Holeshot devices should be banned...

zookrider62!
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zookrider62! 3/31/2010 11:10am
3/31/2010 11:10am
zookrider62! wrote:
I really dont understand this logic at all, I couldnt disgree more. Seems selfish to ban it when others can use it
MIKEY755 wrote:
you're not understanding what he said........ he simply stated that since everyone has it now it's a moot point, when it was only a couple of...
you're not understanding what he said........ he simply stated that since everyone has it now it's a moot point, when it was only a couple of guys that had them they were actually gaining an advantage over the rest. He's not saying that only the "factory" teams should be allowed.


I think what he's getting at is if they ban them it will slow them down coming into the first turn and therefore reduce the amount of first turn crashes.
but why was it acceptable for him to have one and go into the first turn too fast?
MIKEY755
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MIKEY755 3/31/2010 11:11am
3/31/2010 11:11am
Ok!! We must stop this non sense.... were making waaay to many intelligent post today.
CamP
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CamP 3/31/2010 11:15am
3/31/2010 11:15am
zookrider62! wrote:
I really dont understand this logic at all, I couldnt disgree more. Seems selfish to ban it when others can use it
MIKEY755 wrote:
you're not understanding what he said........ he simply stated that since everyone has it now it's a moot point, when it was only a couple of...
you're not understanding what he said........ he simply stated that since everyone has it now it's a moot point, when it was only a couple of guys that had them they were actually gaining an advantage over the rest. He's not saying that only the "factory" teams should be allowed.


I think what he's getting at is if they ban them it will slow them down coming into the first turn and therefore reduce the amount of first turn crashes.
zookrider62! wrote:
but why was it acceptable for him to have one and go into the first turn too fast?
He can correct me if I'm wrong, but I think DV is saying there will be less first turn pile ups without the device as it will space everyone out more. With only a few guys using them it wasn't a problem, but with a full gate of them it makes for a very crowded first corner.
MIKEY755
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MIKEY755 3/31/2010 11:18am
3/31/2010 11:18am
zookrider62! wrote:
I really dont understand this logic at all, I couldnt disgree more. Seems selfish to ban it when others can use it
MIKEY755 wrote:
you're not understanding what he said........ he simply stated that since everyone has it now it's a moot point, when it was only a couple of...
you're not understanding what he said........ he simply stated that since everyone has it now it's a moot point, when it was only a couple of guys that had them they were actually gaining an advantage over the rest. He's not saying that only the "factory" teams should be allowed.


I think what he's getting at is if they ban them it will slow them down coming into the first turn and therefore reduce the amount of first turn crashes.
zookrider62! wrote:
but why was it acceptable for him to have one and go into the first turn too fast?
if 5 guys had these and the other 15 didn't then it was a pretty much non issue because you would only have 3-5 more guy's nail the start and be able to hang with the 5 that had it. Now that everyone has them it has made it easier to get a good start which in turn means more people in the first turn at the same time.

it's a pretty funny argument but you must admit that with all the 250f first turn pile ups that maybe we should tone the starts down a bit and this would be a good starting point.

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Farva
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Farva 3/31/2010 2:22pm
3/31/2010 2:22pm
The problem will always be:

Every rider entering the corner at the same time.

You take all of them away this happens, you give everyone this happens.
ns503
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ns503 3/31/2010 2:29pm
3/31/2010 2:29pm
Farva wrote:
The problem will always be: Every rider entering the corner at the same time. You take all of them away this happens, you give everyone this...
The problem will always be:

Every rider entering the corner at the same time.

You take all of them away this happens, you give everyone this happens.
Yes, but what if they're all going slower?
leakypipe23 3/31/2010 2:42pm
3/31/2010 2:42pm
Rupert X wrote:


Tops on 30 sec girls should pop-off as the gate is about to drop.

And beer should rain down from the skies.
Agreed.
nobhead
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nobhead 3/31/2010 2:57pm
3/31/2010 2:57pm
Who is the DV guy with his European Obama concepts of banning things that hurt private business. J/K DV, I like it. Ban away.
Farva
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Farva 3/31/2010 3:01pm
3/31/2010 3:01pm
Farva wrote:
The problem will always be: Every rider entering the corner at the same time. You take all of them away this happens, you give everyone this...
The problem will always be:

Every rider entering the corner at the same time.

