotdude, Why is it so difficult for Stewart and his fans to just admit he was beat that day by a better rider? All the RC...
Pilotdude,
Why is it so difficult for Stewart and his fans to just admit he was beat that day by a better rider? All the RC crashed, team dynamic bullshit excuses can't re-write history. This was Stefan's last race and he wanted to go out with a bang. Even a fully fit RC would have struggled to beat Everts that day at the MXDN 2006.

They say we all can learn by our mistakes, so if Bubba actually analysed the reasons why he got beat, smoother rider , arcing the corners standing up on pegs to absorb ruts, better choice of lines etc, he would be able to better handle such a challenge next time.
I respect riders from all over the world, AMA riders and GP riders alike, but to try and be-little what Stefan achieved that day is scraping the barrel.
pilotdude wrote:
Rob, a few things. 1. I do respect Everts. Dude was awesome 2. If you think the difference between a Carmichael/Stewart/Villopto team and a Stewart/Tedesco/Villopoto team...
Rob, a few things.

1. I do respect Everts. Dude was awesome

2. If you think the difference between a Carmichael/Stewart/Villopto team and a Stewart/Tedesco/Villopoto team is "bullshit", then you are not being intellectually honest in this debate. One team won the MXdN, the other team would almost certainly have won and put a hurt on everyone for the ages. Just my opinion there.

3. I see GP fans trying to turn Evert's ride in 2006 into something it wasn't far more than I see U.S. fans trying to "belittle" what Everts did. He won. Everyone saw it. Did he dominate the way some people try to hype it? No. Where did Stewart end up in the points in the 2006 Nationals? Fifth. Did DeCoster tell him to ride well within his limits and be smart for the team title? Decoster, Stewart, and everyone else seem to say so.
Everts dominated Stewart. He passed him with ease, like he was play riding. Maybe Stewart was off/nervous/whatever...but Everts smoked Stewart.
mccread
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mccread 7/15/2011 4:17pm
7/15/2011 4:17pm
It is just a lack of exposure and knowledge of how difficult it is to become World Champion and just how versatile and tough you have to be to achieve that.

Americans only look at America and the American motocross media only look at American motocross mostly. If they gave the GPs as much coverage as the AMA nationals and the AMA nationals as much coverage as the GPs, more people would be interested in it. The latest transworld magazine even had an article entitle... who is Marvin Musquin! It is embarassing that a huge motocross country does not know who the two time world champion is!

I also don't know why American riders don't want to represent their country in the World championship and win that as well as the National MX and SX series.

Even Racehead today didn't even mention Bobreyshev win his first GP, or Roczen winning his home GP.. it was all about US motocross. That to me is amazing that the World Champoinship doesn't make it into the US media with the same coverage as the AMA series.

Also Americans only compare themselves to foreigners in their own country or the MXDN.. in both cases they have a huge advantage and usually win... thus creating a perception that they are better than the World Championship (without ever actually racing and winning the world championship)

A lack of knowledge causes a lack of respect. The same thing that mean people who don't race mx think it is easy. It is the same principle.

I think core motocross fans in the US do respect the World Champion though. But the new fans and relative new fans don't really follow GP racing at all.. it is a shame, but that's the way it is in America. I just feel lucky I am able to watch and have been brought up with media coverage of the World Motocross Championship and the AMA series' and respect both for what they are, equally great but very different series.
V
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V 7/15/2011 4:48pm
7/15/2011 4:48pm
mccread wrote:
It is just a lack of exposure and knowledge of how difficult it is to become World Champion and just how versatile and tough you have...
It is just a lack of exposure and knowledge of how difficult it is to become World Champion and just how versatile and tough you have to be to achieve that.

Americans only look at America and the American motocross media only look at American motocross mostly. If they gave the GPs as much coverage as the AMA nationals and the AMA nationals as much coverage as the GPs, more people would be interested in it. The latest transworld magazine even had an article entitle... who is Marvin Musquin! It is embarassing that a huge motocross country does not know who the two time world champion is!

I also don't know why American riders don't want to represent their country in the World championship and win that as well as the National MX and SX series.

Even Racehead today didn't even mention Bobreyshev win his first GP, or Roczen winning his home GP.. it was all about US motocross. That to me is amazing that the World Champoinship doesn't make it into the US media with the same coverage as the AMA series.

