Mark II or III?

squid48
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Edited Date/Time 1/23/2012 2:47pm
Im looking to get a Canon Mark II or III...

Whats everyone thinking i should go for???
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Cabro
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7/29/2008 11:57pm
I think price is not a target for you....I'll buy the MarkIII as it's newer
squid48
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7/30/2008 10:00am
Ive got some money saved up and dont know which way to go...

Ive heard complaints about the III...

So i dont know...
jbomx363
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7/30/2008 2:08pm
$1500 vs $3500. Your choice. I chose a 1dMarkII and am happy I saved the dough to buy other lenses.
7/30/2008 2:43pm Edited Date/Time 7/30/2008 2:44pm
Although when it first came out the focus issues for the mark III Were very apparent, new firmwire updates for the camera have seemed to solve the issues from what I hear of other photogs. And the mark III is more in the $4,000+ range right now.

The Shop

motoxphoto
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7/30/2008 7:05pm
The Mark III is amazing. I have had no problems with mine. The problems were with a limited run. The new ones already have the updated firmare.
Homey
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7/30/2008 7:37pm

The Mark III issues were not a limited run.
It was a 6 month ordeal of shipped bodies and another 2 months after that before it was sorted out. You can read all over the place about many Pro's dealing with it for almost a year. The rumor number of bodies was 150,000.

The firmware was not the fix. They all needed a few parts replaced too. The mirror box was only part of the solution and Canon has not, nor probably never will admit to what all had to be fixed on these bodies.

Anyway Emil thats over now. All current bodies are claimed to be good. I have talked to several who claim there 3 is great so now its safe to buy one.

The only issues to me are A, do you need the extra 2 frames a second? B, do you need the extra 2 megapixels?
From all I know who have it say, its marginally better focusing than the II N. Which means its a 1D series and it focuses great and the 3 is just a tad better.

So weigh all that in and decide if the $2000 extra is worth it.
Hey why not go the rout I did? Get a 1Ds M II. I have seen some good deals on them lately in the used department.
You can get a decent one with under 50K shutter actuations for $3500 to $4000 range.


Just some food for thought.

I too am thinking about my next purchase. I can't justify buying another body yet but can spend some dough on a lens.. :-) then maybe a M3 or 2N over the winter.

Let me know what you decide and how it works out for you.



squid48
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7/30/2008 8:42pm
I dont buy used... i dont care the conditions... im just one of those people that with my luck id buy used and it would break... and id be stuck with more costs....

I had heard of the mark III problems... and it sounds like they are fixed....

This is going to be my camera for quite a while so i want the most recently updated one i can get...
Homey
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7/30/2008 9:46pm
I hear ya on the used route.

Its a tough choice but I am not sure you can get a new 1d M2n now. I think it would have to be used too.
So your choice to buy new would probably be the Mark 3 now the 1D or the 1Ds.


bryno74
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7/30/2008 9:55pm
squid48 wrote:
Im looking to get a Canon Mark II or III...

Whats everyone thinking i should go for???
Go for the Mark III, I have had 4 of them and all have worked flawless for me...
squid48
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7/31/2008 10:02am
4!????

Why have u already had 4?
FreshTopEnd
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7/31/2008 12:19pm
My MkIII has been flawless AF wise and the files are terrific to work with.


Not sure where you'd find a new MkII or MkIIn.


You could talk me out of my MkII if you wanted it.
Chili
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7/31/2008 4:39pm
Homey just an FYI, Squid48 is not Emile Cooper.
squid48
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7/31/2008 8:37pm
FTE do you honestly think the price difference is worth it?? This will be my camera for quite a couple a of years....
FreshTopEnd
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8/1/2008 11:17am
Honestly, that's a question only you can answer. You really have to answer that in the context of what lenses you're going to have or want in the next couple years, too. The lowest you're probably going to find a new MkIII for will be around $3,700. Solid MkII's are going for around $1,500-$1,700. Any body will get traded away eventually, but glass is something you keep for a long time over many bodies. The first lens I bought was the 70-200 2.8, and I've shot that on a 1V, 1D, 1D MkII and now 1Dmk III. If you've already got good glass, then it makes your decision easier (as does unlimited funds). But putting non-L glass on a MkIII is kind of a waste of the money the MkIII will cost you.

Shoot, I was looking at some original 1D files last night from 2004, which body I bought from Kardy back then, and they still hold up well.

Look, I'm in no hurry to off the MkII body, and I won't have any problem finding a buyer when I pull that trigger.