You take all of them away this happens, you give everyone this happens.
ns503 wrote:
Yes, but what if they're all going slower?
If you send 20 riders into a turn made for 5 bad crashes will happen regardless of speed.

Watch the 80cc class at Lake Whitney if you want to see what happens when you slow down the bikes.

The same thing.
XBUTCHX
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XBUTCHX 3/31/2010 3:06pm
3/31/2010 3:06pm
They will get there quicker with the device. Not having it, they will still be going the same speed.Whistling
Outsider
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Outsider 3/31/2010 3:10pm
3/31/2010 3:10pm
Wouldn't there be less chance of injuries if the bike were going into the first turn slower?
Farva
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Farva 3/31/2010 3:17pm
3/31/2010 3:17pm
Outsider wrote:
Wouldn't there be less chance of injuries if the bike were going into the first turn slower?
Skipping a rock sometimes hurts less than when a rock just goes thud.

lostboy819 4/4/2010 12:27am
4/4/2010 12:27am
zookrider62! wrote:
but why was it acceptable for him to have one and go into the first turn too fast?
lol
Jef
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Jef 4/4/2010 12:42am
4/4/2010 12:42am
I'm just a dumb guy ... can anyone explane how that "holeshot device" works? I 've never heard of it before ....
Blake
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Blake 4/4/2010 12:50am
4/4/2010 12:50am
Technically, it could be considered a traction control device, and I do believe those are illegal in AMA Pro..............
Electro21 4/4/2010 2:34am
4/4/2010 2:34am
I have always been a big fan of DV 12, but the banning of holeshot devices doesn't really make a whole lot of sense. Do you really think banning the devices will seperate the field? With or without the devices, the starts will end up the same. I think track design is the key.

I will admit, I am the guy that has been in the beginner class for 10 years and always finishes mid-pack. I feel the guys that make the night show can do just fine without the device, and will still go the same speed. I don't think banning it will make things safer.
CASH476
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CASH476 4/4/2010 2:49am
4/4/2010 2:49am Edited Date/Time 4/17/2016 9:53pm
Does it take more or less skill to get a good start without the holeshot device? If the answer is yes, then it would follow that not everyone would get as good a jump out of the gates & the field would be separated more in the first 10 metres.
creed
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creed 4/4/2010 3:05am
4/4/2010 3:05am
I thought this was a DV April Fools joke, sorry but it doesn't really make sense.

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Loose
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Loose 4/4/2010 5:59am
4/4/2010 5:59am
MIKEY755 wrote:
explain to us how this thread is stupid??? David made a valid point, if everyone has it then no one is at an advantage, with the...
explain to us how this thread is stupid??? David made a valid point, if everyone has it then no one is at an advantage, with the recent first turn pile ups it might be a good idea to ban the use of them. At least it slow them down a little and probably make coming into the first turn a bit safer. I think it's one of the best idea's that has been posted on here lately.
You're gonna have to explain to me how that will work.

Right now everyone has the same, take them away and everyone will have the same. Which means eveyone will be courteous and polite in the first turn???

Maybe I'm cynical but perhaps you should try racing your motorcycle instead of polishing it!
Loose
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Loose 4/4/2010 6:01am
4/4/2010 6:01am
Jef wrote:
I'm just a dumb guy ... can anyone explane how that "holeshot device" works? I 've never heard of it before ....
First you need a bike

and then



fuck it

I can't be bothered
MX Dad #27 4/4/2010 6:25am
4/4/2010 6:25am
I can tell that NONE of you are 5' , 110# girls riding a 250F. We spend over $800 to have FC lower our suspension. Katie needs everything she can get, just to get a FAIR start. Which is why we always use it when we can.
typ2vw159
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typ2vw159 4/4/2010 7:57am
4/4/2010 7:57am
Rupert X wrote:


Tops on 30 sec girls should pop-off as the gate is about to drop.