Also Americans only compare themselves to foreigners in their own country or the MXDN.. in both cases they have a huge advantage and usually win... thus creating a perception that they are better than the World Championship (without ever actually racing and winning the world championship)

A lack of knowledge causes a lack of respect. The same thing that mean people who don't race mx think it is easy. It is the same principle.

I think core motocross fans in the US do respect the World Champion though. But the new fans and relative new fans don't really follow GP racing at all.. it is a shame, but that's the way it is in America. I just feel lucky I am able to watch and have been brought up with media coverage of the World Motocross Championship and the AMA series' and respect both for what they are, equally great but very different series.
A good many Americans are ethnocentric to the core. The sad part is, a good many Americans don't even know what that means unless they google it...and even then they only a 50% chance of understanding it.
moto282
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moto282 7/15/2011 4:49pm
7/15/2011 4:49pm
mccread wrote:
It is just a lack of exposure and knowledge of how difficult it is to become World Champion and just how versatile and tough you have...
It is just a lack of exposure and knowledge of how difficult it is to become World Champion and just how versatile and tough you have to be to achieve that.

Americans only look at America and the American motocross media only look at American motocross mostly. If they gave the GPs as much coverage as the AMA nationals and the AMA nationals as much coverage as the GPs, more people would be interested in it. The latest transworld magazine even had an article entitle... who is Marvin Musquin! It is embarassing that a huge motocross country does not know who the two time world champion is!

I also don't know why American riders don't want to represent their country in the World championship and win that as well as the National MX and SX series.

Even Racehead today didn't even mention Bobreyshev win his first GP, or Roczen winning his home GP.. it was all about US motocross. That to me is amazing that the World Champoinship doesn't make it into the US media with the same coverage as the AMA series.

Also Americans only compare themselves to foreigners in their own country or the MXDN.. in both cases they have a huge advantage and usually win... thus creating a perception that they are better than the World Championship (without ever actually racing and winning the world championship)

A lack of knowledge causes a lack of respect. The same thing that mean people who don't race mx think it is easy. It is the same principle.

I think core motocross fans in the US do respect the World Champion though. But the new fans and relative new fans don't really follow GP racing at all.. it is a shame, but that's the way it is in America. I just feel lucky I am able to watch and have been brought up with media coverage of the World Motocross Championship and the AMA series' and respect both for what they are, equally great but very different series.
V wrote:
A good many Americans are ethnocentric to the core. The sad part is, a good many Americans don't even know what that means unless they google...
A good many Americans are ethnocentric to the core. The sad part is, a good many Americans don't even know what that means unless they google it...and even then they only a 50% chance of understanding it.
Dumb and dumber... (the two posts above ^)
broman64
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broman64 7/15/2011 4:49pm
7/15/2011 4:49pm Edited Date/Time 7/15/2011 4:52pm
V wrote:
Everts dominated Stewart. He passed him with ease, like he was play riding. Maybe Stewart was off/nervous/whatever...but Everts smoked Stewart.
Ithinkyou'vebeendrinking...Ialwaysthinkyou'vebeendrinking...Ijustdisagree...prettysimple...
BMan-
V
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V 7/15/2011 4:54pm
7/15/2011 4:54pm
mccread wrote:
It is just a lack of exposure and knowledge of how difficult it is to become World Champion and just how versatile and tough you have...
It is just a lack of exposure and knowledge of how difficult it is to become World Champion and just how versatile and tough you have to be to achieve that.

Americans only look at America and the American motocross media only look at American motocross mostly. If they gave the GPs as much coverage as the AMA nationals and the AMA nationals as much coverage as the GPs, more people would be interested in it. The latest transworld magazine even had an article entitle... who is Marvin Musquin! It is embarassing that a huge motocross country does not know who the two time world champion is!

I also don't know why American riders don't want to represent their country in the World championship and win that as well as the National MX and SX series.

Even Racehead today didn't even mention Bobreyshev win his first GP, or Roczen winning his home GP.. it was all about US motocross. That to me is amazing that the World Champoinship doesn't make it into the US media with the same coverage as the AMA series.

Also Americans only compare themselves to foreigners in their own country or the MXDN.. in both cases they have a huge advantage and usually win... thus creating a perception that they are better than the World Championship (without ever actually racing and winning the world championship)

A lack of knowledge causes a lack of respect. The same thing that mean people who don't race mx think it is easy. It is the same principle.