FreshTopEnd
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8/1/2008 11:20am
Homey, the MP and shutter speed are marginal differences between the II and III. The real difference seems to be the way the files handle in post processing if you shoot raw. The 14 bit III files are really nice to work with.

The Ds II is going to give you the same sort of IQ differences from the regular II.
squid48
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8/1/2008 4:07pm
I have the same glass you do...

I just cant decide...

Are you willing to sell your II?

Or do you know where i could find a new one?

Because i dont have the funds for a III... but thats what ive been saving up for.

My Rebel is pretty much junk now... im gunna send it to Canon and get it all fixed up, and sell it!
FreshTopEnd
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8/1/2008 5:11pm Edited Date/Time 4/16/2016 7:52pm
I have no idea where a new MkII/N could be found. I do know that people who feel sketchy about getting the MkIII because of the early AF issues are going after the MkII's, and I think any new bodies would get snapped ip pretty quickly. And I doubt you'd get much of a discount off the price of a new one relative to the cost you could get a new MkIII for.

Find out how much canon would charge to fix the rebel; I'm not sure they are going for much used and it'd be a shame to sell it less or not much more than you could sell it for. You might do better to sell it as is, even if it's just as a parts camera.

I keep going back and forth on selling the MkII; the rational part of me says sell. I probably won't put it up for sale until the end of August. What we could do is get together someplace for you to test drive it and see if you like it. Shoot, you could handle the MkIII as well to compare them. Any of the 1D bodies are going to be heavy mothers compared to a rebel.

If you want, check out the Hangtown and Glen Helen galleries; every file with an "f" prefix on the file number is a MkII shot, the files with and "i" prefix are the MkIII files.
squid48
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8/1/2008 5:59pm
I carry around a pretty heavy set.... I have the Rebel, 70-200, battery grip, and 430EX...

I always keep everything on in case i need it... its a good workout! haha.

Hey did u happen to get any pics of my brother at GH or Hangtown?
motoxphoto
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8/1/2008 8:20pm
Homey wrote:
The Mark III issues were not a limited run. It was a 6 month ordeal of shipped bodies and another 2 months after that before it...

The Mark III issues were not a limited run.
It was a 6 month ordeal of shipped bodies and another 2 months after that before it was sorted out. You can read all over the place about many Pro's dealing with it for almost a year. The rumor number of bodies was 150,000.

The firmware was not the fix. They all needed a few parts replaced too. The mirror box was only part of the solution and Canon has not, nor probably never will admit to what all had to be fixed on these bodies.

Anyway Emil thats over now. All current bodies are claimed to be good. I have talked to several who claim there 3 is great so now its safe to buy one.

The only issues to me are A, do you need the extra 2 frames a second? B, do you need the extra 2 megapixels?
From all I know who have it say, its marginally better focusing than the II N. Which means its a 1D series and it focuses great and the 3 is just a tad better.

So weigh all that in and decide if the $2000 extra is worth it.
Hey why not go the rout I did? Get a 1Ds M II. I have seen some good deals on them lately in the used department.
You can get a decent one with under 50K shutter actuations for $3500 to $4000 range.


Just some food for thought.

I too am thinking about my next purchase. I can't justify buying another body yet but can spend some dough on a lens.. :-) then maybe a M3 or 2N over the winter.

Let me know what you decide and how it works out for you.



It was, in fact, a limited run. This is directly from the Canon site:

If the serial number on the bottom of the camera is between 501001 and 546561, it could be affected by the AF mirror adjustment problem, with the exception of cameras with the following serial numbers (click here) which were manufactured with an updated mirror mechanism. (Additionally, all EOS-1D Mark III cameras with serial numbers higher than 546561 have been manufactured with the updated mirror mechanism.)

Please note that the issue occurs only in some of the unmodified EOS-1D Mark III cameras within this serial number range. If your EOS-1D Mark III camera is operating correctly, it will not be necessary to have it repaired for this issue.


The firmware update is, in fact, part of the solution. Again, directly from the Canon web site:

April 30, 2008
Updated Information
We have been investigating, and working on improving, AF system performance to ensure the satisfaction of our customers. As a result, we have released new firmware version 1.2.3 which improves AF performance in AI servo AF for shooting extremely low contrast objects. Please use this new firmware. Click here for details and to download firmware version 1.2.3.


If you purchase a new one (outside that set of serial numbers), it should have the properly functioning mirror and the latest firmware version. I have had mine for around 4 months and both of those things are true.

