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If the government is going to claim that student loans are sooo damaging, why are they still giving student loans? Which is it? Are they good or bad? If they are good, stop trying to forgive debt, if they are bad stop giving out new loans.
It doesn't get much more basic than that.
If the Government really cared about the people with the student loan debt they would figure out why tuition is so high, not have high interest on student loans, only allow the loans to go for education (not puppies, vacations and such). Unfortunately they only care about buying/ tricking people into voting for them. I agree college tuition has gotten out of hand and degrees are filled with bullshit classes that are not needed in that field. Oh ya they claim it makes you well rounded.
Tuition is so high BECAUSE of the student loans...its a no brainer...easy, endless money means colleges can charge whatever they want...and tuition keeps going up and up and up.
The solution is risk based student loans...borrower risk should be evaluated...so should earning potential of the degree...as well as limits on what loans can be used for (tuition, books, school sponsored meal plans, on campus housing, fees...and that's it).
Your last sentence is spot on.
That said, I drank a lot of keg beer in college that was paid for with student loan money....so shout out to my homies that are still paying for that beer all these years later. Much appreciated.
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Don't forget the majority of these institutions our states sponsored, so our tax dollars are also going there
Just another guy here saying "be responsible for your own choices". I don't want to be responsible for strangers poor decisions.
Jokes on you…if Biden gets his way…because you’ll be paying for that beer after all. Haha
Yes, and we are supposed to have a special price for "in state tuition". CA is now offering "in state tuition" price to Mexicans that live in none other than Mexico. Who knew that if you live in Mexico you could get the cheaper price in CA education system? Here's an idea. If you have extra money taken from CA tax payers, use it to give the kids that live here a cheaper price. Na, that could never happen.
Damnit.
The proposed loan forgiveness was $10k ($20k for those with families poor enough). To put that into perspective, one year of in-state tuition at the University of Illinois is $17-23k for an Illinois resident. That does not include any housing, books, food, beer, or other expenses which double that cost.
The average federal student loan debt is around $37k.
$10k was not going to be a free ride through this. I know there are a lot of very angry folks that will downvote, go ahead.
I know how expensive tuition is...and the risk free, easy, endless student loans are largely to blame for that price tag. (and a culture that brainwashed the youth of America into believing they only way they can be successful is if they go to college...so the colleges have endless money and an endless stream of customers who think they HAVE to go to college...the price just keeps going up and up and up)
Forgiving student loan debt is wrong (you signed up for it, you agreed to it, you pay it back!)...but...forgiving student loan debt WITHOUT a drastic overhaul of the entire student loan system is absolute insanity.
My thought on the situation is school loans should be interest free. There should also be some kind of oversight on the amount students are receiving, a good friend of mine bought an 18k dollar truck with the extra money he received in just one semester. He basically borrowed the maximum amount they would lend him every year. This is another reason people get so far behind in school loans ,they borrow way more then they actually need .
That isn’t necessarily true. Sure if you want to get into a trade - mechanic, welder, lineman, etc. You can make more from the get go. But the line of progression or earnings slows significantly compared to a degree holder progression. This is proven, there are stats all over the place. Great you know a couple guys without degrees that made it. But look outside your circle, how many people didn’t? Of course, like you said before, many people with degrees don’t do anything as well. But the number of people who utilize their degrees far out weigh the people who made it with just a GED or diploma. It’s a numbers game, not a “my buddy did this” game. I have the same friends.
Although I agree with you, starting a business based on a skill or trade can be a golden ticket. Let’s say you start an hvac or plumbing business on the west coast. Great, you’re crushing it. But how long till you get demolished by a large corporation? It happens all the time. You can’t make it these days by simply having good customer service and performing solid work. You will be out priced, the cost of leads will kill your margins, you will get crushed.
Also, most people can’t just start a business, it takes capital, just to name one. You can go to a VC who will give you money, but for what? So he can own a majority of your business. Then if it fails he owns you. Unless they write it off as bad debt.
Agree on the interest, although I'm not sure how private lenders would survive with that.
Did your buddy take out private loans as well? My recollection is that the federal loans only offered enough for tuition and housing at your specific school. This was a decade ago and I could also be wrong.
I don't know how you define "made it"? I define it as being self sufficient (not living off the government), owning a home, and living life...and I know SO many people who have made it without college...I know miners who make nearly 6 figures...oil field rough necks over 6 figures...truck drivers...I can't even count how many real estate agents, loan officers, insurance agents, escrow officers I know that don't have a bachelors degree and that are making well into 6 figures (a few at 7 figures). The list of people who have "made it", AND, who make more money than many college grads (who apparently don't earn enough to afford their student loan bill) is LOOOOOOOONG!
Small businesses are the life blood of our economy...don't tell me that its not possible for small businesses to survive. Small business can, and do, survive for decades and decades (its not a risk free route, but it is a proven and viable route).
It doesn't always take capital to start a business...strategic partnerships, for one...I'm starting a SaaS company right now...I could have paid a software dev company $120K-my lowest bid-to build out my software (which is a lot of capital...and I could have done that)...some might have just thrown in the towel on their business idea and said "whelp, its too hard to start a business and I don't have the capital, life isn't fair...hey government forgive my student loans!"....but instead, I found a software engineer who would build out the software in exchange for 30% of the company...a digital marketing expert, who will market the company online for me in exchange for 15% of the company...and I kept the rest of the equity. Time will tell if this company turns out to be a success or not (we are still a young company), but so far its looking awesome! If it is a success giving up that 45% equity, will be expensive (far more expensive than just paying someone $120K and keeping all the equity)...but...it drastically reduced my front end risk (no skin in the game) so it was a trade I was willing to make. I see deals like this happening ALL THE TIME...no college degree required.