I think core motocross fans in the US do respect the World Champion though. But the new fans and relative new fans don't really follow GP racing at all.. it is a shame, but that's the way it is in America. I just feel lucky I am able to watch and have been brought up with media coverage of the World Motocross Championship and the AMA series' and respect both for what they are, equally great but very different series.
V wrote:
A good many Americans are ethnocentric to the core. The sad part is, a good many Americans don't even know what that means unless they google...
A good many Americans are ethnocentric to the core. The sad part is, a good many Americans don't even know what that means unless they google it...and even then they only a 50% chance of understanding it.
moto282 wrote:
Dumb and dumber... (the two posts above ^)
It's not dumb at all. It of course offends your senses, but many Americans are ethnocentric. Studies have been done if you'd care to investigate it for yourself.
V
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V 7/15/2011 4:55pm
7/15/2011 4:55pm
V wrote:
Everts dominated Stewart. He passed him with ease, like he was play riding. Maybe Stewart was off/nervous/whatever...but Everts smoked Stewart.
broman64 wrote:
Ithinkyou'vebeendrinking...Ialwaysthinkyou'vebeendrinking...Ijustdisagree...prettysimple...
BMan-
Post a video of the race. I do believe Stewart was passed....
broman64
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broman64 7/15/2011 5:00pm
7/15/2011 5:00pm
V wrote:
It's not dumb at all. It of course offends your senses, but many Americans are ethnocentric. Studies have been done if you'd care to investigate it...
It's not dumb at all. It of course offends your senses, but many Americans are ethnocentric. Studies have been done if you'd care to investigate it for yourself.
areyoukidding?...Ialwaysthinkthisarguementisstupid,andIalwaysthinktheeurosideisalostcausethathasNOground...Notsome,asIwouldexpect,but,none,adellusionofsortsorts...
BMan-
Sondy132001
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Sondy132001 7/15/2011 5:02pm
7/15/2011 5:02pm
V wrote:
It's not dumb at all. It of course offends your senses, but many Americans are ethnocentric. Studies have been done if you'd care to investigate it...
It's not dumb at all. It of course offends your senses, but many Americans are ethnocentric. Studies have been done if you'd care to investigate it for yourself.
broman64 wrote:
areyoukidding?...Ialwaysthinkthisarguementisstupid,andIalwaysthinktheeurosideisalostcausethathasNOground...Notsome,asIwouldexpect,but,none,adellusionofsortsorts...
BMan-
OK that's it, what's your address ?? I need MXB2's also, you both obviously need a keyboard sponsor !!!!

S
SMITH201
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SMITH201 7/15/2011 5:04pm
7/15/2011 5:04pm
mccread wrote:
It is just a lack of exposure and knowledge of how difficult it is to become World Champion and just how versatile and tough you have...
It is just a lack of exposure and knowledge of how difficult it is to become World Champion and just how versatile and tough you have to be to achieve that.

Americans only look at America and the American motocross media only look at American motocross mostly. If they gave the GPs as much coverage as the AMA nationals and the AMA nationals as much coverage as the GPs, more people would be interested in it. The latest transworld magazine even had an article entitle... who is Marvin Musquin! It is embarassing that a huge motocross country does not know who the two time world champion is!

I also don't know why American riders don't want to represent their country in the World championship and win that as well as the National MX and SX series.

Even Racehead today didn't even mention Bobreyshev win his first GP, or Roczen winning his home GP.. it was all about US motocross. That to me is amazing that the World Champoinship doesn't make it into the US media with the same coverage as the AMA series.

Also Americans only compare themselves to foreigners in their own country or the MXDN.. in both cases they have a huge advantage and usually win... thus creating a perception that they are better than the World Championship (without ever actually racing and winning the world championship)

A lack of knowledge causes a lack of respect. The same thing that mean people who don't race mx think it is easy. It is the same principle.