And beer should rain down from the skies.
Now that would get mx on the map for sure.Dave what can you do for this in 2010?
rucka356
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rucka356 4/4/2010 8:06am
4/4/2010 8:06am Edited Date/Time 4/17/2016 9:53pm
Yeah, may as well ban them. Or maybe put a special tax on them to help pay for healthcare or some other shananagans. What ever happened to capitalism?

Anybody want a used Works Connection Holeshot Device? $30 + shipping
CR250Rider
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CR250Rider 4/4/2010 8:10am
4/4/2010 8:10am Edited Date/Time 4/17/2016 9:53pm
how about making tracks more rutty, rough and technical?


At least 25% sand !
CamP
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CamP 4/4/2010 8:17am
4/4/2010 8:17am
MX Dad #27 wrote:
I can tell that NONE of you are 5' , 110# girls riding a 250F. We spend over $800 to have FC lower our suspension. Katie...
I can tell that NONE of you are 5' , 110# girls riding a 250F. We spend over $800 to have FC lower our suspension. Katie needs everything she can get, just to get a FAIR start. Which is why we always use it when we can.
This discussion is about pro racing, and more specifically SX, where 20 pros hit a narrow first corner at essentially the same time nowadays. I think there would be less first turn pile ups at the SX races without the device and the challenge for a good start more difficult. These guys are pros so it should be more difficult and challenging to get good starts and they shouldn't be starting with a crutch.
davis224
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davis224 4/4/2010 8:23am
4/4/2010 8:23am
I think DV's point is it would lower the speed they hit the first turn in. And he's just talking about pro racing, so your short daughter is going to be fine.
dirtbikersa 4/4/2010 3:14pm
4/4/2010 3:14pm
Do they make that much of a difference?
MX Dad #27 4/4/2010 4:25pm
4/4/2010 4:25pm
MX Dad #27 wrote:
I can tell that NONE of you are 5' , 110# girls riding a 250F. We spend over $800 to have FC lower our suspension. Katie...
I can tell that NONE of you are 5' , 110# girls riding a 250F. We spend over $800 to have FC lower our suspension. Katie needs everything she can get, just to get a FAIR start. Which is why we always use it when we can.
CamP wrote:
This discussion is about pro racing, and more specifically SX, where 20 pros hit a narrow first corner at essentially the same time nowadays. I think...
This discussion is about pro racing, and more specifically SX, where 20 pros hit a narrow first corner at essentially the same time nowadays. I think there would be less first turn pile ups at the SX races without the device and the challenge for a good start more difficult. These guys are pros so it should be more difficult and challenging to get good starts and they shouldn't be starting with a crutch.
It doesn't say anything about PRO racing, the title is "Holeshot devices should be banned...".
2Smoke
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2Smoke 4/4/2010 6:08pm
4/4/2010 6:08pm
Farva wrote:
The problem will always be: Every rider entering the corner at the same time. You take all of them away this happens, you give everyone this...
The problem will always be:

Every rider entering the corner at the same time.

You take all of them away this happens, you give everyone this happens.
ns503 wrote:
Yes, but what if they're all going slower?
they should change it to the type of starts where everyone has to run to their bike, kick start it, then go. now that would be interesting.
CamP
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CamP 4/4/2010 6:15pm
4/4/2010 6:15pm
MX Dad #27 wrote:
I can tell that NONE of you are 5' , 110# girls riding a 250F. We spend over $800 to have FC lower our suspension. Katie...
I can tell that NONE of you are 5' , 110# girls riding a 250F. We spend over $800 to have FC lower our suspension. Katie needs everything she can get, just to get a FAIR start. Which is why we always use it when we can.
CamP wrote:
This discussion is about pro racing, and more specifically SX, where 20 pros hit a narrow first corner at essentially the same time nowadays. I think...
This discussion is about pro racing, and more specifically SX, where 20 pros hit a narrow first corner at essentially the same time nowadays. I think there would be less first turn pile ups at the SX races without the device and the challenge for a good start more difficult. These guys are pros so it should be more difficult and challenging to get good starts and they shouldn't be starting with a crutch.
MX Dad #27 wrote:
It doesn't say anything about PRO racing, the title is "Holeshot devices should be banned...".
I'm pretty sure DV is talking about pro racing here.

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