Bottom line, where there is a will, there is a way...worth ethic, ingenuity, creativity, and determination are far more indicative of success than an over-priced piece of paper to hang on the wall.
If someone wants to be a doctor, or attorney, or engineer, or many other things that absolutely need a college degree, then get a college degree...but for the near 60% of students who don't use, or don't complete their degree...society needs to stop pressuring them to go to college, and start telling them they can be successful without college...this will reduce the cost of college tuition for the rest of us (as enrollment rates would drop).
This is wrong. It is chicken and the egg thing. College graduates are not more successful statisticly because of college degrees, many don't even work in the field they have degrees in statisticly. They are more successful because they are for the most part more ambitious and brighter than a lot of non-college graduates(not all). If you become successful with a degree chances are good you would have become successful in life without a degree, just in a field where a degree wasn't needed. Some people are just more motivated and focused than others, and some people are just screw ups. That is life.
Thank you for taking the time to explain this. Many simply do not understand real education vs. some bought and paid for overpriced “education”. Everyone says go to school and get a “degree” so they can slap your ass in the 9-5 for the rest of your life. Banks are paid off by the government on failed loans, the institution is reimbursed by the government, and the tax payers cover it all. Did anyone mention the largest inflated sector in the last 100 years? Bar none, unequivocally is university education. Did you know that each of the top 10 schools in the nation also have more cash in reserves than all but the top tech firms in the world? They have more the Coca Cola and when you think about how much they own………
Moral of the story, don’t be an idiot and get brain washed into getting a degree “just because”. I believe it was stated above, that certain professions certainly desire and should require the highest education ie. doctors, lawyers, engineers, scientist etc.
If people would spend more time on things that truly make their lives better, more meaningful, etc. and less time doing meaningless shit. They would be much happier. BUT, this is what the system wants you to do. For those who take chances, they are rewarded.
Your situation and someone else that is in their young twenties today is completely different. Your life perspective is based on the hard work you’ve put in to own your house or have a ‘disposable’ income (how you define “made it”.) But this world is different today. I know you hate hearing it, but it’s not the same as when you were 20. Kids can’t go buy a house for a pack of gum and $100. I make twice as much money as both my parents did at my age. How come I don’t have a boat, a trailer, horses, etc like they did? I’m no slouch by the way, I do pretty well for someone in their 20’s. Not to mention, you’re experienced, you have way more wisdom, you’re in a good financial spot to start a business. You’ve learned this craft for what 20+ years? Could you do what you’re doing now, if you were in your 20’s today? This conversation is speculative, I’m not vouching for every kid to get a degree.
I have a business degree. It’s worthless. I’m in computational science now. I didn’t need to go to school, I could have self taught myself everything and probably have way more knowledge than I do now. But I would not have gotten my first job out of college without my degree. It’s just the truth. And that’s a societal problem. I agree.
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To clarify, you think education is necessary but it is a societal issue that it is worthless.
-You make twice as much money as your parents ever have in your 20’s. Yet you don’t have luxuries, and you work at a job that has zero to do with your education
-Things are different now vs before?
Just a quick question, how many jobs have you had?
No, I don’t think education is necessary, didn’t mean for it to come off like that. Im speaking behalf of the people who got a degree to get a job. Again, not saying it’s a necessity to make decent money.
Having my degree is useful. Was it required? No, but I wanted a corporate level position. I couldn’t have gotten it without my degree. It’s a dynamic tool I can use to get in the door of places. It shows I followed through with something and challenged myself. My specific major was useless, I guess I should have clarified that. But I make business decisions everyday, plan to start one myself. You don’t need a degree to start a business.. but I needed it to get a job. Which in turn, I’ll leverage to own a business.
What is the actual question in response to whatever I answer with?
I'm probably in the minority but I truly believe that there should be a guaranteed job after spending $50k plus for college. Not saying anyone HAS to accept the job offers but these institutions have connections.
It's bullshit to turn these kids out on their own after spending this kinda money.
Interesting thought.
But what guaranteed job would someone with a degree such as a Major in Comparative Studies in Race & Ethnicity with a Minor in Feminist, Gender and Sexuality Studies get?
Lol...good point. I'd say if the University/College is charging money for those courses they ought to be prepared to find the graduates a job in those fields.
Maybe those courses would go away.
Texas A&M just wrote a check for $75+million to fire their football coach.
Yeah, I'd say they have a few bucks laying around.
Amazingly I chose both of those right off the Stanford website, so not only is someone paying for those degrees....they are paying A LOT.
Those niche courses/degrees may have a viable outcome for a very limited few but if they take all comers...there should be a job attached to graduation.
Shit like this is why homeschooling is on the rise. They added a lot of section 8 housing to my town, which is one of many reasons why my kids are homeschooled. I don't want my kids around trash.
The multi billion dollar endowments these schools have should pay for this. Not the American tax payer.
Poor doesn't always mean trash. But, I do fully understand where you're at. I don't have a good answer. We homeschooled our kids for several years. It is very time/brain consuming. They all re-entered public school 2 grade levels above age level but it was a LOT of work. Teachers= respect.
I agree. I grew up poor. I'd be willing to bet the #1 reason for people living on section 8 is lack of a complete family unit, and problems spawn from there.
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