I think core motocross fans in the US do respect the World Champion though. But the new fans and relative new fans don't really follow GP racing at all.. it is a shame, but that's the way it is in America. I just feel lucky I am able to watch and have been brought up with media coverage of the World Motocross Championship and the AMA series' and respect both for what they are, equally great but very different series.
Yeah! Laughing

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osamabindrinking 7/15/2011 5:04pm
7/15/2011 5:04pm
I'm sorry first post but its pretty easy. no supercross in europe = less money in europe = less top guys in europe. Don't get me wrong I'm rooting for desalle and belive he is as good as any US mx rider, but need to prove it in the US for the reasons i wrote earlier. So please, pretty please with sugar on top some time in the future make a global mx series.
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SMITH201 7/15/2011 5:14pm
7/15/2011 5:14pm
osamabindrinking wrote:
I'm sorry first post but its pretty easy. no supercross in europe = less money in europe = less top guys in europe. Don't get me...
I'm sorry first post but its pretty easy. no supercross in europe = less money in europe = less top guys in europe. Don't get me wrong I'm rooting for desalle and belive he is as good as any US mx rider, but need to prove it in the US for the reasons i wrote earlier. So please, pretty please with sugar on top some time in the future make a global mx series.
Dude, Desalle is legit! He proved that at Washougal a couple years ago and Unadilla last year!
osamabindrinking 7/15/2011 5:26pm
7/15/2011 5:26pm
Smith201 you are right... exactly what im saying he IS the man. But european guys have a choice/chance to take. Either make decent money in europe or (IF and I stress IF you make it...) make excellent money in the US. But if you dont... you have just not only lost potential money made in the US but also "guearanted" money in europe. It takes alot to make the jump to either side.... if im Desalle og carolli.... Or dungey, villopoto or reed... HELL NO if i would be going to the other side of the pond to chase a dream to make 2 mill istead of the 1 mill i am making here....
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broman64 7/15/2011 5:30pm
7/15/2011 5:30pm
Sondy132001 wrote:
OK that's it, what's your address ?? I need MXB2's also, you both obviously need a keyboard sponsor !!!!

S
Ijustdecided,"whatthehell"...Tomorrow,I'llgetanewone...Thirdonein2weeks...but,"nobody"didit...
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petegrath 7/15/2011 5:51pm
7/15/2011 5:51pm
Moto East Mag wrote:
Probably because MXA for years and years promoted the idea that the GPs were a joke compared to the US National Series. They are just different...
Probably because MXA for years and years promoted the idea that the GPs were a joke compared to the US National Series.
They are just different. The tracks are super tough, for one.
And some of it is just old fashioned American jingoism.
I don't know about that dude. I respect all of the pros, both sides of the pond cause they can ride better than I'll ever think of riding. But I lived in Europe for a few years, and I can't tell ya how many times I was confronted for just being an American. Things are always "fucked up in the U.S., and better there" according to many. We see it alot right here, and alot of the "jingoism" is simply American dudes fucking with the Euros in response to a post or thread that displays that attitude. I think maybe the humor is lost in translation though, and of course lots of dudes take joy in that when fucking with such posters...
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CamP 7/15/2011 5:53pm
7/15/2011 5:53pm Edited Date/Time 7/15/2011 5:53pm
SMITH201 wrote:
Dude, Desalle is legit! He proved that at Washougal a couple years ago and Unadilla last year!
I was at Washougal. He was on it and always sounded a gear higher than everyone else.
JB 19
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JB 19 7/15/2011 5:54pm
7/15/2011 5:54pm
You're kinda new around here huh?
V
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V 7/15/2011 5:59pm
7/15/2011 5:59pm
JB 19 wrote:
You're kinda new around here huh?
You must be kinda new around here as well since you did not quote the person that you were replying to, thus leaving everyone other than your important self out in the dark. Smile
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GuyB 7/15/2011 6:02pm
7/15/2011 6:02pm
Who's this we you speak of?
machine
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machine 7/15/2011 6:17pm
7/15/2011 6:17pm
I think the lack of respect comes from the days before the European tracks caught up with our tracks with the bigger technical jumps. It really wasn't that long ago that Euro riders would come over here and were scared to do some of the big jumps. Some of the Euro tracks are still pretty flat compared to our tracks, it's just a fact.

Whit that said, they have had longer careers in general because of the flatter less jumpy tracks that can cause career ending injuries.
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umagumadog 7/15/2011 6:27pm
7/15/2011 6:27pm
Us ethnocentric fans do respect this World Champion.

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7/13/2008
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Fort Myers, FL US
Overdrive 7/15/2011 6:37pm
7/15/2011 6:37pm Edited Date/Time 7/15/2011 6:39pm
I have a problem with the name alone, WORLD CHAMPION........ There are just so many things wrong with that Im not even going to go into it. Rename it something more fitting and you might get more respect. By that standard Ryan Dungey was the Champion of the UNIVERSE last year.

Oh wait thats like saying Heath Voss was World SX Champion......The title carries very little credibility.

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