Homey
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8/1/2008 9:00pm
Moto
The 1d M3 was released in April 2007 so that statement is 1 year after the release.
They also released a "blue dot" version in late 07 but the problems still existed in some of them too.

the serial #'s listed in that statement also show that it affected 45000 cameras and thats just in the USA Or maybe North america.

The global # was rumored to be 150,000

To me its a big deal as I got tired of waiting for one and bought a 1Ds M2 instead. I bought it in Jan. of 08 and made a comment that now that I spent the money the M3 will now soon be fixed.. Haha so I was close.

Chili

Thanks. I thought it was emil. How many photogs on here have the Squid nick name?

FTE. Yes that was my point. I learned today that the High ISO on them is much better than the M2's.
to me thats a huge bonus and almost worth it in itself. I talked to 2 photogs today about the camera and they both claim they can notice a difference in the speed and accuracy of focus in the M3 over their old M2 cameras.

I will buy a M3 over the winter just for the better ISO. That is unless you sell me your M2 cheap enough.. LOL


FreshTopEnd
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8/2/2008 10:50am
The Rob Galbraith site just released his latest evaluation of the MkIII with the hardware and firmware updates.

The blue dots reference the earlier MkIII's where they retrofitted a new mirror assembly, which apparently accounted for the AF problems people were having when it was hot. That was resolved by winter, and new bodies now are coming with the new design from the factories.

The firmware updates continue. RG's testing pretty much concerns AI Servo tracking. He's also focused on 10fps burst shooting while tracking subjects shooting wide open at 2.8. His conclusion is that the latest firmware hasn't resolved the AI-Servo issues when shooting this way. His sense is that as the computer assesses the speed of the object it's overreacting and, most often, front focusing. He also found that this tracking issue pretty much went away when shooting at stopped down to 5.6.

To me, this explains why I'm not having the issues others say they are having. I generally do not shoot long bursts and generally shoot between f4 and 6.1 to have enough DOF to keep the whole bike in focus. The rigs been fantastic for me in that regard. If you accept what he's saying (and the frustration others are having), then it may be an outstanding motosports camera but not a first choice for field sports if you are burst shooting wide open.

He also said that he loves the speed at which the AF locks on (although I guess the latest firmware update tempers that) and the image quality, and he sticks with the MkIII rather than reverting to the mkII because of that.

If you want to see a lot of people wound tight about this issue, check out the canon forum on Fred Miranda.
FreshTopEnd
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8/2/2008 10:52am Edited Date/Time 8/2/2008 10:54am
I think you could probably pick up a MkIII used for a decent price. A lot of people have psyched themselves out on this camera. Shoot, all of the Id's have been great cameras, even the original 1D still produces pretty good files if you're not pushing high iso. Sure was a battery hog, though.
FreshTopEnd
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8/2/2008 10:56am
Squid, have you hefted a 1D? The body alone without a lens probably weighs more than your rebel set up. Good for sore shoulders when you're shooting a 300 2.8 all day.
squid48
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8/2/2008 7:53pm
Ill survive.... i need a good work out! haha.

FTE, did u happen to get any shots of 472 in the lites class at GH or Hangtown??
Factoryphoto
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8/5/2008 4:27pm
If you shoot RAW Casey which I dont think you do and I dont think you shoot on burst either.. A Mark II N is a great camera I have just over 50k shots with it not a single issue ever.. A 1D S like Homey said is what I would be looking at or a very limited used II N.. I cant say anything about the Mark II but look at FTE's photos from over the years hes got some great stuff with it.. There was a nice Mark II N on sf bay craigs list for 2k with only 26K shutter releases with it.. If money is not a issue then go with the III like everyone says its more updated but if money is an issue I would not hesitate to buy from a well known user on fred miranda.com or canon forums.. Look at there feedback ask them to send a photo recently taken with the camera and send it to me or I can send you the program that tells you how many shutter releases the camera has taken.
squid48
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8/5/2008 11:06pm
Hoss, Money is always an issue... im working my ass off everyday trying to make as many dimes and nickels i can for a new one. Like i said, I wont buy used.... so its sounding more and more like my only option is the III. Im not in that big of a hurry to get one quite yet...

I just wanted to see what peoples thoughts were on them.

My mind is pretty much set on the III because i know its good and its going to last me a while...

I just gotta make sure i keep saving so i can get it and dont spend my savings on other things....

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